new way to lvlup -Undaunted Skill Line- please

maniac4maniac

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

For MaX cp, end-game PvE players it can take:

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - week/s to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

And other suggestions:

- completing random normal gives 5-10 points
- completingrandom vet gives 10-20 points (hm)
- 1 world boss cleaned for the 1st time gives 10-20 points

Malamar1229

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

maniac4maniac

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

That sounds like a good idea for PvE-rs aswell, why not

Axoinus

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

I am going to politely disagree with your logic. If you don't want PvPers to feel pressured to do PvE content, then PvErs should not feel pressured to do PvP content.

PvE lives matter

Oakmontowls_ESO

Alternatively you can go after dungeon achievements for xp

maniac4maniac

Oakmontowls_ESO wrote: »

Alternatively you can go after dungeon achievements for xp

How long ago did you try to find a group (for not-pledges)?

I'm talking about week+ with dungeon achievs because it's really hard nowadays to find people who would like to go into vet Dungeons, coz they were there hundreds of times and dungeons are mostly forgotten now for this and that reason. I myself am helping friends sometimes with that, but i really am bored after 1-3 dungeons there.

Samadhi

Axoinus wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

I am going to politely disagree with your logic. If you don't want PvPers to feel pressured to do PvE content, then PvErs should not feel pressured to do PvP content.

PvE lives matter

it is feasible to simply buy a bunch of repair kits, port to a recently captured keep, and circle around repairing the walls while they crumble (they crumble until resources hit max level after a particular span of time without being flipped)
even more boring than pve grind, but know people who have done it
if zone chat is to be believed, it is also part of how emperor candidates stay on top

find dungeon runs stressful enough that if an equivalent were provided for Undaunted, would definitely capitalize on it tho

If ZOS lets me level up Undaunted by spending some gold and/or AP and porting around Tamriel hammering Q rather than fighting,
would definitely be up for seeing the gap closed

logarifmik

Sure, make the game more casual to attract more casuals, which will complain about any non-casual aspect of the game on the forum, and by reading these devs will make game even more casual and attract more casuals to complain, and finally we will end up with god damn Pokemon game or whatever.

maniac4maniac

logarifmik wrote: »

Sure, make the game more casual to attract more casuals, which will complain about any non-casual aspect of the game on the forum, and by reading these devs will make game even more casual and attract more casuals to complain, and finally we will end up with god damn Pokemon game or whatever.

Wut?

What is casual or hardcore in wasting time on things you did before hundreds of times and can't do in 1 day like you can do all other similar things? Lvl of Undaunted doesn't show your skill, your dps, your understanding of anything. It shows how much time you wasted (not spent) in dungeons that you don't need and want to do.

I should just ignore this comment i know

lolo_01b16_ESO

Let's make a deal, you level fighters guild whenever I create a new char and I level undaunted for you

But seriously I feel like undaunted is the fastest and most fun guild to level. And if you don't have a guild or any friends to play with, why do you want to level undaunted at all? Your solo gameplay won't change much if you miss a few % on your stats and you can't use those synergies when you're alone.

logarifmik

maniac4maniac wrote: »

Wut?

What is casual or hardcore in wasting time on things you did before hundreds of times and can't do in 1 day like you can do all other similar things? Lvl of Undaunted doesn't show your skill, your dps, your understanding of anything. It shows how much time you wasted (not spent) in dungeons that you don't need and want to do.

I should just ignore this comment i know

Sorry about that, it's a bad PewDiePie influence. My point is, it shouldn't be easy. You must spent some time to achieve it, otherwise all this Undaunted conception have no sense at all. If you roll a new character you must do it again. Nevertheless, I agree that less frustrated way to master this particular skill line is needed. But this way must contain a lot of pain anyway.

Samadhi

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Let's make a deal, you level fighters guild whenever I create a new char and I level undaunted for you

But seriously I feel like undaunted is the fastest and most fun guild to level. And if you don't have a guild or any friends to play with, why do you want to level undaunted at all? Your solo gameplay won't change much if you miss a few % on your stats and you can't use those synergies when you're alone.

For context, on my Bosmer(my only character of 14 to have maxed the line so far):

Undaunted = 2 skill points = 6% Health, Magicka and Stamina
Racial = 9 skill points = 6% Stamina, 21% Stamina regen, 1485 Poison/Disease resist, better sneak

Undaunted has a more significant impact on my survivability, and arguably overall gameplay, as a solo PvP player
than my racial passives do,
at a fraction of the skill points

and without a group to rely on, managing my own survivability is entirely my task to handle with the resource pools available to me

not to claim to need it more or less than any other player -- just not clear on why you would expect anyone to not at all want an increase to their primary stats

olsborg

Yes I agree wholeheartedly, atleast make it so you can do the daily quest from the npc 10 times per day instead of 1.

maniac4maniac

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Let's make a deal, you level fighters guild whenever I create a new char and I level undaunted for you

But seriously I feel like undaunted is the fastest and most fun guild to level. And if you don't have a guild or any friends to play with, why do you want to level undaunted at all? Your solo gameplay won't change much if you miss a few % on your stats and you can't use those synergies when you're alone.

You will be at fighters' guild lvl 7-9 when you reach lvl 50 with a new char farming lvl on undead in several locations or just Skyreach in common.

It's hard AF to find a group that wants to make more than Pledges "today". So you are limited to 2-3 dungs per day mostly - that's why. And you can't really speed it up like everything else in the ESO. May be there are people, but i didn't find any from zone chats from ~5-7 main zones during 3 days (weekend btw) in a row.

Magdalina

I don't really see it as an issue. Mage's guild is one hell of a grind, Idk how people do it. I've done it on my main without grinding and on only one alt by grinding only partially and couldn't do it again. There's 0 fun in collecting lorebooks for Nth time around from any side. UD? We have SO many dungeon achievements now it levels super fast if you just run pledges daily. Heck my baby(cp ~300) EU is already UD 8 and she's only done like several vet dungeons total, mostly random normals or something without even trying for pledges daily. I wish we had more guild lines like UD, those leveling which actually required actively playing the game.

pieratsos

Axoinus wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

I am going to politely disagree with your logic. If you don't want PvPers to feel pressured to do PvE content, then PvErs should not feel pressured to do PvP content.

PvE lives matter

What are you even talking about. You can get vigor, carltrops, war horn in 2 hours. Thats not pressure or forced to do PVP, thats just encouraging you to try PVP and if u dont like it, dont ever do it again.

Malamar1229

Axoinus wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

I am going to politely disagree with your logic. If you don't want PvPers to feel pressured to do PvE content, then PvErs should not feel pressured to do PvP content.

PvE lives matter

Youre right...which why I think vigor should be removed from the game.

Dawnblade

The guild daily quests should be repeatable like DB quests (at least through one cycle of quests since it is possible to complete them all each day if you can find shares of them all) - and really anywhere there are dailies, players should be able to pick them all up instead of trying to find someone to share quests.

As for all the whatabouts...my $.02 below:

PVP vs PVE skill line debate: I'd be happy to see the two separated in some way, from mirroring the passives / skills in both PVP and PVE lines to making the passives / skills in each lines specific to the content (undaunted boosting dungeon / trials, assault boosting PVP).

Mages / Fighters debate: Both are also boring grinds, however, both can be done in a few hours of solo focus - whereas Undaunted has a lot of limitations outside of having a premade group ready to plow through every dungeons for every achievement.

SisterGoat

Unless you do ALL the dungeons, including veteran, and do all the pledges daily, it takes a pretty long time to level them up. I wish Public Dungeons counted towards Undaunted experience.

Carbonised

Malamar1229 wrote: »

I agree though I also feel in its current state the undaunted mettle passive should be reworked to increase dmg against raid bosses by 1/2/3% so PvPers don't feel pressured to grind that tree out.

Considering that appearance transmog is on its way, it is high time to do away with the whole "mix light, heavy and medium armor for endgame" nonsense. The days when ZOS wanted players to hybrid between armor weight and mag/stam are long over anyway, we're more and more pigeonholed into the mag/stam, med/light armor niches, so at least go all the way and rework the passive. The above suggestion is a great one, leave the undaunted passives for trials and dungeons, and let us be able to wear fully light, heavy or medium armor on our characters without gimping them.

T4T2FR34K

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

VaranisArano

Can't you get the daily delve quest from one of the Undaunted NPCs that's basically "go there, kill 10 monsters and the boss". I haven't tested this, but I think you can then group with someone else who got a different daily delve, share the quest, and complete that one as well which would let you run through a whole bunch of easy delves to level Undaunted quickly at least as long as you had people willing to share the quest with you.

Runefang

Fake tank and queue for all the normal dungeons.

pieratsos

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

Fail. Yeah, just discourage the making of alts. Its not boring enough that you should run around for hours reading books every time you want to create an alt. Now you should be doing it for weeks.

T4T2FR34K

pieratsos wrote: »

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

Fail. Yeah, just discourage the making of alts. Its not boring enough that you should run around for hours reading books every time you want to create an alt. Now you should be doing it for weeks.

You don't have to do it that way...that's your choice...and if your not having fun and you feel you HAVE to have these things...get a different hobby.

p.s. I don't need a response from you I've been where u are...think about it like this, how are going to feel about this in 1 year, 5 years or 10 years...do you still cry over all the progress and quarters you spent at the arcade...do you lament the fact that every other game you invested time in and is now wasted...you know what, never-mind...lol enjoy your ulcer and thinning hairline.

VaranisArano

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

Please keep in mind that these were different before One Tamriel. Before One Tamriel, you couldn't grind through the Mages Guild. You couldn't get to half the zones! You had to pick up the books as you leveled and if you could reach higher level zones after level 50, you'd have to dodge around unkillable enemies (thanks to that miss chance for attacks).

Fighter's Guild, technically, you could level by grinding. Except, you didn't want to because if you did you risked outleveling your other quest content!

So pre-One Tamriel, Mages and Fighters Guild quests were a pretty intense grind that you picked up naturally as you played the game. Just like the Undaunted leveling as you started to get into dungeons.

Post-One Tamriel, the whole world is open and you can't outlevel content. So now grinding for Mages and Fighters Guild is totally viable. Even Undaunted got easier, since now you can group freely with players of any alliance, making pre-made groups much easier to find. Its not like there isn't precedent for having skill lines get easier, as well, since ZOS lowered the amount of AP required to get Assault and Support skill lines in PVP.

pieratsos

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

Fail. Yeah, just discourage the making of alts. Its not boring enough that you should run around for hours reading books every time you want to create an alt. Now you should be doing it for weeks.

You don't have to do it that way...that's your choice...and if your not having fun and you feel you HAVE to have these things...get a different hobby.

You do realise that you HAVE to do those things in order to be competitive right?
Unless you actually propose a different way to lvl them up that doesnt involve a long boring repetitive grind that you already did on every single one of ur characters then there is absolutely no reason to make the grind longer.

T4T2FR34K

pieratsos wrote: »

You do realise that you HAVE to do those things in order to be competitive right?

But you're not competitive and grinding to FG/MG 10 isn't going to make u any better...so why are you trying so hard?

T4T2FR34K

VaranisArano wrote: »

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

Please keep in mind that these were different before One Tamriel. Before One Tamriel, you couldn't grind through the Mages Guild. You couldn't get to half the zones! You had to pick up the books as you leveled and if you could reach higher level zones after level 50, you'd have to dodge around unkillable enemies (thanks to that miss chance for attacks).

Fighter's Guild, technically, you could level by grinding. Except, you didn't want to because if you did you risked outleveling your other quest content!

So pre-One Tamriel, Mages and Fighters Guild quests were a pretty intense grind that you picked up naturally as you played the game. Just like the Undaunted leveling as you started to get into dungeons.

Post-One Tamriel, the whole world is open and you can't outlevel content. So now grinding for Mages and Fighters Guild is totally viable. Even Undaunted got easier, since now you can group freely with players of any alliance, making pre-made groups much easier to find. Its not like there isn't precedent for having skill lines get easier, as well, since ZOS lowered the amount of AP required to get Assault and Support skill lines in PVP.

I grew up on XB, PRE-1T (VR14) so save the its hard on PC plea for some nub.

thedude33

My tank is level 6 undaunted I think. Every other toon is level 1 undaunted and they won't get any higher. I won't dare queue for a dungeon as a DPS. No way I would meet the 'standards'. Likely end up being the subject of a forum post about fake dps or potatoes. I think people would be surprised at the amount of people that won't do dungeons for the same reason.

VaranisArano

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

T4T2FR34K wrote: »

maniac4maniac wrote: »

It was always long, but it was okay when dungeons were not a dead zone like it is now

Nowadays it's the hardest content in the game - to find a group to lvlup undaunted by doing achievements.
And without that by doing only 2-3 pledges each day it takes forever to finish 9-10 lvl skill tree.

Mage line - 1 day to max
Fighters line - hours-1 day to max
Undaunted - weeks to max

And you can't do a lot solo. At least remove daily undaunted delve limit of 1 delve per day, please, so fully desperate people could lvlup it there?

I don't know what you people are agreeing on...the problem isn't that it takes weeks to max undaunted...the problem is that it takes a day to max mages/fighters guild...its fine as is and should just illustrate how the others need to be brought into line...

Please keep in mind that these were different before One Tamriel. Before One Tamriel, you couldn't grind through the Mages Guild. You couldn't get to half the zones! You had to pick up the books as you leveled and if you could reach higher level zones after level 50, you'd have to dodge around unkillable enemies (thanks to that miss chance for attacks).

Fighter's Guild, technically, you could level by grinding. Except, you didn't want to because if you did you risked outleveling your other quest content!

So pre-One Tamriel, Mages and Fighters Guild quests were a pretty intense grind that you picked up naturally as you played the game. Just like the Undaunted leveling as you started to get into dungeons.

Post-One Tamriel, the whole world is open and you can't outlevel content. So now grinding for Mages and Fighters Guild is totally viable. Even Undaunted got easier, since now you can group freely with players of any alliance, making pre-made groups much easier to find. Its not like there isn't precedent for having skill lines get easier, as well, since ZOS lowered the amount of AP required to get Assault and Support skill lines in PVP.

I grew up on XB, PRE-1T (VR14) so save the its hard on PC plea for some nub.

I don't think you quite understood my point. My point was that Fighters and Mages Guild was more of a grind before all the zones were opened up by One Tamriel. So was Undaunted since you couldn't use pre-made groups cross-Alliance. One Tamriel made grinding Fighters and Mages Guild both possible and desirable, and ZOS hasn't changed that.