ZOS vs vampires ?

Bruccius

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

The "visual consequence" argument is illogical.

Werewolf has no visual indication while not in wolf form, yet you can still get benefits from having the ability slotted. No visual consequence.

When ZOS reworks vampire to be less usable, there should also be an option made to allow vampires to look normal.

Vampirism isn't lycantrophy. I recommend you replay Skyrim and Bloodmoon, it might shock you, but those with the beast blood do not have an appearance change... Now behold vampires from day one of the franchise up until now, tell me, do they look normal?

No?

It's almost as if they're not meant to look normal.

People who want to alter the vampire's appearance are the folk who do not care for the lore.

''But hur dur, these specific people under specific circumstances could hide their vampirism!'', people use as their best counter argument, not realizing that it isn't a common rule.

What's next? ''I play an Orc for the passives, but want to look like a Breton, ZOS please allow me to change my appearance to look like a Breton!'', come on, it's starting to become a meme.

Salvas_Aren

The cheap argument of lore.

How many items in the crown store are not lore friendly? How many skins are not lore friendly?

But beware someone requests vampire skins, then the lore stands above all and each. Even if someone requires vampire skins for the crown store, oh holy lore.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

Ahh another thread of "boohoo I am Vampire i want this and that boohooo".
@AbyssDragon_2115 please tell me what is the downsides of been an vampire these days, and what are the benefits?


Vampires were pretty well balanced on release. Fighters Guild abilities did humongous damage on them, some one shotted them.
There weren't Champion Points either so all was balanced out.

Fast forward 5 years later. And there are more Vampires than non vamp (or WW) players.
They get all the benefits and none of the drawbacks after all the buffing through the CP caps.

And this has become so broken that given the amount of vampires (and WW) in game, should be renamed to "Vampires & Werewolves Online". Is sickening ZOS listened to the crybabies all those years and didn't hit vampires with the nerf bat yet.

AlienatedGoat

Bruccius wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

The "visual consequence" argument is illogical.

Werewolf has no visual indication while not in wolf form, yet you can still get benefits from having the ability slotted. No visual consequence.

When ZOS reworks vampire to be less usable, there should also be an option made to allow vampires to look normal.

Vampirism isn't lycantrophy. I recommend you replay Skyrim and Bloodmoon, it might shock you, but those with the beast blood do not have an appearance change... Now behold vampires from day one of the franchise up until now, tell me, do they look normal?

No?

It's almost as if they're not meant to look normal.

People who want to alter the vampire's appearance are the folk who do not care for the lore.

''But hur dur, these specific people under specific circumstances could hide their vampirism!'', people use as their best counter argument, not realizing that it isn't a common rule.

What's next? ''I play an Orc for the passives, but want to look like a Breton, ZOS please allow me to change my appearance to look like a Breton!'', come on, it's starting to become a meme.

I'm not arguing that WW should look different in normal form. I'm saying it's illogical to assume that to derive benefit, either WW or vamp should have to look different. There are several lore examples for vamp in particular.

The "visual consequence" has always been a BS strawman argument put forth by the ignorant and/or those who have a bone to pick with vamps.

Bruccius

@AlienatedGoat
Except that they shouldn't ''have to'' at all. Vampires look different, werewolves do not. That's established lore. The beast blood does not alter the appearance of someone unless if used. Vampiric blood is used at all times, that's why they look differently.

''by the ignorant''
Funny you mention that, considering in lore vampires do look different from normal folks on Tamriel. It's almost as if the ''let me hide my vampirism'' camp is the ignorant one here.

@Salvas_Aren
I don't think you quite understand the purpose of ''skins''. If ZOS wants to make a vampire skin, so be it, I don't think anyone is complaining about vampire skins... If anything, I keep on hearing the ''give me a vampire toggle!'' camp complain about how ''skins don't do the job''....

Grow up and accept that if you want to be a vampire, your appearance changes. It's no more ridiculous than complaining you look like an Orc while all you wanted was the Orcish perks.

AlienatedGoat

Bruccius wrote: »

@AlienatedGoat
Except that they shouldn't ''have to'' at all. Vampires look different, werewolves do not. That's established lore. The beast blood does not alter the appearance of someone unless if used. Vampiric blood is used at all times, that's why they look differently.

''by the ignorant''
Funny you mention that, considering in lore vampires do look different from normal folks on Tamriel. It's almost as if the ''let me hide my vampirism'' camp is the ignorant one here.

Did you not read the part about there being lore exceptions, or are you just being belligerent?

Shawn_PT

We have a Werewolf-themed DLC now. It comes with a skin. A WW skin which is fugly and nobody uses because not even WWs want to look like hairy beasts while in human form.

One day, maybe we'll have a vampire-themed dungeon DLC. It perhaps comes with a vampire skin. One that instead of being 'pretty' or pleasing to the eye, makes players look like monstrous vampires like those in Skyrim, glowing eyes, bat-like noses. Careful what you wish for and all that

I'm okay with that. I'd rather have my vampires look like vampires than have them look like walking pink marshmallows tbh. I'm also okay with a passive we have to put points in that reduces the stage look. 1 point and it looks human on stage 1, looking like stage 3 when fully starved. Up until 4 points where they can look 100% human regardless of stage. Options for everyone. A cost in the form of skill points for those who care about their looks.

Oh, and fangs. Can we have fangs pretty please with a cherry on top?

AbyssDragon_2115

Rain_Greyraven wrote: »

II have always been for allowing Vampires to hide their Vampyness.....
As long as they have none of the powers during the daytime, and there is an ability to detect them , which turns them into full loot Full PVP.

Some people can read this like "Blah blah blah". Let me translate:
"Lets make ESO to be one of those korean mmo clones" © Rain_Greyraven

zyk

Fashion Scrolls Online

AbyssDragon_2115

Bruccius wrote: »

People who want to alter the vampire's appearance are the folk who do not care for the lore.

@Bruccius
first - You should dig better into lore... and you will change your mind.
second - Peoples often equalizing MMO and single player games
third - Salvas_Aren already said it:

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

The cheap argument of lore.
How many items in the crown store are not lore friendly? How many skins are not lore friendly?
But beware someone requests vampire skins, then the lore stands above all and each. Even if someone requires vampire skins for the crown store, oh holy lore.

and fourth - simple logic - Are tattoos or body art paints lose their colors upon death?

AbyssDragon_2115

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

@AbyssDragon_2115 please tell me what is the downsides of been an vampire these days, and what are the benefits?

@p_tsakirisb16_ESO
I've start that thread about visual side not a balance. There is official feedback gathering topic

There you can find my post. Cause you said "please"... a few words about IMO.
Benefits:

• faster resources regen - 4th stage to get normal bonus
• no sneak penalty - 4th stage only
• decreased damage with low health - useful for HP tanks

Downsides:

• Fire hits very hard on 4th stage - many dungeons have a lot of fire dmg, in PvP almost every MP build use fire staff - "Hello, Fiery Rage ulti" and one of vet Maelstrom arena rounds (Igneous Cistern) is incompletable for me.
• Dawnbreaker in PvP hits hard, and as you said in "Vampires & Werewolves Online" peoples use it a lot.
• Vamp skills obviously weak choice for stamina builds - which I prefer.

Hurbster

AbyssDragon_2115 wrote: »

Rain_Greyraven wrote: »

II have always been for allowing Vampires to hide their Vampyness.....
As long as they have none of the powers during the daytime, and there is an ability to detect them , which turns them into full loot Full PVP.

Some people can read this like "Blah blah blah". Let me translate:
"Lets make ESO to be one of those korean mmo clones" © Rain_Greyraven

That makes no sense whatsoever.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

AbyssDragon_2115 wrote: »

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

@AbyssDragon_2115 please tell me what is the downsides of been an vampire these days, and what are the benefits?

@p_tsakirisb16_ESO
I've start that thread about visual side not a balance. There is official feedback gathering topic

There you can find my post. Cause you said "please"... a few words about IMO.
Benefits:

• faster resources regen - 4th stage to get normal bonus
• no sneak penalty - 4th stage only
• decreased damage with low health - useful for HP tanks

Downsides:

• Fire hits very hard on 4th stage - many dungeons have a lot of fire dmg, in PvP almost every MP build use fire staff - "Hello, Fiery Rage ulti" and one of vet Maelstrom arena rounds (Igneous Cistern) is incompletable for me.
• Dawnbreaker in PvP hits hard, and as you said in "Vampires & Werewolves Online" peoples use it a lot.
• Vamp skills obviously weak choice for stamina builds - which I prefer.

The visual side of the vampire is one of the negatives. Deal with it or get cure.
In addition, you only put there some "passives", not the "active" skills of the vampires, and the synergies with many other skills, like those from DKs and Sorcerers. And these synergies makes them a complete OP class on their own.

The fire weakness of Stage 4 is null and void at CP810 cap. You get more damage, but is far too little than the normal damage you should be getting due to the original game design. Which cap was Level 50, extended to VR16 later on.

And VR16 was the last time ZOS bothered to balance Vampires, 5 years ago.
So deal with it, or get cure. Don't expect everything. Or else put a helmet.

Bruccius

AbyssDragon_2115 wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

People who want to alter the vampire's appearance are the folk who do not care for the lore.

@Bruccius
first - You should dig better into lore... and you will change your mind.
second - Peoples often equalizing MMO and single player games
third - Salvas_Aren already said it:

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

The cheap argument of lore.
How many items in the crown store are not lore friendly? How many skins are not lore friendly?
But beware someone requests vampire skins, then the lore stands above all and each. Even if someone requires vampire skins for the crown store, oh holy lore.

and fourth - simple logic - Are tattoos or body art paints lose their colors upon death?

I should dig into the lore? You sure about that? A TESwikian of over three years doesn't know the lore?
Ha, no. Hate to be the one to tell you this, but vampires looking different is the rule. Only very specific groups, or very specific vampires, do not look as the rest does. Feeding also plays a role.

If you want to look normal, don't be a vampire.

Reistr_the_Unbroken

StormChaser3000 wrote: »

@Sylvermynx There are vamp NPCs in game who can hide their nature. Why can't players do that then?
We don't care what you see or not see. We care what we see. And we will keep bugging ZOS until the victorious end of the story.

Plus there’s the issue of some NPCs not seeing your a vampire EVEN AT STAGE 4

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

commdt

StormChaser3000 wrote: »

commdt wrote: »

Just use any skin. Blackmarrow Necromancer one is very slim

For which you need to have a no death run in Scalecaller vet dungeon. "Yay, can't wait to try it!". Plus those shiny lines don't look good imo. -.-

Also while I'm 100% pro getting something that would mask it, I also want to be able to keep stage one look on some of my characters. Suprisingly my male Altmer looks 10 times better with stage 1 vampirism than with none...

Scalecaller no-death is very easy, much easier than say Mazzatun no-death was back then. And it doesnt require you to do anything special, just run it like always and youll get it eventually

zyk

Every time I see this thread, I think its title sounds like a movie I'd like to watch.

SilverPaws

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

Bruccius

SilverPaws wrote: »

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

I'm what you call a wikian of over three years of experience, a ''troll'', lmao, sure.

Of course, you cannot provide evidence of it being normal for vampires to hide their appearance, because it isn't normal.

SilverPaws

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

I'm what you call a wikian of over three years of experience, a ''troll'', lmao, sure.

Of course, you cannot provide evidence of it being normal for vampires to hide their appearance, because it isn't normal.

Link me any source telling that vampires can't hide their appearance, you are only one here without any evidence

eklhaftb16_ESO

I don't mind being "ugly". In fact, I even like the look of vampire skin, especially the phase 3. What irks me is that my tattoos become washed out for some weird reason (the reason probably being that vampirism effect is applied as an uppermost layer by default, and nobody ever bothered to move it below the tattoo layer...)

And, as the old saying goes: You can't make IKEA meatballs without beating some dead horse first.

Bruccius

SilverPaws wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

I'm what you call a wikian of over three years of experience, a ''troll'', lmao, sure.

Of course, you cannot provide evidence of it being normal for vampires to hide their appearance, because it isn't normal.

Link me any source telling that vampires can't hide their appearance, you are only one here without any evidence

You're the one claiming it is normal, so you're the one who needs the evidence, smarthat.

There's a reason why the majority of vampires on Tamriel look hideous; because it's normal for them to do so.

Reistr_the_Unbroken

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

I'm what you call a wikian of over three years of experience, a ''troll'', lmao, sure.

Of course, you cannot provide evidence of it being normal for vampires to hide their appearance, because it isn't normal.

Link me any source telling that vampires can't hide their appearance, you are only one here without any evidence

You're the one claiming it is normal, so you're the one who needs the evidence, smarthat.

There's a reason why the majority of vampires on Tamriel look hideous; because it's normal for them to do so.

I think there’s a clan of vampires in Cyrodiil who could hide their appearance

Mayrael

Rain_Greyraven wrote: »

II have always been for allowing Vampires to hide their Vampyness.....


As long as they have none of the powers during the daytime, and there is an ability to detect them , which turns them into full loot Full PVP.

Ok but at night they insta kill you as you are just a bag of blood for them.

Emmagoldman

I use to be against being able to hide it because I felt that people should know who is a vampire. So you take the buffs, then there is a consequence. Yet with skins it is a mute point. I wouldn’t care at this point

SilverPaws

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

I'm what you call a wikian of over three years of experience, a ''troll'', lmao, sure.

Of course, you cannot provide evidence of it being normal for vampires to hide their appearance, because it isn't normal.

Link me any source telling that vampires can't hide their appearance, you are only one here without any evidence

You're the one claiming it is normal, so you're the one who needs the evidence, smarthat.

There's a reason why the majority of vampires on Tamriel look hideous; because it's normal for them to do so.

As i said, just troll no evidence just empty talk

SilverPaws

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

Vampires hiding they're appearance isn't against lore.. Ignore the Bruccius troll he is just one of the ppl who likes to just trigger others. Keep up and someday zos will finally provide us with some normal skin instead of this.

I'm what you call a wikian of over three years of experience, a ''troll'', lmao, sure.

Of course, you cannot provide evidence of it being normal for vampires to hide their appearance, because it isn't normal.

Link me any source telling that vampires can't hide their appearance, you are only one here without any evidence

You're the one claiming it is normal, so you're the one who needs the evidence, smarthat.

There's a reason why the majority of vampires on Tamriel look hideous; because it's normal for them to do so.

Can you tell me why vestige, one of the most powerful beings on Nirn could not hide his/her vampirism ? We already saw in game that it's possible also as someone said here, in Cyrodil is breed of vampires that look like normal people when they are fed.

lucky_Sage

In no longer a vampire because now dks sent pigeon hold onto them but before it was because I took my time making the character look the way I want I didn't want a stupid skin or ugly vampire I wanted what I made