Steel Tornado.

DivineFirstYOLO

Steel Tornado is a necessity against good players (talking about groups) in Cyrodiil and especially in high MMR BG matches. Serious group players have their HoTs tick all the time - stacking vigor/mutagen/etc for the whole group. You are not going to kill anyone without good timed burst and Steel Tornado in such matches.

Saying Steel Tornado is OP when getting Xv1ed is a weak argument, cause basically every damaging skill in the game is OP when multiple people hit you at the same time.


Keep your heals ups, stay with the group, have more than 20k HP = problem solved.

Jakx wrote: »

Explain why 95% of the pvp base is running around as a Stamina setup then comeback to original point. The meta has swung way too far towards Stam and this is a culprit.

Do you have some statistical data to back that number up or are you talking out of your a**?

CatchMeTrolling

Think the amount of stam players that use it make it a little bit obnoxious rather than it being op. The fact that it’s an aoe execute doesn’t really make it better.

The issue with this skill is how brain dead easy it is to use. In a bg match its night and day when you have or don’t have this skill on your bar. And it actually hits for a decent amount, I don’t agree with the people saying it doesn’t hit hard.

Ayastigi

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Think the amount of stam players that use it make it a little bit obnoxious rather than it being op. The fact that it’s an aoe execute doesn’t really make it better.

The issue with this skill is how brain dead easy it is to use. In a bg match its night and day when you have or don’t have this skill on your bar. And it actually hits for a decent amount, I don’t agree with the people saying it doesn’t hit hard.

It hits for a decent amount but to get the most use out of it you need to transmute some of your jewelry to bloodthirsty. Stacking bloodthirsty with dw passives makes it a useful skill. It's not op and doesn't need to be nerfed. It's funny seeing so many people run it though lol.

Ragnarock41

Solariken wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

I'm sorry that your in-built instinct "low health -> I should dodge to became invincible for the next 2 seconds" has a counter.

Btw, Steel Tornado has base cost of 3780. Builds that are able to spam it will hit like wet noodles and the ones that will hurt can do 3-5 tornados in a row before they are completely out.

Yes but it still needs a minor cost increase, it is far too efficient in single target application. As it stands, most players don't even slot Bloodthirst/Rapid and rarely have to use any single-target spammable because they can just DBoS+Spin all the things. Lame potato playstyle that should be more expensive to utilize IMO.

players don't even slot rapid/bloodthirst because it is simply garbage tier.

CatchMeTrolling

Ayastigi wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Think the amount of stam players that use it make it a little bit obnoxious rather than it being op. The fact that it’s an aoe execute doesn’t really make it better.

The issue with this skill is how brain dead easy it is to use. In a bg match its night and day when you have or don’t have this skill on your bar. And it actually hits for a decent amount, I don’t agree with the people saying it doesn’t hit hard.

It hits for a decent amount but to get the most use out of it you need to transmute some of your jewelry to bloodthirsty. Stacking bloodthirsty with dw passives makes it a useful skill. It's not op and doesn't need to be nerfed. It's funny seeing so many people run it though lol.

I’ve hit for 5k plus which is a decent in bgs considering the typical max health players have. Then factoring in that every player doesn’t proactively heal and wait to the last moment.

Trancestor

idiots defending steel tornado here smh...why do i feel like these players that say "just block it" or "your problem for roll dodging" are either trash players who just want to feel like they are good by talking crap on the forums or they are block/spam BoL magplars / streak + resto ult spamming magsorcs.

Jakx

Its because theyre all Stam users who cant see the meta is heavily skewed now. Join them instead of being proactive in the community.

Ragnarock41

I don't deny the efficiency of steel tornado on a group v group fight, however if you're dying to ST spam only, then you have no right to insult the players who don't. And if you're dying to ST spam on a 1v1 you shouldn't even have opinions about it.

Casul

If it is such an issue as an execute why not make it a reverse execute like twilight tormentor?

Purdomination33

Make it dodgeable. In BG's its especially effective due to low HP and generally lower crit resist. No idea why its not dodgable. But hey, I can "just" run away....in a video game...in a video game mode scored by killing players. But running is fun too.

What is the logic behind undodgable skills anyway? Like how is it decided. Skills just asking to be abused conidering its automatic damage.

Thought ZOS wanted to take all the extras from skills, such as the stun from c frags.

Waffennacht

Purdomination33 wrote: »

Make it dodgeable. In BG's its especially effective due to low HP and generally lower crit resist. No idea why its not dodgable. But hey, I can "just" run away....in a video game...in a video game mode scored by killing players. But running is fun too.

What is the logic behind undodgable skills anyway? Like how is it decided. Skills just asking to be abused conidering its automatic damage.

Thought ZOS wanted to take all the extras from skills, such as the stun from c frags.

All AoEs are undodgeable

Sanctum74

Trancestor wrote: »

idiots defending steel tornado here smh...why do i feel like these players that say "just block it" or "your problem for roll dodging" are either trash players who just want to feel like they are good by talking crap on the forums or they are block/spam BoL magplars / streak + resto ult spamming magsorcs.

Or maybe there are just people with enough common sense to keep their buffs, shields, and hot's up and don't die to slow animation skills with low damage.

Aztlan

No.More.Nerfs.

Vapirko

Waffennacht wrote: »

Purdomination33 wrote: »

Make it dodgeable. In BG's its especially effective due to low HP and generally lower crit resist. No idea why its not dodgable. But hey, I can "just" run away....in a video game...in a video game mode scored by killing players. But running is fun too.

What is the logic behind undodgable skills anyway? Like how is it decided. Skills just asking to be abused conidering its automatic damage.

Thought ZOS wanted to take all the extras from skills, such as the stun from c frags.

All AoEs are undodgeable

But this was a lazy move by the balance team, they just make all skills function the same even though not all skills are created equal. WoE is not equal to steel tornado, nor is caltrops, ritual of retribution etc. And we can clearly see the effects of this kind of “balance.”

Mrsinister2

I play all classes and it's only annoying when I'm on a nightblade you cant cloak you can't roll your usually screwed unless shade is down.

Sanctum74 wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

idiots defending steel tornado here smh...why do i feel like these players that say "just block it" or "your problem for roll dodging" are either trash players who just want to feel like they are good by talking crap on the forums or they are block/spam BoL magplars / streak + resto ult spamming magsorcs.

Or maybe there are just people with enough common sense to keep their buffs, shields, and hot's up and don't die to slow animation skills with low damage.

It's not slow at all to you can totally ani cancle it it also does hit decently hard. I only die to it on my nbs tho cause it's very hard to get away from and standing still blocking is a death sentence as well. I don't no that it needs a giant nerf tho since I have no issues with it on other classes so Idk.

Malamar1229

Imo it has become more effective tool since bleeds are strong right now

Diddly_D_Potatoes

I love me some steel tornado. I even farmed up a Sword Dancer set to give my spins more win.

I do have a complaint about it tho.

When I'm chasing someone down and spinning I sometimes have trouble getting the winning. You have to catch up to and run past them for it actually hit. The lag literally saves them. This could be fixed by increasing it radius.

Flame_of_Hades

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

I don't deny the efficiency of steel tornado on a group v group fight, however if you're dying to ST spam only, then you have no right to insult the players who don't. And if you're dying to ST spam on a 1v1 you shouldn't even have opinions about it.

Idk, my stam sorc can get kills by : rending slash, LA, puncture, bash, LA, reverb, LA, spin, LA, spin, LA, spin, LA, spin, LA, spin, LA, spin, LA, spin........ LA, DB, LA, Spin........

EDIT : this goes for non- potato targets as well.

frostz417

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

frostz417

Also. Might I drop on my last two cents and say spin to win doesn’t need a nerf until snipe gets a nerf, same with root spammers and snare spamming.

Solariken

frostz417 wrote: »

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

You're right it's a super mediocre skill, which is why nobody in the top MMR BG bracket really uses it.

Edit: WHOOPS sorry typo I meant it's a hella strong skill which is why every gd mother and her brother is running it in top MMR BGs. It's a freaking ballerina bloodbath wake the heck up man.

frostz417

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

You're right it's a super mediocre skill, which is why nobody in the top MMR BG bracket really uses it.

Edit: WHOOPS sorry typo I meant it's a hella strong skill which is why every gd mother and her brother is running it in top MMR BGs. It's a freaking ballerina bloodbath wake the heck up man.

Is that all you have to say to counter my argument? No facts proving otherwise? Also I play top bracket MMR and the spin to win isn’t even the main issue in there. The main issue is the perma root tanks with ice staves.. not spin to win, as I said before. The ability itself isn’t even good. Only good when pair’d with dawnbreaker.
Not to mention once again any decent player isn’t going to just run straight into a bunch of stam characters....
here’s a tip. Don’t be a potato

Solariken

frostz417 wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

You're right it's a super mediocre skill, which is why nobody in the top MMR BG bracket really uses it.

Edit: WHOOPS sorry typo I meant it's a hella strong skill which is why every gd mother and her brother is running it in top MMR BGs. It's a freaking ballerina bloodbath wake the heck up man.

Is that all you have to say to counter my argument? No facts proving otherwise? Also I play top bracket MMR and the spin to win isn’t even the main issue in there. The main issue is the perma root tanks with ice staves.. not spin to win, as I said before. The ability itself isn’t even good. Only good when pair’d with dawnbreaker.
Not to mention once again any decent player isn’t going to just run straight into a bunch of stam characters....
here’s a tip. Don’t be a potato

There are plenty of arguments and counterarguments already posted. I just made an appeal to the empirical. I wish we had access to hard stats but I'm pretty forkin sure DBoS is the most prevalent skill used in BGs by a country mile with Steel Tardnado coming in steamy second.

Permafrost and ice shenanigans are pretty annoying but that's generally a flavor of cheese abused by premade 4-stack tardballs.

Still not sure why you keep saying Steel Tardnado isn't good though. It's super strong. Used after DBoS, it hits harder than DBoS while also proccing bleeds and enchants.

But as a wise man once said, potatoes gonna potate. So I'll just keep throwing myself into the DBoS dogpiles like the potato I am until ZOS makes a respectable attempt to balance this mess.

frostz417

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

You're right it's a super mediocre skill, which is why nobody in the top MMR BG bracket really uses it.

Edit: WHOOPS sorry typo I meant it's a hella strong skill which is why every gd mother and her brother is running it in top MMR BGs. It's a freaking ballerina bloodbath wake the heck up man.

Is that all you have to say to counter my argument? No facts proving otherwise? Also I play top bracket MMR and the spin to win isn’t even the main issue in there. The main issue is the perma root tanks with ice staves.. not spin to win, as I said before. The ability itself isn’t even good. Only good when pair’d with dawnbreaker.
Not to mention once again any decent player isn’t going to just run straight into a bunch of stam characters....
here’s a tip. Don’t be a potato

There are plenty of arguments and counterarguments already posted. I just made an appeal to the empirical. I wish we had access to hard stats but I'm pretty forkin sure DBoS is the most prevalent skill used in BGs by a country mile with Steel Tardnado coming in steamy second.

Permafrost and ice shenanigans are pretty annoying but that's generally a flavor of cheese abused by premade 4-stack tardballs.

Still not sure why you keep saying Steel Tardnado isn't good though. It's super strong. Used after DBoS, it hits harder than DBoS while also proccing bleeds and enchants.

But as a wise man once said, potatoes gonna potate. So I'll just keep throwing myself into the DBoS dogpiles like the potato I am until ZOS makes a respectable attempt to balance this mess.

Well if you’re going to keep being a no skill potato and throw yourself into a group of stamdens you deserve to get farmed and bagged. 100%
Also, I’m not saying it’s not good. I’m simply saying It ain’t as game breakingly OP as you potatoes make it seem like. It doesnt even hit NEARLY as hard as DBoS, beetles, or any other execute for that matter.

It’s arguably the most easiest skill to counter, have some awareness and know if you’re running straight into a stamden who’s like “please charge me bro, I have a thicc burst ready for you mindless potato zerglings who are dumb enough to charge head first into me”
Also, might I mention that steel tornado is a complete meme in a 1v1. If you die to steel tornado in a 1v1 you should re-evaluate your full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc role playing build. If you think steel tornado hits hard alone you lack any knowledge. It’s the combo that makes it good. Even then common sense and combat awareness can easily make you avoid it.

If you’re going to cry about steel tornado being game breakingly OP how about we mention snipe? 40 meter dizzy swings that stun and apply major defile, can be mindlessly spammed from a safe distance and even cause a health desync.

I shall say this once again. Aquire some PvP skill and awareness and don’t be a mindless potato. L2p

wheem_ESO

frostz417 wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

You're right it's a super mediocre skill, which is why nobody in the top MMR BG bracket really uses it.

Edit: WHOOPS sorry typo I meant it's a hella strong skill which is why every gd mother and her brother is running it in top MMR BGs. It's a freaking ballerina bloodbath wake the heck up man.

Is that all you have to say to counter my argument? No facts proving otherwise? Also I play top bracket MMR and the spin to win isn’t even the main issue in there. The main issue is the perma root tanks with ice staves.. not spin to win, as I said before. The ability itself isn’t even good. Only good when pair’d with dawnbreaker.
Not to mention once again any decent player isn’t going to just run straight into a bunch of stam characters....
here’s a tip. Don’t be a potato

There are plenty of arguments and counterarguments already posted. I just made an appeal to the empirical. I wish we had access to hard stats but I'm pretty forkin sure DBoS is the most prevalent skill used in BGs by a country mile with Steel Tardnado coming in steamy second.

Permafrost and ice shenanigans are pretty annoying but that's generally a flavor of cheese abused by premade 4-stack tardballs.

Still not sure why you keep saying Steel Tardnado isn't good though. It's super strong. Used after DBoS, it hits harder than DBoS while also proccing bleeds and enchants.

But as a wise man once said, potatoes gonna potate. So I'll just keep throwing myself into the DBoS dogpiles like the potato I am until ZOS makes a respectable attempt to balance this mess.

Well if you’re going to keep being a no skill potato and throw yourself into a group of stamdens you deserve to get farmed and bagged. 100%
Also, I’m not saying it’s not good. I’m simply saying It ain’t as game breakingly OP as you potatoes make it seem like. It doesnt even hit NEARLY as hard as DBoS, beetles, or any other execute for that matter.

It’s arguably the most easiest skill to counter, have some awareness and know if you’re running straight into a stamden who’s like “please charge me bro, I have a thicc burst ready for you mindless potato zerglings who are dumb enough to charge head first into me”
Also, might I mention that steel tornado is a complete meme in a 1v1. If you die to steel tornado in a 1v1 you should re-evaluate your full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc role playing build. If you think steel tornado hits hard alone you lack any knowledge. It’s the combo that makes it good. Even then common sense and combat awareness can easily make you avoid it.

If you’re going to cry about steel tornado being game breakingly OP how about we mention snipe? 40 meter dizzy swings that stun and apply major defile, can be mindlessly spammed from a safe distance and even cause a health desync.

I shall say this once again. Aquire some PvP skill and awareness and don’t be a mindless potato. L2p

You can call him a potato a bunch of times if you want, but it's not true.

All three Stamina weapon lines have an execute available yet virtually everyone in Battlegrounds uses the same one, I wonder why that is? Almost all Stam builds are now using 2h/DW, so Poison Injection is usually out straight away (barring archer builds, of course), but why use the DW execute over the 2h version? The 2h execute hits harder on a single target, and at least some classes have better ways of countering stealth (like Hurricane), but I virtually never get hit by it. 'Course, Nightblades aren't nearly as common as they used to be in the high MMR games anyway.

As I said earlier in the thread, it's as close to a spammable as is needed for many (most?) Stamina builds in Battlegrounds; stack up bleeds, Dawnbreaker, Spin-spam. When several players team up and do it together, it's not that uncommon to get some team wipes going.

'Course, I'm probably a little bitter since the only "execute" I have access to requires me to dedicate both ultimate slots, micromanage a pet, and hope he doesn't bug out and vanish (while not actually being dead). Meanwhile, Stam builds just spam one button without having to worry about accidentally targeting the wrong thing, and get the bonus of applying a DOT that is superior to mine (even if I double cast it) to other targets.

NuarBlack

Spin2win is good because of its two unique mechanics which no one seems to be able to recognize and it makes all there arguments and comparisons non-starters. One, it doesn't need to be aimed. Eso has a targeting problem especially on console and zoo sorcs and pack leader werewolves still cause issues everywhere or just the general zerg ball issues of the game. So unlike mages fury or another single target execute where you will miss the execute cause it targeted a pet or another player, spin2win you just have to be in range with no aiming required.

Second, spin2win doesn't have a thrushhold at which it becomes effective like other executes which is at 25% pretty much across the board even for reverse slice. It scales linear starting at 99% health then gains the dw bonus on top at 25% making it rather effective as a spammable despite what some are trying to claim. Meaning it is vastly more effective than its tool tip 99% of the time as a spammable.

Now whether this is a problem with spin2win or the fact that other options are lackluster or other core mechanics in ESO are the problem like targeting or the standardization of all AOEs being undodgeable could be debated.

kalunte

just another point that often forget to be mentioned:

as an AOE skill, it is undodgeable for sur, but also you dont even have to care about targeting anything, do a proper waving with LA/HA or whatever.

this may not annoy many of aoe user, but this part of the problem hurst me the most. you just go in, and do as much (if not more while getting into execute phase) damage as a single target ability in 1vs1 fight, needless to say 2/3/4/5times the dmg a single target ability does when you hit 2/3/4/5/+ enemies at the same time..

i assume i'm a stamina nightblade using a bow and i dealt with all game mechanics since the very begining of the game. still this particular spell is way too popular to be fair.

-medium range (9m radius => melee attacks are 5m..)
-cost: 3780 base cost, minus 15% from DW passive, minus up to 14% Medium Armor passive =>2684 real cost
-AOE: cant be dodged,
-AOE: no need to target
-Direct Damage aoe: removes cloak or any invisible
-Direct Damage aoe: procs enchants and all other buffs
-same base dmg as execute skills in general but still gets +20% dmg from DW passive.
-synergize a bit too well with permafrost because of DW "ruffian" 's passive (WHILE USING DUAL WIELD ATTACKS, Gives you a 15% damage bonus when attacking stunned, immobilized, disoriented, or silenced enemies.)

the spell is good. maybe too good, maybe not. it just stacks so many unfair things on its own that ppl can see some and starts crying.

again, this spell allows ppl not to use many other spell but this one + 1 or 2 and ultimate to do the damage part of the job leaving 7/8 slots for dmg and surviability buffs. you can also build your entire stuff around this only spell and it'll work for every class.

ppl have been complaining about sorcs being able in the past to insta-blow-you-up when doing their combo perfectly but at least they add to target at you and throw the entire combo on you only.

with "skill-tornado" you barely only have to slot the spell and manage to run at 9m- of your opponent to start being a real pain that must be taken care of. i mean, even the worst players when they cross a healer becomes a real tough guy with skill tornado on, best players just become gods. (guldarx if you read this, you're the ig-god i'm pointing at )

Bam_Bam

Jakx wrote: »

Death Recap.

Steel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel Tornado


I think I made my point. All the nerf threads and this plague in the game continues. I said it once before... tell me more about an AOE ability with a built in execute mechanic that isnt dodgeable. Do you know why magwarden rose up? It was in the response to the OP stam meta that we currently have and spin-to-win heroes. I'm completely on board with magden having access to too many easy things like major protection and awful slows but just remember it was born from necessity because of OP stam meta. I'm all for having a discussion about immobilize effects but everyone seems to conveniently forget the flip side of how strong stam specs are at the moment.

Just keep spinning.

Except, if you play your "spin to win" as you describe - "Steel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel TornadoSteel Tornado", you'll be out of your main resource quickly and then susceptible to all kinds of anger and hate and get smashed.

Bam_Bam

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

The apply and forget skill which brings you to execute range is more of an issue rather than this skill itself

I think the execute by itself is actually expensive to use

THIS.

frostz417

wheem_ESO wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Solariken wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

I find it funny how most good players who have any PvP knowledge and skill don’t have an issue with spin to win.

Why? Because anyone with a brain can tell when a stam set up is literally RUNNING towards them about to DB spin to win.
The ability cost 3.7k stam, does about low base damage only making it more when in execute and even then it’s no more than 5k 6k highest it’ll ever be. Other executes such as radiant, endless fury, impale, reverse slice etc hit 6-8k or higher.

Spin is most effective against cloak blades who spam cloak and cry relentlessly when they’re cloak is countered by anything.

Most people who complain about spin to win are people who go into cyro or BG’s with a pve build or running some kind of full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc Role play build and get farmed.

Sorry that the facts hurt. Spin to win isn’t much of an issue if you have any decent PvP knowledge and know how to actually counter or have any awareness.

Also, dying in a 1v1 to a spin to win spammer is a complete meme. You should re-evaluate your PvP build and playstyle if you die to this..

You're right it's a super mediocre skill, which is why nobody in the top MMR BG bracket really uses it.

Edit: WHOOPS sorry typo I meant it's a hella strong skill which is why every gd mother and her brother is running it in top MMR BGs. It's a freaking ballerina bloodbath wake the heck up man.

Is that all you have to say to counter my argument? No facts proving otherwise? Also I play top bracket MMR and the spin to win isn’t even the main issue in there. The main issue is the perma root tanks with ice staves.. not spin to win, as I said before. The ability itself isn’t even good. Only good when pair’d with dawnbreaker.
Not to mention once again any decent player isn’t going to just run straight into a bunch of stam characters....
here’s a tip. Don’t be a potato

There are plenty of arguments and counterarguments already posted. I just made an appeal to the empirical. I wish we had access to hard stats but I'm pretty forkin sure DBoS is the most prevalent skill used in BGs by a country mile with Steel Tardnado coming in steamy second.

Permafrost and ice shenanigans are pretty annoying but that's generally a flavor of cheese abused by premade 4-stack tardballs.

Still not sure why you keep saying Steel Tardnado isn't good though. It's super strong. Used after DBoS, it hits harder than DBoS while also proccing bleeds and enchants.

But as a wise man once said, potatoes gonna potate. So I'll just keep throwing myself into the DBoS dogpiles like the potato I am until ZOS makes a respectable attempt to balance this mess.

Well if you’re going to keep being a no skill potato and throw yourself into a group of stamdens you deserve to get farmed and bagged. 100%
Also, I’m not saying it’s not good. I’m simply saying It ain’t as game breakingly OP as you potatoes make it seem like. It doesnt even hit NEARLY as hard as DBoS, beetles, or any other execute for that matter.

It’s arguably the most easiest skill to counter, have some awareness and know if you’re running straight into a stamden who’s like “please charge me bro, I have a thicc burst ready for you mindless potato zerglings who are dumb enough to charge head first into me”
Also, might I mention that steel tornado is a complete meme in a 1v1. If you die to steel tornado in a 1v1 you should re-evaluate your full divines hybrid bow destro pet sorc role playing build. If you think steel tornado hits hard alone you lack any knowledge. It’s the combo that makes it good. Even then common sense and combat awareness can easily make you avoid it.

If you’re going to cry about steel tornado being game breakingly OP how about we mention snipe? 40 meter dizzy swings that stun and apply major defile, can be mindlessly spammed from a safe distance and even cause a health desync.

I shall say this once again. Aquire some PvP skill and awareness and don’t be a mindless potato. L2p

You can call him a potato a bunch of times if you want, but it's not true.

All three Stamina weapon lines have an execute available yet virtually everyone in Battlegrounds uses the same one, I wonder why that is? Almost all Stam builds are now using 2h/DW, so Poison Injection is usually out straight away (barring archer builds, of course), but why use the DW execute over the 2h version? The 2h execute hits harder on a single target, and at least some classes have better ways of countering stealth (like Hurricane), but I virtually never get hit by it. 'Course, Nightblades aren't nearly as common as they used to be in the high MMR games anyway.

As I said earlier in the thread, it's as close to a spammable as is needed for many (most?) Stamina builds in Battlegrounds; stack up bleeds, Dawnbreaker, Spin-spam. When several players team up and do it together, it's not that uncommon to get some team wipes going.

'Course, I'm probably a little bitter since the only "execute" I have access to requires me to dedicate both ultimate slots, micromanage a pet, and hope he doesn't bug out and vanish (while not actually being dead). Meanwhile, Stam builds just spam one button without having to worry about accidentally targeting the wrong thing, and get the bonus of applying a DOT that is superior to mine (even if I double cast it) to other targets.

If you honestly think a stam player who just spans spin to win and only spin to win is OP... oh buddy. I’d only argue it’s Op when combo’d with dawny and beetles or other things. But in realty the skill alone isn’t that great. It’s only good being complemented with other skills. It’s literally the finisher.

If you’re honestly dying to someone who’s only spamming s2w and you’re at 100% health, that’s an l2p issue right there bud. There’s no way around it. Literally that’s just sad dying to just s2w from 100% health.

Of course it’s OP with a group doing it.... but that can apply to almost anything. Magplars all Jesus beaming you at once, a bunch of snipes hitting you. People stacking destro ultimates, etc. You get the point.

Also, most of those stam builds who only use bleeds dawny and s2w are built only for group comp. they aren’t any good solo or if you’re in a 1v1 with them, which happens more often than not.

Also, for your double bar execute I assume you’re speaking of a magden.. which is one of my favorite PvP classes, so allow me to ask. Why in the hell are you running the bear in pvp? You’re literally gimping yourself by using that silly ultimates lol. Slot northern storm, executes aren’t even needed to be a good player in PvP. My magden just does a good ol’e Beetle, LA, shock reach, LA, Elemental weapon(Or birds if you like them better), gg they’re most likely done for. I got a little of topic there but that’s just a suggestion Incase you’re having a hard time with a magden, cuz trust me I used to struggle a lot with it. Has a steeper learning curve than most other classes.