Many people againts Necro with the excuse of Lore and mah immersion... so..

Belegnole

This isn't SWTOR, you don't get to play the Dadric side. You're not Molg Bal's minion so get used to it.

Unfortunately the game just wasn't made that way.

Personally I think it would have been a blast. But you know... things

Considering how the game WAS made necromancers make no sense to me at all. I'm mean, they're the bad guys right? Yes, the line is definitely blurry around the edges. But, it is very clear who the enemy is.

Cpt_Teemo

Rupz_Koomar wrote: »

ESO isn't that of an immersive game. And neither ESO is completely faithful to the lore.
None of these reasons justify why Necromancer class should not be a thing in ESO.
There are 100 other reasons I can list you which justify that but you already know as u argued with everyone who oppose a new class.Take what u learnt from them and educate yourself :P

Necromancer class is not happening in the next 2 or 3 years as it does not make sense businesswise so U can now stop with new class nonsense
You have been waiting for it since launch and u will wait for it for years to come and most probably forever..

Who knows the necromancer was apart of the base class in AoC

Prof_Bawbag

Kiara wrote: »

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Rupz_Koomar wrote: »

ESO isn't that of an immersive game. And neither ESO is completely faithful to the lore.
None of these reasons justify why Necromancer class should not be a thing in ESO.
There are 100 other reasons I can list you which justify that but you already know as u argued with everyone who oppose a new class.Take what u learnt from them and educate yourself :P

Necromancer class is not happening in the next 2 or 3 years as it does not make sense businesswise so U can now stop with new class nonsense
You have been waiting for it since launch and u will wait for it for years to come and most probably forever..

Faithful to the lore. Christ, Skyrim managed to bastardize more of the TES lore than anything ESO has thrown up. In fact, Bethesda themselves are the worst when it comes to keeping their own TES lore in check. I get there are niggles contained within ESO, but it's no woese than what we've witnessed on TES games proper.

I wholeheartedly disagree. ESO has way more plot holes and lore inconsistence than any TES game ever had in my opinion

Also, I'd love to see necromancer class ^.^

I'd love to see examples of that. ESO is set in a time which at best was kinda shrouded in mystery, so ZoS were given a blank canvas of sorts. Whereas TES games proper bore little or no resemblance to what came before them. I also think a mistake people make with ESO is they apply other players into their logic. The reality is, those other players in-game are only there to make it work as an MMO. They don't actually exist in the grand scheme of things. Our toon is the centre of the gaming universe if that makes sense, so there's not actually millions of others riding around on flame mounts from a lore perspective.

As i said, Skyrim was supposed to be filled with Nord tribes, glaciers that reached as far as the eye could see and a whole host of other stuff that was in no way represented in Skyrim itself. Then there was Oblivion. I can only assume you never read any books relating to Cyrodiil that came before Oblivion because what was written and what we got were 2 different things.

ParaNostram

Honestly I remember during early days of ESO when the beta wasn't even in effect and everyone was just guessing and hyped about the game, I thought this game was going to be AMAZING for Necromancer players. I mean, Mannimarco the King of Worms running around!? Too good of an opportunity to pass up.

Now many years later I can see that ZOS is too good at passing up on good opportunities.

Akrasjel

This is going places

Zordrage

ParaNostram wrote: »

Honestly I remember during early days of ESO when the beta wasn't even in effect and everyone was just guessing and hyped about the game, I thought this game was going to be AMAZING for Necromancer players. I mean, Mannimarco the King of Worms running around!? Too good of an opportunity to pass up.

Now many years later I can see that ZOS is too good at passing up on good opportunities.

ITS STILL not too late....

notimetocare

Zordrage wrote: »

Where the hell Dragon Knights as a class came from into the game.......
Where those abilities came from to begin with.....because i don't remember to even SEE most of those so called DK abilities in other elderscrolls games...

Someone enlighten me....did i missed some lore about it... ? or we can just Stop this Whole no necro because immersion and Lore nonsense ?

because right now as i see it a Necro class would make way more sense then the Entire Dragon Knight class....

You ignore that Necromancy is currently yhe enemy of the word... Immersion. Nobody says it isnt lore friendly.

Most non-mages are very anti-necromancy. Most of the worm cult's current damage to the world is Necromancy (including many other groups raising the dead, defiling the dead and the like). Nobody is gong to trust a necromancer

Zordrage

notimetocare wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

Where the hell Dragon Knights as a class came from into the game.......
Where those abilities came from to begin with.....because i don't remember to even SEE most of those so called DK abilities in other elderscrolls games...

Someone enlighten me....did i missed some lore about it... ? or we can just Stop this Whole no necro because immersion and Lore nonsense ?

because right now as i see it a Necro class would make way more sense then the Entire Dragon Knight class....

You ignore that Necromancy is currently yhe enemy of the word... Immersion. Nobody says it isnt lore friendly.

Most non-mages are very anti-necromancy. Most of the worm cult's current damage to the world is Necromancy (including many other groups raising the dead, defiling the dead and the like). Nobody is gong to trust a necromancer

and ? that wont stop us saving the world.... and does not stop the good necros existing....

This thing can be easily used on Vampires... i mean all those quest where everyone and their grandma thinks that Vampire are soooo BAD and naughty they should not exists its a plague yadayadayadaya... YET we can be one... DID IT BREAK anyones immersion or lore ? no....

Kiara

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

I'd love to see examples of that. ESO is set in a time which at best was kinda shrouded in mystery, so ZoS were given a blank canvas of sorts. Whereas TES games proper bore little or no resemblance to what came before them. I also think a mistake people make with ESO is they apply other players into their logic. The reality is, those other players in-game are only there to make it work as an MMO. They don't actually exist in the grand scheme of things. Our toon is the centre of the gaming universe if that makes sense, so there's not actually millions of others riding around on flame mounts from a lore perspective.

As i said, Skyrim was supposed to be filled with Nord tribes, glaciers that reached as far as the eye could see and a whole host of other stuff that was in no way represented in Skyrim itself. Then there was Oblivion. I can only assume you never read any books relating to Cyrodiil that came before Oblivion because what was written and what we got were 2 different things.

I know how Cyrodiil was supposed to look, considering Colovians/Nibenay cultural differences and whats not. I never said Skyrim was good lore-wise, I only said that ESO is worse in lore consistence than TES games and I will give you examples of such inexcusable lore plot holes:

1. Books that were non existant in 2 era,
2. Existence of Cropsford,
3. Cyrodiil not being jungle,
4. Existence of Seyda Neen (looking almost the same, I mean, seriously?)
5. Where the heck are other 23 species of Khajiit?

I could go on with this list but I see no point in doing that because it is not the topic, just an answer to your post and I hope I did

Also, I agree what you said about Skyrim and it was a huge disappointment for me. I could say the same about portryal of Altmer for example but there is no point in doing that. And well lore is one of the main reasons I play TES series (sounds masochistic xD) so I can't say things above apply to me.

Oh, and about necromancers being "bad guys" Ever heard of "fight fire with fire" sentence?
I don't think every necromancer in whole Nirn follows Mannimarco in my opinion. ^.^

notimetocare

Zordrage wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

Where the hell Dragon Knights as a class came from into the game.......
Where those abilities came from to begin with.....because i don't remember to even SEE most of those so called DK abilities in other elderscrolls games...

Someone enlighten me....did i missed some lore about it... ? or we can just Stop this Whole no necro because immersion and Lore nonsense ?

because right now as i see it a Necro class would make way more sense then the Entire Dragon Knight class....

You ignore that Necromancy is currently yhe enemy of the word... Immersion. Nobody says it isnt lore friendly.

Most non-mages are very anti-necromancy. Most of the worm cult's current damage to the world is Necromancy (including many other groups raising the dead, defiling the dead and the like). Nobody is gong to trust a necromancer

and ? that wont stop us saving the world.... and does not stop the good necros existing....

This thing can be easily used on Vampires... i mean all those quest where everyone and their grandma thinks that Vampire are soooo BAD and naughty they should not exists its a plague yadayadayadaya... YET we can be one... DID IT BREAK anyones immersion or lore ? no....

Vampirism can be concealed. Plan not to revive corpses when fighting with others? Good luck saving the world when nobody wants to interact with you, or would logically want to murder you?

Davor

monktoasty wrote: »

Bethsada owns the world..anything they do becomes lore.....the only thing they can do wrong is contradict their own lore..but if they do it in a manner that is logical than that now becomes lore because they are the originators of the content.

So Disney.

Zordrage

notimetocare wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

Where the hell Dragon Knights as a class came from into the game.......
Where those abilities came from to begin with.....because i don't remember to even SEE most of those so called DK abilities in other elderscrolls games...

Someone enlighten me....did i missed some lore about it... ? or we can just Stop this Whole no necro because immersion and Lore nonsense ?

because right now as i see it a Necro class would make way more sense then the Entire Dragon Knight class....

You ignore that Necromancy is currently yhe enemy of the word... Immersion. Nobody says it isnt lore friendly.

Most non-mages are very anti-necromancy. Most of the worm cult's current damage to the world is Necromancy (including many other groups raising the dead, defiling the dead and the like). Nobody is gong to trust a necromancer

and ? that wont stop us saving the world.... and does not stop the good necros existing....

This thing can be easily used on Vampires... i mean all those quest where everyone and their grandma thinks that Vampire are soooo BAD and naughty they should not exists its a plague yadayadayadaya... YET we can be one... DID IT BREAK anyones immersion or lore ? no....

Vampirism can be concealed. Plan not to revive corpses when fighting with others? Good luck saving the world when nobody wants to interact with you, or would logically want to murder you?

thats not how works... even if this would be irl stuff.... lol

Davor

Why are people saying Necromancers are the bad guys? Also why are people saying that Necromancers are not lore friendly? Wasn't it Oblivion Mages Guild that outlawed necromancy? So since this is before Oblivion we should be able to have Necromancers.

Also if it was banned and not just frowned on, and they were in "hiding" I am sure there are people who practice it as well, since I am sure Menomarco (I keep forgetting the guy who killed us name.) isn't the only practicing necromancer in all of Tamerial. Since he was practicing I am sure there are many others as well that are doing so as well.

So why necromancers in hiding or not, are evil? Are Dunmers evil for talking to their ancestors? They are dead. Are vampires evil because they are undead and can create more undead. No necromancers are not evil unless the person does evil.

Neyane

I need a necromancer skill line, I can't believe we haven't got one yet.

Apache_Kid

I just cannot even imagine about caring about lore in an mmo. Go play a single player RPG if you care about immersion.

monktoasty

Zordrage wrote: »

ParaNostram wrote: »

Honestly I remember during early days of ESO when the beta wasn't even in effect and everyone was just guessing and hyped about the game, I thought this game was going to be AMAZING for Necromancer players. I mean, Mannimarco the King of Worms running around!? Too good of an opportunity to pass up.

Now many years later I can see that ZOS is too good at passing up on good opportunities.

ITS STILL not too late....

Yea it's too late..loot boxes too greedy no time make game good just make good lootz

ValkynSketha

You could kill an entire village in skyrim and then necro them, hearing them moan in suffering while they fight for you, as well summon deadra and ***, and there is already necro npcs in game already, how is it lore unfriendly?

platonicidealgirlfriend

11 and a half years after Bethsoft pulled a "Tiber Septim did it" with Oblivion y'all wanna complain that dev's can get fast and loose with the lore?

wolf486

Whenever I played a magic character in skyrim I liked raising dead bodies to help
However instead of a new class, could they not add a new necromancer skill line to the sorcerer?

Kel

Belegnole wrote: »

This isn't SWTOR, you don't get to play the Dadric side. You're not Molg Bal's minion so get used to it.

Unfortunately the game just wasn't made that way.

Personally I think it would have been a blast. But you know... things

Considering how the game WAS made necromancers make no sense to me at all. I'm mean, they're the bad guys right? Yes, the line is definitely blurry around the edges. But, it is very clear who the enemy is.

Are you playing as a vampire? And even if you personally are not playing as one, you know they ARE playable, right? You know Molag Bal created vampires, right? So, why does one make sense and another doesn't?
Plus, my charater has made many deals with daedra. Helping one in ICP comes to mind...working with one in Sanguin Demesne, is another example.
"It's very clear who the enemy is..". Yes, it is. One cult that doesn't represent all necromancers. That's like saying a German is automatically a ***, just because he/she comes from Germany. What doesn't make sense to me is your argument against it...because really you don't have one. Your entire argument against it is "no..."

Elsonso

.

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

I think everyone should be aware if they aren't already, that TES/Bethesda aren't like Tolkien/Middle Earth or whatever. No one wrote masses of TES lore books (not books written by people inside the world) as Tolkien did for his fantasy world. So, the TES world and its lore are essentially always a work in progress until one of the creators decides to do something like Tolkien which probably won't happen.

Not only is it a work in progress, it is mutable. It can change. Without the need of a "dragon break".

I doubt that they will ever add a Necromancer class to the game. At best, we will get some other class added that has some skills often found in necromancers. This would probably be in the form of a classic "zombie/undead" combat pet.

notimetocare

Davor wrote: »

Why are people saying Necromancers are the bad guys? Also why are people saying that Necromancers are not lore friendly? Wasn't it Oblivion Mages Guild that outlawed necromancy? So since this is before Oblivion we should be able to have Necromancers.

Also if it was banned and not just frowned on, and they were in "hiding" I am sure there are people who practice it as well, since I am sure Menomarco (I keep forgetting the guy who killed us name.) isn't the only practicing necromancer in all of Tamerial. Since he was practicing I am sure there are many others as well that are doing so as well.

So why necromancers in hiding or not, are evil? Are Dunmers evil for talking to their ancestors? They are dead. Are vampires evil because they are undead and can create more undead. No necromancers are not evil unless the person does evil.

Necromancy is frowned upon by most cultures in Tamriel throughout most of time. It was only outlawed once, yes. But also take into account the current state of Tamriel and how widespread Necromancy is in a negative context.

Necromancy is used by the Dunmer in ancestor worship. It serves no combat function. One point ia that hey have no care if Necromancy is used against lesser races, but that is a facet of their supremacy moreso than support of Necromancy. Additionally some Dunmer do not care at all if Necromancy is used.

The biggest issue would be with Redguards. They absolutely abhor Necromancy and it is the main issue in the zone storyline. No way they would ever let a necromancer help them.

emilyhyoyeon

Apache_Kid wrote: »

I just cannot even imagine about caring about lore in an mmo. Go play a single player RPG if you care about immersion.

Lore is a huge thing in other MMOs like LOTRO. Lore and immersion are not the same things

notimetocare

Zordrage wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

Where the hell Dragon Knights as a class came from into the game.......
Where those abilities came from to begin with.....because i don't remember to even SEE most of those so called DK abilities in other elderscrolls games...

Someone enlighten me....did i missed some lore about it... ? or we can just Stop this Whole no necro because immersion and Lore nonsense ?

because right now as i see it a Necro class would make way more sense then the Entire Dragon Knight class....

You ignore that Necromancy is currently yhe enemy of the word... Immersion. Nobody says it isnt lore friendly.

Most non-mages are very anti-necromancy. Most of the worm cult's current damage to the world is Necromancy (including many other groups raising the dead, defiling the dead and the like). Nobody is gong to trust a necromancer

and ? that wont stop us saving the world.... and does not stop the good necros existing....

This thing can be easily used on Vampires... i mean all those quest where everyone and their grandma thinks that Vampire are soooo BAD and naughty they should not exists its a plague yadayadayadaya... YET we can be one... DID IT BREAK anyones immersion or lore ? no....

Vampirism can be concealed. Plan not to revive corpses when fighting with others? Good luck saving the world when nobody wants to interact with you, or would logically want to murder you?

thats not how works... even if this would be irl stuff.... lol

Thats pretty much exactly how it works. The most glaring issue is that a Redguard in the Alikr storyline would never accept the help of a necromancers. Provided they did not outright murder you

Zordrage

monktoasty wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

ParaNostram wrote: »

Honestly I remember during early days of ESO when the beta wasn't even in effect and everyone was just guessing and hyped about the game, I thought this game was going to be AMAZING for Necromancer players. I mean, Mannimarco the King of Worms running around!? Too good of an opportunity to pass up.

Now many years later I can see that ZOS is too good at passing up on good opportunities.

ITS STILL not too late....

Yea it's too late..loot boxes too greedy no time make game good just make good lootz

i Wish i could laugh on this..but deep down..i feel truth in it....

Ermiq

Apache_Kid wrote: »

I just cannot even imagine about caring about lore in an mmo. Go play a single player RPG if you care about immersion.

Go play Korean MMOs then. ESO is a game in TES universe. It HAS to follow TES series lore. If it doesn't then call it something like Necromancers Online and go dance with Mannimarco and other necros till the next Dragon Break... Oh, there can't be a Dragon Break if it's not a TES game.

Davor wrote: »

No necromancers are not evil unless the person does evil.

Alllriiighty then. Rising corpses from their graves is not an evil. No, no, no. They're dead already, so there's nothing bad in this action.

Belegnole wrote: »

This isn't SWTOR, you don't get to play the Dadric side. You're not Molg Bal's minion so get used to it.

Unfortunately the game just wasn't made that way.

Personally I think it would have been a blast. But you know... things

Considering how the game WAS made necromancers make no sense to me at all. I'm mean, they're the bad guys right? Yes, the line is definitely blurry around the edges. But, it is very clear who the enemy is.

You can't explain this point to them. They don't listen. They just want to play as they want.

monktoasty wrote: »

Eremith wrote: »

Zordrage wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

From UESP

The Dragon Knights (or Dragonknights) were followers of a new martial tradition that emerged during the Interregnum of the Second Era, originating from the dispersed Akaviri Dragonguard. Their abilities were said to descend from the powers of dragons, although none had been seen in Tamriel for thousands of years at that time. They were particularly skilled at manipulating fire, and could wreathe themselves in it completely without being harmed.

That's how DKs are lore friendly.

that lore came with ESO right ? to Validate the class somehow..... but wasnt there anywhere else in the actual ES lore right ?

if we think like this every single Lore issue people have and story immersion is INVALID because the devs can just Write another something like this and say NOW its lore friendly

Yes, that's how it works.
ZOS could make ESO2 with compeletely new storylines and all new quests. That's how playable necros would become valid.
In current ESO necros are invalid.

I wonder why you still can't see that.

They are not invalid because they exist already. A simple dlc could easily explain their emergence.

I've seen enough of "easily explaining DLCs" in ESO. I know that it'll be poorly made integration (just like all other new things done in this game).

Rainraven

Zordrage wrote: »

Where the hell Dragon Knights as a class came from into the game.......
Where those abilities came from to begin with.....because i don't remember to even SEE most of those so called DK abilities in other elderscrolls games...

Someone enlighten me....did i missed some lore about it... ? or we can just Stop this Whole no necro because immersion and Lore nonsense ?

because right now as i see it a Necro class would make way more sense then the Entire Dragon Knight class....

Excuse?

Lore is nice. I don't want a Necro class because I don't want to deal with dead body pets all over the damn place. It also sounds like a nightmare for PVP.

No pets at all and I'm fine with it, but then it's not really a necromancer, so.

Kel

You can't explain this point to them. They don't listen. They just want to play as they want.

http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Necromancy


"The debate over necromancy has been raging in magical circles for centuries. Advocates of the Dark Practice decry its censorship, lamenting the sacrifice of knowledge at the altar of public opinion. One argument they've been known to give is that attaining a proper and ethical understanding of necromancy is vital to best combat the menaces who have given the practice such an infamous reputation."

Except, again, this comes from the Bethesda lore page. How can you ignore what Bathesda has said...that not all necromancers are evil, and some are willing to fight the evil ones who give necromancy a bad name.
So I take from this is that it's you (thoes against the idea of playable necromancy, not you personally) who won't listen. Here is a clear example of why this can work in the lore...from Bethesda! But of course, you won't listen, because it blows apart your argument that it's not lore friendly, despite this clear example from the people who write the lore!
/facepalm...

Orticia

Not against necromancers, don;t consider them lore unfriendly. I think they would fit just fine. I simply would prefer not to have a new class, but one or more skill lines instead. I prefer more options to characters I already love playing and spend a lot of time on, instead of having to start from scratch.

SirAndy

Zordrage wrote: »

that lore came with ESO right?

That's how lore works.

The intellectual property owner has one or more writers come up with whatever they want, which is then put into the game and thus manifests itself as lore from that point forward.