It's Time To Make Vamparism More Punishing

DuskMarine

zyk wrote: »

DuskMarine wrote: »

if werewolf wasnt junk hed be wrong but werewolf is serious junk right now

Werewolves can be very strong in PVP.

then why havent i seen one in over a year?? reason being 99.9% of players are vamps. the raiders always run vamps(if you dont your gimping yourself on damage mitigation and recovery). pvpers are vampires every single one ive ran into(especially nightblades) for damage mitigation recovery and the ability to run in stealth. werewolves.........i havent seen a single one in over a year because its practically the most useless thing since they nerfed it into the ground removing the just standing stamina recovery killed any practical use of werewolf. if you see a werewolf their either rping or giving out a bite but they never use the transformation cause its useless now. its a complete waste of time to get on a character your planning on raiding with.

Rohamad_Ali

No thank you . I would rather ZoS leave Vampire alone then this to get esthetic change .

Betsararie

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Blanco wrote: »

Can't tell if OP is serious. Vampirism already has a huge drawback, it's called fire damage. Happen to run across a mag DK, and you are in a severely unbalanced fight. That is more than enough drawback. And not to mention the god awful appearance.

There are no enemy DKs in PvE.

What I said would apply to PVE too, why not.

CoA 2, Blessed crucible final boss. Are two examples that come to mind. The difficulties of each of those dungeons/fights is increased noticeably for vampires. I consider that sufficient drawback, personally.

Gilvoth

the past few months i keep seeing these type of threads that seem to be asking for and wanting, wishing, that other people and classes and anyone whom is different then themselves to suffer, or hurt or have bad things happen to thier class, race, and even skills.

perhaps would be Much better for us all if we wished Good upon eachother, and stop this petty type of threads and instead request Buffs and helps and increases in strengths and better things for one another.

lets be good to eachother.

high time these type of decrease and nerf and hurt eachother threads come to an end.

Aliyavana

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

the past few months i keep seeing these type of threads that seem to be asking for and wanting, wishing, that other people and classes and anyone whom is different then themselves to suffer, or hurt or have bad things happen to thier class, race, and even skills.

perhaps would be Much better for us all if we wished Good upon eachother, and stop this petty type of threads and instead request Buffs and helps and increases in strengths and better things for one another.

lets be good to eachother.

high time these type of decrease and nerf and hurt eachother threads come to an end.

agreed, its time for a hide vampirism skin and for us to do away with the "cosmetic is a downside, cure it if you don't like it" mind set.

Geru77

Decisions, decisions. Do I run with the uber lewt doods and look like a coked up hooker?Sacrifices must be made!

Aliyavana

Geru77 wrote: »

Decisions, decisions. Do I run with the uber lewt doods and look like a coked up hooker?Sacrifices must be made!

except you don't have to as you can avoid that with a ugly flashlight skin!

flguy147ub17_ESO

being a vampire next patch in PVP will be increibly harsh with light attacks buff with fire staff and there are dawnbreakers everywhere. Gonna cure mine because wont be able to survive in pvp with it i dont think

Aliyavana

flguy147ub17_ESO wrote: »

being a vampire next patch in PVP will be increibly harsh with light attacks buff with fire staff and there are dawnbreakers everywhere. Gonna cure mine because wont be able to survive in pvp with it i dont think

Believe me that cyrodil will still be over in with vamps

DuskMarine

flguy147ub17_ESO wrote: »

being a vampire next patch in PVP will be increibly harsh with light attacks buff with fire staff and there are dawnbreakers everywhere. Gonna cure mine because wont be able to survive in pvp with it i dont think

it wont be any worse than it already is it wont change a dang thing

Sergykid

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

And I Agree That Vampirism Passives Should Be Active With An Ability Slotted.

DoctorESO

But what about those of us who want the 10% magicka recovery without any downsides?

jircris11

why do people insist on trying to make others time on eso hell? I play a vampire khajiit I have a skill slotted and I still do good in pvp and pve. Some people how ever must follow a meta to be "good" and then others simply want to make everything usless or "more difficult/punishing" this is a MMO you have to cater to more then just one type of gamer. If you want such things go play skyrim or morrowind. hell be a vampire on morrowind and then come back and talk about punishing.

TheShadowScout

Aliyavana wrote: »

a lot of players are against hiding vamparism because they consider it a drawback but would probably qq if they were forced to slot a vampire ability, a REAL drawback, in order to get the benefits of regen...

I think it would make no sense at all to have to slot a vampire ability to gain the benefits - since vampirism is an integral change of a beings nature seom mortal (well, sort of mortal in the case of vestiges) to undead... and the benefits are a reflection thereof. That is also why there should be no "transformation" to use the vampy abilities (that would be werewolves)

However, I always felt that there should be -something- to hide the vampire appearance, and some good reasons for vampires to "masquerade" as mortals.

Like...

• ...give them an ability that lowers appearance by one stage, meaning at stage 1 they can use it to seem completely mortal... at the cost of an ability slot. We know it is possible, since Count Verandis Ravenwatch did it during the first meeting in the rivenspire story!

...and then...

• ...give all NPCs an chance to spot vampires and react unfavorably... guards would go "kill on sight", vendors and other civilian NPCs would refuse to talk to the person and yell for the guard instead... make vampires seem like -monsters- instead of mere players with an additional skill line. And have that chance being dependend on their stage... at los stages they might perhaps pass for sickly or albinos, but there still ought to be a chance someone will go "waitaminit, that's a bloodsucking fiend! Guards, kill it, kill it with fire!" - so, lets say... 20% discovery chance at stage 1, 40% at 2, 80% at 3 and automatic as stage four - lowered by the aforementioned ability just like the looks.

Of course, I personally would want other "classic" drawbacks as well. Like...

• ...greatly reduced swimming speed, and even a strong magica drain while swimming, to make them do their very best to avoid any "running water"...
• ...a chance to loose control and auto-attack innocent civilian NPCs, the guards of your own side in cyrodil and even other players including your own party members (unless they too are vampires) when at stage four and a vampire just can no longer resist the smell of sweet blood running through someones vains...
• ...penalties during daylight (yes, I know, the lore made them all daywalkers as to not make the players too vexed if they took damage in sunlight like in all other TES games, but there still could be -some- effect; the traditional dracula from the story did not crumble to ash under the son, merely lost his supernatural powers... the "sundeath" came later, in the movies when they wanted a more flashy "snatching victory from the jaws of defeat" ending then the original tale provided)

But I also would like to see some more perks for vampires. Like...

• ...gaining access to the same teleport gap closer that bloodfiends have!
• ...gaining a "charm" skill that allows them to feed from civilian NPCs (and possibly even players, though those would get a chance to CC-break the effect!) without the victim calling in a crime (witnesses still would tho)
• ...doing damage when they feed off some NPC, leaving those at half health from blood loss!
• ...gaining a "Bite of Woe" when joining the dark brotherhood, so you finally no longer have to worry about both being on the same command and sometimes triggering the wrong one, but get one "DoItAll" bite attack that also counts in Sithis eyes for proper assassinations!
• ...not being aggroed from random bloodfiends in the wilds (yellow status, attackable but non-hostile) as those lesser bloodsuckers finally learn their place!
• ...gaining access to a special "vampires only" location (maybe reusing and expanding the one from the vampire introductionary quest? And also adding a door to there from a certain cave in cyrodil?) where they can find willing blood donor vampire groupies, crafting stations for and vendors selling vampire-supporting item sets, whatever...

DuskMarine

Sergykid wrote: »

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

And I Agree That Vampirism Passives Should Be Active With An Ability Slotted.

if they made it to where you had to have an ability slotted it would be useless and permanently purged from peoples memories then no one will be a vampire(making the only game with useful vampire power skyrim). if i had to slot a ability to use it with the other problems it has id just take it off and say screw it it has no use if they make it like that.

bloodthirstyvampire

@TheShadowScout
Yes so much this I'm in love with the idea, but all the why so serious players would flip their lids whine and complain, plus zos Can't exactly make money off it and its waaaaaay to much work and you know how much zos like to copy an paste.

Don't get me wrong everything you listed sounds sexy to me

bloodthirstyvampire

DuskMarine wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

And I Agree That Vampirism Passives Should Be Active With An Ability Slotted.

if they made it to where you had to have an ability slotted it would be useless and permanently purged from peoples memories then no one except bloodthirstyvampire will be a vampire(making the only game with useful vampire power skyrim). if i had to slot a ability to use it with the other problems it has id just take it off and say screw it it has no use if they make it like that.

Ftfy @DuskMarine

DuskMarine

bloodthirstyvampire wrote: »

DuskMarine wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

And I Agree That Vampirism Passives Should Be Active With An Ability Slotted.

if they made it to where you had to have an ability slotted it would be useless and permanently purged from peoples memories then no one except bloodthirstyvampire will be a vampire(making the only game with useful vampire power skyrim). if i had to slot a ability to use it with the other problems it has id just take it off and say screw it it has no use if they make it like that.

Ftfy @DuskMarine

rper i imagine?

Darrett

I still think stage 1 should hide all visual vampiric indicators and it should get progressively worse with each stage you advance. Then cause a detection radius per stage that applies a bounty to the vampire player. So if you want to remain at stage 4, you’re going to be severely limited in what you can do from a PvE perspective.

Beyond that, a PvP flag if your vampiric bounty is triggered would be interesting as well, or a bounty system similar to SWG’s so people could load up on fire damage and fighter’s guild abilities and go chase after vampire players, though that would probably warrant some kind of increase in advantages to make up for the inconvenience.

MLGProPlayer

Sergykid wrote: »

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

Seriously lol?

It's called proper case and it's how you're supposed to write titles (other than in APA academic papers).

bloodthirstyvampire

Nope I'm no rper I just have a personal preference for my toons to be vampires is all
@DuskMarine

MLGProPlayer

DuskMarine wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

And I Agree That Vampirism Passives Should Be Active With An Ability Slotted.

if they made it to where you had to have an ability slotted it would be useless and permanently purged from peoples memories then no one will be a vampire(making the only game with useful vampire power skyrim). if i had to slot a ability to use it with the other problems it has id just take it off and say screw it it has no use if they make it like that.

Vampire builds are supposed to be niche. Right now, they're pretty much mandatory for PvE.

Korah_Eaglecry

Joy_Division wrote: »

If ZOS had done something to give mortals their own advantages / skillline, than being vampire or werewolf might actually be meaningful choices rather than a power-grab.

Thats what the Fighters Guild Skillline was supposed to be. It was supposed to be able to counter the curse skilllines. But Vampirism and Lycanothropy was so popular that they ended up being over-represented and so when balance changes were made they were done so to appease those groups. Everyone seemed to have forgotten that there was a mortal/uncursed skillline that was supposed to be apart of that balance. I cant remember the last time anyone talked about the Fighters Guild Skillline when talking about balance passes on either Vampires or Werewolves. It always ends up centering on how fair or unfair things would be for those two skilllines to have to sacrifice for what they have. Meanwhile you dont hear anyone suggesting Fighters Guild as counters to those two skilllines anymore.

DuskMarine

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

DuskMarine wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

Why Did You Write The Title Like This? Looks Stupid.

And I Agree That Vampirism Passives Should Be Active With An Ability Slotted.

if they made it to where you had to have an ability slotted it would be useless and permanently purged from peoples memories then no one will be a vampire(making the only game with useful vampire power skyrim). if i had to slot a ability to use it with the other problems it has id just take it off and say screw it it has no use if they make it like that.

Vampire builds are supposed to be niche. Right now, they're pretty much mandatory for PvE.

there is no niche if what it takes to be a dps makes getting the ability needed for passives to trigger impossible without losing damage and thus puts it out the window. same with werewolf there is litterally no point in running it at all unless you wanna just screw your build

Korah_Eaglecry

I think it wouldnt be beyond reasonable to introduce Glamours as something they could sell in the Crown Store or drop in a Trial to allow Vampires to change their appearance to something more appeasing. The magic isnt out of question and would align with the franchise lore.

ADarklore

Aliyavana wrote: »

a lot of players are against hiding vamparism because they consider it a drawback but would probably qq if they were forced to slot a vampire ability, a REAL drawback, in order to get the benefits of regen. "Embrace vampirism" is the argument. So the anti hide vampirism crowd should really embrace it and be forced to slot a vampire ability as one of the draw backs of vampirism just like the old days. At this point the majority of people only consider vampirism as a stat increase and many don't care about the cosmetics and the drawback isn't bad enough and so take advantage of the stat increase vampirism without even touching the full power of vamprism. atleast with this change people will not feel forced to take advantage and ruin their appearance they spent a considerable amount of time tweaking before ruining it with a skin that leaves your fur, skin, and tatoos bleached. Really eso has one of the worst incarnations of vampirism appearance wise.

Lore reasons (illusion magic, blending in with mortals, ingame explanations) and gameplay mechanics (Skins that hide vamparism already...) doesnt matter apparently and yet We can already hide our heavy armor by looking like we have light armor, or wear a wedding dress on a tank. I can make my axes look like daggers and still inflict bleeds on my opponents. I can hide my zaans and pretty soon i can even change my gear to look like monster sets which make a bigger difference in gameplay but yet hide vamparism is a huge no to them yet probably use the outfit system to hide their real gear. I think this change would help purge a huge number of players that treat vampirism like a stat increase with little drawback.

Why do YOU care how other people are playing the game that THEY paid for?!? Unless you paid for their game, then you shouldn't expect to be able to decide how other players play the game or are 'punished' for how they decide to play it!!

Aliyavana

ADarklore wrote: »

Aliyavana wrote: »

a lot of players are against hiding vamparism because they consider it a drawback but would probably qq if they were forced to slot a vampire ability, a REAL drawback, in order to get the benefits of regen. "Embrace vampirism" is the argument. So the anti hide vampirism crowd should really embrace it and be forced to slot a vampire ability as one of the draw backs of vampirism just like the old days. At this point the majority of people only consider vampirism as a stat increase and many don't care about the cosmetics and the drawback isn't bad enough and so take advantage of the stat increase vampirism without even touching the full power of vamprism. atleast with this change people will not feel forced to take advantage and ruin their appearance they spent a considerable amount of time tweaking before ruining it with a skin that leaves your fur, skin, and tatoos bleached. Really eso has one of the worst incarnations of vampirism appearance wise.

Lore reasons (illusion magic, blending in with mortals, ingame explanations) and gameplay mechanics (Skins that hide vamparism already...) doesnt matter apparently and yet We can already hide our heavy armor by looking like we have light armor, or wear a wedding dress on a tank. I can make my axes look like daggers and still inflict bleeds on my opponents. I can hide my zaans and pretty soon i can even change my gear to look like monster sets which make a bigger difference in gameplay but yet hide vamparism is a huge no to them yet probably use the outfit system to hide their real gear. I think this change would help purge a huge number of players that treat vampirism like a stat increase with little drawback.

Why do YOU care how other people are playing the game that THEY paid for?!? Unless you paid for their game, then you shouldn't expect to be able to decide how other players play the game or are 'punished' for how they decide to play it!!

that is the exact argument I used against the anti hide vampirism crowd, its only fair I apply their same logic against them. They consider the appearance a punishment but cosmetics shouldn't be a punishment whatsoever but I don't like being forced into vampirism for extra stats and for mist form (for classes without escapes) and not be able to hide vampirism.

RinaldoGandolphi

The downside and weaknesses of vampire right are perfect with its bonuses, it’s right where it should be balance wise and left alone.

The Only thing that should change is stage 4 vampires if seen by the city guard get a 1000 gold bounty and killer in sight. You are after all a blood sucking undead monster, it should matter.

As long as you feed down to stage one before entering a town your good to go. The more often you feed the more human you look, going without feeding makes you look like a monster and people and guards should react accordingly. It’s stupud you can walk around town as a stage 4 vampire or a werewolf and no one cares.

Stage 4 vampire should equal kill on sight by guards and a bounty

Transforming into a werewolf in sight of guards should equal a bounty and kill on sight by the guards

Both vampires and werewolves are monsters and players should be treated as such. Don’t transform into a we in town your fine, feed to stage one before entering town, your good...otherwise town guards will try to kill you for the monster you are and rightfully so

I have 3 toons that are vamps and one that is a ww so it is what it is.

DoctorESO

People are being "forced" into vampirism due to the competitive advantage it provides and being at a comparative disadvantage without it.

Aliyavana

DoctorESO wrote: »

People are being "forced" into vampirism due to the competitive advantage it provides and being at a comparative disadvantage without it.