If shield nerf goes live

usmguy1234

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »

im disappointed when I clicked this...I was expecting the OP to say he will quit the game if the nerf goes live...oh well join the pile of dead bodies il make with meow stamblade >:3

Enjoy the lack of competition... not that I suspect you enjoyed it in the first place.

kadar

usmguy1234 wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

Why would that be fair?

Put everyone on the same playing field defensively.

If each defensive mechanism existed in a vacuum where each was equal in power, nature, and effect that would make sense...
But defense is a function of all the mechanisms working together-- each is used in conjunction with shields and...everything. Block, Cloak, Roll, Heal, ect. are also distinctly different mechanically. It would be illogical to treat everything the same as the Ward/Harness.

Additionally, the cast time will simply make large, relatively cheap shields more difficult to get. Giving every defensive mechanism in the game a 1s cast time would completely destroy the reactive nature of the game as a whole.

Just as long as it doesn't effect your class right? I suggest you watch this video before you comment more on a class that you obviously don't understand.

It literally is my class. Not to mention the fact that the shield changes effect every class.
Haven't updated the ol' sig in years...

My only reason for commenting on this thread at all is because this is a bad idea:

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

Make a statement like that ^ and then proceed to tell people you don't know that they don't understand the way a class works...

edit: Now that I'm thinking about it you were probably just being dramatic for effect, not making an actual suggestion. That's understandable.

edit2: just realized who made that video lol. I've fought that guy 1v1 many times. Watch the other vids on his channel, let's just say it will reveal his primary goal in playing this game.

Benemime

anatole1234 wrote: »

I honestly hope they go through with it. Already got a heavy sorcerer build that don't utilize shields. Can't believe people forgot sorc has the BoL equivalent with the twilight matriarch.

O don't want to be forced to slot matriarch on both bars.

usmguy1234

The_Outsider wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

Why would that be fair?

Put everyone on the same playing field defensively.

If each defensive mechanism existed in a vacuum where each was equal in power, nature, and effect that would make sense...
But defense is a function of all the mechanisms working together-- each is used in conjunction with shields and...everything. Block, Cloak, Roll, Heal, ect. are also distinctly different mechanically. It would be illogical to treat everything the same as the Ward/Harness.

Additionally, the cast time will simply make large, relatively cheap shields more difficult to get. Giving every defensive mechanism in the game a 1s cast time would completely destroy the reactive nature of the game as a whole.

Just as long as it doesn't effect your class right? I suggest you watch this video before you comment more on a class that you obviously don't understand.

It literally is my class. Not to mention the fact that the shield changes effect every class.
Haven't updated the ol' sig in years...

My only reason for commenting on this thread at all is because this is a bad idea:

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

Make a statement like that ^ and then proceed to tell people you don't know that they don't understand the way a class works...

edit: Now that I'm thinking about it you were probably just being dramatic for effect, not making an actual suggestion. That's understandable.

edit2: just realized who made that video lol. I've fought that guy 1v1 many times. Watch the other vids on his channel, let's just say it will reveal his primary goal in playing this game.

Yes it was for dramatic effect. And I realize the person who made this video might not be the most pleasant person but he's a pretty good sorc player. His words still hold weight.

HEBREWHAMMERRR

Just adapt man. The shield nerf sucks but utilize the changes they’re making to shield and play more tanky. Heavy armor and sustain will be king.

Revokus

HEBREWHAMMERRR wrote: »

Just adapt man. The shield nerf sucks but utilize the changes they’re making to shield and play more tanky. Heavy armor and sustain will be king.

But heavy sorc is trash..they are missing so much major breach, healing etc..like no one never tried that before...lol if it was good people would have played heavy armor sorc before. It's always making me laugh people saying adapt etc or say go heavy ! They will see that it's not viable and won't be able to kill a fly in pvp. The'll just be another troll tank I know I saw one today with a trash heavy armor sorc build he was doing 0 dps in cyrodiil he was just tanky. Then they will realize we were right and the class is dead..in pvp at least.

Aurielle

Today, I ended up (quite accidentally) on a team of fellow Templar healtanks in a BG deathmatch. There was one non-Templar in the group. All us Templars? Not one single death. We won very, very easily — albeit a bit more slowly than we would have if we were on DPS builds. It was pure cancer. We threw down our runes and rituals, our healing ultimates and our Earthgore pools, and jabbed/flared/POTL’ed everyone to death. The non-Templar on our team (who had a low PVP rank) died four times. Everyone on the opposing teams had about 7-8 deaths on average, and hardly any kills.

Point is, any class has the potential to seem “OP” or “imbalanced” depending on group synergy and the experience levels of those involved. I don’t think ANYONE who has experience with Deathmatch BGs would call Templar healtanks “OP” (in land grabs, yes, but not DMs), and yet our team was completely unstoppable because no one was doing anything to defile us or pressure us off our runes.

So please: when you get roflstomped in Cyrodiil or BGs, don’t just look at the class skills that show up in your death recap and flee to the forums screaming for nerfs to that particular class; consider the group composition and the skill of the opposing player(s) relative to your own. I can guarantee you that if you take the time to learn how to counter shieldstacking, you’ll find that sorcs aren’t nearly as OP as you think they are.

Doctordarkspawn

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

If shield cast times go live i will simply shelve all characters of mine that utilize a damage shield in both PvE and PvP. Cast times on my abilities that allow me to survive is simply not a mechanic I will enjoy to play with. Sooner rather than later they will realize that people are no longer wearing light armor in PvP and they will revert this idiotic proposition and I can go back to those characters that will go on the shelf if these changes make it to live.

Just wish I hadn't spend pretty much the entire summerset patch and 1st month of wolfhunter practicing and getting better on my PvP magsorc. What a giant slap in the face. All those countless hours just wasted. Down the drain

Exactly. My mag sorc is literally a day younger then my first character which is about 4 years old at this point.
So I have literally poured 4 years of work in to this character. Just to have all that work blown to the wind by some very not well thought out nerfs by the dev team. And you have people gloating in the forums with glee about these changes. Yet they'll probably get mad that I made this thread and not see the hypocrisy in that.

Let them gloat and jeer. Next patch they will come for their class and add cast time to breath of life or add a cast time to wings or cloak. Those people are fools who do not understand what a slippery slope this is.

It's a very slippery slope. Arguably more so then ever at this point.

It is, that's why as a templar I've been advocating people quit.

THIS ISN'T SUSTAINABLE. IT HAS TO STOP. THROUGH BRUTE FORCE IF NECESSARY.

Doctordarkspawn

HEBREWHAMMERRR wrote: »

Just adapt man. The shield nerf sucks but utilize the changes they’re making to shield and play more tanky. Heavy armor and sustain will be king.

Yes, because that totally helps PVE in any way shape or form when the star-fall from Hel-ra starts and your instantly dead before you can move.

ruengdet2515

Wait for new gear set in future
1...
2...
3...
4...
5 = Instant cast any shield and can not interrupt.

Every thing ok ?

Valrien

Hateanthem wrote: »

Before people accuse me of not playing a sorc, I do have a max level sorc that I have ran vet dungeons and done quite a bit of pvp on....

It's 1 second. ONE SECOND. It's not 4 seconds, it's not a 30 sec cd, it's just 1 second. It's basically the cast time of defensive posture. It's not a super huge deal. The class is not going to be worthless, the players are not taking a personal slap to the face.

It's one freaking second people.

Does it suck? Yep.

Are there better ways to go about changing shields? I'm sure there are. Maybe a DPS penalty for having a shield up, or an increased cost, or whatever.

But it's only 1 second.

ONE FREAKING SECOND.

Nirn is not going to implode.

Spotted the crafter/quester

max_only

ruengdet2515 wrote: »

Wait for new gear set in future
1...
2...
3...
4...
5 = Instant cast any shield and can not interrupt.

Every thing ok ?

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hey all,

Just wanted to let you know we've been monitoring the feedback on this thread and elsewhere on the forums. Clearly there's a lot of concern around the impact of adding a cast time to Conjured Ward and Annulment.

First I'd like to talk about our motivation with the change. We believe choices between damage output and survivability make combat more interesting. There are a number of areas within our system that could better adhere to this philosophy, but these self-cast damage shield abilities stood out as being particularly out of line. It was too easy to throw a bunch of effective health on yourself while making a minimal sacrifice in terms of DPS itemization and rotation. This applied to both PvE and PvP scenarios.

The addition of a cast time makes that choice between damage output and survivability more deliberate and strategic. However, as many of you have pointed out, there are several potential issues with this solution. We identified many of these risks prior to PTS, and we're actively monitoring feedback from the community, Class Reps, and PTS testers.

If we decide to make significant changes to the abilities, those changes would not appear until at least PTS 3. However, we agree Conjured Ward and Annulment are too easy to interrupt in PvP, so we'll be making both spells immune to interrupts for PTS 2. We'll also be meeting with the Class Reps next week to discuss the changes.

In the meantime, we encourage you to continue experimenting, evaluating, and providing feedback.

Immune to interrupts.
Immune to interrupts.
Immune to interrupts.

Now that you pvpers are taken care of, can we talk about the rest of us light armor users who aren’t shield stacking Sorcs that are getting punished along with this cast time?

Vahrokh

ruengdet2515 wrote: »

Wait for new gear set in future
1...
2...
3...
4...
5 = Instant cast any shield and can not interrupt.

Every thing ok ?

Maybe sold through crown store?

TheInfernalRage

Aurielle wrote: »

Today, I ended up (quite accidentally) on a team of fellow Templar healtanks in a BG deathmatch. There was one non-Templar in the group. All us Templars? Not one single death. We won very, very easily — albeit a bit more slowly than we would have if we were on DPS builds. It was pure cancer. We threw down our runes and rituals, our healing ultimates and our Earthgore pools, and jabbed/flared/POTL’ed everyone to death. The non-Templar on our team (who had a low PVP rank) died four times. Everyone on the opposing teams had about 7-8 deaths on average, and hardly any kills.

Point is, any class has the potential to seem “OP” or “imbalanced” depending on group synergy and the experience levels of those involved. I don’t think ANYONE who has experience with Deathmatch BGs would call Templar healtanks “OP” (in land grabs, yes, but not DMs), and yet our team was completely unstoppable because no one was doing anything to defile us or pressure us off our runes.

So please: when you get roflstomped in Cyrodiil or BGs, don’t just look at the class skills that show up in your death recap and flee to the forums screaming for nerfs to that particular class; consider the group composition and the skill of the opposing player(s) relative to your own. I can guarantee you that if you take the time to learn how to counter shieldstacking, you’ll find that sorcs aren’t nearly as OP as you think they are.

Unfortunately, most of the devs prefer theory crafting instead of actual game playing.

smashcats

The shield nerf will be fine imo, over reactions as usual, are all the people complaining even maining mag sorcs anyways?

Thrain

Im pretty sure if this nerf goes live all sorcs will feel like Harry^^

Unknown_Redemption

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

Ehnjoy your Narf

usmguy1234

smashcats wrote: »

The shield nerf will be fine imo, over reactions as usual, are all the people complaining even maining mag sorcs anyways?

No, no it won't be fine. Sorc will be the bottom of both pve and pvp if this goes live.

usmguy1234

Unknown_Redemption wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

Ehnjoy your Narf

Thank you for the constructive feedback.

Kayotic

I don’t *stack shields* but losing all my defenses:babyrage:

Lucky28

Greevir wrote: »

The only other thing I can see replacing the 1 sec cast time is shields having something no other skill in the game has. A cooldown.

really?, how about something that already exists in the game, like major/minor shields so you can't stack hardened ward and harness. that would fix the problem and not *** everyone over.

Biro123

For me? if the changes go live as is, I can't see ever playing my magsorc again (sadly the only toon I ever finished the undaunted grind on). I usually enjoy the theory-crafting that comes with a new patch - but this time for magsorc, I've got nothing..

My Stam-focussed Hybrid sorc, I think will still be viable - but loses utility from overload bar (GTAOE's for breaches etc.. mines/caltrops/trap etc).. But I may as well just play my stamblade again...

I would play my stamplar,(and it would be quite strong with what I have in mind) but am 50 crowns short of a class-change token, and I'm damned if I'm giving them any more money!

usmguy1234

Biro123 wrote: »

For me? if the changes go live as is, I can't see ever playing my magsorc again (sadly the only toon I ever finished the undaunted grind on). I usually enjoy the theory-crafting that comes with a new patch - but this time for magsorc, I've got nothing..

My Stam-focussed Hybrid sorc, I think will still be viable - but loses utility from overload bar (GTAOE's for breaches etc.. mines/caltrops/trap etc).. But I may as well just play my stamblade again...

I would play my stamplar,(and it would be quite strong with what I have in mind) but am 50 crowns short of a class-change token, and I'm damned if I'm giving them any more money!

I went stamplar in preparation for these changes to go live. Compete ineptness and complete disregard for the class rep program leads me to think these changes are pretty much finalized.

xshatox

adapt or die

usmguy1234

xshatox wrote: »

adapt or die

Same could be said for those screaming for shield nerfs.

Ri_Khan

The victims just keep piling up...

will we ever feel safe again?

Hateanthem

MasterSpatula wrote: »

Hateanthem wrote: »

Before people accuse me of not playing a sorc, I do have a max level sorc that I have ran vet dungeons and done quite a bit of pvp on....

It's 1 second. ONE SECOND. It's not 4 seconds, it's not a 30 sec cd, it's just 1 second. It's basically the cast time of defensive posture. It's not a super huge deal. The class is not going to be worthless, the players are not taking a personal slap to the face.

It's one freaking second people.

Does it suck? Yep.

Are there better ways to go about changing shields? I'm sure there are. Maybe a DPS penalty for having a shield up, or an increased cost, or whatever.

But it's only 1 second.

ONE FREAKING SECOND.

Nirn is not going to implode.

That's a truly, truly awful take. You have to be aware that, as a LA user, it can be quite easy to get hit for 125% or more of you total health in a single second from just a DLC/Chapter World Boss or the Geyser Bosses, to say nothing of bosses in harder content.

As a magsorc, if you're taking damage for full second without shields, you're likely just plain dead.

I main a tank, and as a resistance capped tank, usually with some kind small shield of rocks floating around me, there are still one shot mechanics with the new DLC bosses.

Here's an idea, make sure you have the fights down so the shield can be cast preemptively for those moments.

Hateanthem

Valrien wrote: »

Hateanthem wrote: »

Before people accuse me of not playing a sorc, I do have a max level sorc that I have ran vet dungeons and done quite a bit of pvp on....

It's 1 second. ONE SECOND. It's not 4 seconds, it's not a 30 sec cd, it's just 1 second. It's basically the cast time of defensive posture. It's not a super huge deal. The class is not going to be worthless, the players are not taking a personal slap to the face.

It's one freaking second people.

Does it suck? Yep.

Are there better ways to go about changing shields? I'm sure there are. Maybe a DPS penalty for having a shield up, or an increased cost, or whatever.

But it's only 1 second.

ONE FREAKING SECOND.

Nirn is not going to implode.

Spotted the crafter/quester

I'm almost up to 8 traits on blacksmithing. Been playing since launch so I think I'm doing pretty good on my crafting.

I primarily PvP.

Guess I spotted the kid who stands by the wayshrine and spams duel invites.

Odovacar

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

I see your post all the time on Discord! You always have a fair, level headed approach to the game! Lets hope they tweak the PTS notes after their class rep meeting tomorrow.

usmguy1234

Odovacar wrote: »

usmguy1234 wrote: »

I think it's only fair that all survivability mechanisms gain a 1 second cast time. That means block, cloak, etc, etc.

I see your post all the time on Discord! You always have a fair, level headed approach to the game! Lets hope they tweak the PTS notes after their class rep meeting tomorrow.

Thank you! Though this thread is slightly satirical in nature, it does stand to make a point. That point being these changes are very bad for the game. I'm taking a "put the nerf boot on the other foot" approach in hoping that other classes have that "oof" moment when they think about their main defense being stripped away and made obsolete.