No Necromancer Class for Elsweyr!

Davor

WhitePawPrints wrote: »

Disclaimer: I know this opinion is unpopular and I know that this has been the most requested class in the game since launch, even over the Warden which was datamined before the game was launched.

However, I must STRONGLY disagree with the notion of tying the Necromancer Class in with Elsweyr.

Reason One: Necromancers have NO place with the Knahaten Flu!

The Knahaten Flu was a disease with an very high mortality rate, and notable supposedly caused several races to go extinct and devastate the population of Tamriel, most notably the Khajiit. Technically the Flu is still supposed to have approximately 15 years left before the disease is not longer found but in ESO's time line it is presumed that the disease is no longer a threat. The only mention of the Flu so far in the game is by visiting the past with Shazah in Reaper's March during one of the final quests in the zone.

It is suspected that the Elsweyr DLC's main quest line will be dealing with the aftermath of this plague. With a disease so devastating, second only to the Thrassian Plague, Necromancers looking to reap from all the death would most definitely be seen with extreme prejudices, even more so than usual. So I wonder how a Necromancer player is supposed to go through Elsweyr, supposedly helping with a plague so fresh in the survivors' minds.

Reason Two: Warrior Monks are common among Khajiit!

The Monk class is the second most requested class I have seen among the ESO community, along with the most requested Skill Tree of Unarmed. Warrior Monks have already been in previous games. But the biggest reason for this is simply that the Khajiit culture heavily supports the monk-class type. One of the most obvious examples of this is in Khenarthi's Roost, where several monks are being trained:



If we are going to add a class, then let it be added with content that ties in!

Reason Three: Necromancers had their chance!

Manimmarco, the most powerful Necromancer in all of Tamriel history, already caused chaos with his Worm Cult. The Worm Cult was defeated, and Manimmarco is bound in Coldharbour (unless you freed him... for some reason). He won't be heard from again in 800 years! A Necromancer class would have fit well earlier on in the game.

Reason Four: Nothing Ties In!

Necromancers make sense, we already have lots of necromancer NPC's, necromancer questlines, and loads of necromancer support. Dragons do not, and it is extremely risky added them into ESO. Titans were their substitute and Titans are sufficient. However, Dragons, Necromancers and Elsweyr make no sense! There is so much rich lore with Elsweyr, the Two Moons, Lorkhaj/Lorkan, and a culture we have not yet seen in an Elder Scrolls game that we should not need to throw in Dragons and Necromancers to fluff it.

If all that was datamined is all being thrown in one package, then I'm just going to assume ZoS is throwing everything in that was requested with no regard to the content. Not that we should be surprised, ZoS has continuously thrown out pretty things with no substance, just to try to increase sales.

The Warrior Monk class would make the PERFECT choice for the Elsewyr DLC. The Necromancer, as I've seen already requested, can be permitted to a skill tree.. or wait until 2020's DLC where it can be tied in a bit better with a theme that really says "necromancer" and "undead".

Very well written. Very well done. I really see your point. While I may not agree with it, I respect it. You have made me see something in a different light now than I didn't see it before. I still hope you can enjoy the content non the less.

Time will tell and hopefully all will work out in the end for everyone.

Morgul667

I propose we just enjoy the class instead:)

MornaBaine

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Wardens had nothing to do with Vvardenfell (the Dunmer are probably the least nature loving people in Tamriel). The class and the zone are two separate, unrelated things.

I agree with this and was endlessly annoyed when they added gimmicky Dunmer themed things to what should have been a purely non-Morrowind thing. Or, conversely, it should have been ALL Morrowind themed. But having a bear AND a Netch is just thematically jarring and was OBVIOUSLY done to tie it in to Morrowind. And it just doesn't work. I am REALLY hoping there isn't going to be any racial/cultural nonsense slapped on to Necromancy!

Robo_Hobo

Yeah, I was hoping for a monk class with Elsweyr too, because of how it would tie in so well with Elsweyr and Goutfang, Whispering Claw and Rawlith Khaj.

I'm not against a Necromancer class though, just feel monk would have been a better fit this time.

generalmyrick

WhitePawPrints wrote: »

Disclaimer: I know this opinion is unpopular and I know that this has been the most requested class in the game since launch, even over the Warden which was datamined before the game was launched.

However, I must STRONGLY disagree with the notion of tying the Necromancer Class in with Elsweyr.

Reason One: Necromancers have NO place with the Knahaten Flu!

The Knahaten Flu was a disease with an very high mortality rate, and notable supposedly caused several races to go extinct and devastate the population of Tamriel, most notably the Khajiit. Technically the Flu is still supposed to have approximately 15 years left before the disease is not longer found but in ESO's time line it is presumed that the disease is no longer a threat. The only mention of the Flu so far in the game is by visiting the past with Shazah in Reaper's March during one of the final quests in the zone.

It is suspected that the Elsweyr DLC's main quest line will be dealing with the aftermath of this plague. With a disease so devastating, second only to the Thrassian Plague, Necromancers looking to reap from all the death would most definitely be seen with extreme prejudices, even more so than usual. So I wonder how a Necromancer player is supposed to go through Elsweyr, supposedly helping with a plague so fresh in the survivors' minds.

Reason Two: Warrior Monks are common among Khajiit!

The Monk class is the second most requested class I have seen among the ESO community, along with the most requested Skill Tree of Unarmed. Warrior Monks have already been in previous games. But the biggest reason for this is simply that the Khajiit culture heavily supports the monk-class type. One of the most obvious examples of this is in Khenarthi's Roost, where several monks are being trained:



If we are going to add a class, then let it be added with content that ties in!

Reason Three: Necromancers had their chance!

Manimmarco, the most powerful Necromancer in all of Tamriel history, already caused chaos with his Worm Cult. The Worm Cult was defeated, and Manimmarco is bound in Coldharbour (unless you freed him... for some reason). He won't be heard from again in 800 years! A Necromancer class would have fit well earlier on in the game.

Reason Four: Nothing Ties In!

Necromancers make sense, we already have lots of necromancer NPC's, necromancer questlines, and loads of necromancer support. Dragons do not, and it is extremely risky added them into ESO. Titans were their substitute and Titans are sufficient. However, Dragons, Necromancers and Elsweyr make no sense! There is so much rich lore with Elsweyr, the Two Moons, Lorkhaj/Lorkan, and a culture we have not yet seen in an Elder Scrolls game that we should not need to throw in Dragons and Necromancers to fluff it.

If all that was datamined is all being thrown in one package, then I'm just going to assume ZoS is throwing everything in that was requested with no regard to the content. Not that we should be surprised, ZoS has continuously thrown out pretty things with no substance, just to try to increase sales.

The Warrior Monk class would make the PERFECT choice for the Elsewyr DLC. The Necromancer, as I've seen already requested, can be permitted to a skill tree.. or wait until 2020's DLC where it can be tied in a bit better with a theme that really says "necromancer" and "undead".

monk = stamina morphs

necromancer = magicka morphs?

eh? ;-)

generalmyrick

starkerealm wrote: »

I'm just a little dubious of the Necromancer icon being for a class, it's colored like the DLC releases, making me suspect this is going to be a DLC release, rather than a new class.

i'll be there, new character slot ready to do that chapter too! woot! :-)

Banana wrote: »

More is good.

im bored with the old stuff! you can give me new stuff so i can hang around and be a part of the economy or i can move onto a new game?

more content = new players and keeps interest going

no mo' content = shrivel and die! have fun playing with yourself!

MajBludd wrote: »

I heard all of necromancer skills deal oblivion damage

sloads on steroids!? i hoping for sets that boost oblivion damage and potions that do! woot, i'll be in pvp trolling with my no skills self! woot!

starkerealm wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Where are you guys getting this info from?

Everyone's been assuming that, "store_necromancy_collectable.dds" must be a necromancer class, because there's nothing in the crown store other than classes.. even though the medallion is formatted like a DLC.

Also Alcast who is a class rep mentioned Necro Class/ Skill line

Alcast is under NDA over anything discussed in the class rep program. Meaning that either he's breaching NDA (unlikely, but it would basically shred his relationship with ZOS on a pretty minor topic), OR necromancy hasn't been discussed with the class reps, and he's speculating based on available information.

Of the two, the latter is far more likely. It doesn't end with his account banned, and a civil suit for breach of contract against him.

or, necro is a thing and they want alcast to talk about it so we create threads like this so they can read them and see if they want to move forward.

ArchMikem wrote: »

templesus wrote: »

Y’all need to cut it out with all this Lore BS. It has no place in a game this big, especially when it’s an MMORPG. If you want lore go play those single player games.

Excuse you? It has EVERY place in this game. It's an Elder Scrolls game therefore it has Elder Scrolls Lore. Actual fans of the series would expect nothing less than the game to adhere fully to the world setting.

what quest give the "actual fan" achievement?
is there a cost?
do i get a motif in the mysterious box AFTER i accomplish the missions for the achievement? :-)
================================

if we get a necromancer class, here's what's going to happen.
1. tons of complaining = always.
2. someone will try to play it organically.
3. the class will be dubbed sucky and not as good as the others
4. MY PERSONAL FAVORITE, somebody will stick a 2h and a bow on it, spam wrecking blow and poison inject.
5. we'll all have fun doing what we like to do~~~~~~~~ no matter what number you are.

jmgrant44ub17_ESO

New class and new zones mean more lag and more nerfs. Every addition they make usually comes with nerfs for two reasons. The first is to make the class more viable. Major mending got nerfed on some classes and in some cases taken away to make the warden more attractive. The other is the servers for this game have not gotten any better or bigger. The last server upgrade was One Tamriel and that was done to make the game work better with consoles and their in house management easier. With everything they have done they will not invest in the infrastructure to improve the overall game performance. Remember their early solution for lag was to remove the deer for Cyrodiil. It would be great if they would improve the servers and made the game run smother with the next chapter and part of their big announcement would be “we've fixed the lag in Cyrodiil”.

Geroken777

Davor wrote: »

ankeor wrote: »

templesus wrote: »

Y’all need to cut it out with all this Lore BS. It has no place in a game this big, especially when it’s an MMORPG. If you want lore go play those single player games.

You know why Elder Scrolls sells?

Because LORE.

Nothing less, nothing more.

Proof please.

https://www.amazon.com/Lord-Souls-Elder-Scrolls-Novel/dp/0345508025

https://www.amazon.com/Infernal-City-Elder-Scrolls-Novel-ebook/dp/B002UZ5J22

If the lore wasn't good these wouldn't exist and it wouldn't be sold. The existence of these books is proof that one of the unique selling points of the elder scrolls series is the lore.

luen79rwb17_ESO

I'm very happy because all that's comming have been community requests since forever! (Necros, Dragons and Elswyr) and that's a fact wether you like it or not. People have been asking for all that stuff.

So this chapter above all is a real demonstration of ZOS commiting their resources to the community. This is huge!

BaylorCorvette

Necromancer class or bust!

Anzriel

Ertosi wrote: »

Op, you're not alone. I'm not a fan of the idea at all.

Half because it shows too much favoritism to one single magic subschool. They should have brought spellcrafting instead which includes all specialist spellcrafters. A necromancer class has no place without also bringing Conjurer, Alterer, and Illusionist classes as well.

Half because every civilized NPC and guild hates necromancers and undead. It's going to be so cheesy seeing them run through town with undead minions in tow but no one batting an eye.

I feel like Necromancer has been asked for pretty often, and I don't think I've seen anyone really ask for a specialist in any other school personally. That's probably why it's happening.

Also, I might be wrong as I'm by no means a loremaster, but I think different places have different views on Necromancy. Dunmer use a very specific type of necromancy for their ancestors for example, and hate all other kinds, but Imperials see it more or less as any other kind of magic but you have to have permission from a person while they were living, or a family member. So i don't think every citizen or people hate necromancy.

Geroken777 wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

ankeor wrote: »

templesus wrote: »

Y’all need to cut it out with all this Lore BS. It has no place in a game this big, especially when it’s an MMORPG. If you want lore go play those single player games.

You know why Elder Scrolls sells?

Because LORE.

Nothing less, nothing more.

Proof please.

https://www.amazon.com/Lord-Souls-Elder-Scrolls-Novel/dp/0345508025

https://www.amazon.com/Infernal-City-Elder-Scrolls-Novel-ebook/dp/B002UZ5J22

If the lore wasn't good these wouldn't exist and it wouldn't be sold. The existence of these books is proof that one of the unique selling points of the elder scrolls series is the lore.

To be fair, that isn't "why Elder Scrolls sells" which makes it sound like it's the only reason. Brand recognition, an enjoyable combat system, housing, crafting and customizable PCs also play a large part. I think it's fair to say lore plays a role in the game's popularity and sales but to act like it's the only reason when in reality a pretty large portion of the playerbase probably knows very little about the lore is misleading.

siddique

I never thought about it, but Monk sounds fun! No weapons, only hand to hand combat with it's own skill line.

BigBadVolk

luen79rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I'm very happy because all that's comming have been community requests since forever! (Necros, Dragons and Elswyr) and that's a fact wether you like it or not. People have been asking for all that stuff.

So this chapter above all is a real demonstration of ZOS commiting their resources to the community. This is huge!

Wish people would have cried for Sanguine too

Wrathmane

Necromancers ok
Elsweyr thats actually pretty cool

There should be no Dragons...... Lore wise they are game breaking..... Dragons haven't been seen seen since the mythic era and aren't supposed to be seen again till the events of Skyrim which takes place what 2000 years in the future from ESO? The presence of Dragons in this time completely breaks Skyrim.

Surak73

WhitePawPrints wrote: »

Reason Three: Necromancers had their chance!

Manimmarco, the most powerful Necromancer in all of Tamriel history, already caused chaos with his Worm Cult. The Worm Cult was defeated, and Manimmarco is bound in Coldharbour (unless you freed him... for some reason).

Oh well: actually, I have freed him, and now he's coming back with his minions. Everything comes full circle...

josiahva

They are adding a necromancer class? Way to cave to popular opinion ZOS...when are you introducing flying mounts? NO MORE PET CLASSES THAT TAKE NO SKILL TO PLAY!!!

eklhaftb16_ESO

Don't dismiss the idea yet, we know next to nothing about the actual story.
Apparently, Abnur Tharn is coming back for the new story arch, so maybe he's gonna be our mentor?

Reistr_the_Unbroken

eklhaftb16_ESO wrote: »

Don't dismiss the idea yet, we know next to nothing about the actual story.
Apparently, Abnur Tharn is coming back for the new story arch, so maybe he's gonna be our mentor?

That would be amazing

Inval1d

Wrathmane wrote: »

There should be no Dragons...... Lore wise they are game breaking..... Dragons haven't been seen seen since the mythic era and aren't supposed to be seen again till the events of Skyrim which takes place what 2000 years in the future from ESO? The presence of Dragons in this time completely breaks Skyrim.

"Known to Live

Ahbiilok - Sightings dating back to the early years of the Dragonguard throughout the northern Jerralls. Multiple attempts to kill him have failed. He is believed to be lairing somewhere in Morrowind.

Mirmulnir - Last sighted in the Reach in 2E 212.

Nahfahlaar - Repeated alliances with mortal protectors which have prevented his elimination. His last known protector was the King Casimir II of Wayrest, which the Dragonguard successfully ended in 2E 369. He escaped and current location is unknown.

Paarthurnax - The legendary lieutenant of Alduin in the Dragon War. He is now known to lair on the Throat of the World under the protection of the Greybeards of High Hrothgar. Master Araidh continues the established policy of avoiding direct confrontation with the Greybeards while waiting for an opportunity to exact justice upon him."

https://www.imperial-library.info/content/atlas-dragons

starkerealm

Edaphon wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Where are you guys getting this info from?

Everyone's been assuming that, "store_necromancy_collectable.dds" must be a necromancer class, because there's nothing in the crown store other than classes.. even though the medallion is formatted like a DLC.

DLC and class icons look very similar:

Now, look at the color of the medallions.

lordrichter wrote: »

The use of the term "collectable" in the filename, instead of "upgrade", is somewhat different. However, I admit I have not followed the progression of Psijic and Warden icon files since they were originally datamined. I also have not been in the main datamining thread to see if someone else has mentioned this.

There's a lot of confirmation bias going on right now. People saw, "necromancer," and assume, "it must be a class/skill line," even though, there's basically no evidence to support this.

Now, it's certainly possible that it's a new class, that would be pretty damn cool, but people are getting really fired up about something that is formatted like a DLC icon. I don't blame them, the Russian site assumed that the icon was for a class, labeled it as such, and then everyone else took that at face value, but, right now there's no hard confirmation on the subject.

Now, Rich gets on stage next Tuesday and says, "necromancer class," then... cool. But, right now, we've got an icon colored like a DLC medallion, and everyone's going, "it must be a new class!"

Azurya

necromancers are petsorcs with dead corpses instead of pets

perogwin_ESO

There are a lot of people running around who say they know the lore, but don't actually bother to investigate it, because if they did they would realize just how little they actually know.

Necromancy

It is not against the lore at all for Necromancy, especially in Elsweyr

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Necromancy

Let me highlight a very specific point for you from Lore:

Elsweyr

Elsweyr is said to be relatively accommodating to necromancy. The Khajiit are said to show little if any outrage over uncovered graves, and corpses can apparently be purchased in the port of Senchal. Though corpses don't hold up well in the forests, the deserts of Elsweyr preserve corpses for centuries, allowing skilled necromancers to make use of them relatively easily. The way the bodies are buried in the deserts, under only a small cairn of stones, is also ideal for necromancers on the prowl for resources

So if they were going to add a Necromancer Class, Elsweyr is the best area for it to be added.

I was hoping it would be added when they finally got around to doing the College of Winterhold since it is even TAUGHT there, but this will do.

Quoted From Lore: "At the prestigious College of Winterhold, it is even considered a legitimate arcane study, provided it is done discreetly and in accordance with the College's rules".

Dragons

As for the Dragons, as long as there aren't a ton of them and they are mainly Trial/Dungeon based (heck even a Single young one as a World Boss) then they will fit in fine.

Again, look into the lore before before you say they don't fit. It isn't until the time of the Skyrim Game (which isn't until the 4th Era) that they are considered extinct after the dealings with Alduin

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Dragons

From Lore:

"Many held the belief that the dragons were extinct. This was not true, as live dragons continued to exist throughout the Third and early Fourth Era. Nomads in the Alik'r Desert frequently spoke of "Great Wyrms" inhabiting its vast wastes, although these claims were never independently confirmed. The Akatosh Chantry hold dragons as their holy symbol, and keep tamed dragons in their "sacred grove". Many ancient legends tell of dragons making deals with other races to protect themselves. According to Brarilu Theran, at least one dragon is known to have laired in the smoking ruins of Vvardenfell after the Red Year, long after the cliff racers were driven off by Saint Jiub."

If they existed through out the 3rd and early 4th it means they are alive during the ESO time line since it is just passed the middle of the 2nd Era, so again, as long as there isn't one lurking at every turn they fit perfectly well in the ESO Timeline

Another bit of info from Lore:

"After being largely absent from the affairs of Tamriel for hundreds of years, dragons reappeared en masse in Skyrim and Morrowind in 4E 201 thanks to the return of Alduin."

Note that they are described as "Being Absent from the Affairs of Tamriel" nothing about them being extinct.

What annoys me the MOST about all these Lore Mongers coming out of the woodwork is that almost all of them get their info from the Skyrim game. Skyrim takes place in 4E 201, ESO is currently taking place in 2E 583 - Skyrim wont happen for about 1000 years from when ESO is currently happening.

In fact the first game in the Elder Scrolls "Main" series (Arena) doesn't take place till E3 370, over 600 years from where we are now in game. If you include the Extended Elder Scrolls Universe Games the first game after ESO chronologically is still 298 years in the future from the current time line, and that is The Redguard Game.

<Please note each of the lore pages I linked have full reference numbers and citations on where the info was found for people who will think this stuff is made up, so you can look into it yourself>

THE MORE YOU KNOW

ProfessorKittyhawk

I'm sure this topic is definitely going to change ZOS's mind about necromancy. 20% of the time, it works every time.

Taunky

Get lost.

Elsonso

starkerealm wrote: »

Edaphon wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Where are you guys getting this info from?

Everyone's been assuming that, "store_necromancy_collectable.dds" must be a necromancer class, because there's nothing in the crown store other than classes.. even though the medallion is formatted like a DLC.

DLC and class icons look very similar:

Now, look at the color of the medallions.

lordrichter wrote: »

The use of the term "collectable" in the filename, instead of "upgrade", is somewhat different. However, I admit I have not followed the progression of Psijic and Warden icon files since they were originally datamined. I also have not been in the main datamining thread to see if someone else has mentioned this.

There's a lot of confirmation bias going on right now. People saw, "necromancer," and assume, "it must be a class/skill line," even though, there's basically no evidence to support this.

Now, it's certainly possible that it's a new class, that would be pretty damn cool, but people are getting really fired up about something that is formatted like a DLC icon. I don't blame them, the Russian site assumed that the icon was for a class, labeled it as such, and then everyone else took that at face value, but, right now there's no hard confirmation on the subject.

Now, Rich gets on stage next Tuesday and says, "necromancer class," then... cool. But, right now, we've got an icon colored like a DLC medallion, and everyone's going, "it must be a new class!"

There will be civil unrest in the forum no matter what gets announced by ZOS. Sadly, people have constructed a dream world for 2019 and I question whether ZOS will get to half of it. Even if they do, they will do it wrong.

Caligamy_ESO

Every one of the people who post on here against Necromancer because it doesn't make any sense have read a single page of lore about Elseweyr. If you had you wouldn't say that.

And its not at all about a little datamined crown store icon that's leading to this assumption. It's this:
"Venture to the land of the Khajiit in The Elder Scrolls Online: Elsweyr, our newest chapter, an epic story in an all-new zone. Face dread creatures from the past—Dragons!—and discover the dark skills of a new character class, the Necromancer, as you join with new friends and old enemies to save Elsweyr from war and devastation."

MehrunesFlagon

Paazhahdrimaak wrote: »

Elsweyr Zone, Yes
Necromancer Class, Yes
Dragons, NO (Unless they are all 'Undead' due to necromancy)

I want to at least have a dragon pet that has skin.Preferably living.

Burgererer

TL;DR

Dragons, necromancy, catland. Theyre gonna happen. So quit being a party pooper. And uhhh sorcs can summon daedra in the middle of town. So undead are completely fair game.

Ermiq

ShadowHvo wrote: »

Necromancers is the most requested class for a good reason, in particular because only few games ever allow you to play such a villainous archtype, and yet Elder Scrolls have always allowed for the option. For it to finally be implemented in ESO is truly awesome.

Really? You seem to not playing MMORPGs much. Necromancer is a pop class in MMORPGs. Almost any MMORPG I've ever played has this archtype.
And there's no surprise that ZO$ decided to make this cla$$ instead of any other.

proteinexe

"nothing ties in"

It doesn't have to - if there's a dragon break, ZoS is allowed to do whatever they want, and it'll "tie in" at a later date and that'll be that. They can re-write the lore for this specific part of tamriels history.