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Once again I'm underwhelmed Bosmer's Hunter Eye

TheGreatBlackBear
TheGreatBlackBear
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Why Zos? What are you doing? Roll dodging every six seconds is a waste of stamina. Furthermore stamina dds already have enough penetration in PVE. In PVE it's all about stacking and burning. Roll dodging every few seconds is disruptive and is likely to get you killed. Come on, it's like who ever comes up with this stuff doesn't even play the game. Is that why you all gave wood elves so much stam recovery? To blow it on rolling around like some child high on sugar? Just stop and use your brains for a second. Please.
  • Night_Wolf2112
    Night_Wolf2112
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    WHAT!?!?

    I am gonna get major use out of this!!!!

    With my Spriggan's Gear and Kragh's …. all I need is to get close enough to detect that, easily visible from any distance, mob/WB/Dungeon Boss... then just roll dodge once and I should be able to shoot an arrow or swing my axe right through the enemies body with all the detect and penetration I know have! ;)

    Edited by Night_Wolf2112 on February 12, 2019 9:57PM
  • max_only
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    Saint Olms the Just won’t get away from my detective skills! I can never see it outside of 4 meters!
    #FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
    #OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
    || CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
    ""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom
  • Nerftheforums
    Nerftheforums
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    Well, in PvP it is going to be really valuable. Bosmer is a good dd race according to the parses, top 3 races or smth like that?
  • MartiniDaniels
    MartiniDaniels
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    Well, in PvP it is going to be really valuable. Bosmer is a good dd race according to the parses, top 3 races or smth like that?

    It was true in 4.3.0. After that all other stamraces were buffed, and bosmers nerfed. Though 10% speed for 6 seconds not bad in pvp.. so pvp-wise race looks ok now. But in PVE it's probably weakest race with no viable role rather then inferior stamdps.
  • Tasear
    Tasear
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    Useful in pvp but 100% useless in pve
  • FrancisCrawford
    FrancisCrawford
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    How good is the Bosmer kit for werewolves? Stealth detection is awful for everybody, and stamina regen doesn't seem ideal for werewolves, but the rest seems decent.
  • max_only
    max_only
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    How good is the Bosmer kit for werewolves? Stealth detection is awful for everybody, and stamina regen doesn't seem ideal for werewolves, but the rest seems decent.

    Bosmer poison resist has always persisted into WW form so you always have that.
    #FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
    #OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
    || CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
    ""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom
  • BlueRaven
    BlueRaven
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    @Tasear Can you give any insight at how a passive like these managed to get this far?

    There has to be someone with a more direct access to the devs who has pointed out the issues with this passive. I have never personally experienced anything like this in ESO before. It seems this forum is kind of useless for feedback.
    Edited by BlueRaven on February 13, 2019 1:42AM
  • FrancisCrawford
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    max_only wrote: »
    How good is the Bosmer kit for werewolves? Stealth detection is awful for everybody, and stamina regen doesn't seem ideal for werewolves, but the rest seems decent.

    Bosmer poison resist has always persisted into WW form so you always have that.

    Exactly. And the after-rolling benefits would seem to be useful, at least if one was going to roll anyway.
  • Sylvermynx
    Sylvermynx
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    Well, for me it's totally useless. I can't reliably roll with sat as my only connect. As I also can't reliably bar swap, fire spells/attacks, or use ult.

    *laughing* Sucks to be me!
  • Nerftheforums
    Nerftheforums
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    Well, in PvP it is going to be really valuable. Bosmer is a good dd race according to the parses, top 3 races or smth like that?

    It was true in 4.3.0. After that all other stamraces were buffed, and bosmers nerfed. Though 10% speed for 6 seconds not bad in pvp.. so pvp-wise race looks ok now. But in PVE it's probably weakest race with no viable role rather then inferior stamdps.

    Parses show differently though.
  • Nerftheforums
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    max_only wrote: »
    Well, in PvP it is going to be really valuable. Bosmer is a good dd race according to the parses, top 3 races or smth like that?

    3 meters of stealth detect is completely useless in PvP. Do you know how close that is in this game?

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/455172/a-visual-of-khajiits-new-stealth-capability-stacking-is-quite-extreme/p1

    Open up the 3 meter bonus spoiler. In pvp, detecting someone at that distance will barely give you enough time to block. That is why all other stealth detect skills and potions are more than double that distance.

    Who was even talking of stealth detection? If I need to reveal someone I pop a detect pot, I don't start walking around like a chimp searching for someone I will never catch. Same could be said of the old passive: only some few people and play styles were benefitting from the stealth detection reduction bonus, and tbh I am extra happy that snipers and gankers will be less powerful.
    I was talking about the movement speed and pen bonus. 6 is solid, you have the time to kite, turn around and make good use of both movement speed and pen. Can't wait to use it on my stamnb, and I think I might race change some other classes since i prefer medium armor playstyles with good mobility (a meme in this game)
  • mxxo
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    This passive looks a bit like: we didnt want to give anything powerful to bosmer, so we just took smth that looks good on paper. I mean who wants to roll around all the time? This passive is just too situational to be taken seriously. It turns Wood Elves into Clown Elves :p
    Edited by mxxo on February 13, 2019 7:22AM
  • Tasear
    Tasear
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    Ratzkifal wrote: »
    My biggest problem with the penetration is that you need to do something out of order to get it. In pvp it's a neat little bonbon, but it just can't compare. The 10% movement speed is what an Orc gets ALL THE TIME (while sprinting).... IN ADDITION TO 258 Weapon damage. Bosmer should have something neat that's either active all the time or really good on a condition that actually benefits you in a meaningful way once the condition is met. Take the Breton resistance for example. That one is great all the time and when you get a status effect, you really appreciate the extra resistance because you are generally in danger.

    Give Bosmer permanent penetration. Increase that effect on dodgeroll if you must. Or give them back the 20%. People say "Oh it's so broken!" but that's not broken. That's just part of being a bosmer and other races have other nice things that Bosmer don't.

    This is biggest issue for something temporary it doesn't do enough.

    Just give us 10% movement in stealth and resolve bosmer not having a decent utilitiy and give sneaky bosmers a boon.
  • Ysbriel
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    Why Zos? What are you doing? Roll dodging every six seconds is a waste of stamina. Furthermore stamina dds already have enough penetration in PVE. In PVE it's all about stacking and burning. Roll dodging every few seconds is disruptive and is likely to get you killed. Come on, it's like who ever comes up with this stuff doesn't even play the game. Is that why you all gave wood elves so much stam recovery? To blow it on rolling around like some child high on sugar? Just stop and use your brains for a second. Please.

    Eternal Hunt

    (9 Traits) (2 Items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (3 Items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (4 Items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (5 Items) When you use Roll Dodge, you leave behind a rune that detonates when enemies come close dealing 8125 Poison Damage and immobilizing them for 1.5 seconds.


    That plus roll dodge canceling is the answer, if anybody comes here talking trash about this set is because they probably use it and does the roll dodge cancellation trick to proc it.
  • MartiniDaniels
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    Ysbriel wrote: »
    Why Zos? What are you doing? Roll dodging every six seconds is a waste of stamina. Furthermore stamina dds already have enough penetration in PVE. In PVE it's all about stacking and burning. Roll dodging every few seconds is disruptive and is likely to get you killed. Come on, it's like who ever comes up with this stuff doesn't even play the game. Is that why you all gave wood elves so much stam recovery? To blow it on rolling around like some child high on sugar? Just stop and use your brains for a second. Please.

    Eternal Hunt

    (9 Traits) (2 Items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (3 Items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (4 Items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (5 Items) When you use Roll Dodge, you leave behind a rune that detonates when enemies come close dealing 8125 Poison Damage and immobilizing them for 1.5 seconds.


    That plus roll dodge canceling is the answer, if anybody comes here talking trash about this set is because they probably use it and does the roll dodge cancellation trick to proc it.

    So whole race should have 3rd passive for one niche pvp build working with couple of sets and around one exploit?
  • Ysbriel
    Ysbriel
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    Basically that’s it, a lot of people use the animation canceling “mechanics” to gain bonuses


    Crusader

    (2 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (3 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (5 items) Increases the duration of the dodge chance bonus of Roll Dodge by 0.3 seconds.


    Senche's Bite

    (2 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (3 items) Adds 833 Weapon Critical
    (4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (5 items) When you use Roll Dodge, your Weapon Damage is increased by 430 and Weapon Critical by 657 for 5 seconds.

    Way of Air

    (2 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (3 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (4 items) Increases stealth detection radius by 2 meters.
    (5 items) When you use Roll Dodge, your Weapon Damage and Spell Damage is increased by 344 for 6 seconds.
  • MartiniDaniels
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    Ysbriel wrote: »
    Basically that’s it, a lot of people use the animation canceling “mechanics” to gain bonuses


    Crusader

    (2 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (3 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (5 items) Increases the duration of the dodge chance bonus of Roll Dodge by 0.3 seconds.


    Senche's Bite

    (2 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (3 items) Adds 833 Weapon Critical
    (4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (5 items) When you use Roll Dodge, your Weapon Damage is increased by 430 and Weapon Critical by 657 for 5 seconds.

    Way of Air

    (2 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (3 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (4 items) Increases stealth detection radius by 2 meters.
    (5 items) When you use Roll Dodge, your Weapon Damage and Spell Damage is increased by 344 for 6 seconds.

    Relequen gives more dps increase then all those 3 sets combined.
  • MartiniDaniels
    MartiniDaniels
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    Senche's Bite

    (2 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
    (3 items) Adds 833 Weapon Critical
    (4 items) Adds 1096 Max Stamina
    (5 items) When you use Roll Dodge, your Weapon Damage is increased by 430 and Weapon Critical by 657 for 5 seconds.

    Hunding's rage

    2 items: Adds 9-833 Weapon Critical
    3 items: Adds 12-1096 Maximum Stamina
    4 items: Adds 9-833 Weapon Critical
    5 items: Adds 3-299 Weapon Damage

    If you do simple math, you'll see that this beginner level famous craftable set gives only 130 less WD, but given that time and resources you wasted on roll-dodge, it's even more effective then Senche's bite. And it will be especially more effective on orc, dunmer, khajiit, redguard and imperial.
  • Ysbriel
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    Relequen gives you damage over time and it’s mostly useful on dungeons, most people i’ve seen using the Relequen on PvP end up getting destroyed and im sorry i didn’t mention this but im referring to PvP were people do their Mr.Roboto follow me to that tree builds or builds that you notice a sudden weapon swap that seemed useless and now the guy just buffed his damage even further to finish the job. As i ran through VET Dungeons i’ve seen people do crazy amounts of damage with sets that you dont hear any of the META chasers talk about.
  • Nerftheforums
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    Tasear wrote: »
    Ratzkifal wrote: »
    My biggest problem with the penetration is that you need to do something out of order to get it. In pvp it's a neat little bonbon, but it just can't compare. The 10% movement speed is what an Orc gets ALL THE TIME (while sprinting).... IN ADDITION TO 258 Weapon damage. Bosmer should have something neat that's either active all the time or really good on a condition that actually benefits you in a meaningful way once the condition is met. Take the Breton resistance for example. That one is great all the time and when you get a status effect, you really appreciate the extra resistance because you are generally in danger.

    Give Bosmer permanent penetration. Increase that effect on dodgeroll if you must. Or give them back the 20%. People say "Oh it's so broken!" but that's not broken. That's just part of being a bosmer and other races have other nice things that Bosmer don't.

    This is biggest issue for something temporary it doesn't do enough.

    Just give us 10% movement in stealth and resolve bosmer not having a decent utilitiy and give sneaky bosmers a boon.

    So a buff to speed and damage after dodge roll is too niche and situational, but a buff to stealth speed is not? Excuse me wtf? Who the hell plays in stealth? 90% of the pvp population never crouched once, and 100% of the pve population never does so in any dungeon or trial. There are SO many options for speed in stealth (vampirism and sets), and you want to make a passive that is useful almost only in PvP into one that is useful for nobody except 2 role players? Again, excuse me wtf?
  • TheInfernalRage
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    Someone told me the changes make sense because it's like when archers dodge roll to re-position themselves to find an opening (thereby increasing their damage).

    Sounds like role playing to me.

    When you are in a freakin' trial, either being surrounded with so much effects, movements and enemies, you don't waste stamina just to "re-position" for that nice opening. Jeezuz H. Christ. They changed it to 6 seconds just to cater the laziness involved in not thinking creative enough.

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