Master's Bow needs a big nerf and Ballista Ultimate as well

LeHarrt91

Soul Assault on a MagDen can get to 80K and prevents stealth for a few seconds. Line up Deep Fissure, Stun and Assault away (bonus is that you can use any weapon, Ballista requires a bow to be slotted). To top it off its 75 ultimate cheaper and Ballista.

idk

*Grabs popcorn

Vapirko

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

Soul Assault on a MagDen can get to 80K and prevents stealth for a few seconds. Line up Deep Fissure, Stun and Assault away (bonus is that you can use any weapon, Ballista requires a bow to be slotted). To top it off its 75 ultimate cheaper and Ballista.

True but the soul assault has always been considered a very cheesy ult. Thank god it’s not what it used to be.

Unfadingsilence

As I said when OP posted this... just a L2P post right here ppl nothing more to see, but can I get some likes tho??

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO

nsmurfer wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

LOL

I never expected someone would call me out, much less for "spamming Ballista".

But as you did, lemme break apart your post.

• Master's Bow gives 301 Weapon Damage, not 750. 450 extra comes from Infused enchant. The 301 weapon damage is a debuff on the enemy, not a self buff and hence is not affected by any buffs like Major Brutality, medium armor passive and only affects one enemy. By using it, you are losing out on the 4pc and 5pc bonus of a set on the bar it is in. While as a backbar weapon, it is certainly strong, it is not really OP. 301 weapon damage is not going to turn you into godmode 1vXer beast.
• Ballista is strong, only in certain situations. While, it does the highest damage as an Ulti in the game, it is freaking dodgeable. I do use it to kill scrubs and I certainly cannot spam it. Against good opponents, it only serves to drain stamina real fast, if you pair it with a CC. I primarily use it in outnumbered combat to force someone out of offensive for 5 secs, so I can cloak out or if I see you spamming Snipe.

Unbelievable, how you can defend your trashy playstyle while pretending to be innocent. you probably a broken build and defend it. It is ridiculous how it takes multiple people to hunt exploiters like you, while you can happily destroy someone in the middle of dozens of players and get out. I have been playing since beta so dont bother giving the L2P card. you know some thing is wrong when someone dodge 6+ in a row, spamming vigor and shuffle and not running out of stamina whatsever, while eating a 4k spell dmg, 48k magicka soul assault and still being able to drop Ballista and kill people with zero sustain issue what so ever. I got combat logs of your ballista killing me mid Soul Assault ticking over 28k HP, while I am stuck in Soul Assault animation. both are channels, why should one guy survive while the other dies.

OneKhajiitCrimeWave wrote: »

That setup is very clever, not going to lie.
And this is what we mean when we talk about people making strong builds. There's nothing broken in that, and definitely nothing trashy about it.

A few people who read the thread will have to go look up Shadow Walker because it's an "off radar" set. Damn strong set when used right and i'm surprised/glad more people don't run it.

And OP, maybe a member of your group can invest in some detect pots? Or your NB tank can run and spam mark?

TLDR: sweet build, OP L2zerg

Shadow Walker has been a top three favorite set of mine forever. If you have just one or two enchantments set to magic recovery you get a great sustain and health set. Hard to pull off with needing to stay still but very useful.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

nsmurfer wrote: »

Master's Bow is the most OP single item in pvp in the game. it is way way more broken than Master's DW (which itself is broken af imo). after ZOS butchered my main magsorc from beta, i switched to stamblade and from what I have seen playing one for the last month, the base class in itself is quite balanced, but itemization and the bow skill line makes it possible to create ridiculous builds on stamblade.
And of all these items, Master's Bow is the most broken, giving 750 weapon damage from using the strong DoT in the game. why bother with bleeds that tick for 2k max every 2 secs when you can get 2k+ damage evry sec with an included execution capability. Adding 750 weapon damage to Poison injection from a single weapon is ridiculously broken. It is creating a toxic divide in the PvP, where this one item is separating the normal stamblades from the broken godmode stamblades. Why bother to invest in damage sets, when you can simply build for sustain and survivability while backbar Master's Bow gives you the power of more than 2xHunding's Rage. Almost every single good openworld/duel/BG stamblade I know is using it, while other PvPers cannot really match them as said Bow (inspite of being BiS PvP weapon) is locked behind one of the hardest PvE good content. This forced rarity is classic toxic dev mentality of catering to the elitist minority while abandoning the vast majority of players.

also, Ballista..... It is ridiculous how a 70K+ tooltip ultimate is allowed to stay in the game unnerfed. It can literally take someone from max HP to zero in matter of seconds. there is this AD stamblade shadow kiter in pc na vivec, who is spamming this ulti for 30K+ damage on 28k resist and 3k crit resist builds. It is so freaking *** how OP this ulti is, with no realistic means of defense. every time, i meet this dude, it goes the same way with him dodging and cloaking 90% of attacks, then fear to ballista with bow proc, then spamming the sap essense stam morph, till I die. it is the same result on my magsorc, bleedsorc, bleedblade, rollerblade. even if I survive, I will out of resources trying to shield, outheal, dodge, block it, making me a free kill at this point. Ballista needs to at least 250 ulti with lesser damage. Apart from wingsDK and magplar or nearby LOS, this ulti is pretty auto win.

I uh... um. I am having serious trouble determining the true purpose of this post. Is.... is this real?

Their is none

Trancestor

Ballista sound is bugged, you can't hear it most of the time when it's pounding on you and its kinda hard to see it too, other than that l2p.

Ramber

I only use masters bows in PVP and its not that OP at all, and now you give up a 4th and 5th set piece to use it.

Jameliel

If you catch the right people off guard, you can melt them. Other than that, lots of players will smash you if they don't melt in your first combo or 2. You cant really carry a masters bow defendant build and not be extremely squishy. You may kill a lot, but you certainly die a lot too unless you try 1 combo and then immediately cloak and run if they don't die.

Sheezabeast

Some people have an incredible amount of love for their hard to obtain end game bow gear. Don't ruin it for them, join them.

templesus

This can’t be real right? Nah, can’t be real. Someone asking for nerfs of Master Bow which is in itself mediocre because bow in its entirety is average at best, AND said person also stated Stamblade is balanced? Can’t be real, don’t believe it.

TheYKcid

nsmurfer wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Also, calling me an exploiter because you think I spammed dodge, Vigor, Shuffle etc is kinda BS. None of those needs spamming and even I wanted to, I can easily do so, as I build for enough sustain for it. 4k Spell damage, 48k magicka will always die to something with lesser damage potential but with higher sustain in fights that last longer than 10 secs.

you dragged my group all the way from ash to nik, spamming said skills and I am pretty sure that requires 3k+ stam recovery with cost reduction setup. Given you use a khajit, not bosmer, redguard or argonian, i am willing to bet that it requires a zero damage sustain setup, which you obviously dont use given your damage potential. one of my groupies was a Nb tank, who had 45k Hp and you dropped him as well, which is ridiculous as i have seen him tank more than half a dozen player.

LOL if you and your entire grouped chased a solo all the way to the next keep (and still got your asses kicked), then there's a certain term for the kind of player you are, and it starts with a Z.

No one is going to take you seriously when you make balance calls. Or claim to know the limits of a proper solo build, when it's painfully clear you haven't explored that avenue of play to any meaningful degree. 3k stam regen required for staying in the fight as a Stamblade? Master bow giving 750 WD? Give us a break, dude.

Sparr0w

brandonv516 wrote: »

Guess you've never heard of the 100k tooltip Soul Assault.

Pretty sure I've felt one

supaskrub

If you are dying to Ballista and come into the forums asking for it to be nerfed you should have your posting rights removed..

D0PAMINE

Damn im always late to these threads and all the best comments are already posted.

NoMoreChillies

after reading this *GEM* of a thread, the only logical conclusion is :

NERF SORCS

therift

"It's better to be thought a fool than to open one's mouth post a salty nerf thread and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln

Masel

susmitds wrote: »

LOL

I never expected someone would call me out, much less for "spamming Ballista".

But as you did, lemme break apart your post.

• Master's Bow gives 301 Weapon Damage, not 750. 450 extra comes from Infused enchant. The 301 weapon damage is a debuff on the enemy, not a self buff and hence is not affected by any buffs like Major Brutality, medium armor passive and only affects one enemy. By using it, you are losing out on the 4pc and 5pc bonus of a set on the bar it is in. While as a backbar weapon, it is certainly strong, it is not really OP. 301 weapon damage is not going to turn you into godmode 1vXer beast.
• Ballista is strong, only in certain situations. While, it does the highest damage as an Ulti in the game, it is freaking dodgeable. I do use it to kill scrubs and I certainly cannot spam it. Against good opponents, it only serves to drain stamina real fast, if you pair it with a CC. I primarily use it in outnumbered combat to force someone out of offensive for 5 secs, so I can cloak out or if I see you spamming Snipe.

The weapon damage is affected by major and minor brutality and all other weapon damage amps. What makes you think otherwise?

SupremeRissole

This thread has made my day

"This guy 1vX'd my whole trashy ball group and its all because he uses a bow that gives (insert incorrect weapon damage) and uses a dodgeable/blockable 175 ultimate"

Learn
To
Play

People will literally complain about anything these days, I swear one dude is gonna die to viper and call for another nerf on it.

The only thing truly broken in ESO is the server.

Siohwenoeht

Masel wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

LOL

I never expected someone would call me out, much less for "spamming Ballista".

But as you did, lemme break apart your post.

• Master's Bow gives 301 Weapon Damage, not 750. 450 extra comes from Infused enchant. The 301 weapon damage is a debuff on the enemy, not a self buff and hence is not affected by any buffs like Major Brutality, medium armor passive and only affects one enemy. By using it, you are losing out on the 4pc and 5pc bonus of a set on the bar it is in. While as a backbar weapon, it is certainly strong, it is not really OP. 301 weapon damage is not going to turn you into godmode 1vXer beast.
• Ballista is strong, only in certain situations. While, it does the highest damage as an Ulti in the game, it is freaking dodgeable. I do use it to kill scrubs and I certainly cannot spam it. Against good opponents, it only serves to drain stamina real fast, if you pair it with a CC. I primarily use it in outnumbered combat to force someone out of offensive for 5 secs, so I can cloak out or if I see you spamming Snipe.

The weapon damage is affected by major and minor brutality and all other weapon damage amps. What makes you think otherwise?

Iirc because it only affects your target after applying poison arrow it acts as a debuff only to your target and maintains it's flat value of 301. e.g. it won't affect how much damage your pet does etc.

Kel

You chased him 6v1 and blame him for it...that's hilarious....

You complain about him ducking out of fights, yet see nothing you tried to counter it, like sloting Radiant Magelight or using detect pots....

You seem to do nothing to mitigate the damage from Ballista, like LoS or blocking or dodge rolling...you seem to just stand there taking damage from a ultimate and think you should somehow survive.
This reminds me of the thread asking for dawnbreaker to be nerfed because someone was getting hit by multiple and thinking they should live through it.

You say "don't play the L2P card with me" yet this is all a L2P issue.

Don't stand there doing nothing and think you're supposed to survive a ultimate.
L2P

TheYKcid

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Masel wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

LOL

I never expected someone would call me out, much less for "spamming Ballista".

But as you did, lemme break apart your post.

• Master's Bow gives 301 Weapon Damage, not 750. 450 extra comes from Infused enchant. The 301 weapon damage is a debuff on the enemy, not a self buff and hence is not affected by any buffs like Major Brutality, medium armor passive and only affects one enemy. By using it, you are losing out on the 4pc and 5pc bonus of a set on the bar it is in. While as a backbar weapon, it is certainly strong, it is not really OP. 301 weapon damage is not going to turn you into godmode 1vXer beast.
• Ballista is strong, only in certain situations. While, it does the highest damage as an Ulti in the game, it is freaking dodgeable. I do use it to kill scrubs and I certainly cannot spam it. Against good opponents, it only serves to drain stamina real fast, if you pair it with a CC. I primarily use it in outnumbered combat to force someone out of offensive for 5 secs, so I can cloak out or if I see you spamming Snipe.

The weapon damage is affected by major and minor brutality and all other weapon damage amps. What makes you think otherwise?

Iirc because it only affects your target after applying poison arrow it acts as a debuff only to your target and maintains it's flat value of 301. e.g. it won't affect how much damage your pet does etc.

Masel is correct. Caustic Arrow is factored as a debuff that adds 301 base WD to any attack from applicant towards the target, and therefore is multiplied through any %-WD bonuses the applicant possesses. Spell Strat behaves the same way.

Nevertheless, this doesn't mean Master bow overperforms in any way. It's rarely the preferred choice over Master DW, which adds FAR more pressure (contrary to what OP seems to believe). It also comes with the innate drawbacks of backbarring a bow—namely the hugely reduced WD on that bar (approx. 450, before multipliers) which significantly reduces the tooltip of any skills run on that bar (PI itself obviously, but also vigor for example, which is almost always forced onto the backbar for Stamblade). And being unable to setup your combo against a wing spammer, for another.

There's also the consideration—as with any Arena weapon—of dropping uptime on one of your 5pc sets, which further reduces the stats on your backbar. And which also restricts the number and types of sets you can run, compared to pure 5/5/2.

PS. It doesn't affect pet damage because most pets scale off max magicka exclusively. The exception is Atronach.

Miswar

Nerf xD ...you don't even need an Masters bow on proper snipe build xD

People in these forums have real "learn to play" issues.

Actually visited cyrodil yesterday and there were a lot these "nerf this and that" people all over the map and they could not kill a damn thing nor protect themselves.

Kadoin

OneKhajiitCrimeWave wrote: »

Rules for fighting ballista:

1. Don't be a fool. If you're channeling a skill break it off. Ballista is not a channel so they can heal, block and LoS while you're getting destroyed.
2. If you see a gold shiny item appear move away from it fast. Throw in a dodge roll, some heals/shields/both. If you have 48k Magicka then spam shields to mitigate damage to your health bar.
3. Line of Sight it. If you engaged in wide open ground with no cover by choice (like it seems to imply if you were hunting them 6 on 1) then that is on you.

Also as a general rule, unless you know a setup is "broken" don't put people on blast for their setup or simply label it a "trashy playstyle"

What happens when someone bugs it out to make it invisible though? You don't see or hear it. I know someone that does it all the time, and from what I've seen the bug is pretty simple to pull off.

therift

Kadoin wrote: »

OneKhajiitCrimeWave wrote: »

Rules for fighting ballista:

1. Don't be a fool. If you're channeling a skill break it off. Ballista is not a channel so they can heal, block and LoS while you're getting destroyed.
2. If you see a gold shiny item appear move away from it fast. Throw in a dodge roll, some heals/shields/both. If you have 48k Magicka then spam shields to mitigate damage to your health bar.
3. Line of Sight it. If you engaged in wide open ground with no cover by choice (like it seems to imply if you were hunting them 6 on 1) then that is on you.

Also as a general rule, unless you know a setup is "broken" don't put people on blast for their setup or simply label it a "trashy playstyle"

What happens when someone bugs it out to make it invisible though? You don't see or hear it. I know someone that does it all the time, and from what I've seen the bug is pretty simple to pull off.

Then you collect any evidence you can... circumstances of when and how the bug was exploited... and report it using the in-game Bug reporting tool.

You don't post a salty nerf thread requesting that a weapon everyone else uses legitimately be nerfed because you think that will take care of the exploit from the bug.

Kel

therift wrote: »

Kadoin wrote: »

OneKhajiitCrimeWave wrote: »

Rules for fighting ballista:

1. Don't be a fool. If you're channeling a skill break it off. Ballista is not a channel so they can heal, block and LoS while you're getting destroyed.
2. If you see a gold shiny item appear move away from it fast. Throw in a dodge roll, some heals/shields/both. If you have 48k Magicka then spam shields to mitigate damage to your health bar.
3. Line of Sight it. If you engaged in wide open ground with no cover by choice (like it seems to imply if you were hunting them 6 on 1) then that is on you.

Also as a general rule, unless you know a setup is "broken" don't put people on blast for their setup or simply label it a "trashy playstyle"

What happens when someone bugs it out to make it invisible though? You don't see or hear it. I know someone that does it all the time, and from what I've seen the bug is pretty simple to pull off.

Then you collect any evidence you can... circumstances of when and how the bug was exploited... and report it using the in-game Bug reporting tool.

You don't post a salty nerf thread requesting that a weapon everyone else uses legitimately be nerfed because you think that will take care of the exploit from the bug.

This should be bannered at the top of the form. Everyone should see this post.

Lord_Eomer

JobooAGS wrote: »

Master bow is only 301 weapon damage to a single target, not 750. If you are including enchants well, those are another seperate problem. Ballista only takes a dodge or 2 and 175 ultimate is wasted.

Ballista hit very harder on magicka players,

Where you hardly have stamina to dodgeroll or cc break!

This skill might need some adjustments for pvp!

nsmurfer

I tried shadow walker in the past and it is useless. you can't move, do anything which is useless in combat.

susmitds wrote: »

Also, calling me an exploiter because you think I spammed dodge, Vigor, Shuffle etc is kinda BS. None of those needs spamming and even I wanted to, I can easily do so, as I build for enough sustain for it. 4k Spell damage, 48k magicka will always die to something with lesser damage potential but with higher sustain in fights that last longer than 10 secs.

You single-bar the one of the most useless sets and call it building for sustain? my pal who is Legate on his NB use bone pirate+battle acrobat both bars and cannot spam dodge+vigor without running out. That too, while actually using a real sustain build not a half-assed one. i personally use @Alcast 's assassin build - master bow on my nb, probably the best builds for nb pvp but when my surprise attack hits for sub 3k on the average person, while Sap essence's stam morph hits me on my 28k resist Magsorc for 4k upwards, with Master's bow being the primary difference, it has to be OP.

TheYKcid

That awkward moment when someone quotes alliance rank as the yardstick for skill...

Emma_Overload

brandonv516 wrote: »

Guess you've never heard of the 100k tooltip Soul Assault.

I've heard of it, and I can tell you that Ballista is so much better that I've considered running back-barred Bow on my MAGICKA Sorcerer!

The biggest and most important difference between Ballista and Soul Assault is that channeling Soul Assault leaves you incredibly vulnerable to counter-attack by competent players. For that reason alone, I've stopped using it when I'm running solo.