The Zoo meta is getting old...

Thogard

Tab targeting works if you know how to use it. But how to use it is clunky and... difficult... to achieve the intended result, especially if the intended target and pets are moving.

Aurielle

Thogard wrote: »

Tab targeting works if you know how to use it. But how to use it is clunky and... difficult... to achieve the intended result, especially if the intended target and pets are moving.

It’s VERY difficult to activate on console, esp. if you’ve remapped your barswap button to your right analog stick (default is left directional button) to make barswapping a fluid process. For me, I have to tab target by holding down on the left directional button while targeting the player I want to highlight. That means I can’t move during this process, because I have to take my thumb off the left analog stick. It also takes approximately one second to highlight the player you’ve targeted. A full global cooldown, just to try to highlight a player. If a pet moves in front of the player while you’re attempting to highlight them during that second (which happens all the time), then you highlight the pet instead. It’s a complete waste of time. I could remap tab targeting to my left analog stick, but that would mean I’d have no easy way of sprinting. It also wouldn’t solve the LOS issue when attempting to highlight a player.

It suffices to say that pet targeting needs a rework. It is incredibly unfair that certain classes and WW specs gain what essentially amounts to free mitigation. It’s discouraging, too, how many pet sorcs in particular are resorting to this cheese lately, and then adding further cheese on top of it. Fought a petsorc last night that was using Zaan, for instance. The best way to counter a single pet sorc is to engage them in melee range, and then you have effing Zaan proccing on you. It’s getting to the point now where I am honestly considering carrying backup sets of proc cheese to use against players who eschew skill and rely on sets and imbalances for kills. I hate the idea of fighting cheese with cheese, but what else can you do?

Undefwun

My issue is this... people know what they are doing....

There is a difference between a good build that works well, because it plays to your strengths and bolsters your weaknesses, (and even glass cannon gank or die builds) and then THOSE builds that do well purely because they exploit bad mechanics.

And everyone knows the difference, no one is in awe of their skills.
They KNOW they are running a broken build, they just don't care, because no one can hold them accountable, cos internet.
Well, you're a crap human being.

"But oh its a game, lighten up". Nothing to do with that, I think it just speaks volume about your character as person. You are purposely running a build that is made to ruin fun of the game for others and you think it's ok. Trolling and raging are not new concepts in online gaming.

In general I really don't care if I lose a fight, I expect it, because I am at a disadvantage due to location and ping, half the time I lose the to the game than to other people..
The point, as long as it was a GOOD FUN FIGHT, ok I deal with it. I want to to want to msg the other person afterward "That was fun"...

Fighting a zoo sorc sitting inside his Atro, while all 4 pets are doing free damage while you try to get a target on them is NOT a good fun fight, that is pretty much just raging and griefing other people for your amusement.

Same goes for WWs, I got 2 mutts chasing me around, eating my single target ulties, doing free damage, on my stealth toons they are following me across half the map.
Meanwhile the WWs are doing a lot of dmg and ridiculous amouns of healing. What's the rationale here with the healing? I get the damage, you are a big beast with claws, fine, but that healing, come on.

And NB fear got reduced from 3 ppl to 2 because 'over powered' and WW fear does what? 6? What's the justification here?
Combine the fear and healing.. lol. Someone told me "It's ok, cos it's an ulti only" *face palm*

Again you play a build like this you know it's got very little to do with you, your build is winning.

I just write those players off as "does not count, NPC', nothing they are doing besides logging is beating me, their build is.

If they are on my team, I don't run with em, I don't support them, I try to probably steal their kills, they brought their own team, they don't need the rest of us.

(Unless we get matched against the other bane of solo queue BGs, optimised pre-mades. Then I am happy for them to cheese each other)

Edit: typo

KhajiitFelix

The stamblade meta is getting old....

Aurielle

Undefwun wrote: »

My issue is this... people know what they are doing....

There is a difference between a good build that works well, because it plays to your strengths and bolsters your weaknesses, (and even glass cannon gank or die builds) and then THOSE builds that do well purely because they exploit bad mechanics.

And everyone knows the difference, no one is in awe of their skills.
They KNOW you are running a broken build, they just don't care, because no one can hold them accountable, cos internet.
Well, you're a crap human being.

"But oh its a game, lighten up". Nothing to do with that, I think it just speaks volume about your character as person. You are purposely running a build that is made to ruin fun of the game for others and you think it's ok. Trolling and raging are not new concepts in online gaming.

In general I really don't care if I lose a fight, I expect it, because I am at a disadvantage due to location and ping, half the time I lose the to the game than to other people..
The point, as long as it was a GOOD FUN FIGHT, ok I deal with it. I want to to want to msg the other person afterward "That was fun"...

Fighting a zoo sorc sitting inside his Atro, while all 4 pets are doing free damage while you try to get a target on them is NOT a good fun fight, that is pretty much just raging and griefing other people for your amusement.

Same goes for WWs, I got 2 mutts chasing me around, eating my single target ulties, doing free damage, on my stealth toons they are following me across half the map.
Meanwhile the WWs are doing a lot of dmg and ridiculous amouns of healing. What's the rationale here with the healing? I get the damage, you are a big beast with claws, fine, but that healing, come on.

And NB fear got reduced from 3 ppl to 2 because 'over powered' and WW fear does what? 6? What's the justification here?
Combine the fear and healing.. lol. Someone told me "It's ok, cos it's an ulti only" *face palm*

Again you play a build like this you know it's got very little to do with you, your build is winning.

I just write those players off as "does not count, NPC', nothing they are doing besides logging is beating me, their build is.

If they are on my team, I don't run with em, I don't support them, I try to probably steal their kills, they brought their own team, they don't need the rest of us.

(Unless we get matched against the other bane of solo queue BGs, optimised pre-mades. Then I am happy for them to cheese each other)

Couldn’t have said it better myself. It’s griefing, plain and simple. There’s even a petsorc on PS4 NA who uses the goblin gem polymorph to make themselves even smaller and harder to hit while standing inside their atronach or behind their twilight. It’s so stupid.

Like I said, I don’t want to start using cheese myself, as I enjoy challenging fights that push the limits of my skill. What other choice do you have, though, when a significant number of the people you’re playing against try to win by exploiting whatever they feel they need to exploit?

Aurielle

I’m so tired of this. I just worked three gruelling twelve hour shifts in a row, and decided to kick back and relax tonight with some ESO. First BG match? Up against a premade team with two packleader WWs and two Wardens (both of whom had Maw of the Infernal sets equipped). The WWs were both wearing Zaan. I was on my S&B/2H stamDK. Couldn’t target much, and since I’m full melee, was frequently Zaan’ed and bled to death even when I COULD target players through the sea of Daedroths and dire wolves. I left match, tried to queue on another character, decided I was too effing tired to deal with this BS, and launched up BFV.

Fix. Pet. Targeting. Please.

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

TriangularChicken

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

two of one class type restriction sounds actually good, but too hard to implement for zos.. i mean they cant even fix the queue..

Strider__Roshin

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Dude is way too emotional, but yeah it's clear that the targeting system in respect to pets is quite infuriating. As far as class restrictions go I think it would be healthy for BGs if there couldn't be duplicate classes per team. It would inspire people to be proficient with multiple classes. And it would be nice to fight something other than sorcs and wardens all day.

ezio45

bongtokin420insd16 wrote: »

#Lionslivesmatter

what summons a lion?

ezio45

WuffyCerulei wrote: »

Ye I’m not sure why 98% of sorcs are going pet builds in pvp now. You’re losing 2 slots. And the pet is just free ulti for people with the max Fighter’s Guild passive.

because non pet is a pile of steaming *** since nerfmire

ezio45

ya, getting kinda sick of this myself

Aurielle

Daus wrote: »

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Dude is way too emotional, but yeah it's clear that the targeting system in respect to pets is quite infuriating. As far as class restrictions go I think it would be healthy for BGs if there couldn't be duplicate classes per team. It would inspire people to be proficient with multiple classes. And it would be nice to fight something other than sorcs and wardens all day.

I don’t think he’s being overly emotional at all. He’s frustrated and angry, and I get it. This cancer is ALL over BGs now. You can’t target anything. Even being able to SEE the players you’re trying to hit is sometimes near impossible, especially when there are multiple atronachs and daedroth procs in the way. It’s not fun trying to play in that mess.

@ZOS_GinaBruno , I hope the devs are looking into this.

Qbiken

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Complains about cancer pets, runs a magden with frostblockade and winterborn.....smh

Aurielle

Qbiken wrote: »

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Complains about cancer pets, runs a magden with frostblockade and winterborn.....smh

Thinks a single frost Warden is as cancerous as a full petsorc/WW premade.....smh

jcm2606

In what way is restricting how many classes can be on a team a decent solution to players abusing this atrocious targeting system? Just bloody add an option to disable pet targeting. Boom, problem instantly solved.

jcm2606

Qbiken wrote: »

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Complains about cancer pets, runs a magden with frostblockade and winterborn.....smh

The guy complaining isn't the one recording. The recorder's Shadowplay didn't capture his own audio, but the description implies he was equally frustrated.

Aurielle

jcm2606 wrote: »

In what way is restricting how many classes can be on a team a decent solution to players abusing this atrocious targeting system? Just bloody add an option to disable pet targeting. Boom, problem instantly solved.

Yeah, agreed. There’s no need to over complicate things with adding in class restrictions and whatnot; just disable pet targeting! Or enable pet targeting ONLY when the pet is specifically highlighted with the tab target feature! Or discourage stacking by making players take a percentage of the damage dealt to their pets! There are many simple options to fix this problem.

vamp_emily

hmmm.. was that a premade group complaining about another premade group in the video? I don't think pugs cry that hard.

I've only experienced 1 pet group in BG since playing and that was last weekend. I will admit it does get kind of crazy.

Aurielle

vamp_emily wrote: »

hmmm.. was that a premade group complaining about another premade group in the video? I don't think pugs cry that hard.

I've only experienced 1 pet group in BG since playing and that was last weekend. I will admit it does get kind of crazy.

You will experience more. They are becoming ubiquitous. Every play session of mine (ranging anywhere from 1-6 hrs), I encounter multiple pet groups. It’s getting extremely frustrating. It’s not right that some groups are essentially able to create a zerg for themselves in an area devoted to small scale PVP.

Edit: case in point, just played against another one.

Trinity_Is_My_Name

LOL. Love em all!

Ender1310

I think this is realistic. Are they dominating you? Having a zoo should offer some mitigation. I think targeting provides it. Unless pets should give a cc. I like this unintended mitigation from summoning a horde. It's what is supposed to happen. Now the question. Are they dominating you? Cause being annoying isn't enough of a reason to nerf another play style in my opinion. Is there a counter and is everyone doing it? Is it like sload's where that is all there is?

jcm2606

Ender1310 wrote: »

I think this is realistic. Are they dominating you? Having a zoo should offer some mitigation. I think targeting provides it. Unless pets should give a cc. I like this unintended mitigation from summoning a horde. It's what is supposed to happen. Now the question. Are they dominating you? Cause being annoying isn't enough of a reason to nerf another play style in my opinion. Is there a counter and is everyone doing it? Is it like sload's where that is all there is?

Let me ask you this: do you think something that makes targeting much more difficult, or worse, completely breaks it, is balanced? Personally, I don't think so. Nothing should give you mitigation by messing with targeting to such a significant degree.

Even still, the counter to this, tab targeting, is literally broken. It seemingly has a mind of its own, sometimes working as intended, sometimes forcing all your attacks to hit everyone and everything but the person you have targeted, and then...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yprAGEEfOPk

(And yes, if anyone asks, I will continue posting this clip because it perfectly shows how broken tab targeting is.)

Aurielle

Ender1310 wrote: »

I think this is realistic. Are they dominating you? Having a zoo should offer some mitigation. I think targeting provides it. Unless pets should give a cc. I like this unintended mitigation from summoning a horde. It's what is supposed to happen. Now the question. Are they dominating you? Cause being annoying isn't enough of a reason to nerf another play style in my opinion. Is there a counter and is everyone doing it? Is it like sload's where that is all there is?

So, in other words, you’re a pet sorc and you don’t see why it’s a problem that you can kite around your meatshields and avoid most of the damage dealt to you without hampering your offensive capabilities whatsoever. K.

Having large amounts of mitigation generally means that you’re a tank, and that you can’t deal enough damage to be anything more than an annoyance. This is not true for people who run pet builds. Pet sorcs are free to spam CC and executes behind their pets without having to wear mitigation sets. Same goes for WWs and their light attack/heal spam. It’s unabalanced.

Valdek

Please add:

Combat settings —> turn off being able to target pets.

Please!

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino

Daus wrote: »

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Dude is way too emotional, but yeah it's clear that the targeting system in respect to pets is quite infuriating. As far as class restrictions go I think it would be healthy for BGs if there couldn't be duplicate classes per team. It would inspire people to be proficient with multiple classes. And it would be nice to fight something other than sorcs and wardens all day.

My mic was muted in that video, I think I had GeForce Experience toggled off with my mic or something. It was a friend of mine, and it was really tilting lol. Point blank though, if a game is really frustrating to play (not because of a lack of skill, but because it's the way the game is designed), then it's time to uninstall and take a break from it.

Strider__Roshin

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

Daus wrote: »

Rizz_the_Filthy_Dino wrote: »

All that needs to be said is this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfT9B33EU00

Dude is way too emotional, but yeah it's clear that the targeting system in respect to pets is quite infuriating. As far as class restrictions go I think it would be healthy for BGs if there couldn't be duplicate classes per team. It would inspire people to be proficient with multiple classes. And it would be nice to fight something other than sorcs and wardens all day.

My mic was muted in that video, I think I had GeForce Experience toggled off with my mic or something. It was a friend of mine, and it was really tilting lol. Point blank though, if a game is really frustrating to play (not because of a lack of skill, but because it's the way the game is designed), then it's time to uninstall and take a break from it.

QFT

MurderMostFoul

jcm2606 wrote: »

In what way is restricting how many classes can be on a team a decent solution to players abusing this atrocious targeting system? Just bloody add an option to disable pet targeting. Boom, problem instantly solved.

This, but maybe light and heavy attacks still hit pets. I just hate wasting skills/ resources on the zoo.

LiraTaurwen

Yesterday a friend asked me to join him to do some bellow-50 BGs, I only had one char bellow level 50 a sorc that I only played on launch for a couple of months. I came back to ESO last Decemeber and started playing healer with warden and templar, one for pve other for pvp, so I'm still a newbie and learning.

I joined him with my sorc and decided to change skills to have 2 pets just to try it out, the other skills were picked kinda randomly as didn't have much time to prepare. My char has only gear she collected from quests back when I played years ago, she was level 38 had no food and only npc pots. A complete nub char, I even forgot to allocate my skill points on race passives lol

I'm completely amazed at how op this pets things is, all I had to do was stay back heavy attack to send pets and just kill from affar lol. I did 10 matches and we didn't lost a single one, got so many kills and so few deaths it's not even funny. Could defend relics against 3 players, same with capture flags etc...

Of course people on the other teams might not be the best players, I don't know but I also didn't know what I was doing either and I consider myself a nub.

I can only imagine how powerfull this is with players that know what they are doing and have sets to help their build. Not to mention how annoying is to have all those pets around making a mess and making it impossible to target people.

ruikkarikun

I'm not using pets in pvp now, and have some fights with pet sorc, didn't find it annoying.

This is too funny to hear that from guys who cloaks each second or jumps to shade. Or guys who block, spam wings, spin2win, permafrost. Want to continue?
I want to make topic why single wings ability counter and kills master staff, which took months to farm it, and hundreds of hours?