Do You Think A 1 Second Cast Time on Annulment & Conjured Ward Is Good For The Game?

IZZEFlameLash

No, and I mostly play PVP

No. This does not belong in fast paced action game.

LadyNalcarya

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

I think this is one of the worst changes ZOS ever made. There are multiple reasons:

1) It mostly hits casual players and those who only started trials and vet dungeons, as well as low cp players (they have less points to put into resists). There is no reason to punish those people.

2) I know that at least some of my friends and guildies will quit the game because it ruins their chars and they dont want to play any other chars. Playstyle selection is ESO is already quite poor despite "play as you want" motto - all stamina classes use the same abilities, all dds use the same gear, a lot of popular archetypes like "archer" or "ice mage" are pretty underwhelming etc. There's no reason to remove a perfectly viable playstyle and drive away players who were spending their time and money on the game.

3) I do not believe that sorc was all that OP. Last patches nerfed it pretty hard, and it's not the hardest class to kill. It's easy to wreck noobs with a sorc.. But come on, it's not something you'd brag about. And there are certain builds that are much more op and do not even have to sacrifice damage for sustain (unlike magsorcs). Those builds got indirectly buffed by this patch, btw.

4) Cast time skills disrupt the flow of combat. The new animation is ugly and it looks like the character is lagging or something. ESO has a pretty decent combat system for an mmo, and there's absolutely no reason to make it more clunky and less responsive. Also, cast time skills often get bugged, cause health desynch and other issues so it essentially makes the skill useless in pvp: we all know how laggy it is. Cast time shields already look laggy when there's only a small amount of people around you (on pts) and take longer than 1 second, they simply wont work in prime time Vivec.

5) I think that defensive skills such as block, dodge, shield, "Oh shi-" heals should be as responsive as possible. Maybe devs could change their potency if they think that something is too strong, but a player should be able to defend themselves whenever needed. It is nessesary in open world pvp and new vet trials.

6) It is not smart to balance the game around forum trolls and #nerfsorcs memes. I mean, what the heck is that? You have a full team of class reps, yet you only listen to people who complain about sorc's shieldstacking even after killing said sorc (I remember seeing thread about this). This is unbelievably stupid.

So there's plently of reasons to believe that this patch might be very destructive for the game and it's playerbase and I'm seriously hoping it won't go live like this.

UrQuan

No, and I mostly play PVE

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

I think this is one of the worst changes ZOS ever made. There are multiple reasons:

1) It mostly hits casual players and those who only started trials and vet dungeons, as well as low cp players (they have less points to put into resists). There is no reason to punish those people.

IMO this piece cannot be over-emphasized. This change hurts everyone who runs trials, but especially people who are newer to trials. A magicka player who is just learning non-vet trials will find themselves constantly getting killed before their healer can do anything about it, and end up being frustrated that they can't stay alive long enough to contribute. The same goes for a magicka player who has done non-vet trials and is just starting to learn vet trials. That is not healthy for the community, because it means far fewer people will stick it out long enough to learn to play trials, which means that the endgame community will dwindle.

JadonSky

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

I think this is one of the worst changes ZOS ever made. There are multiple reasons:

1) It mostly hits casual players and those who only started trials and vet dungeons, as well as low cp players (they have less points to put into resists). There is no reason to punish those people.

2) I know that at least some of my friends and guildies will quit the game because it ruins their chars and they dont want to play any other chars. Playstyle selection is ESO is already quite poor despite "play as you want" motto - all stamina classes use the same abilities, all dds use the same gear, a lot of popular archetypes like "archer" or "ice mage" are pretty underwhelming etc. There's no reason to remove a perfectly viable playstyle and drive away players who were spending their time and money on the game.

3) I do not believe that sorc was all that OP. Last patches nerfed it pretty hard, and it's not the hardest class to kill. It's easy to wreck noobs with a sorc.. But come on, it's not something you'd brag about. And there are certain builds that are much more op and do not even have to sacrifice damage for sustain (unlike magsorcs). Those builds got indirectly buffed by this patch, btw.

4) Cast time skills disrupt the flow of combat. The new animation is ugly and it looks like the character is lagging or something. ESO has a pretty decent combat system for an mmo, and there's absolutely no reason to make it more clunky and less responsive. Also, cast time skills often get bugged, cause health desynch and other issues so it essentially makes the skill useless in pvp: we all know how laggy it is. Cast time shields already look laggy when there's only a small amount of people around you (on pts) and take longer than 1 second, they simply wont work in prime time Vivec.

5) I think that defensive skills such as block, dodge, shield, "Oh shi-" heals should be as responsive as possible. Maybe devs could change their potency if they think that something is too strong, but a player should be able to defend themselves whenever needed. It is nessesary in open world pvp and new vet trials.

6) It is not smart to balance the game around forum trolls and #nerfsorcs memes. I mean, what the heck is that? You have a full team of class reps, yet you only listen to people who complain about sorc's shieldstacking even after killing said sorc (I remember seeing thread about this). This is unbelievably stupid.

So there's plently of reasons to believe that this patch might be very destructive for the game and it's playerbase and I'm seriously hoping it won't go live like this.

It really feels like it was just laziness on ZOS's part. Instead of taking the time to code to make it more balance they literally copied the cast time and animation from pet summoning to hardenward and thought "Yeah that works". There were plenty of threads with great ideas to balance shields like not allowing hardenward to stack with other self shields. Meaning if you cast harden ward then light armor shield harden ward would be voided and light armor takes its place. But if a player cast a shield on you it will stack (Healing ward, Oblivion shield, boneshield, etc).. But that would actually take some effort and based on what iv seen in these patch notes ZOS doesn't want to put in that effort they just threw something in because people complained about shield stacking so they copied pasted some code that would prevent it not caring how horrible it was.

bpmachete

No, and I mostly play PVP

No. I think they should do a 0.25 instead and keep it interruptable for a very small window of counterplay. Also no matter what they do, even if 0.5 and not interruptable they should not make it "snare" the casting player.

Septimus_Magna

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

The 1 second cast time is a terrible direction, no defensive skill should have a delay period. It also shows how little the devs understand about their own game. This change wont make the game feel better in any way or form, everyone that sticks around will avoid builds that need dmg shields to stay alive and be successful that way.

If shields are too strong in PVE exclude them from Battle Spirit and nerf the overall value by 50%.
If shields are too strong in PVP remove shield stacking by implementing a minor and major shield system.

Even both changes would be better than a 1 second cast time because you need to be able to react quick defensively.

LadyNalcarya

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

UrQuan wrote: »

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

I think this is one of the worst changes ZOS ever made. There are multiple reasons:

1) It mostly hits casual players and those who only started trials and vet dungeons, as well as low cp players (they have less points to put into resists). There is no reason to punish those people.

IMO this piece cannot be over-emphasized. This change hurts everyone who runs trials, but especially people who are newer to trials. A magicka player who is just learning non-vet trials will find themselves constantly getting killed before their healer can do anything about it, and end up being frustrated that they can't stay alive long enough to contribute. The same goes for a magicka player who has done non-vet trials and is just starting to learn vet trials. That is not healthy for the community, because it means far fewer people will stick it out long enough to learn to play trials, which means that the endgame community will dwindle.

Yeah. There's one thing I noticed about these forums:

Random forum user:
"I got kicked from a group for low dps and they told me to l2p! QQ"
Other forum users:
"It's sooo elitist! The community is so toxic!"

Random forum user:
"My playstyle is getting destroyed in the next patch. QQ"
Other forum users:
"You must adapt, l2p and git gud!"

I wonder where are all the anti-elitists now...

Rukzadlithau

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

No, an automatically applied cooldown for Shield skills - kinda like when you get interrupted during a channel - would be better, if the devs can‘t get away from the idea that a „delay“ is the solution to shield balanceing. This still provides instant protection and prevents absurd stacking in pvp.

GrantTheGriffon

No, and I mostly play PVE

Far too many changes were made to Sorc and light armour shields in one patch. The ability to critically strike shields should have been a starting point and changes made from there. I completely disagree with Sorc shields being on the "*** end" of the stick. The class is being penalised whilst other class shields e.g. DK's and Templars, get off when their survivability can be just as strong in addition to their other skills and abilities.

As it stands, I believe the one second induction should be removed entirely. As others have pointed out this "clunky" induction negatively impacts on all manner of gameplay for sorcs from DPS rotations to survivability.

Should the ability to critically strike shields still result in Sorcs being a bit too strong in PvP then other potential solutions include:

- Shield fatigue. Similiar to the streaks cost increase each time its used within x amount of time.
- Shields cannot stack.
- Increased magicka cost to shields.

Alternatively if shields must remain with an induction then Sorcs really need buffs in mobility. The introduction of the swift trait in combination of gap closers has resulted in the streak being utterly worthless when stamina classes are determined to chase the Sorc. There is no escaping in these scenarios. Rework the streak. Some suggestions:

- The streak distance is increased
- Streak fatigue is reduced from 50% (it should be kept in some form, it would be too strong otherwise)
- Streak allows Sorcs to "navigate" for a short amount of time while streaking. This allows them to determine where they "exit" the streak so it isn't so predictable and telegraphed. An example would be "fade bolt" in Dragon Age Inquisition:

https://youtu.be/KLXLEBdnlf4?t=5m10s

Trancestor

No, and I mostly play PVP

I don't get the logic ZOS has with these big time nerfs really, if this goes live, people just won't use shields, simple as that, why make something that is a big part of many classes simply unusable? This won't hurt only magsorcs, tho magsorcs will get hurt from this the most (they will be by far the worst class in PVP), it also hurts magdens, solo magden playstyle will be dead, only support healbot magden will be viable, magblades will also be trash, any good magblade does not rely on cloak, their healing is going to be non existent next patch and combine that with harness being unusable they aren't going to be far behind magsorc as the worst pvp class. You're pretty much killing 3 classes here ZOS. Please play your own game once in a while before even thinking about making such ridiculous changes.

OrdoHermetica

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

As others above me have mentioned, while I do think that shields needed a nerf - fighting a perma-shield stacking build in PvP is one of the most annoying experiences ever, and it is slightly ridiculous that some builds can just stack through any and all damage outside of one-shots in PvE - I think this is probably the worst possible way to go about it.

Also as others have mentioned, I think there are many, many ways it could be done better. Progressively increasing cost if cast repeatedly a la Streak is one good option. Another is simply increasing the cast cost by, say, 50% in order to prevent cheese builds from being able to constantly cast it. Another idea would be to keep the cast time off of the Light Armor shield skill while buffing and adding a cast time to Sorc shields, allowing them (and other LA magicka builds) to keep their instant-cast emergency shield while also allowing Sorcs to summon more powerful shields in advance of something they know is coming.

But yeah, if these changes hit Live I won't be bothering with shields, full stop, on my magicka toons. I don't really think that's what ZOS intended, but here we are.

Lanranax

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

remove the cast times. Shields are needed in pvp and pve. Without them in pve it would give stamblades an even larger advantage against magic classes and in PVE, we need it sometimes to stay alive. We can't always can't on healers in some trials and dungeons.

The focus should be on giving better executes and sustain for sorcs and dk's both stam and magic classes.

This is a big mistake.

Vexarius

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

All the very valid mechanical reasons acknowledged, yet aesthetically the cast time makes it look like my sorc is flexing his muscles in order to push out some serious constipation. This can’t be good for either group... don’t strain yourself...

Baharoth77

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

Let them keep this change to shield with a cast time as is with already over performing stamina classes. I will unsub the second it hits and never look back along with my friends. Try me and find out.

pedrenrik

No, and I play an even mix of PVP and PVE

No.
One thing I like in ESO is how fast the combat is. It requires a quick response and smart play.
I personally think every single skill that has a cast time breaks the combat. It stops being fluid.
I PvP mostly in battlegrounds, and I see that every magicka character relly a lot on his/her shield to survive, lacking a fast healing skill.
In PvE, you wont always have your healer to give you ward or healing springs, and in moments like Starfall in HRC, not having a shield could mean a wipe.

Xvorg

No, and I mostly play PVP

No, it's stupid

And as a side comment, I wish this was the reaction of the community when ZoS decided to nerf block

SirLeeMinion

No, and I mostly play PVE

Ping spikes already provide fun delays that allow me to watch my character do nothing while in combat. On those days I have a good connection, I can always heavy attack to enjoy the fun of slow-moving game play. Sometimes it's fun to leave CCs uncleared and just sit there rooted doing nothing. Plus, I can always use the /dance command in combat when I need to slow things down further.

Making shields useless for everyone was a great way to address shield stacking and healers feeling unnecessary, so I hope ZOS will ignore the many helpful suggestions players have put forward to actually fix these problems. But, I don't think I'll be able to handle the overwhelming fun of slower gameplay and so will unslot shields and shelve those toons that absolutely rely on them. Eighteen months from now, they'll likely reverse things with a different change that nobody wanted and I'll dust them off again. We'll see...