Is 30K dps enough for endgame trial raids?

essi2

Yes

Individual DPS only matters if everyone is doing low DPS, also you'll probably do more DPS in a Trial group then you do Solo anyways.



NB! The real poll answer is Depends, I just picked Yes because I'm tired and starting to become belligerent about the whole DPS conversation.

Runefang

Yes

essi2 wrote: »

Individual DPS only matters if everyone is doing low DPS, also you'll probably do more DPS in a Trial group then you do Solo anyways.



NB! The real poll answer is Depends, I just picked Yes because I'm tired and starting to become belligerent about the whole DPS conversation.

So low DPS is fine if somebody is carrying you?

supaskrub

Yes

Anyone recall what the highest single target parse was in the worlds first vMOL clear? (you will find that answer somewhere on the very forums), find out that number and take of a conservative 15% (raid buffs, which would have been considerably higher than 15% I guess)... Remember this was when dps was nowhere near as high as it is now.. Then you will have your answer.

People are infatuated about "mega" dps and forget that dps was not always as high as it is now, sure times have changed since that first worlds clear and we have ridiculous things like 91m health on a boss which has to be burned down by high dps due to mechanics.. but even that trial (vAS) can be completed by 25k-30k players providing you don't go hardmode or +1..

Nifty2g

Yes

Yes you can end game raid with 30k
Dps requirements are for those in a group who push buffs and debuffs to make their high dps possible.

Different scenarios

Dapper Dinosaur

Yes

DoctorESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

If you don’t cheese a NB 45k the only people left running won’t even look at you.

But 20k+ is good enough.

This one regrets to inform you that 20k is not good enough for VAA HM, VHRC HM, VMOL, VHOF, VAS+1, and VAS+2.

Not everyone is as toxic as you.

A couple people running self buffed 20k+ can easily be brought along, as long as they can learn to not die to the mechanics!

Well, if we're talking about carrying someone, then 0 dps is also good enough. 30k is okay, but 20k is not, unless you want to be carried.

If I were to bring my 20k DPS along in a vet trial, I would not only be warning my group ahead of time, but I would also be making it my job to handle as much of the rezzing as I can so the stronger DPS don't have to stop. Being 35k+ dps is not the only way to dps.

Mureel

It's a trap! xD

Mureel

mt

Mureel

supaskrub wrote: »

Anyone recall what the highest single target parse was in the worlds first vMOL clear? (you will find that answer somewhere on the very forums), find out that number and take of a conservative 15% (raid buffs, which would have been considerably higher than 15% I guess)... Remember this was when dps was nowhere near as high as it is now.. Then you will have your answer.

People are infatuated about "mega" dps and forget that dps was not always as high as it is now, sure times have changed since that first worlds clear and we have ridiculous things like 91m health on a boss which has to be burned down by high dps due to mechanics.. but even that trial (vAS) can be completed by 25k-30k players providing you don't go hardmode or +1..

I was just going to say same - thanks for saving me the trouble!

GiuEliN0

Depends

Really depends from the context,
The legacy trials vSOHM, vAA, vHRC Yes.
the others, nope.

Alcast

Yes

Player 1: 25k dps, does not die
Player 2: 35k dps, keeps dieing at least once or twice every run

What player would you take?

Zer0oo

Yes

Yes 30k is enough for vet trials. The real question is can you also achieve similar numbers in a real trial situation? Do you die to mechanics? Do you kill other players due to ignoring mechanics? Can you dps while doing mechanics?...

30k dps is on the lower end of the dps spectrum. I would not advised to go in a group with all dds that have only ~30k since it will make the trial longer and a lot harder.

DoctorESO

Yes

.

DoctorESO

Yes

.

bloodthirstyvampire

Well I refuse to play anything but stamblade try 30k with that

DoctorESO

Yes

.

klowdy1

How about 22k with less than 50% boss uptime because boss is tanking in fire, and heals can't keep up, so you're also sustaining yourself?

DoctorESO wrote: »

Nighn_9 wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

If you don’t cheese a NB 45k the only people left running won’t even look at you.

But 20k+ is good enough.

This one regrets to inform you that 20k is not good enough for VAA HM, VHRC HM, VMOL, VHOF, VAS+1, and VAS+2.

There are normal versions of every trial and 20k dps is enough for those. Goodluck new raiders! (get the hint?)

I wouldn't call normal trials "endgame trial raids," which is what the OP is asking about.

Normal trials are endgame, they just aren't the most difficult endgame. It's called progression, and most people don't start at the hardest part of the game. He didn't say vet trials.

bloodthirstyvampire

DoctorESO wrote: »

bloodthirstyvampire wrote: »

Well I refuse to play anything but stamblade try 30k with that

30k is low for a stamblade, hmm?

Still don't have an accurate reading on my dps

My gear is
1 veli 1 kena 5 vo 5 tfs all gold divines, daggers, bow sharpend, tho i'll transmute 1 dagger to nirnhoned, a weapon damage and poison enchantment on daggers, stam enchantments on armour,
With jewelry robust, 1 reduce feat cost, 1 increase stam recovery.

I use the lover mundus, cam throne drink buff,weapon damage pots with poison on bow

sudaki_eso

Yes

DoctorESO wrote: »

bloodthirstyvampire wrote: »

Well I refuse to play anything but stamblade try 30k with that

30k is low for a stamblade, hmm?

In my raid progress guild 30k solo for a stamblade is the minimum to run vet trials with us. Depending on your class its between 27-32k solo that is required to join the progress teams. We dont mind if you have lower dps but you probably wont make it in the progress teams.

Talek

Depends

Like i said for many new players in training trials, you may do 20k dps or you may do 30k dps but if you are dead you are doing 0 dps, the most important is to learn mechanics and not die. Your group might do ~20-25k dps average and finish vet trial if everyone know what to do. Especially Craglorn trials, 20k is more than enough, for the new ones probably 25k+.

Tinus_92

Yes

Princess_Ciri wrote: »

if it was a casual group just seeking to clear vet trials then yes

but for serious scores in end game raiding, 30k dps is super low. So no.

Anhedonie wrote: »

Not if you want to run vMoL.

FakeFox wrote: »

You can for sure beat some trials with it, but it's not gonna get you far.

When vmol came out 30k was something only top-level players could get. Vmol hasn't become more difficult since its release, and the dps-increases made the trial more accessible to other players as well.

30k is still more as viable to complete the trial with, as long mechanics are being done right and you aren't aiming at the highest scores. My old guilds' vhof runs also didn't had +30k dps at the time due to mechanics, so even there 30k, if you can do it, is more then enough. 30K also will be more then enough to clear craglorn HMs with, as long people understand the mechanics and work as a team properly, which is much more important as the raw numbers. 30k consistently also is enough to skip the vmol (non-HM) lunar cycle.

Craglorn non hm's, 20k is enough when following mechanics. For normals I would go as far that +10k is even fine, as there are usually enough players around who perform a lot more dps anyways.

commdt

Depends

KingYogi415 wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

If you don’t cheese a NB 45k the only people left running won’t even look at you.

But 20k+ is good enough.

This one regrets to inform you that 20k is not good enough for VAA HM, VHRC HM, VMOL, VHOF, VAS+1, and VAS+2.

Not everyone is as toxic as you.

A couple people running self buffed 20k+ can easily be brought along, as long as they can learn to not die to the mechanics!

Yes a couple of 40+ can carry some 20k trash bag through all the content except maybe vMOL HM. but this doesnt mean that 20k is enough

me_ming

has eso really become this linear? have 30k dps and you're good. kinda sad. but then again, that's why I really don't pay much attention on this game already.

Bryong9ub17_ESO

Anything over 20k is fine in my opinion. As a dps you should be ok with all game content.

Asardes

Yes

Although 30K on dummy is meaningless unless you have learned the trial mechanics well enough to manage that on actual bosses and not die to them. Training rotation on dummy is like learning to drive, when you hit the pedals, the gear changers and turn the wheel without thinking about it, when meeting challenges on the road.

I played with a vAA PuG yesterday and group DPS was about ~200K, with me pulling ~30K on my magicka Sorcerer with simple rotation and self-buffs (Power Surge) since I don't waste expensive spell power potions for farm runs. But that wasn't the biggest problem. People were all over the place in most boss fights, and at the last boss I had to run around and pop all the mines since nobody else was doing it. Knowledge of mechanics is more important that pulling very high DPS, but if you don't even pull 25K you should stay away from veteran trials since a 1h20m vAA runs is not fun by any standards.

SaintSubwayy

Depends

It depends on the vTrial and the rest of the group. But the simple answer would be no, since you have to bring your best DPS, and not rely on others to carry you throuh the Trial.

For the Craglorn Trials its fine to have 30k DPS. For the other Trials 30k is to Low IMO.

vMoL the twinbosses will overwhelm you if the DPS isnt high enough, Rakkhat will do more than 1 circle thus adding the beamingphase is a big Problem for Low DPS groups.

in vHoF you need the DPS aswell, or you can play all the Mechanics with prob a high casualty rate, thus making it harder than it needs to be.

vAS (no HM) DPS doesnt really matter, however in vAS+1 or vAS HM, DPS is very important, else the Minibosses will enrage and wipe the Group.

MrCray78

No

@Alcast Personally I prefer survival to the dps as long as the difference is not too big.If the person hits the 15k dps and does not die it's like even pretty annoying because yes she does not die but by her lack of some mechanical OS damage can occur.
On the other hand, a person who hits at 80k dps but who dies all the time serves even less than the other.
I think it takes a balance between the two a player who hits pretty well (50k) and who never dies.

Aebaradath

Yes

Yes, it's enough. If your DPS is 30k solo, it will be higher with the group buffs anyways. Besides, those super vocal players that demand you use specific sets and pull 40k+ DPS solo (because otherwise you're useless and a detriment to the group! /s) are a minority that grows smaller each day.

If you know the mechanics, can pull your weight around and don't die you're infinitely more valuable than some glass cannon über 100k DPS that dies to a mudcrab falling on him.

Asardes

Yes

Alcast wrote: »

Player 1: 25k dps, does not die
Player 2: 35k dps, keeps dieing at least once or twice every run

What player would you take?

Totally agree with this. For example me, progressing vMoL with my guild - I just recently completed my 3rd run as melee DD. Some players are more experienced, know the fight perfectly, block, move disengage exactly when they need to, and manage to pull 45K+ in that fight. I'm simply content of pulling 35K, but not dying, not being blown back by the wings flap, not bombing the group with the blue balls, not dying to meteors, and resurrecting people who do die to those mechanics - which they do a lot since it's learning run - instead of wiping to lack of DPS since people stay dead.

MLGProPlayer

Yes

me_ming wrote: »

has eso really become this linear? have 30k dps and you're good. kinda sad. but then again, that's why I really don't pay much attention on this game already.

It's always been like that. Every MMO is like that.

If you want more dynamic gameplay, play DLC dungeons. They have a lot more going on than just "stack and burn" since it's only 4 players.

Asardes

Yes

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

me_ming wrote: »

has eso really become this linear? have 30k dps and you're good. kinda sad. but then again, that's why I really don't pay much attention on this game already.

It's always been like that. Every MMO is like that.

If you want more dynamic gameplay, play DLC dungeons. They have a lot more going on than just "stack and burn" since it's only 4 players.

Some of those are harder than Craglorn trials. I still haven't managed to complete vBF HM on my tank w/o healer assistance, though I'm working on a solution for that