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Jewelry crafting research in crown store? Seriously? ESO move to Pay to Win system?

Rittings
Rittings
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I see from some released images on PC and XBOX that the crown store appears to contain a 15-day reduction scroll for jewelry crafting research... This is a HORRIBLE red flag for me. it signals a definite move to "pay to win" for Elder Scrolls.

Basically makes all that was previously stated about having to work towards being a jewelry crafter, and no instant gratification a complete lie. I'm at a loss for words outside of what is not allowed on these forums that I feel like stating.
  • Prabooo
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    af all that you wrote, I couldn't get my eyes off of...

    4:44

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  • Yzalirk
    Yzalirk
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    According to you, Master Crafters paying to learn traits faster is P2W? Get over yourself.
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  • MerlinPendragon
    MerlinPendragon
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    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.
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    Merlin Pendragon - Uther Pendragon - The Lady of the Lake - Sir Lancelot
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  • JasonSilverSpring
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    Research scrolls have existed for a while now. They just added them for jewelry because it is new. I did not check to see if they are more expensive. I know the ones bought with writs are more (10 vouchers instead of 3). And, in now way is this pay to win. It is just pay to speed up.
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  • Rittings
    Rittings
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    This isn't the Master Writ vendor... this is a 15-day instant research scroll for 5,000 crowns from the crown store.

    I never said it was P2W either - i said it was a clear and indicative move TOWARDS Pay-to-Win...

    There is NO cooldown on them either... so you can buy and use as many as you like... you can have all your jewelry crafting done in a matter of minutes. That's ridiculous - especially after THEY (Zenimax) stated they didn't want to make it easy or "instant' to become a master crafter... it makes them look like liars... i'm deeply saddened by this... deeply. They talk about balance, but they just tipped the scales completely.

    It just cheapened all the time investment I put into the game. It's off-putting that something I will have to work so hard for, someone else can just come along and buy instantly.
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  • Rittings
    Rittings
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    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    This is a ridiculous statement. Saying you don't have to actually play the game to win, but can buy it - is crazy. Other MMOs do this in their final death throws - and it's usually the nail in their coffins...
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  • Rittings
    Rittings
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    Research scrolls have existed for a while now. They just added them for jewelry because it is new. I did not check to see if they are more expensive. I know the ones bought with writs are more (10 vouchers instead of 3). And, in now way is this pay to win. It is just pay to speed up.

    Again, i'm not talking about writ vendor - which have a 20h cooldown on use. i'm talking 5,000 crowns to reduce 15-days off your research time, with NO cooldown - so you can just re-apply another until you're done... making it so you can be all done on day 1.
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  • MerlinPendragon
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    Rittings wrote: »
    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    This is a ridiculous statement. Saying you don't have to actually play the game to win, but can buy it - is crazy. Other MMOs do this in their final death throws - and it's usually the nail in their coffins...

    Many gamers are now adults who have been playing MMOs for a long time, in some cases, MULTIPLE DECADES, I work hard for my money and I don't want to spend my limited game time grinding. I have the disposable income to buy my way through some of the grind. It's revenue to ZOS and that's a good thing. This game is no where close to dead and was recently rated one of the healthiest MMOs by MassivelyOP.

    Money talks and BS walks. People who can pay to win to get through some of the grind and make the most of their game time shouldn't be held back by the complaints of the peasantry.

    Pay to win is a good thing, not a bad one.
    Edited by MerlinPendragon on May 22, 2018 3:23AM
    _____________________________________
    Merlin Pendragon - Uther Pendragon - The Lady of the Lake - Sir Lancelot
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  • Rittings
    Rittings
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    Money talks and BS walks. People who can pay to win to get through some of the grind and make the most of their game time shouldn't be held back by the complaints of the peasantry.

    Pay to win is a good thing, not a bad one.

    If you care to call me "peasantry" then I shall take great pleasure in offering up insults back at you, and let it be known that I'm merely defending myself against you like, "thy poisonous bunch-backed toad!!" (I love Shakespeare)

    P2W is still P2W. It's an act of desperation. It's one thing to "cut the grind" down after a set period of time - but to immediately give advantage to someone throwing money at the game then it breeds lazy contempt in players - and actually puts off the larger customer base as it pampers to a few scurvy toffs who feel like they don't have time to play.

    I'll tell you who makes a GREAT blueprint for a gaming company for an MMO... David Braben's, Frontier Developments. FDev have it SPOT ON when their store only contains items for aesthetics and customizing your ships/toons. People get out of the game what they put in... it rewards people for their loyalty, patience and investments. It's also meant that the community that play the game seem to be a lot less aggressive towards each other - despite the game setting being one that is almost entirely PVP... it's amazing... and FDev invest in fixing their bugs and glitches and aim to make the entire gaming experience one that people love and enjoy.... you get out what you put in... it's like a rule for life...
    Edited by Rittings on May 22, 2018 5:02AM
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  • MerlinPendragon
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    There is room in ESO for the people who want to grind and the people who want to pay. People who choose to grind are not holier than those who wish to pay.

    ESO is healthy BECAUSE it offers both pay to win and normal progression options. The game is not being set off balance by those who wish to spend money in the Crown Store.

    ESO was recently named one of the healthiest MMOs available. Offering items and upgrades in their crown store is not an act of desperation... it is business savvy. This is the way the entire industry is moving. There is nothing wrong with having a profit motive and it does not prevent them from being able to offer an awesome experience.
    _____________________________________
    Merlin Pendragon - Uther Pendragon - The Lady of the Lake - Sir Lancelot
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  • EvilCroc
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    P2W is a sutuation, when buying with money is the ONLY option to get powerful items/abilities.
    Time savers are NOT P2W.
    Edited by EvilCroc on May 22, 2018 5:53AM
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  • Inoki
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    EvilCroc wrote: »
    P2W is a sutuation, when buying with money is the ONLY option to get powerful items/abilities.
    Time savers are NOT P2W.
    P2W doesn't mean just acquiring something exclusively for money. It also means acquiring the same as everyone else only faster, because by definition you get to be "first" with that gear and it enhances your game play over others. You advance in the queue.

    It's like paying for VIP seats in a cinema - because you pay something extra they care for you more and less about others, which in this case is also wrong because all of us paid equally for the game. So far the game is not F2P and I hope it never will be. That would kill it.

    More info:
    There is room in ESO for the people who want to grind and the people who want to pay. People who choose to grind are not holier than those who wish to pay.

    ESO is healthy BECAUSE it offers both pay to win and normal progression options. The game is not being set off balance by those who wish to spend money in the Crown Store.

    ESO was recently named one of the healthiest MMOs available. Offering items and upgrades in their crown store is not an act of desperation... it is business savvy. This is the way the entire industry is moving. There is nothing wrong with having a profit motive and it does not prevent them from being able to offer an awesome experience.
    I don't mind paying to support the game. I throw in a few bucks here and there quite frequently because I do appreciate the talent behind the game. I mean, it is amazing isn't it?

    Life too is a game everyone needs to learn to play and it is not fair, never was and never will be. People who say a game is not fair probably don't go out much.

    There's nothing wrong with making profit, but exploiting almost every mechanic to monetize it can be perceived as malicious and definitely aims to go down a dark path.

    The only thing that can be done about people who P2W is to beat them with their P2W toys and laugh in their face of how incompetent they are despite what they spent, @Rittings ;)

    It's only a matter of perspective. Don't let P2W ruin your day. If it becomes too much for you, quit. Sometimes it's the only option. Believe me once it becomes a haven for P2Wers and only those remain in the game they will be outnumbered by those who don't favour it and without anyone to play against and the game will die.

    I appreciate the game. I find it the best MMO I ever played which is why I frequently spend money on it, but the moment this becomes too much of a money sink and a blatant P2W (game play enhancing items only acquirable via CS and not in game) I am out of here in the blink of an eye. I did it before, I'll do it again. And they'll lose another financial contributor.
    Edited by Inoki on May 22, 2018 8:19AM
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  • Turelus
    Turelus
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    I personally wouldn't call it P2W, I would just call it greedy and insulting. :tongue:
    @Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
    "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."
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  • JasonSilverSpring
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    Rittings wrote: »
    Research scrolls have existed for a while now. They just added them for jewelry because it is new. I did not check to see if they are more expensive. I know the ones bought with writs are more (10 vouchers instead of 3). And, in now way is this pay to win. It is just pay to speed up.

    Again, i'm not talking about writ vendor - which have a 20h cooldown on use. i'm talking 5,000 crowns to reduce 15-days off your research time, with NO cooldown - so you can just re-apply another until you're done... making it so you can be all done on day 1.

    I knew what you meant. Research scrolls in the crown store are not new. They just added for jewelry. The 15 day ones are newer but they just represent a bulk discount since there has never been a cool down on crown store scrolls.

    You can't be done on day one really unless you really grind to acquire the items to research.
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  • JasonSilverSpring
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    Turelus wrote: »
    I personally wouldn't call it P2W, I would just call it greedy and insulting. :tongue:

    How is it greedy? If someone is willing to pay for the convenience of not waiting, why not profit from it?

    The 15 day ones are cheaper than 15 one day ones. Greedy would be not offering the bulk discount.

    I have never bought any research scrolls from the crown store and will not because I am not that pressed to finish research since there is such a grind for upgrade mats. But, so what if others do.
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  • Yzalirk
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    OP, please stop. You continue to make less sense the more you argue. In fact, I am convinced you are just a troll.
    Rittings wrote: »
    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    This is a ridiculous statement. Saying you don't have to actually play the game to win, but can buy it - is crazy. Other MMOs do this in their final death throws - and it's usually the nail in their coffins...

    Where is your evidence of this claim? If ESO is in its “final death throw,” why is Summerset a thing? ESO has been voted the third most popular MMO. Nothing stinks of death there.
    Rittings wrote: »
    This isn't the Master Writ vendor... this is a 15-day instant research scroll for 5,000 crowns from the crown store.

    I never said it was P2W either - i said it was a clear and indicative move TOWARDS Pay-to-Win...

    There is NO cooldown on them either... so you can buy and use as many as you like... you can have all your jewelry crafting done in a matter of minutes. That's ridiculous - especially after THEY (Zenimax) stated they didn't want to make it easy or "instant' to become a master crafter... it makes them look like liars... i'm deeply saddened by this... deeply. They talk about balance, but they just tipped the scales completely.

    It just cheapened all the time investment I put into the game. It's off-putting that something I will have to work so hard for, someone else can just come along and buy instantly.
    Rittings wrote: »
    Money talks and BS walks. People who can pay to win to get through some of the grind and make the most of their game time shouldn't be held back by the complaints of the peasantry.

    Pay to win is a good thing, not a bad one.

    If you care to call me "peasantry" then I shall take great pleasure in offering up insults back at you, and let it be known that I'm merely defending myself against you like, "thy poisonous bunch-backed toad!!" (I love Shakespeare)

    P2W is still P2W. It's an act of desperation. It's one thing to "cut the grind" down after a set period of time - but to immediately give advantage to someone throwing money at the game then it breeds lazy contempt in players - and actually puts off the larger customer base as it pampers to a few scurvy toffs who feel like they don't have time to play.

    I'll tell you who makes a GREAT blueprint for a gaming company for an MMO... David Braben's, Frontier Developments. FDev have it SPOT ON when their store only contains items for aesthetics and customizing your ships/toons. People get out of the game what they put in... it rewards people for their loyalty, patience and investments. It's also meant that the community that play the game seem to be a lot less aggressive towards each other - despite the game setting being one that is almost entirely PVP... it's amazing... and FDev invest in fixing their bugs and glitches and aim to make the entire gaming experience one that people love and enjoy.... you get out what you put in... it's like a rule for life...

    Now you contradict yourself. You say it is P2W then you say did not.

    How does spending money to learn traits faster “breed lazy contempt” in players? How about players who buy armor set pieces because they do not want to farm them? Of course, only difference being in-game gold currency versus money spent Crowns but same concept nevertheless.

    If players want to pay to learn traits faster, there is no harm there. I am still confused why you take no issue with the other research scrolls. Players still need to actually collect said traits to learn and craft with along with the materials and leveling up the skill line.
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  • BejaProphet
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    I don't think its P2W strictly speaking. But I do think the no cool down option borderlines it. If we want to define P2W as abilities or something giving an advantage that are ONLY available via purchase, then its worth considering this: It takes an extremely long time to 9 trait research a craft. Many months. That means there will be a MASSIVE window in which the ONLY people who can sell rings on the market for high requirement sets like twice born star or others will be those who have paid to get there more quickly. This means there is going to be many months in which you can now pay to have a very large market advantage and rake in huge sums of gold.

    Perhaps not P2W, but when seen from that light the OP has some merit in saying this is a step in that direction. There should be a cool down.
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  • Inoki
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    I don't think its P2W strictly speaking. But I do think the no cool down option borderlines it. If we want to define P2W as abilities or something giving an advantage that are ONLY available via purchase, then its worth considering this: It takes an extremely long time to 9 trait research a craft. Many months. That means there will be a MASSIVE window in which the ONLY people who can sell rings on the market for high requirement sets like twice born star or others will be those who have paid to get there more quickly. This means there is going to be many months in which you can now pay to have a very large market advantage and rake in huge sums of gold.

    Perhaps not P2W, but when seen from that light the OP has some merit in saying this is a step in that direction. There should be a cool down.
    in this regard, generally speaking, anything that allows for faster progression (with the exception of character levelling scrolls, because those truly do not give one any advantage over others) can be considered P2W, not talking about gear with absurd stats only obtainable from the CS, which I hope it will never come to, because that would kill the game instantly.

    only items that have no impact on game play whatsoever (like cosmetics for reasonable prices) should ever be added as luxury items to a store as means of extra cash to sustain the game along with an optional subscription. we already have such items, e.g. potions and experience scrolls and these are nice additions if they also keep low price tags like 500 Crowns per recurrently purchasable bundle.
    Edited by Inoki on May 22, 2018 2:43PM
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  • Stormahawk
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    Horse leveling from the Crown store existed previously as a CATCH UP mechanism. The same was the case when they added instant research scrolls for the original crafts (blacksmithing, woodworking, etc). I personally think that those instant research scrolls cheapened the time it took to become a Master Crafter, but it is still a catch up mechanism.

    Now this Jewelry Crafting instant research is letting players pay to get AHEAD and essentially gives them a small monopoly for several weeks on 6 to 9 trait sets like Julianos. A monopoly means easy gold for those players and that's where the P2W from paying to get ahead is a problem. It could have been easily remedied by either delaying the release of the instant research scrolls by a couple of weeks, or by adding a comparable research scroll with no cooldown to the writ vendor. ZOS did not choose any of the solutions to the "pay to get AHEAD" problem and sent a clear message to the p2w direction of the game is taking.

    TL;DR
    This Jewelry insta-research is different from previous instances where the Crown store acted as a catch-up mechanism. For the first time the Crown store allows players to pay to get ahead. This is most definitely a form of pay to win and sends a signal that this is where the game is going.

    (edited to add tl;dr)
    Edited by Stormahawk on May 22, 2018 2:47PM
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  • Rittings
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    @Yzalirk - calling me a "troll" is a bit much. I think you need to sit yourself down.

    How did I contradict myself? I put a question mark that clearly indicates I'm ASKING IF we think it's a move to P2W - meaning I'm not stating it IS P2W... then I say it's a move TOWARDS P2W in my opinion in my opening statements. If you do not understand how pretense and punctuation works, then that's on you.

    As previously stated, "catch up" methods once most players have obtained something is VERY different to offering something that puts those that pay ahead of others. That's a definite move TOWARDS P2W. It is not a move I welcome, or condone. This game has been so successful because it has previously rewarded those that invest time in it, whilst balancing it out for newer players that wish to "catch up".

    I will tell you now, I'm an ESO+ member, and have only ever purchased crowns to get upgrades like the Banker/Merchant or a mount I really wanted. I have no interest in paying for something just to get ahead, when I can earn it in the game. I find it unethical and makes it all pointless.

    That said, I don't mind players playing "catch up" on horse training, blacksmithing etc. Even crown motifs.

    This has definitely reflected negatively on Zenimax for me though. Mainly because they CLEARLY stated they didn't want instant gratification for players to become master jewelry crafters... and this move is in direct contradiction with that statement. Making the previous one a lie.

    It's not going to be terribly hard for people to get all the traits. All it will take is 3 or 4 people with money to go and get the different traits on the first day and ... boom. 9-trait crafters in the first day.

    In fact, I cannot confirm it yet, and I'm working to confirm it - but I heard PC already have 9-trait jewelry crafters. Once confirmed I will screenshot.
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  • notimetocare
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    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    Uh... No. Just no
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  • MerlinPendragon
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    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    Uh... No. Just no

    Umm.. Yeah. Wake up and smell the coffee. This is the future of the gaming industry whether you like it or not.
    _____________________________________
    Merlin Pendragon - Uther Pendragon - The Lady of the Lake - Sir Lancelot
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  • BejaProphet
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    Inoki wrote: »
    I don't think its P2W strictly speaking. But I do think the no cool down option borderlines it. If we want to define P2W as abilities or something giving an advantage that are ONLY available via purchase, then its worth considering this: It takes an extremely long time to 9 trait research a craft. Many months. That means there will be a MASSIVE window in which the ONLY people who can sell rings on the market for high requirement sets like twice born star or others will be those who have paid to get there more quickly. This means there is going to be many months in which you can now pay to have a very large market advantage and rake in huge sums of gold.

    Perhaps not P2W, but when seen from that light the OP has some merit in saying this is a step in that direction. There should be a cool down.
    in this regard, generally speaking, anything that allows for faster progression (with the exception of character levelling scrolls, because those truly do not give one any advantage over others) can be considered P2W, not talking about gear with absurd stats only obtainable from the CS, which I hope it will never come to, because that would kill the game instantly.

    only items that have no impact on game play whatsoever (like cosmetics for reasonable prices) should ever be added as luxury items to a store as means of extra cash to sustain the game along with an optional subscription. we already have such items, e.g. potions and experience scrolls and these are nice additions if they also keep low price tags like 500 Crowns per recurrently purchasable bundle.

    Re-read my very first statement. I say its not P2W.
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  • Rittings
    Rittings
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    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    Uh... No. Just no

    Umm.. Yeah. Wake up and smell the coffee. This is the future of the gaming industry whether you like it or not.

    Clearly don't know the gaming industry - and clearly don't know what you're talking about or even listening to any of us. Go check out Frontier Development and their gaming business model. Then go check their customer base. Nearly all adult gamers who have a solid income and spend lots of money in their store on aesthetics ONLY. In their space MMO you can't even trade items or give credits/gold to any other player etc. They want everyone to work for it and they get a highly dedicated fan base because of it... not only that, the community is a rich tapestry of helpful and committed players...
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  • JPcrazysquirrel3
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    imgur.com/e72ZqYi

    God the interface for trying to get a d*** picture or gif posted here sucks.
    Edited by JPcrazysquirrel3 on May 23, 2018 1:39AM
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    Class reps are just like our politicians. They promise mountains made of gold for us, but in the end, whenever they can they try to push their own agenda.

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  • MerlinPendragon
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    Rittings wrote: »
    I think you need to sit yourself down.

    .

    I think you need to take your own advice.
    Rittings wrote: »
    That's a definite move TOWARDS P2W. It is not a move I welcome, or condone.

    We need MORE pay to win - not less.

    The gaming industry is no longer a market geared toward children and teenagers. There are now many much older adults, some of whom have been playing MMOs for 20+ years, and we have disposable income to spend on our hobbies - including the games we like.

    If I want to buy my way through certain content - such as the crafting research time - I should be able to put my money to work and make that happen. If you don't - that's fine - but you shouldn't be preventing me from doing so.

    I do CONDONE P2W models.
    Rittings wrote: »
    I have no interest in paying for something just to get ahead, when I can earn it in the game. I find it unethical and makes it all pointless.

    That's good for you if you like to earn everything in-game, however, the fact that I like to buy items to take out some of the grind does not make me nor my actions "unethical". I strongly suggest some basic business classes before you start making broad based accusations that certain business decisions are unethical. ZOS is a business - not a charity and not a day care center. Money comes first - that's a cold hard reality whether you like it or not.
    Rittings wrote: »
    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    Uh... No. Just no

    Umm.. Yeah. Wake up and smell the coffee. This is the future of the gaming industry whether you like it or not.

    Clearly don't know the gaming industry - and clearly don't know what you're talking about or even listening to any of us. Go check out Frontier Development and their gaming business model. Then go check their customer base. Nearly all adult gamers who have a solid income and spend lots of money in their store on aesthetics ONLY. In their space MMO you can't even trade items or give credits/gold to any other player etc. They want everyone to work for it and they get a highly dedicated fan base because of it... not only that, the community is a rich tapestry of helpful and committed players...

    You're kidding me right?

    EA's financial statements are publicly available information. Go read the notes to the financials, including management's discussion and analysis. Nearly $400 million in gross revenues from these types of in-game purchase type revenue streams. Sitting there and denying that the gaming industry is moving toward more of this type model is equivalent to an ostrich sticking their head in the ground.

    Frontier Development's model might work for them - but that's never going to work for ESO. They are not on the same plane as ZOS/Bethesda and is not a particularly useful comparison.

    As I have said several times already - Money talks and BS walks. People like myself who have disposable income and wish to spend it in game should not be prevented from doing so by holy rollers who think high and mighty of themselves because they grind out every achievement in the game.
    Edited by MerlinPendragon on June 1, 2018 8:05PM
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  • Aliyavana
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    Rittings wrote: »
    I think you need to sit yourself down.

    .

    I think you need to take your own advice.
    Rittings wrote: »
    That's a definite move TOWARDS P2W. It is not a move I welcome, or condone.

    We need MORE free to play - not less.

    The gaming industry is no longer a market geared toward children and teenagers. There are now many much older adults, some of whom have been playing MMOs for 20+ years, and we have disposable income to spend on our hobbies - including the games we like.

    If I want to buy my way through certain content - such as the crafting research time - I should be able to put my money to work and make that happen. If you don't - that's fine - but you shouldn't be preventing me from doing so.

    I do CONDONE P2W models.
    Rittings wrote: »
    I have no interest in paying for something just to get ahead, when I can earn it in the game. I find it unethical and makes it all pointless.

    That's good for you if you like to earn everything in-game, however, the fact that I like to buy items to take out some of the grind does not make me nor my actions "unethical". I strongly suggest some basic business classes before you start making broad based accusations that certain business decisions are unethical. ZOS is a business - not a charity and not a day care center. Money comes first - that's a cold hard reality whether you like it or not.
    Rittings wrote: »
    There is nothing wrong with pay to win.

    We need more of it, not less.

    Uh... No. Just no

    Umm.. Yeah. Wake up and smell the coffee. This is the future of the gaming industry whether you like it or not.

    Clearly don't know the gaming industry - and clearly don't know what you're talking about or even listening to any of us. Go check out Frontier Development and their gaming business model. Then go check their customer base. Nearly all adult gamers who have a solid income and spend lots of money in their store on aesthetics ONLY. In their space MMO you can't even trade items or give credits/gold to any other player etc. They want everyone to work for it and they get a highly dedicated fan base because of it... not only that, the community is a rich tapestry of helpful and committed players...

    You're kidding me right?

    EA's financial statements are publicly available information. Go read the notes to the financials, including management's discussion and analysis. Nearly $400 million in gross revenues from these types of in-game purchase type revenue streams. Sitting there and denying that the gaming industry is moving toward more of this type model is equivalent to an ostrich sticking their head in the ground.

    Frontier Development's model might work for them - but that's never going to work for ESO. They are not on the same plane as ZOS/Bethesda and is not a particularly useful comparison.

    As I have said several times already - Money talks and BS walks. People like myself who have disposable income and wish to spend it in game should not be prevented from doing so by holy rollers who think high and mighty of themselves because they grind out every achievement in the game.

    I hope vma weapons and other bis gear never make it to the crown store
    Options
  • JPcrazysquirrel3
    JPcrazysquirrel3
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    Aliyavana wrote: »
    I hope vma weapons and other bis gear never make it to the crown store

    I can picture it now:
    "For only the small price of $1000 worth of crowns, YOU can have this purple invigorating VMA weapon!"
    "Wood Elves aren't made of wood. Sea Elves aren't made of water. M'aiq still wonders about High Elves."
    "It's just not a home until you decorate the torture chamber, am I right?"
    "If you want to lose 10lbs of ugly fat, I'd be happy to chop your head off!"
    "Degenerates!" --- Todd Howard
    "If it's not broke, don't fix it,....unless you're ZO$ and are just doing it for the money!" --- Me
    Mayrael wrote: »
    Class reps are just like our politicians. They promise mountains made of gold for us, but in the end, whenever they can they try to push their own agenda.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    Bio:
    I am in a Kevduit video
    PS4 (main platform)
    --- JP_Dovahkriid

    PC (just for PTS since Dragon Bones)
    --- JP_Dovahkriid

    Playing since console release in 2015

    17 characters; mainly play PvE tanks and healer, as well as PvP stamDK, magplar, and stamblade; I also have a handful of DPS toons to have variety. All AD, with one, now PvE, DC toon.

    I was on the forums before, but something happened with my account info and I had to create a new account.
    Options
  • Rittings
    Rittings
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Aliyavana wrote: »

    I hope vma weapons and other bis gear never make it to the crown store

    Put MerlinPendragon in charge and they'll magically appear in there. It's what he wants. He can't earn them himself, so needs to buy his way through.

    As far as ZoS goes - they make plenty of their income via in-game aesthetics. That's their bread and butter and THAT is what has made this game so healthy and set apart from the other games - NOT introducing P2W items. I don't want to see exclusive items that make gods of players in the crown store - and neither should you. So I'm hoping they take heed and stop this step towards that.

    FDev, as I've stated, has a mature demographic of players. Ones that would NOT tolerate P2W in any format. Wannabe gamers (and I call them that, because clearly they need to buy the victories) tend to ditch Elite Dangerous as fast as they pick it up when they realize everything isn't delivered on a silver platter to them... it's highly refreshing.

    We pay for this game... we pay a subscription of DLCs and extra for expansions... that should be enough to deter ZoS from further gouging. If it isn't... then like others have stated here, the P2W players will be all that remain.

    As I've repeated several times too, it's not just the horrible direction this takes, it's also the fact we were clearly lied to about jewelry crafting being something we needed to work towards, rather than instant gratification. I feel that we were mislead, and they've already taken our money for Summerset pre-orders before going back on that word. It's lowered my trust in Zenimax completely.

    Options
  • JPcrazysquirrel3
    JPcrazysquirrel3
    ✭✭✭✭
    Rittings wrote: »
    Aliyavana wrote: »

    I hope vma weapons and other bis gear never make it to the crown store

    Put MerlinPendragon in charge and they'll magically appear in there. It's what he wants. He can't earn them himself, so needs to buy his way through.

    As far as ZoS goes - they make plenty of their income via in-game aesthetics. That's their bread and butter and THAT is what has made this game so healthy and set apart from the other games - NOT introducing P2W items. I don't want to see exclusive items that make gods of players in the crown store - and neither should you. So I'm hoping they take heed and stop this step towards that.

    FDev, as I've stated, has a mature demographic of players. Ones that would NOT tolerate P2W in any format. Wannabe gamers (and I call them that, because clearly they need to buy the victories) tend to ditch Elite Dangerous as fast as they pick it up when they realize everything isn't delivered on a silver platter to them... it's highly refreshing.

    We pay for this game... we pay a subscription of DLCs and extra for expansions... that should be enough to deter ZoS from further gouging. If it isn't... then like others have stated here, the P2W players will be all that remain.

    As I've repeated several times too, it's not just the horrible direction this takes, it's also the fact we were clearly lied to about jewelry crafting being something we needed to work towards, rather than instant gratification. I feel that we were mislead, and they've already taken our money for Summerset pre-orders before going back on that word. It's lowered my trust in Zenimax completely.

    But you do have to work towards jewelry crafting.

    Learning the traits faster doesn't mean anything really, unless you'd like to have an equal complaint about blacksmithing, clothing, and woodworking research scrolls too?
    You have a much longer grind getting all of the required materials to make one piece of jewelry than any other craft. It definitely does take more "work towards".
    "Wood Elves aren't made of wood. Sea Elves aren't made of water. M'aiq still wonders about High Elves."
    "It's just not a home until you decorate the torture chamber, am I right?"
    "If you want to lose 10lbs of ugly fat, I'd be happy to chop your head off!"
    "Degenerates!" --- Todd Howard
    "If it's not broke, don't fix it,....unless you're ZO$ and are just doing it for the money!" --- Me
    Mayrael wrote: »
    Class reps are just like our politicians. They promise mountains made of gold for us, but in the end, whenever they can they try to push their own agenda.

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    Bio:
    I am in a Kevduit video
    PS4 (main platform)
    --- JP_Dovahkriid

    PC (just for PTS since Dragon Bones)
    --- JP_Dovahkriid

    Playing since console release in 2015

    17 characters; mainly play PvE tanks and healer, as well as PvP stamDK, magplar, and stamblade; I also have a handful of DPS toons to have variety. All AD, with one, now PvE, DC toon.

    I was on the forums before, but something happened with my account info and I had to create a new account.
    Options
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