Defile Stam Sorc is officially dead now !

ATomiX96

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Defile meta needed changing.

Stam Sorc is absolutely bananas strong though. Stack 3x damage sets and run minimal regen, speed+lingering pots, 2x swift, dark deal and meditate

I'm having a hell of a time doing the psijic quest for a 7th time tho lol

How long does it take to do

took me an one and a half hour on release day for my first char and on 2nd onwards always sub 1 hour, assuming you have wayshrines.

IZZEFlameLash

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Darn I can no longer keep the strongest debuff in the game up 100% by only casting one ability every 10 seconds. - OP

News flash: Your suppose to die in PvP, this isn't a trial or people that don't have mechanics. It's the only way you learn and get better, and if your not getting better why even play ?

What is it with this trend of people scared of counters in PvP. Is there some type of ESO Battle-Royale add on I don't know about ?

News flash: You are supposed to die also. But no, you want to be able to run like a racing horse and deal so much damage at the same time applying the strongest debuff in the game 100% so that no one can touch you without risking death in few seconds.

Ragnarock41

del9 wrote: »

Y’all need to learn to land a dizzy swing.

I could use some more free AP , so yeah guys, learn to d.swing.

Bleed stamsorc is gonna eat anything alive though.

Ragnarock41

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

I literally can't wait to come back home to give a shot to all the new stuff. And silver leash is definitely on my list.(also master 2h is back on that list considering zos might buff those weapons again)

Hutch679

Stam sorc is godly. Lol this thread is hilarious!

Kadoin

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

In my opinion - the super healers will get worse and more unkillable builds are introduced. Let's be honest defile was the wolf keeping the deers in check. Now the deers will destroy the land. But again that's just my opinion, and we all know 1 persons opinion doesn't really mean anything in eso.

Thanks for the feedback.

I'm pretty sure defile nerf has made little to no difference on my healer. In fact, I mostly use healing ward and keep mutagen on 100% anyway. Who defile REALLY hurt are all the stam builds that can't purge it like I can, the stam builds that can't shield when you got that bleed stack like I can, the stam builds that still don't have a heal that heals them for 11K like I do, etc. Get real. It sounds like you're not happy ZOS turned off your easy mode. The change was needed, especially in these "bloody" times.

WeylandLabs

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Darn I can no longer keep the strongest debuff in the game up 100% by only casting one ability every 10 seconds. - OP

News flash: Your suppose to die in PvP, this isn't a trial or people that don't have mechanics. It's the only way you learn and get better, and if your not getting better why even play ?

What is it with this trend of people scared of counters in PvP. Is there some type of ESO Battle-Royale add on I don't know about ?

News flash: You are supposed to die also. But no, you want to be able to run like a racing horse and deal so much damage at the same time applying the strongest debuff in the game 100% so that no one can touch you without risking death in few seconds.

L2burst I have died a lot especially in my Earthgore. Thats a LYC "learn your class" issue, strongest debuff yes. It's there for a reason, either you burst or you apply dots. It seems like a few people in this post have never played a dot build. And to be honest not sure if some of you understand the way dot builds work ?

It's not just my build or my class etc etc, it's bad for the game and the class. We are only limited to 1 playstyle now.

Kadoin wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

In my opinion - the super healers will get worse and more unkillable builds are introduced. Let's be honest defile was the wolf keeping the deers in check. Now the deers will destroy the land. But again that's just my opinion, and we all know 1 persons opinion doesn't really mean anything in eso.

Thanks for the feedback.

I'm pretty sure defile nerf has made little to no difference on my healer. In fact, I mostly use healing ward and keep mutagen on 100% anyway. Who defile REALLY hurt are all the stam builds that can't purge it like I can, the stam builds that can't shield when you got that bleed stack like I can, the stam builds that still don't have a heal that heals them for 11K like I do, etc. Get real. It sounds like you're not happy ZOS turned off your easy mode. The change was needed, especially in these "bloody" times.

Easy mode - ? Ok well as this progresses I will sit on it and wait. Until the community understands that healing will get more out of control. And defile builds like mine were keeping them in check.

End result nobody dies in PvP anymore. Im actually interested in what people will complain about next ? Dont say healing ...

Lexxypwns

If you think the defile nerfs haven’t strengthened healing then you’re kidding yourself

IZZEFlameLash

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Darn I can no longer keep the strongest debuff in the game up 100% by only casting one ability every 10 seconds. - OP

News flash: Your suppose to die in PvP, this isn't a trial or people that don't have mechanics. It's the only way you learn and get better, and if your not getting better why even play ?

What is it with this trend of people scared of counters in PvP. Is there some type of ESO Battle-Royale add on I don't know about ?

News flash: You are supposed to die also. But no, you want to be able to run like a racing horse and deal so much damage at the same time applying the strongest debuff in the game 100% so that no one can touch you without risking death in few seconds.

L2burst I have died a lot especially in my Earthgore. Thats a LYC "learn your class" issue, strongest debuff yes. It's there for a reason, either you burst or you apply dots. It seems like a few people in this post have never played a dot build. And to be honest not sure if some of you understand the way dot builds work ?

It's not just my build or my class etc etc, it's bad for the game and the class. We are only limited to 1 playstyle now.

Kadoin wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

In my opinion - the super healers will get worse and more unkillable builds are introduced. Let's be honest defile was the wolf keeping the deers in check. Now the deers will destroy the land. But again that's just my opinion, and we all know 1 persons opinion doesn't really mean anything in eso.

Thanks for the feedback.

I'm pretty sure defile nerf has made little to no difference on my healer. In fact, I mostly use healing ward and keep mutagen on 100% anyway. Who defile REALLY hurt are all the stam builds that can't purge it like I can, the stam builds that can't shield when you got that bleed stack like I can, the stam builds that still don't have a heal that heals them for 11K like I do, etc. Get real. It sounds like you're not happy ZOS turned off your easy mode. The change was needed, especially in these "bloody" times.

Easy mode - ? Ok well as this progresses I will sit on it and wait. Until the community understands that healing will get more out of control. And defile builds like mine were keeping them in check.

End result nobody dies in PvP anymore. Im actually interested in what people will complain about next ? Dont say healing ...

L2burst yourself if you think nobody dies in PvP right now. If someone doesn't die as often, you can thank Swift and bad targetting system from game to not allow any ability to hit them for damage. High damage and high mobility meta and StamSorc excels in this environment. They don't even need 3 Swifts and remain super deadly. While at it, you should also take your own advice of LYC.

Kadoin

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

IZZEFlameLash wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Darn I can no longer keep the strongest debuff in the game up 100% by only casting one ability every 10 seconds. - OP

News flash: Your suppose to die in PvP, this isn't a trial or people that don't have mechanics. It's the only way you learn and get better, and if your not getting better why even play ?

What is it with this trend of people scared of counters in PvP. Is there some type of ESO Battle-Royale add on I don't know about ?

News flash: You are supposed to die also. But no, you want to be able to run like a racing horse and deal so much damage at the same time applying the strongest debuff in the game 100% so that no one can touch you without risking death in few seconds.

L2burst I have died a lot especially in my Earthgore. Thats a LYC "learn your class" issue, strongest debuff yes. It's there for a reason, either you burst or you apply dots. It seems like a few people in this post have never played a dot build. And to be honest not sure if some of you understand the way dot builds work ?

It's not just my build or my class etc etc, it's bad for the game and the class. We are only limited to 1 playstyle now.

Kadoin wrote: »

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

In my opinion - the super healers will get worse and more unkillable builds are introduced. Let's be honest defile was the wolf keeping the deers in check. Now the deers will destroy the land. But again that's just my opinion, and we all know 1 persons opinion doesn't really mean anything in eso.

Thanks for the feedback.

I'm pretty sure defile nerf has made little to no difference on my healer. In fact, I mostly use healing ward and keep mutagen on 100% anyway. Who defile REALLY hurt are all the stam builds that can't purge it like I can, the stam builds that can't shield when you got that bleed stack like I can, the stam builds that still don't have a heal that heals them for 11K like I do, etc. Get real. It sounds like you're not happy ZOS turned off your easy mode. The change was needed, especially in these "bloody" times.

Easy mode - ? Ok well as this progresses I will sit on it and wait. Until the community understands that healing will get more out of control. And defile builds like mine were keeping them in check.

End result nobody dies in PvP anymore. Im actually interested in what people will complain about next ? Dont say healing ...

Look to Robes of the Hist and Crest of Cyrodil for your problems. You won't believe how high those two heal if you are a "healer". I said it day one that they heal too much and are a problem. Wear both on a char with a lot points in healing and have a vit pot. See what happens...Now do the same on Warden or NB. Uh oh, we have a problem and its not the defile change!

Mayrael

OP so what does it mean? You were using overperforming mechinc to get the kills, now when it's more balanced you're no longer effective (as many other). What the point of your post? You think that defile nerf was bad? Or maybe you think that building around mechanic that leaves no counterplay for most of the players is perfectly legit way to play? Defile still has its place, it's still as powerful as it used to be, just can't be applied 100% of a time as easy as it used to be. It's like claiming that sload is not as effective as it used to be. Yes it isn't but does it mean that builds based on sload was ok?

IlCanis_LupuslI

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

@Waffennacht could you(seriously no troll) enlighten me about the point of using silver bolts Vs critical rush or invasion on a stamsorc? I'm always ready to try out weird stuff

IlCanis_LupuslI

I've shelved my stamblade bruiser and Im learning the ropes on stamsorc(khajiit, bruiser)
Its nice im usually a ww build but since the passive is bugged basically making wws very very squishy im playing as a human.
I was thi king of using a crushing weapons(psyjiic) - pierce armor-la-reverb combo for damage what do you think? @Waffennacht

IlCanis_LupuslI

stamsorc is awesome I should have tried it sooner

Waffennacht

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

@Waffennacht could you(seriously no troll) enlighten me about the point of using silver bolts Vs critical rush or invasion on a stamsorc? I'm always ready to try out weird stuff

I'm a BG player primarily and position is extremely important

Rather than zooming into your opponent (potentially losing your LoS, or now facing 2 or more opponents) you bring them into your pbAoE, and allies' range.

+ Snare + wpn dmg + anti vamp/we

Oh and you'll be addicted once you pull a sorc off of mines.

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

I've shelved my stamblade bruiser and Im learning the ropes on stamsorc(khajiit, bruiser)
Its nice im usually a ww build but since the passive is bugged basically making wws very very squishy im playing as a human.
I was thi king of using a crushing weapons(psyjiic) - pierce armor-la-reverb combo for damage what do you think? @Waffennacht

I like SnB - however I can't give up Spin2win and the range/expedition from bow.

With roll dodge being so strong spin2win is a soft counter

@Mangeli200194 my Stamsorc is very much movement and position based

Eternal Hunt Impreg and veli atm is what I use

IlCanis_LupuslI

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

Waffennacht wrote: »

I'll take a Stam sorc over any other class in BGs right now

Second would be stamden

Then Stam NB

But Stam sorc is strong, so strong.

I'm waiting for more people to use silver leash though

Hmmm makes sense, I'm more of a bruiser and a open world player thou. With me it's defense before offense. That's why I Ned forward momentum and snb

IlCanis_LupuslI

But I'll definetly try silver sharðs maby I'll like it, crit rush isn't hitting the spot, invasion was nice liked that 1, well see.
Ever tried crushing weapon(psyjiic spammable)
With a other spammable for example pierce armor on stamsorc?
@Waffennacht

Waffennacht

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

But I'll definetly try silver sharðs maby I'll like it, crit rush isn't hitting the spot, invasion was nice liked that 1, well see.
Ever tried crushing weapon(psyjiic spammable)
With a other spammable for example pierce armor on stamsorc?
@Waffennacht

Invasion is cool, just you do kinda lose the CC for burst unless you build around it (like db follow up or something)

I like crit rush + vMA 2h

Pierce is good, I also like heroic Slash for the buffs it gives (and snare)

Your build and mine are a bit too different to give more than just generalized advise

katorga

The defile nerf benefit stam sorcs, a class least able to counter being defiled. So actually I think it is a buff. I do think healing classes will be the thing this patch.

On the negative side, EVERYONE can Dark Deal now, and with built in major protection to boot.

Jjitsuboy98

Does anyone know if the CP siphoner out if the tower tree acts as a defile towards an opponents healing?

Arkangeloski

Checkmath wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Checkmath

StamSorc is already strong asf if you run Master bleed builds...

And if you don't?

Being shoehorned into a masters weapon ... from where do I know this?

Stamplar?

Magsorc?

Checkmath wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@Checkmath

StamSorc is already strong asf if you run Master bleed builds...

thats why there is written *nerf damage* first.

If class X with master weapon Y works too well but is nothing special without, your solution is to nerf the allround damage to force them even more in a specific setup?

Did you not read?
OP was talking about stamsorcs and defile, so I suggested to make stamsorc a defile class with a basic chance to apply defile on damage. Since this would be OP like this, the damage would need a nerf (PvP perspective only). This would result in a class with a lots of unique playstyled and unique group utility. Anyway I added at the end, that this probably would not be a fancy idea.

I did not talk at all about nerfing a class, because it performs well with one arena weapon. Feanor was talking about it being strong with master dual wield, I did not talk about that, I was referring to my previous post about adding defile to the stamsorc toolkit.

And I think it's even worse to gut (PvP) damage for a debuff that is easily applied by a large amount of other means.

and you again did not read my first post, right? I suggested a passive, which gives a chance to apply defile on all damage, so being able to maybe constantly defile somebody (I said, it is only a fun and bad idea anway). You surely would agree, that this would be OP. Basically a stamsorc still could run bleeds and all cancer, without having to rely on reverbrating bash or lethal arrow (which both would need to be casted all 4 seconds for permanent uptime).
It was a suggestion to give stamsorc some meaning, a speciality unique and a logical step to implement this idea would be nerfing their damage, because they should not have damage and defile both at the same time.

Add defile to one of the negate morphs

Lexxypwns

@Mangeli200194 if you want a bruiser stam sorc build I think Pelican’s Summerset build is the way to go, maybe sub Balorgh for BS.

2x swift 1x Infused 2h+DW Fury+7th

WeylandLabs

As I read more and more of the comments, the more I feel that a lot of people never played a dot stam sorc. Especially a DW/Bow dot stam sorc open world PvP. This post was not about arguing over defile, I clearly stated that defile is dead in the game and especially on my class now.

And if you have never played a true dot SS you will never know. Seems like a lot of you died to it and are fast to give bias opinions. That leaves only 1 viable style of play and that is burst. Sure you can run DW/2h again that still relys on burst to keep the dots going and it's very counterable ( only to people that know how the build works. )

As for Stam Sorc identity - putting in a defile passive is the most creative thing I ever read in the 2+ years on the forums.

It's very interesting that I see people tell people to run YouTube builds. Don't you get it already - there are players in the game like myself that counter those builds specifically. So when I see a build on YouTube and it's views of 2k to 20k I see that 2k to 20k I can kill. I don't make YouTube's or plan too, but again limiting Stam Sorc to burst is awful.

mikey_reach

Defile is still strong just not as easy to get, i get 42% from incap 6 sec and 20% from poison 5.5 sec. I do agree that stam sorc needs an identity as far as a spammable goes, stam dk not as bad but sustain could be a little better.

WeylandLabs

If somebody could break down the timing of defiles on each set and abilities that would be great.

Then take that time and and base that on cast time to apply and cooldown, defile is a very strong debuff I get that. Also put into account, are you using it in a duel are you using it in a group are you small group are you solo ? All we hear is its too strong and its automatically justified without no REAL viable math-gameplay involved in the senrio.

Without no real feedback il just say give you the answer. I chose to play the super hp regen build again my base regen is 4.2k and 10.1k buffed. Fast and trolly now it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what I'm wearing but, im sure somebody will figure it out. Then it will catch on again and thus becomes the problem. I think I will light the match, in another post.

Valencer

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

LeifErickson wrote: »

Darn I can no longer keep the strongest debuff in the game up 100% by only casting one ability every 10 seconds. - OP

News flash: Your suppose to die in PvP, this isn't a trial or people that don't have mechanics. It's the only way you learn and get better, and if your not getting better why even play ?

What is it with this trend of people scared of counters in PvP. Is there some type of ESO Battle-Royale add on I don't know about ?

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

As I read more and more of the comments, the more I feel that a lot of people never played a dot stam sorc. Especially a DW/Bow dot stam sorc open world PvP. This post was not about arguing over defile, I clearly stated that defile is dead in the game and especially on my class now.

And if you have never played a true dot SS you will never know. Seems like a lot of you died to it and are fast to give bias opinions. That leaves only 1 viable style of play and that is burst. Sure you can run DW/2h again that still relys on burst to keep the dots going and it's very counterable ( only to people that know how the build works. )

As for Stam Sorc identity - putting in a defile passive is the most creative thing I ever read in the 2+ years on the forums.

It's very interesting that I see people tell people to run YouTube builds. Don't you get it already - there are players in the game like myself that counter those builds specifically. So when I see a build on YouTube and it's views of 2k to 20k I see that 2k to 20k I can kill. I don't make YouTube's or plan too, but again limiting Stam Sorc to burst is awful.

You figured out that stacking a ton of points into Befoul and slotting a major defile skill means any build relying on heals and not damage shields was basically a guaranteed kill since morrowind. Grats, have a cookie.

That doesn't require a specialized build though. You can keep telling yourself you were running some niche build, but lots of people did exactly what youre talking about. It's not really rocket science.

Since youre such a fan of counterplay Im sure you can explain what counterplay defiles have outside of "just slot purge"?

IZZEFlameLash

Shokasegambit1 wrote: »

If somebody could break down the timing of defiles on each set and abilities that would be great.

Then take that time and and base that on cast time to apply and cooldown, defile is a very strong debuff I get that. Also put into account, are you using it in a duel are you using it in a group are you small group are you solo ? All we hear is its too strong and its automatically justified without no REAL viable math-gameplay involved in the senrio.

Without no real feedback il just say give you the answer. I chose to play the super hp regen build again my base regen is 4.2k and 10.1k buffed. Fast and trolly now it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what I'm wearing but, im sure somebody will figure it out. Then it will catch on again and thus becomes the problem. I think I will light the match, in another post.

Lol, okay. Have fun dealing near 0 damage with it even though the build has been around for a while.

IlCanis_LupuslI

Lexxypwns wrote: »

@Mangeli200194 if you want a bruiser stam sorc build I think Pelican’s Summerset build is the way to go, maybe sub Balorgh for BS.

2x swift 1x Infused 2h+DW Fury+7th

@Lexxypwns Thanks but ive made my own build,
Witchmans armor+Hundinggs+trollking
2x swift+1x robust
2h/snb(dps setup)
dpscoombo= Crushing weapons+light attack+Ransack+reverberating bash+dbos
its a bit complex and requires good la weaving abilities but its working miracles, ive won 4-5 1vsx situations in the 1st week of gameplay.
turns out khajiit passive synergize extremly well with stamsorc concerning damage+heals(crit passive) and health regen(trollking)

Chilly-McFreeze

Mangeli200194 wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

@Mangeli200194 if you want a bruiser stam sorc build I think Pelican’s Summerset build is the way to go, maybe sub Balorgh for BS.

2x swift 1x Infused 2h+DW Fury+7th

@Lexxypwns Thanks but ive made my own build,
Witchmans armor+Hundinggs+trollking
2x swift+1x robust
2h/snb(dps setup)
dpscoombo= Crushing weapons+light attack+Ransack+reverberating bash+dbos
its a bit complex and requires good la weaving abilities but its working miracles, ive won 4-5 1vsx situations in the 1st week of gameplay.
turns out khajiit passive synergize extremly well with stamsorc concerning damage+heals(crit passive) and health regen(trollking)

It's been a while that I saw someone using Witchman's. I always felt like the occassional 1.5k heal & 3k stam return on dawnbreaker isn't worth it on a stam sorc, since I can get that far easier through dark deal, or now through meditation. What makes it worth it?

IlCanis_LupuslI

The 3k stam return is not cuppled with regen unlike bonepirate so basically you can block more and the 3k stam return is pretty nice, im loving it. i have a exxellent sustain combined with dark deal so i rarely have to use it and can keep the pressure up longer without having to disengage
Its basically 2/3 of the argonian passive sustainwise