Raising people in dungeons.

firedrgn

Some people get overwhelmed with just basic stuff.
Also most assume someome else will do it.

Really the group needs to communicate . I think dps should rez. But i have had dk tank rez the whole group like nothing phased him her.

So just good comunicatiin is impotant. You can really get a idea when you say hi and no one responds thats its gping to be fun.

Runefang

Minyassa wrote: »

I honestly did not know that DPS are expected to rez, because I've seen tanks being the ones to do it, and the few times I tried it, it was an open invitation for the boss to stomp me into paste while doing it. But if that's what's most efficient I'll just have to learn how to survive it. I'm soooooooooooo squishy.

It should only be the DPS when doing hard content. If the tank is able to drop block for a few seconds and rez, they should. Nobody is going to miss anything they were going to do in those few seconds (except if they needed to taunt of course!).

For the really hard dungeons and most trials dropping block simply isn't an option so it falls to DPS.

Healers can rez, but again in hard content they need to be healing full time. On easy content they ought to be half DPSers anyway.

jaws343

xbobx wrote: »

heaven13 wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

There are many times where mechanics of a fight prevent you from getting a res off as a DPS without dying or being interrupted. Or the healing may not be great and stopping to res will result in death.

But, those instances aside, I do not res someone who keeps dying if the group can handle the fight without them. If you need to be res'd more than twice in a non-hardmode fight, you are helping the group more by being dead.

As a DPS who can self sustain and self heal, I'd rather burn down the last of a boss than risk wiping while trying to res the DPS who cannot seem to stay alive or the healer who dies every time the boss looks their way.

LOL. Went into vWGT the other day. BOTH dps had less than 15.5k health. As healer, using food, I had more than either of them. Our tank tried to keep rezzing everyone but their low health was killing them faster than anything I could do to keep them alive. That was a bad day.

isnt the websites part of the problem? I always see the guides say all in stamina and then put stamina on all your equipment. Seems to me you would want 3-4 gear to have health to get you to 18-20k hp. i find i dont have much problems with stamina regen so would losing 3k stamina change your damage that much?

I think 16-17K health is fine for a DPS, if, and only if, you are experienced. Healers should definitely have around 20K. My trials healer is sitting at 32K mag and 20K health. Because I cannot heal if I am dead.

Reverb

As a healer I will always run to rez, unless it's a fight (or group) that requires continuous healing. With the passives, I will rez faster than anyone else, and would rather the remaining DPS keep focused on finishing the fight.

As a tank, I only rez if I am in position. If the fallen party member is far away, I'm not going to drag the boss out of ground dots to rez someone.

As a dps I always res unless the healer or tank gets there first.

Exceptions: if a person dies over and over and over, it's usually better to stop wasting time rezzing them, and just finish the fight as a 3-man.

It's also common that the dead is in a bad spot, or somewhere that can't be found, or the rez prompt doesn't appear. This should be communicated when that's the reason for not rezzing.

zaria

Runefang wrote: »

Generally tanks should rez. They can just taunt the boss and then have plenty of time to get it done, just wait for the right window.

If tanks can't afford to drop block or they're tanking multiple bosses then dps should rez.

Healers rez only in easy content when their role isn't needed at all.

In a pug I only rez when my dps contribution is less than 70% of the group total.

Problem is that tank faces the boss heavy attacks and interrupts.
If damage is light healer rez, if healer has to work hard DD rez, if you are DD and healer don't rez its either because he has to heal all the time or can not find the body, if you see it rez, finding it might be an issue especially if he was turned to ash.
I have an addon who help finding dead bodies.

xbobx

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

xbobx wrote: »

Lets try it once in a while.

I can't number how many times i have been in a dungeon where someone dies during a boss fight due to some circumstance and people just leave them there only for more to be eventually picked off till a full wipe all because one person couldnt bother to pull away and raise even though the only boss and no adds is focused on the tank or someone kiting.

I usually end up being the person kiting hoping to hell that either the tank gets hate back so i can raise the person or the other DD can go do it, but it rarely happens.

There are a lot of times where they are marked on the ground where they died so people can't find them. Other times too if they die in just the right spot you can't res them. Don't just assume people aren't doing it for the sake of not doing it. Also sometimes the mechanics make it so you can't. If

not assuming it when they run right over your dead body and continue to attack the target or are standing within feet of you. I understand when people cant raise you and I certainly can understand when they can and don't bother.

Glurin

I usually try to rez people if I can reach them and do so without taking too much damage or being interrupted. It helps being a little tanky for a DPS since I can take a little more punishment during the rez.

The exception is if I've already rezed you two or three times in the same fight. You're spending more time dead than alive at that point so I'm not gonna waste even more time and soul gems bringing you back to life. Fortunately, those cases are few and far between.

Porter_H

As a tank, I'm getting better at rezzing in Vet dungeons. A lot of times you have to time it just right even between heavy attacks (especially in HM). Had a low dps group that kept getting one shot by mechanics on the last boss in HM Banished Cells (standing in fire or the cast) yesterday .... yes, it happens. If I rez one of the 3 people and try to rez someone else, the first person I rez should try to rez the 4th also.

Ideally, dps or healer would rez if it's not a melee dps that has died next to the tank. If the tank has to move far then the boss has to be repositioned and any AoEs (damage or heals) is now missing!

VaranisArano

The only death that gets immediate attention from everyone is when the tank dies. The tank dies, the boss goes hog wild, and everyone knows they need a rez.

The next quickest response is when the healer dies and that's when the tank hunkers down until the DPS realize they don't have heals and rush to get the healer up.

If a DPS goes down, the healer and the tank focus on doing their jobs while somebody nearby grabs the dead DPS. In terms of "this death massively screws up our battle plan," a dead DPS needs the least priority compared to a dead healer or tank.

Caveat: there are some players that you know from experience with the other fights in the dungeon that you might as well leave them dead. Its not very nice, but sometimes that's the honest truth. I once had a group in COH II on the second to last boss where I had two DPS who refused to listen to the mechanic about rolling away from each other. So I (the tank) rezzed the healer who had better DPS than the two of them put together and we killed the boss.

LeagueTroll

How about git gud and die less?

Diminish

I primarily play as a DD and I've went through HUNDREDS of soul gems PUGing vet DLC dungeons for motifs this past 1 - 2 weeks (not due to my own accord). It gets to the point where during a boss fight if the same person continues to die, I am not wasting my time reviving them. If DDs are expected to be the one reviving (and they are), then perhaps it should become general practice for the tank and healer to provide a handful of gems at the start of the dungeon to each DD in the group.

idk

Everyone in the forms are strong experienced players that perform perfectly.

Seriously, while I do rez I have been in groups that chose not to rez someone . One time we picked up a CP160 healer for vet HM pledges. I recall she died early on the last boss in ICP and we left her alone and finished the fight. We really did not need a healer but it was an off time so we just grabbed a 4th via GF.

No arguing, but there are times I would leave someone, just not often.

Maryal

Sometimes people die when the battery in their battery-operated mouse unexpectedly dies mid-battle ....

Jarryzzt

One perspective to add here is that of visibility. Which can vary widely from machine to machine and from UI/control setup to UI/control setup.

For example, I personally find it very difficult to see player bodies on the ground in certain dungeons even if there is no fight/murder/mayhem going on. Brown outfits blending into equally brown floor with control prompts popping up only if I am directly looking at the body at close range. There is literally nothing sillier than someone screaming for a rez and my first response being - where? [Fortuitously, I play DPS exclusively - in this MMO - and so this usually isn't a huge deal.]

My point is that I cannot be the only one facing issues such as these. And, unfortunately, these impose some limitations on what can be done in-game irrespective of what one thinks should be done.

---

Closer to the topic at hand - in principle, rezzing should be done. In practice, every fight is a little different. For example, if the boss is almost dead, just burning him down and rezzing afterwards may be a better strategy than stopping, rezzing and moving on.

PUGs being PUGs, of course - dog eat dog (ha!) and all that - all sorts of nonsense might happen.

VaranisArano

Maryal wrote: »

Sometimes people die when the battery in their battery-operated mouse unexpectedly dies mid-battle ....

I feel like there's a story here...

ArchMikem

Funny I find a thread like this.

I tried doing Vet Cradle the other day and I (one of the DDs) was just completely ignored. Wasn't just me though we almost wiped but the Tank pulled through and managed to Res the Healer, who then went on a Healing spree while the Tank went to Res the other DD. But after the other DD got up, I was utterly ignored. They even walked over my body a few times. When they went down again and finally wiped I just said "nice" and left the group.

Glurin

VaranisArano wrote: »

Maryal wrote: »

Sometimes people die when the battery in their battery-operated mouse unexpectedly dies mid-battle ....

I feel like there's a story here...

Probably, but you know what happens (or should happen) when you die because the battery in your mouse died? You get a new battery, rez and keep fighting. Maybe let everyone else know your battery died if you feel the need.

You don't accept the rez and try to finish the dungeon with a dead battery.

Glurin

ArchMikem wrote: »

Funny I find a thread like this.

I tried doing Vet Cradle the other day and I (one of the DDs) was just completely ignored. Wasn't just me though we almost wiped but the Tank pulled through and managed to Res the Healer, who then went on a Healing spree while the Tank went to Res the other DD. But after the other DD got up, I was utterly ignored. They even walked over my body a few times. When they went down again and finally wiped I just said "nice" and left the group.

To be fair, there are times I simply can't rez someone. Not for lack of trying, mind you. And not because I'm being attacked either. Sometimes I simply can't find the body. Bit of a pain when that happens because then I have to either stop what I'm doing and act like I'm looking for a contact lens in the middle of the boss fight, or abandon them until I somehow trip over the corpse while avoiding boss attacks.

Also there's been a couple of times where there was some kind of bug and whenever I looked at someone all I got was "being resurrected" even though it was clear that wasn't the case, so I couldn't do anything for them.

FrancisCrawford

Jemcrystal wrote: »

Please state why we raise people from the dead instead of raising up our own selves.

Because the game designers made the choice that in a boss fight you can't rez on your own.

PureEnvelope35

'You raised me up so I can can die to bosses'

mocap

Thats why we all love PUG's ) Random experience, good or bad, doesn't matter. It's always different, makes this game less monotonous and scripted, more unpredictable. Especially if you hate PvP...

blacksghost

Don’t try to resurrect me if it means you are going to die in the attempt.

For me not being able to see the dead body is the main issue.

If one team member is dead and another is resurrecting them keep the aggro distracted.

Team efforts win dungeons

Magdalina

I will res a few times(assuming a pug. Obviously I will res friends, but friends will also normally do me a favor of not dying every 5 seconds) then if person's contribution is less than what I'm losing by wasting time ressing them and they keep dying, screw that.

Also, a very, very, VERY important thing - ressing is NOT the job of any one set role, at least in dungeons it's definitely not. Whoever can res, resses. The perfect scenario is actually a support role ressing so we lose less dps but given pugs do not equal perfect scenario, normally it's expected of the dps to res since they can do it safely-ish(assuming tank has agro and healer is healing). However, if dps have agro or mechanics to follow, no, the healer isn't allowed to just stand there watching me kite the boss for full three minutes just because "healers don't res". If there's a dps race going on and I as a dps know that stopping doing damage will mean a failure, then you should try to res even if you're the tank.

Of course it's highly situational, no one's expecting the tank to try to res in the middle of a heavy attack or healer drop healing a damage intense phase for that, but pretending "only dps/healer res" while there's a clear opportunity for you to res and save the day is just silly.

Ratzkifal

That was actually my idea for a Necromancer support skill line ultimate. Unfortunately it's going to be pretty hard to balance between pve and pvp here, especially if multiple Necromancers could chain their skills. So even as an ultimate it would be kind of broken .. or useless.

Azurya

Aisle9 wrote: »

xbobx wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Seeing as I pug in 4 man's, when someone dies I'm like, "how?"

excuse my ignorance, but what does pug mean.

Dead people, basically

MADE MY DAY!!!!!

Eyesinthedrk

Sometimes I’m just too focused on what I’m doing. Say something and I’ll get the res.

As someone said earlier if you keep dying then I may choose to see how far I can get without you. Especially if it’s in a damage heavy execute phase like falkreath, mazz or dsa.

randomkeyhits

I've often found in pug runs that the only indication that a res is needed is because of the empty health bar.

silence.

Its almost as if they are embarrassed they died and just want to move on quickly.

If I can see where they are then yep, definitely revive but if its the other damager then I'l not going to waste time searching for them.

Chaos2088

I normally play dps, and as soon as someone is down I try and get to them asap to rez....It is the job of the dps to do this...

I do find that if I die at all....sometimes not always, but the general pug dungeons, the other dd is not paying attention at all...and many times even run past/over me...and ends up either being the tank or healer to rez...

Just need to get it out there more that DD's need to rez....if you don't have soul gems....why que! -grumble noise-

MajesticHaruki

I only res if the fight is hard and deaths can occur randomly based on bad luck. Otherwise I just burn the boss to finish the fight. There are many dungeons and occasions where rezzing has actually better chances of being the reason of wipe. Now in cases that some players ignore the group's messages to eat food cause of 11k health or stand still in red circles and don't move at all, it's a waste of time. Helping newbies learn the game is a duty for me like others taught me but if you ignore repeatedly my warnings and tips I won't bother.

Prof_Bawbag

Sometimes it isn't always obvious where the person has fallen. I hate the ash piles because on console you just have to be placed just so for the rez icon to appear. However, there have been times where I've struggled to find a fallen player as they've been somewhere completely random. I can see they're dead, but where i simply can't see at times.