Mage's Wrath stealing kills in BGs

Ivan04

You know what the issue is for over a year now, I know coding is hard, but please pay attention to it and fix it.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Wrobel

helios777

Ivan04 wrote: »

You know what the issue is for over a year now, I know coding is hard, but please pay attention to it and fix it.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Wrobel

Go away

Reverb

I get plenty types of kills on my DK and my Templar. If you are having so many kills "stolen" that you need to open forum topics about it, take a good look at your own contribution to your matches.

Strider__Roshin

The person that procs it should get the credit.

Feanor

Daus wrote: »

The person that procs it should get the credit.

Not a good solution either. As someone pointed out, you can steal the kill from the Sorc then.

Derra

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

bardx86

The explosion doesn't even kill most builds anymore and it can be dodged. Its fine.

Beardimus

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

This ^

And just get a sorc on your team. Execute is their role, as your healers is support. Kills only fuel one game type also.

I think most complaints are from people having a sorc on their team and having their kill score 'beat' but it's a team game so who cares if you win the match!

ezio45

whatever you do zos, dont nerf wrath -_- this is a problem with how the system regesters kills not wrath...

as much as yall would love to bury sorc a little further with the old nerf hammer.....

RebornV3x

They could do what Battlefield does if you do more than 75% damage to another player but someone else deals the killing shot its called "Assist counts as Kill" and counts as a kill for the player that did the most damage it also counts as a kill for the other person to.

Ashamray

Live sorcs alone, if they won't be able to earn frags and bring medals to the team, what's the reason to be a sorc there?

jrgray93

I also find it extremely annoying when I'm something like 4-5-25 at the end of a BG, especially when it's the other team getting the kills. That said, I'm not sure how they could address that. Making it register the person who triggered it as the killer is only good within your team. If it's a cross-team assist, it's more a nerf to the sorc than it's worth.

Also, no, wrath and fury stealing kills doesn't reflect on what you're doing right or wrong. That's a silly argument. And no, making it dodgable didn't make it not take kills. Not everyone is spamming dodge rolls. Some of us play magic.

mr_wazzabi

RebornV3x wrote: »

They could do what Battlefield does if you do more than 75% damage to another player but someone else deals the killing shot its called "Assist counts as Kill" and counts as a kill for the player that did the most damage it also counts as a kill for the other person to.

I made a post with this suggestion a while back. Give both players the credit and points for both teams. It's ok if we have draws in the match.

Juhasow

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

To be honest for someone that spams it fact it's dodgable changed literally nothing.

ku5h

Juhasow wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

To be honest for someone that spams it fact it's dodgable changed literally nothing.

How come? Dodge cancel Vigor and you're out of executer range when next one hits you, while the Sorc is wasting precious GCDs. It's more then enough of a counter.

mr_wazzabi

ku5h wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

To be honest for someone that spams it fact it's dodgable changed literally nothing.

How come? You do vigor into dodge and you're out of executer range when next one hits you, while the Sorc is wasting precious GCDs. It's more then enough of a counter.

Vigor won't take you fro 5 to 20% and stop an execute. I've died more times than I can count trying to exactly what you said.

DeadlyRecluse

1 point for team who did most damage to a kill, 1 point for team who got KB: that (relatively) simple change would eliminate most killstealing concerns, imo.

Mages wrath is the most egregious, even now that it's dodgeable, for pure killstealing, but it's far from the only culprit. I've gotten hilarious scores intentionally not engaging in fights and killstealing with radiant destruction, for example.

Juhasow

They should just make executes to cost 2x more resources when used on enemy with more then 50% health.

ku5h wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

To be honest for someone that spams it fact it's dodgable changed literally nothing.

How come? Dodge cancel Vigor and you're out of executer range when next one hits you, while the Sorc is wasting precious GCDs. It's more then enough of a counter.

It's to easy to apply dmg through dodge on target that struggles with surviving and have no escape options. In BGs there are magsorcs specialized to spam heavy attack from lightning staff+curse with oblivion dmg enchant and optionally torug's pact and some other memes just to make sure sooner or later when You'll be out of stam because of roll dodge spam You will die instantly from execute. It's undodgable unblockable range dmg pressure you cant do anything about because most of the time those sorcs will flee away the moment You'll be closer then 20 meters or if there wont be any of their allies between You and them and then when You'll engage some combat they'll start their memes with spamming execute when You are full hp just to secure the kill that others worked on. Dedicated execute spammer is legit build option for battlegrounds which is kinda stupid.

greenmachine

Take their shields away. Dead sorcs can't execute.

Solariken

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

Why because everyone plays a roll-spamming stamblade?

Biro123

Juhasow wrote: »

They should just make executes to cost 2x more resources when used on enemy with more then 50% health.

ku5h wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

To be honest for someone that spams it fact it's dodgable changed literally nothing.

How come? Dodge cancel Vigor and you're out of executer range when next one hits you, while the Sorc is wasting precious GCDs. It's more then enough of a counter.

It's to easy to apply dmg through dodge on target that struggles with surviving and have no escape options. In BGs there are magsorcs specialized to spam heavy attack from lightning staff+curse with oblivion dmg enchant and optionally torug's pact and some other memes just to make sure sooner or later when You'll be out of stam because of roll dodge spam You will die instantly from execute. It's undodgable unblockable range dmg pressure you cant do anything about because most of the time those sorcs will flee away the moment You'll be closer then 20 meters or if there wont be any of their allies between You and them and then when You'll engage some combat they'll start their memes with spamming execute when You are full hp just to secure the kill that others worked on. Dedicated execute spammer is legit build option for battlegrounds which is kinda stupid.

Perhaps lack of spammable has something to do with that? Old-fashioned DW builds used to use wrath as a spammable, because it's all they had.

Sorc' is a burst class, and wrath has the longest duration out of all the burst abilities, so absolutely can be cast first in q burst rotation.

Still, the main problem is not the ability, but scoring based on kills. It was fine before bgs existed, was, and still is an integral and necessary component of sorc-burst.

Lord-Otto

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

ku5h wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Ever since it became dodgeable it´s not a valid argument anymore.

To be honest for someone that spams it fact it's dodgable changed literally nothing.

How come? You do vigor into dodge and you're out of executer range when next one hits you, while the Sorc is wasting precious GCDs. It's more then enough of a counter.

Vigor won't take you fro 5 to 20% and stop an execute. I've died more times than I can count trying to exactly what you said.

You surviving Fury is more of a testament as to how weak its damage really is.

Ivan04

I'm gonna keep starting threads regularly until our beloved devs address it in some way, because it is an issue, whether you (magsorc main) believe it or not. It's too obvious at this point and does not need explaining.

Biro123

Ivan04 wrote: »

I'm gonna keep starting threads regularly until our beloved devs address it in some way, because it is an issue, whether you (magsorc main) believe it or not. It's too obvious at this point and does not need explaining.

It's an issue, just not with the ability.

Perhaps you'd see more people agreeing if your threads instead ask for the scoring to change.

jaws343

Ivan04 wrote: »

I'm gonna keep starting threads regularly until our beloved devs address it in some way, because it is an issue, whether you (magsorc main) believe it or not. It's too obvious at this point and does not need explaining.

But it isn't an issue. Focus the sorc and kill them if you are having a problem with it. Anyone can kill steal, anyone. Nightblades do it and do it much more effectively than mag sorcs because they can do it from stealth. Can't tell you how many times AOE's got the last tick of damage on an opponent I was targeting.

And this is a competitive game. Get your kill before the sorc can cast fury or before the sorc gets to the fight.

And in PVP, I don't have a main, I play all classes. And I kill steal far more on my DK with leap than picking enemies off one by one on a mag sorc.

WoppaBoem

You need to be able to steel kills that is the game much fun to do it. However I do feel the frustration. Many times a long ranged sorc spams the execute and steels my kills. It is sad really and sounds fun to do for like 2 games but doing more than that is really boring. We all need to have differences so there always outliners that make you gringe and this is one but don't change it who knows what will be next....

bardx86

greenmachine wrote: »

Take their shields away. Dead sorcs can't execute.

They already did

Ivan04

To steal kills on other classes you have to actually execute your opponents. On magsorc you can just mark someone as your kill and leave. You don't have to actively engage in combat when the enemy is low on health. That is the issue.

jcm2606

Ivan04 wrote: »

To steal kills on other classes you have to actually execute your opponents. On magsorc you can just mark someone as your kill and leave. You don't have to actively engage in combat when the enemy is low on health. That is the issue.

This. This is the problem with comparing Sorc to other classes when it comes to kill stealing. Other classes, you actually have to commit in order to steal the kill.

Going to leap into a group with lower health players? You're committing all of your ultimate, and your positioning to it.

Going to weave in and out of stealth, picking off targets? You're committing your magicka, positioning, time, and effort into doing so, and taking the risk of being caught in the process.

Going to cut through a group with lower health players with Steel Tornado? You're committing a huge amount of stamina to spamming it, and you're actually getting in on the fight.

Going to spam beam at a target? You're committing your magicka, the ability to use skills while channeling, and the possibility of being interrupted.

While Sorc can sit back, choose targets they think will die in a few seconds, light them up with Wrath, and let the rest of the players do the work, all the while getting the credit nine times out of ten.

This is a problem with the skill, but the solution isn't to nerf the skill, but to change how points are scored from this skill. Treat it like a synergy. Whoever actually gets it to proc, whoever actually commits to the kill, gets the kill. If the Sorc wants the kill, they'll have to commit to it.

This also isn't an issue for players on the same team. Personally, I couldn't give a *** whether I come in first or last on the leaderboard. So long as I actually contributed to the game, I'm happy. This is an issue with team scoring, specifically in deathmatch. Wrath allows a Sorc to sit back and earn kills lazily for their team, even if they aren't actually doing anything.

usmguy1234

Ivan04 wrote: »

You know what the issue is for over a year now, I know coding is hard, but please pay attention to it and fix it.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Wrobel

It's the only way sorcs can get kills in bgs now. Why try to strip that from us too?

Feanor

Whoever actually gets it to proc, whoever actually commits to the kill, gets the kill. If the Sorc wants the kill, they'll have to commit to it.

You just shift the stealing away from the Sorc and to the other players.