Alliance switching to boost AP and take Emp - discuss!

Ch4mpTW

Do you mind taking a look into all these matters which are ruining PvP in this game? The emperor system is a joke, and the amount of cross-alliance dealings is at an all-time high. You have people selling/trading emperorship (literally), and guilds essentially deciding on who wins which campaigns. @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_MattFiror

Vermintide

VaranisArano wrote: »

Vermintide wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

There's not really anything you can do about the scroll-runners, though.

Sure there is- Make the lock account wide.

If you read what I posted, not all wacky hijinks that happen with scrolls happen because someone is actually trolling in favor of the other faction.

Making a lock account wide would deter all but the most dedicated spies, sure. Trolls still happen. So do incompetent scroll runners.

My point wasn't that an faction lock wouldn't help. My point was that a faction lock isn't going to solve all the problems with scroll runners.

Oh, I misunderstood you- But of course, there is no solution on this earth to fix incompetent players, that's something we just have to deal with I was specifically talking about the faction hoppers who are blatantly abusing the ability to their guild/alliance's advantage.

Beardimus wrote: »

Vermintide wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

There's not really anything you can do about the scroll-runners, though.

Sure there is- Make the lock account wide.

Now that's going too far even for me!! Certainly wouldn't advocate that .

I wouldn't say so. You could still allow a switch once per campaign, or allow different factions per campaign, in order to facilitate people grouping with friends and so on. It would just prevent exploits.

As a wise woman once said- Nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

Aisle9

Vermintide wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Vermintide wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

There's not really anything you can do about the scroll-runners, though.

Sure there is- Make the lock account wide.

If you read what I posted, not all wacky hijinks that happen with scrolls happen because someone is actually trolling in favor of the other faction.

Making a lock account wide would deter all but the most dedicated spies, sure. Trolls still happen. So do incompetent scroll runners.

My point wasn't that an faction lock wouldn't help. My point was that a faction lock isn't going to solve all the problems with scroll runners.

Oh, I misunderstood you- But of course, there is no solution on this earth to fix incompetent players, that's something we just have to deal with I was specifically talking about the faction hoppers who are blatantly abusing the ability to their guild/alliance's advantage.

Beardimus wrote: »

Vermintide wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

There's not really anything you can do about the scroll-runners, though.

Sure there is- Make the lock account wide.

Now that's going too far even for me!! Certainly wouldn't advocate that .

I wouldn't say so. You could still allow a switch once per campaign, or allow different factions per campaign, in order to facilitate people grouping with friends and so on. It would just prevent exploits.

As a wise woman once said- Nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

So exploiters and non exploiters would take the shaft in the same way, the only people unaffected would be who plays only 1 character anyways.

GGWP

FloppyTouch

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Do you mind taking a look into all these matters which are ruining PvP in this game? The emperor system is a joke, and the amount of cross-alliance dealings is at an all-time high. You have people selling/trading emperorship (literally), and guilds essentially deciding on who wins which campaigns. @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_MattFiror

This is so frustrating for me as a true blue dealing with the crap guilds do to get emp or win a campaign...

But at the same time this is war and in war you have underhand tactics and spying. Money wins war so paying off the “enemy” is all fair and more realistic.

Ch4mpTW

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Do you mind taking a look into all these matters which are ruining PvP in this game? The emperor system is a joke, and the amount of cross-alliance dealings is at an all-time high. You have people selling/trading emperorship (literally), and guilds essentially deciding on who wins which campaigns. @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_MattFiror

This is so frustrating for me as a true blue dealing with the crap guilds do to get emp or win a campaign...

But at the same time this is war and in war you have underhand tactics and spying. Money wins war so paying off the “enemy” is all fair and more realistic.

@FloppyTouch On PS4-NA you DC pretty much control any and everything Cyrodiil-related. Both Shor and Vivec. It’s to the point that people won’t even aim for capturing the last keep, if that’s all that’s needed for their alliance to have emperorship (I’ve seen this dozens of times as an AD). Why? Because supposedly none of the “higher-ups” gave “permission” to do so. This happens regularly in Vivec, and will often result in supposedly getting: Cussed out, disrespected, harassed, insulted, and threatened by entire guilds. Both through zone chat and inbox messages.

Absolutely disgusting, isn’t it? That’s the current state of Cyrodiil on PS4-NA. In both Vivec and Shor. You’re either an extremely popular person who’s “allowed” to do certain things, or you are in guilds with some of these people to enable certain things. Otherwise? Get a bad reputation, and get treated horribly by the “elites” and “popular” players. It’s all types of screwed up.

Matter of a fact, dig this. Not too long ago, when DC won a campaign that was just prior to the Imperial City event? Guess what they did. They completed controlled and locked out any non-DC players from engaging Molag Bal for drops, and had zerg groups patrolling the sewers to insure this. This was on PS4-NA, by the way. And there quite a few threads that popped up about the actions of these players. As it multiple guilds that set this all up.

But ready for the kicker...?

Months later, when ZOS had the whole double AP event going on? These same DC players (it was the very same guild of players) that was capturing and recapturing outposts with EP players (they were all guildies). Remember hearing about this particular ban-wave, and how people were outraged that ZOS didn’t strip these people of their: AP, rank, and Rewards of the Worthy? Yep. Those very same people for the most part.

I don’t know what it’s going to take, but ZOS needs to get serious on handling the bs going on in Cyrodiil. Especially on PS4-NA. It’s beyond bad at this point. It’s horrible. And it also doesn’t help that time and time again, ZOS turns around and undoes bans that they apply on these dishonest players. Fix your game, ZOS. And fix it soon. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_BrianWheeler

Beardimus

I think this has been a good debate @ZOS_BrianWheeler I think what i'd love to hear is we are aware of the feedback or we have the data on what really goes on with switching - and its something we will consider - even if its a year away (hope not) understanding that ZOS understand the impact to use more 'RP' / Faction Loyal players who do treat the war more seriously than a game to be 'gamed' would be epic.

Beardimus

Sadly the behavior continues. Its detrimental to the game, it really is.

I get the arguments against lock, but honestly - I still want a solution, and all I can think of that's implementable is a lock - be it 24/48 hr on 7/30 day - or whole campaign. Its something.

having new guildies join PvP and basically see first hand to get on and beat the flippers you have to join em, that Emp is passed about etc - its demotivating.

Of course an element of alliance support is needed to get Emp, you have to call in your factions army to help flip those keeps - its not a solo thing. But devaluing the greater war effort by letting people score points both sides of the fight is just odd.

Love to hear a viable solution to fix this - if its not Alliance Lock.

antihero727

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

This is very common. I’m not a fan at all.

There’s too much drama for my taste. I know quite a few players that switch factions to the “winning side” for optimal AP gains.

This happened a week ago on Vivec and I was told to take off my tinfoil hat. It’s not a conspiracy if it actually happened. The ones defending the system are the ones abusing or reaping the side benefits.

Hurtfan

I don't like it myself and will never do it, but that's irrelevant. If other people want to alliance hop, for whatever reason, more power to them if it keeps them playing PvP.

Lord_Etrigan

Ok what is with this *** of two Emps in one campaign?
I’m in Shor and it’s happening right now with two smurf Emps in one campaign

reiverx

We are down to a fraction of the campaigns that we used to have. They've been shut down because PVP numbers have been dwindling for a long time.

All those people that have left are not coming back. Ever.

Something needs to be done to revitalize PVP and make it more like a real campaign with objectives that are worthwhile. All we have now is something where AP is king of kings.

I think adding a faction-locked campaign would be a good start. Just to test the waters and see how it goes.

Then, you know, something about the lag and stuff......

central_scrutinizer

I honestly stopped caring about emp at all the first time I saw a group deliberately sabotaging their own faction to favour their buddy's ascent over anybody else who was on their way to earn it first, with no concern at all for the good of the faction or the map, just the farm.

This is my main problem with canned instanced pvp, there's no true consequences since you can just hop out at will, swap at will ect, instanced pvp (especially with no item loot, corpse retrieval ect) is basically just a minigame so this kind of bs is inevitable. I laugh so hard whenever I see anybody use the word "carebear" in reference to any situation in eso because what passes for red in ESO is pretty damn blue when you really look at it.

I honestly don't see how people can continue to play if they actually care, because this kind of thing is constantly happening. My genuine advice is to not hold your breath for any kind of fix because instanced pvp inherently can not be fixed, instead just focus on what actually is enjoyable about it to you.

Beardimus

Lord_Etrigan wrote: »

Ok what is with this *** of two Emps in one campaign?
I’m in Shor and it’s happening right now with two smurf Emps in one campaign

It's probably one 'real' Emp. And the other probably has the title from a campaign that shut down, you keep it permanent then, title only no power

SugaComa

It ruins the flow of the game and campaign ... And shouldn't be allowed

BaylorCorvette

Not a fan faction swapping on campaigns. I'd prefer if your campaign was locked on your account so that if you had an AD toon home camp on Vivec only AD toons on your account can make Vivec home.

Beardimus

SugaComa wrote: »

It ruins the flow of the game and campaign ... And shouldn't be allowed

agreed!

Beardimus

BaylorCorvette wrote: »

Not a fan faction swapping on campaigns. I'd prefer if your campaign was locked on your account so that if you had an AD toon home camp on Vivec only AD toons on your account can make Vivec home.

and I concur. The debate has run on and I've heard people out - but the more I see (and it's gone on all month) this needs to happen, at the LEAST with a time lock - 48 hours, but i'd prefer full campaign.

People should not be able to take a keep, leave the wall down, log out, in with other toon run in and take it back. Let alone all the other stuff that goes on - scroll running etc. Its getting stale now.

What i'm more shocked with it the defence on it - I brought it up on discord and one response was that I was a sucker for not joining in as that's the only way. Shocking!

heres to some modicum of alliance loyalty

Karivaa

Beardimus wrote: »

BaylorCorvette wrote: »

Not a fan faction swapping on campaigns. I'd prefer if your campaign was locked on your account so that if you had an AD toon home camp on Vivec only AD toons on your account can make Vivec home.

and I concur. The debate has run on and I've heard people out - but the more I see (and it's gone on all month) this needs to happen, at the LEAST with a time lock - 48 hours, but i'd prefer full campaign.

People should not be able to take a keep, leave the wall down, log out, in with other toon run in and take it back. Let alone all the other stuff that goes on - scroll running etc. Its getting stale now.

What i'm more shocked with it the defence on it - I brought it up on discord and one response was that I was a sucker for not joining in as that's the only way. Shocking!

heres to some modicum of alliance loyalty

Who does this? Lol! I’m on Xbox and with only 3 campaigns left for us this does not happen.

Beardimus

EU it does I'm afraid when Individuals are despitate, more so tho its a guild thing, paint map one way, paint it back etc. Moving your alliance scrolls about, flipping keeps between two groups of mates etc etc.

It's just getting dull.

I mean call me old fashioned or perhaps its the RPer in me but I wanna fight mt enemy and them be just that not suddenly they appear on my alliance when we winning then pop up on the other if tide of battle switches. It's just weird.

DoctorESO

So, things will always be easier to get than it was for the people before them. In the end, though, it's not really going to matter 20, 10, even 5 years from now whether or not you got emp, or whether or not someone got emp easier than you.

Beardimus

Absolutely it doesn't matter @DoctorESO Nor will the majority of things in our lives over that period. Shall we just not care? That's mighty depressing sir, certainly not my outlook to not care as one day the sun will blight out the earth and all this won't matter...

My time in game is limited, and my thoughts on this forum are in context of the enjoyment in game, in context.

Does this game or any game matter in my wider life, nope no sir ee. But I'm not ranking things. In context I and many other find nefarious behaviour in a hobby we enjoy (and invest time in) to be undermining and annoying and this is a place to chat about such things, but cheers for your input

Vapirko

We’ve been asking ZOS to lock factions for the duration of campaigns but nothing so far. Among the myriad of things that need to happen this is definitely one of them. It’s amazing, imo, how many people would rather abuse the system then just have good fights and play the game instead of cheesing their way along.

runningtings

Shor EU PC the last few days has been a total joke, groups of yellows teaming up with groups of reds to take keeps and therefore emp.

Not really in the spirit of the game is it?

Meantime, we have DC groups off taking Drakelowe...

ktdotexe

[deleted]

DoctorESO

Beardimus wrote: »

Absolutely it doesn't matter @DoctorESO Nor will the majority of things in our lives over that period. Shall we just not care? That's mighty depressing sir, certainly not my outlook to not care as one day the sun will blight out the earth and all this won't matter...

My time in game is limited, and my thoughts on this forum are in context of the enjoyment in game, in context.

Does this game or any game matter in my wider life, nope no sir ee. But I'm not ranking things. In context I and many other find nefarious behaviour in a hobby we enjoy (and invest time in) to be undermining and annoying and this is a place to chat about such things, but cheers for your input

I'm not saying "don't care." I'm saying to remember the big picture and not let the small things in life have too much of a negative effect on one's life. The latter is all about perspective.

Things will always be easier to get than it was for the people before them. In the end, though, it's not really going to matter 20, 10, even 5 years from now whether or not you got emp, or whether or not someone got emp easier than you.

VaranisArano

DoctorESO wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Absolutely it doesn't matter @DoctorESO Nor will the majority of things in our lives over that period. Shall we just not care? That's mighty depressing sir, certainly not my outlook to not care as one day the sun will blight out the earth and all this won't matter...

My time in game is limited, and my thoughts on this forum are in context of the enjoyment in game, in context.

Does this game or any game matter in my wider life, nope no sir ee. But I'm not ranking things. In context I and many other find nefarious behaviour in a hobby we enjoy (and invest time in) to be undermining and annoying and this is a place to chat about such things, but cheers for your input

I'm not saying "don't care." I'm saying to remember the big picture and not let the small things in life have too much of a negative effect on one's life. The latter is all about perspective.

Things will always be easier to get than it was for the people before them. In the end, though, it's not really going to matter 20, 10, even 5 years from now whether or not you got emp, or whether or not someone got emp easier than you.

If I'm still playing this game in 5 years, I'll be hella impressed with ESO. That doesnt mean I shouldn't advocate for problems that impact my enjoyment or the balance of the game now. Which, yeah, faction swapping is one of,those things that has a detrimental impact on campaign balance now.

DoctorESO

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Absolutely it doesn't matter @DoctorESO Nor will the majority of things in our lives over that period. Shall we just not care? That's mighty depressing sir, certainly not my outlook to not care as one day the sun will blight out the earth and all this won't matter...

My time in game is limited, and my thoughts on this forum are in context of the enjoyment in game, in context.

Does this game or any game matter in my wider life, nope no sir ee. But I'm not ranking things. In context I and many other find nefarious behaviour in a hobby we enjoy (and invest time in) to be undermining and annoying and this is a place to chat about such things, but cheers for your input

I'm not saying "don't care." I'm saying to remember the big picture and not let the small things in life have too much of a negative effect on one's life. The latter is all about perspective.

Things will always be easier to get than it was for the people before them. In the end, though, it's not really going to matter 20, 10, even 5 years from now whether or not you got emp, or whether or not someone got emp easier than you.

If I'm still playing this game in 5 years, I'll be hella impressed with ESO. That doesnt mean I shouldn't advocate for problems that impact my enjoyment or the balance of the game now. Which, yeah, faction swapping is one of,those things that has a detrimental impact on campaign balance now.

Sure, I agree with advocacy. I'm just saying to remember the context - this is a game and is a small part of life in the grand scheme of things, so it's not worth having serious mental distress over. Not saying you are specifically...it's just a saying.

VaranisArano

DoctorESO wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Absolutely it doesn't matter @DoctorESO Nor will the majority of things in our lives over that period. Shall we just not care? That's mighty depressing sir, certainly not my outlook to not care as one day the sun will blight out the earth and all this won't matter...

My time in game is limited, and my thoughts on this forum are in context of the enjoyment in game, in context.

Does this game or any game matter in my wider life, nope no sir ee. But I'm not ranking things. In context I and many other find nefarious behaviour in a hobby we enjoy (and invest time in) to be undermining and annoying and this is a place to chat about such things, but cheers for your input

I'm not saying "don't care." I'm saying to remember the big picture and not let the small things in life have too much of a negative effect on one's life. The latter is all about perspective.

Things will always be easier to get than it was for the people before them. In the end, though, it's not really going to matter 20, 10, even 5 years from now whether or not you got emp, or whether or not someone got emp easier than you.

If I'm still playing this game in 5 years, I'll be hella impressed with ESO. That doesnt mean I shouldn't advocate for problems that impact my enjoyment or the balance of the game now. Which, yeah, faction swapping is one of,those things that has a detrimental impact on campaign balance now.

DoctorESO

VaranisArano wrote: »

DoctorESO wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Absolutely it doesn't matter @DoctorESO Nor will the majority of things in our lives over that period. Shall we just not care? That's mighty depressing sir, certainly not my outlook to not care as one day the sun will blight out the earth and all this won't matter...

My time in game is limited, and my thoughts on this forum are in context of the enjoyment in game, in context.

Does this game or any game matter in my wider life, nope no sir ee. But I'm not ranking things. In context I and many other find nefarious behaviour in a hobby we enjoy (and invest time in) to be undermining and annoying and this is a place to chat about such things, but cheers for your input

I'm not saying "don't care." I'm saying to remember the big picture and not let the small things in life have too much of a negative effect on one's life. The latter is all about perspective.

Things will always be easier to get than it was for the people before them. In the end, though, it's not really going to matter 20, 10, even 5 years from now whether or not you got emp, or whether or not someone got emp easier than you.

If I'm still playing this game in 5 years, I'll be hella impressed with ESO. That doesnt mean I shouldn't advocate for problems that impact my enjoyment or the balance of the game now. Which, yeah, faction swapping is one of,those things that has a detrimental impact on campaign balance now.

Sure, I agree with advocacy. I'm just saying to remember the context - this is a game and is a small part of life in the grand scheme of things, so it's not worth having serious mental distress over. Not saying you are specifically...it's just a saying.

Beardimus

Sure, I agree with advocacy. I'm just saying to remember the context - this is a game and is a small part of life in the grand scheme of things, so it's not worth having serious mental distress over. Not saying you are specifically...it's just a saying.

@DoctorESO no one is having serious mental distress over this? Odd turn of phrase. In context i'm expressing my feelings about something, once the Xbox is off or i'm off the Forum where I come with the purpose of debating things I will show my passion / make my point.

Am I a quivering wreck away in general life at work / with my family thinking about alliance switching - absolutely not. You don't know me sir, and with my life 'load' i'm very pragmatic about what I choose to worry about or not.

HOWEVER, in context, call it RP if you wish! I'm annoyed within that bubble when people cheat.

Honnestly dude I feel you have distress over my mental distress!

Anyway - BOO to cheats, BOO to alliance switching and YAY ZOS have commented they are looking at a lock / solution