Still No Strife Change

NyassaV

Change Strife

Dymence wrote: »

The only change Strife needs imo, is for the HoT to be a fixed value and not related to the damage dealt. That way, it's always going to be useful even against people permablocking or with insane damage reduction stacking. Sorcs surge got this treatment ages ago and I expected Strife to follow suit not long after, but it never happened. The cost increase really isn't an issue though.

It's a pretty big issue because now we have worry even more about *** stamina sustain

f047ys3v3n

Other

The strife thing is a problem that can't be solved without breaking the rule of Wrobel which states:

When the Wrobel makes a decision that causes problematic unintended secondary effects he will never reverse the first decision but always chooses to instead make tertiary changes that will have 4th order effects that will be even more problematic.

This problem was caused by a combination of the Morrowind nerf to sustain (aimed at PVP issues), the multi-proc relentless change (aimed at PVE low NB dps issues), and the new buffed light attack damage (aimed at huge dps divergence caused by a bunch of bad choices over the last 3 years.) Wrobel is now freaking out because he thinks that NB's, who are the most common in PVE now, who sustain better, and have to sustain better than others and are focused on that in order to multi-proc relentless now, will get a much higher, dps boost from the stronger light attacks than everybody else and so be super OP. He does not understand:

1: The poor design of vAS is the biggest reason for NB popularity and it has mostly to do with their 100% major expedition and a sticky DOT. It is not about their raw DPS, which is not great.
2: Sustain is not a problem for folks running cheat engine and neither is DPS. They scale themselves. Until he addresses this he is really just tilting at windmills.

I really doubt that good choices are going to be made in this area. I'm just planning on not playing my mNB and hoping that the mechanics in the new trial do not play well for the mNB so that the guys juicing will move on to something else and it will then appear cratered to Wrobel.

NyassaV

Change Strife

f047ys3v3n wrote: »

The strife thing is a problem that can't be solved without breaking the rule of Wrobel which states:

When the Wrobel makes a decision that causes problematic unintended secondary effects he will never reverse the first decision but always chooses to instead make tertiary changes that will have 4th order effects that will be even more problematic.

This problem was caused by a combination of the Morrowind nerf to sustain (aimed at PVP issues), the multi-proc relentless change (aimed at PVE low NB dps issues), and the new buffed light attack damage (aimed at huge dps divergence caused by a bunch of bad choices over the last 3 years.) Wrobel is now freaking out because he thinks that NB's, who are the most common in PVE now, who sustain better, and have to sustain better than others and are focused on that in order to multi-proc relentless now, will get a much higher, dps boost from the stronger light attacks than everybody else and so be super OP. He does not understand:

1: The poor design of vAS is the biggest reason for NB popularity and it has mostly to do with their 100% major expedition and a sticky DOT. It is not about their raw DPS, which is not great.

@ZOS_Wrobel They've kinda got you there.

Subversus

Change Strife

NyassaV wrote: »

show previous quotes

BohnT wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

Strife is dead. They killed it.

Use force pulse, more damage and stronger passives (destruction staff). Really nice build variety btw.

Not in pvp, magblades will hardly feel the difference in pvp. I didn’t even alter my build on the pts to suit the changes, and I run a build that sustains the bare minimum.

i'm not using it in PvP either. Crushing shocking is better. been using it since i heard about the cost increase.Crushing shock has more damage, the range interrupt is nice and it's smoother plus it's not reflect able. this change did great harm to my builds that implemented strife my more brawler type magblade builds, but even on them it's better to just get a new heal source and drop Swallow Soul for CS.

But that's fine. lets have no variety in Builds it's all good.

Strife is still superior.
All advantages of force pulse die in the process:
Unreflectable won't help you kill that DK spamming wings and if he really dies to FP spam he is surely too bad to keep wings up all the time or be a threat at all.
The extra damage is neglectable and in practise FP hits less often with it's full damage because you're chance is only: critchance^3 which is lower for critchance <100%.
And in PvP you want as much burst as you can get there is no time to wait for that triple crit.
The resource gain via destruction expert is so marginal that you can completely ignore it.
With the new interrupt mechanics a ranged interrupt is just the same as a skill without the interrupt. There are two conditions in pvp stunned or CC immune you can't interrupt in either of these.
Status effects:
you have minor maim on your enemy with magnb all the time
Burning is applied with fire glyph or LA/ HA
Minor vulnerability is accessable via CP and mirage

Strife also has multiple advantages over FP:
- Great HoT
- gives you ulti on cast every 4 seconds ---> more frequent bursts
- makes setting up your bar easier as you get the 8% magicka passive
- more healing via passives


Strife will still be the bread and butter spammable for magnbs in PvP.

New Psijic spammable is actually better. A stronger HoT which doesn't come from damage done (that stuff doesn't do well in Cyro cuz battle spirit) would be better like refreshing path. Something many magblades in PvP have unlocked even if they don't currently use it

Strife HoT is the strongest magblades have access too, certainly not path lol.

NyassaV

Change Strife

Subversus wrote: »

show previous quotes

NyassaV wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

Strife is dead. They killed it.

Use force pulse, more damage and stronger passives (destruction staff). Really nice build variety btw.

Not in pvp, magblades will hardly feel the difference in pvp. I didn’t even alter my build on the pts to suit the changes, and I run a build that sustains the bare minimum.

i'm not using it in PvP either. Crushing shocking is better. been using it since i heard about the cost increase.Crushing shock has more damage, the range interrupt is nice and it's smoother plus it's not reflect able. this change did great harm to my builds that implemented strife my more brawler type magblade builds, but even on them it's better to just get a new heal source and drop Swallow Soul for CS.

But that's fine. lets have no variety in Builds it's all good.

Strife is still superior.
All advantages of force pulse die in the process:
Unreflectable won't help you kill that DK spamming wings and if he really dies to FP spam he is surely too bad to keep wings up all the time or be a threat at all.
The extra damage is neglectable and in practise FP hits less often with it's full damage because you're chance is only: critchance^3 which is lower for critchance <100%.
And in PvP you want as much burst as you can get there is no time to wait for that triple crit.
The resource gain via destruction expert is so marginal that you can completely ignore it.
With the new interrupt mechanics a ranged interrupt is just the same as a skill without the interrupt. There are two conditions in pvp stunned or CC immune you can't interrupt in either of these.
Status effects:
you have minor maim on your enemy with magnb all the time
Burning is applied with fire glyph or LA/ HA
Minor vulnerability is accessable via CP and mirage

Strife also has multiple advantages over FP:
- Great HoT
- gives you ulti on cast every 4 seconds ---> more frequent bursts
- makes setting up your bar easier as you get the 8% magicka passive
- more healing via passives


Strife will still be the bread and butter spammable for magnbs in PvP.

New Psijic spammable is actually better. A stronger HoT which doesn't come from damage done (that stuff doesn't do well in Cyro cuz battle spirit) would be better like refreshing path. Something many magblades in PvP have unlocked even if they don't currently use it

Strife HoT is the strongest magblades have access too, certainly not path lol.

Not when your enemy is blocking or isn't taking much damage. There are other sources of healing which can be better or substitute the healing from strife

BohnT

NyassaV wrote: »

show previous quotes

Subversus wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

Strife is dead. They killed it.

Use force pulse, more damage and stronger passives (destruction staff). Really nice build variety btw.

Not in pvp, magblades will hardly feel the difference in pvp. I didn’t even alter my build on the pts to suit the changes, and I run a build that sustains the bare minimum.

i'm not using it in PvP either. Crushing shocking is better. been using it since i heard about the cost increase.Crushing shock has more damage, the range interrupt is nice and it's smoother plus it's not reflect able. this change did great harm to my builds that implemented strife my more brawler type magblade builds, but even on them it's better to just get a new heal source and drop Swallow Soul for CS.

But that's fine. lets have no variety in Builds it's all good.

Strife is still superior.
All advantages of force pulse die in the process:
Unreflectable won't help you kill that DK spamming wings and if he really dies to FP spam he is surely too bad to keep wings up all the time or be a threat at all.
The extra damage is neglectable and in practise FP hits less often with it's full damage because you're chance is only: critchance^3 which is lower for critchance <100%.
And in PvP you want as much burst as you can get there is no time to wait for that triple crit.
The resource gain via destruction expert is so marginal that you can completely ignore it.
With the new interrupt mechanics a ranged interrupt is just the same as a skill without the interrupt. There are two conditions in pvp stunned or CC immune you can't interrupt in either of these.
Status effects:
you have minor maim on your enemy with magnb all the time
Burning is applied with fire glyph or LA/ HA
Minor vulnerability is accessable via CP and mirage

Strife also has multiple advantages over FP:
- Great HoT
- gives you ulti on cast every 4 seconds ---> more frequent bursts
- makes setting up your bar easier as you get the 8% magicka passive
- more healing via passives


Strife will still be the bread and butter spammable for magnbs in PvP.

New Psijic spammable is actually better. A stronger HoT which doesn't come from damage done (that stuff doesn't do well in Cyro cuz battle spirit) would be better like refreshing path. Something many magblades in PvP have unlocked even if they don't currently use it

Strife HoT is the strongest magblades have access too, certainly not path lol.

Not when your enemy is blocking or isn't taking much damage. There are other sources of healing which can be better or substitute the healing from strife

Yeah because using an equal or even inferior spammable along with wasting bar slots to substitute the current spammable is a good idea...

The only place were strife will be replaced in the new patch is in PvE with imbue and that would have happend even without cost reduction

Subversus

Change Strife

NyassaV wrote: »

show previous quotes

Subversus wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

Strife is dead. They killed it.

Use force pulse, more damage and stronger passives (destruction staff). Really nice build variety btw.

Not in pvp, magblades will hardly feel the difference in pvp. I didn’t even alter my build on the pts to suit the changes, and I run a build that sustains the bare minimum.

i'm not using it in PvP either. Crushing shocking is better. been using it since i heard about the cost increase.Crushing shock has more damage, the range interrupt is nice and it's smoother plus it's not reflect able. this change did great harm to my builds that implemented strife my more brawler type magblade builds, but even on them it's better to just get a new heal source and drop Swallow Soul for CS.

But that's fine. lets have no variety in Builds it's all good.

Strife is still superior.
All advantages of force pulse die in the process:
Unreflectable won't help you kill that DK spamming wings and if he really dies to FP spam he is surely too bad to keep wings up all the time or be a threat at all.
The extra damage is neglectable and in practise FP hits less often with it's full damage because you're chance is only: critchance^3 which is lower for critchance <100%.
And in PvP you want as much burst as you can get there is no time to wait for that triple crit.
The resource gain via destruction expert is so marginal that you can completely ignore it.
With the new interrupt mechanics a ranged interrupt is just the same as a skill without the interrupt. There are two conditions in pvp stunned or CC immune you can't interrupt in either of these.
Status effects:
you have minor maim on your enemy with magnb all the time
Burning is applied with fire glyph or LA/ HA
Minor vulnerability is accessable via CP and mirage

Strife also has multiple advantages over FP:
- Great HoT
- gives you ulti on cast every 4 seconds ---> more frequent bursts
- makes setting up your bar easier as you get the 8% magicka passive
- more healing via passives


Strife will still be the bread and butter spammable for magnbs in PvP.

New Psijic spammable is actually better. A stronger HoT which doesn't come from damage done (that stuff doesn't do well in Cyro cuz battle spirit) would be better like refreshing path. Something many magblades in PvP have unlocked even if they don't currently use it

Strife HoT is the strongest magblades have access too, certainly not path lol.

Not when your enemy is blocking or isn't taking much damage. There are other sources of healing which can be better or substitute the healing from strife

It’s so obvious that you are new to the class I can’t even.

When the enemy is blocking, you start kiting. You make up for the lack of healing by using the amazing (!!!) ability to kite on a magblade. A permablocking target is a dead target against a magblade, period.

How can you even bring permablock in the argument against magblades lmfao, out of all classes magblades are arguably the strongest to deal with permablock, if you know what you’re doing. A permablocker is slow. You aren’t.

Just lol. Please stop. If you need people to teach you how to play don’t make threads asking for buffs, make threads asking for help.

Inb4 you also bring wings into this

Rianai

Well, it doesn't need to be a perma blocking target. You just need to get it blocked at the wrong moment (when you want to use different skills instead of spamming strife nonstop), because it will override the healing from previous hits. It is a great heal in PvE, but quite situational in PvP. Rapid Regen tends to heal for more (and is way more reliable), even path can offer better healing, if you don't have to move a lot.

ak_pvp

Subversus wrote: »

show previous quotes

NyassaV wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

Strife is dead. They killed it.

Use force pulse, more damage and stronger passives (destruction staff). Really nice build variety btw.

Not in pvp, magblades will hardly feel the difference in pvp. I didn’t even alter my build on the pts to suit the changes, and I run a build that sustains the bare minimum.

i'm not using it in PvP either. Crushing shocking is better. been using it since i heard about the cost increase.Crushing shock has more damage, the range interrupt is nice and it's smoother plus it's not reflect able. this change did great harm to my builds that implemented strife my more brawler type magblade builds, but even on them it's better to just get a new heal source and drop Swallow Soul for CS.

But that's fine. lets have no variety in Builds it's all good.

Strife is still superior.
All advantages of force pulse die in the process:
Unreflectable won't help you kill that DK spamming wings and if he really dies to FP spam he is surely too bad to keep wings up all the time or be a threat at all.
The extra damage is neglectable and in practise FP hits less often with it's full damage because you're chance is only: critchance^3 which is lower for critchance <100%.
And in PvP you want as much burst as you can get there is no time to wait for that triple crit.
The resource gain via destruction expert is so marginal that you can completely ignore it.
With the new interrupt mechanics a ranged interrupt is just the same as a skill without the interrupt. There are two conditions in pvp stunned or CC immune you can't interrupt in either of these.
Status effects:
you have minor maim on your enemy with magnb all the time
Burning is applied with fire glyph or LA/ HA
Minor vulnerability is accessable via CP and mirage

Strife also has multiple advantages over FP:
- Great HoT
- gives you ulti on cast every 4 seconds ---> more frequent bursts
- makes setting up your bar easier as you get the 8% magicka passive
- more healing via passives


Strife will still be the bread and butter spammable for magnbs in PvP.

New Psijic spammable is actually better. A stronger HoT which doesn't come from damage done (that stuff doesn't do well in Cyro cuz battle spirit) would be better like refreshing path. Something many magblades in PvP have unlocked even if they don't currently use it

Strife HoT is the strongest magblades have access too, certainly not path lol.

Not when your enemy is blocking or isn't taking much damage. There are other sources of healing which can be better or substitute the healing from strife

It’s so obvious that you are new to the class I can’t even.

Inb4 you also bring wings into this

I hope he/she does. I would love to have a nostalgic cry rant for it.

NyassaV

Change Strife

ak_pvp wrote: »

show previous quotes

Subversus wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

Strife is dead. They killed it.

Use force pulse, more damage and stronger passives (destruction staff). Really nice build variety btw.

Not in pvp, magblades will hardly feel the difference in pvp. I didn’t even alter my build on the pts to suit the changes, and I run a build that sustains the bare minimum.

i'm not using it in PvP either. Crushing shocking is better. been using it since i heard about the cost increase.Crushing shock has more damage, the range interrupt is nice and it's smoother plus it's not reflect able. this change did great harm to my builds that implemented strife my more brawler type magblade builds, but even on them it's better to just get a new heal source and drop Swallow Soul for CS.

But that's fine. lets have no variety in Builds it's all good.

Strife is still superior.
All advantages of force pulse die in the process:
Unreflectable won't help you kill that DK spamming wings and if he really dies to FP spam he is surely too bad to keep wings up all the time or be a threat at all.
The extra damage is neglectable and in practise FP hits less often with it's full damage because you're chance is only: critchance^3 which is lower for critchance <100%.
And in PvP you want as much burst as you can get there is no time to wait for that triple crit.
The resource gain via destruction expert is so marginal that you can completely ignore it.
With the new interrupt mechanics a ranged interrupt is just the same as a skill without the interrupt. There are two conditions in pvp stunned or CC immune you can't interrupt in either of these.
Status effects:
you have minor maim on your enemy with magnb all the time
Burning is applied with fire glyph or LA/ HA
Minor vulnerability is accessable via CP and mirage

Strife also has multiple advantages over FP:
- Great HoT
- gives you ulti on cast every 4 seconds ---> more frequent bursts
- makes setting up your bar easier as you get the 8% magicka passive
- more healing via passives


Strife will still be the bread and butter spammable for magnbs in PvP.

New Psijic spammable is actually better. A stronger HoT which doesn't come from damage done (that stuff doesn't do well in Cyro cuz battle spirit) would be better like refreshing path. Something many magblades in PvP have unlocked even if they don't currently use it

Strife HoT is the strongest magblades have access too, certainly not path lol.

Not when your enemy is blocking or isn't taking much damage. There are other sources of healing which can be better or substitute the healing from strife

It’s so obvious that you are new to the class I can’t even.

Inb4 you also bring wings into this

I hope he/she does. I would love to have a nostalgic cry rant for it.

tempting but you can get around wings so I won't