Should DW/All Weapon Abilities be able to proc both Enchantments?

Avran_Sylt

Currently DW abilities (apart from light and heavy attacks) will only proc the main hand enchantment. The same is true for any Direct Damage DoT weapon ability after you swap to your DW bar.

My question for you is this: Should this be the case? Should the Off-hand enchantment be able to proc off of an ability if the main-hand enchantment is on cooldown?

Only DW abilities can proc the 2nd enchantment

Pros:
-Keeps it limited to only DW ability changes
-More consistent usage of the off-hand enchantment will allow for greater variety in your enchantment choice (wep dam on off-hand instead, main hand for elemental effect, Mix/Match status effects when solo playing)
-Makes DW feel more like you're utilizing multiple tools, rather than one with extra flair

Cons:
-Can exploit this with the Infused bug (also reduces off-hand ICD even though it may not be infused)
-Will create more unavoidable proc damage (DW users in PvP)
-Will increase Stamina DPS (balancing issue)

Keep it as it is:

Pros: Nothing changes, easy
Cons: off-hand enchantment is still inconsistent

All Direct Damage weapon abilities can proc the 2nd Enchantment

-This would be achieved by placing a weapon based Direct Damage DoT which damages an enemy (Wall of elements, Volley, Blade Cloak)
Pros:
-More consistent usage of the off-hand enchantment will allow for greater variety in your enchantment choice (wep dam on off-hand instead, main hand for elemental effect, Mix/Match status effects)
-Makes DW feel more like you're utilizing multiple tools, rather than one with extra flair
-opens up a niche build with Infused/Torug's Pact that makes use of Volley's 0.5s Direct Damage Ticks

Cons:
-Can exploit this with the Infused bug (also reduces off-hand ICD even though it may not be infused)
-Will create more unavoidable proc damage (Bow/DW users in PvP)
-Will increase Stamina DPS (balancing issue)
-Will open up a niche build with Infused/Torug's Pact that makes use of Volley's 0.5s Direct Damage Ticks

SaintSubwayy

Other

personally id like to see the Enchant proccing from the Bar the skill was used from.

So if I have a Backbar Shockstaff with a Berserkenchante, and i Cast Blockade of shock, then swap to frontbar, the blockade should proc the Berserkenchant on the backbar.

Enchant Cooldowns should run bound on Bar's, so 2 Seperate CD for Front and backbar.

DW should also procc both enchants, but with a 60% main, 40% offhand procchance

idk

I do not recall enchants on DW weapons being less effective than the same enchant in 2H weapons. As such the DW off hand should keep the reduced chances to proc.

Avran_Sylt

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

Why? Isn't the tradeoff for DW less survivability, mobility, and Crowd Control in exchange for increased single target damage?

Personally I think 2H should have a modifier to the glyph enchantment, but that's another topic.

idk

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

Why? Isn't the tradeoff for DW a lack of survivability, mobility, and Crowd Control in exchange for increased single target damage?

Personally I think 2H should have a modifier to the glyph enchantment, but that's another topic.

No. You make it out that DW is an inferior weapon and it's not. There are differences which are good differences.

Thogard

Other

OP, you don't know what you're talking about and you haven't done your research.

DW light attacks go in this order: Main, off, main, main, off, main (repeat). That's plenty of room for offhand enchant proc.

Furthermore, rending slashes and it's morphs will always proc the offhand weapon enchant.

Avran_Sylt

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

Yes, it isn't inferior because of its differences, so why then do you want to suppress the difference between the two when it comes to enchantments? Especially when it would allow more consistency when it comes to using them (rather than having the off-hand be sporadic).

Avran_Sylt

@Thogard

They changed rending slashes to proc the main hand. And also broke the Berserker Enchantment proccing from DW Abilities with the 3.1.6 Patch.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/366730/twin-slashes-now-procs-main-hand-berserker-glyph-doesnt-proc-from-dw-skills#latest

idk

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

Yes, it isn't inferior because of its differences, so why then do you want to suppress the difference between the two when it comes to enchantments? Especially when it would allow more consistency when it comes to using them (rather than having the off-hand be sporadic).

It's already that way. It's you that must justify a change. It's also consistent with how traits work which makes sense.

DMuehlhausen

Leave it as it is (DW/All Abilities can only proc the main-hand enchantment)

Maybe even take it a step farther.

Only the main weapon trait works as well. That would bring it slightly more in line for 2H without buffing 2 handers. Then I'd almost say make only the main hand count towards sets as well. You don't have to buff or nerf damage and two handers would be more viable then.

Avran_Sylt

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

Except that it isn't consistent with how Sets, or different Enchantment ICD's work.... As such I'm viewing the two weapons as separate entities, each with their own enchantment. And thus the player should be able to use these two entities to proc both enchantments from abilities seeing as both weapons are used for the majority of the DW abilities.

Avran_Sylt

@Thogard

BTW, the Main,Off,Main(repeat) is probably dated info, I think the way they figure out which enchantment to proc changed after they borked the HA's enchantment proc.

Think now it's : (Enchant1)(Enchant2)(Repeat) . However it can be either the main or off-hand that starts the cycle.
(vid)

https://youtu.be/Zpig7ky2QOY

Thogard

Other

Interesting I'll have to do some testing.

idk

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

Except that it isn't consistent with how Sets, or different Enchantment ICD's work.... As such I'm viewing the two weapons as separate entities, each with their own enchantment. And thus the player should be able to use these two entities to proc both enchantments from abilities seeing as both weapons are used for the majority of the DW abilities.

None of what you are attempting to compare work off the same systems. Probably change that could be made is to have the enchants on both DW weapons have normal change to proc, but have only half their value when placed onto a one hand weapon. That would be in line with weapon traits.

Of course, I am not interested in that change, but since you want to make such comparisons, it is best to compare with the closest example available.

PlagueSD

Leave it as it is (DW/All Abilities can only proc the main-hand enchantment)

Leave is as is. My charges on my main hand deplete just about the same rate as my offhand, so I know both enchants are going off.

paulsimonps

The way I would want it to be is this. When using a light attack, heavy attack or an ability, if both enchantments are off cooldown then next hit procs main hand, any hit after that with any of those things previously mentioned would proc off hand. Then it goes in a rotation based on the cooldown of the enchantments. As it stands now you can only proc the enchantment of the currently used bar anyway, this change came with Horns of the Reach, but I would still like to see, with that change in mind that both enchantments would proc more fairly.

Slick_007

the only time an offhand weapon should be able to proc is if the offhand weapon hit. from any ability (this is how main works yes?)

GreenSoup2HoT

Only DW Abilities should be able to proc the off-hand Enchantment

I'd love for Hidden Blade to proc my off-hand reliably. Would give me a reason to use it.

leepalmer95

You'd have to half dw enchant in that case.

They both do proc otherwise my off hand wouldn't need charging.

Dr.NRG

Other

This thread is simpy BS. DW does proc both enchants! You heavy attck it procs both, you light att it prcos with whatever weapon hits. The only thing that does not work is you cant stack some enchants such as weapon dmg glyphs.

Slick_007

leepalmer95 wrote: »

You'd have to half dw enchant in that case.

They both do proc otherwise my off hand wouldn't need charging.

i dont think thats in dispute. i think the question is if you use an ability that just uses main hand, if thats on cd, should it use the proc from offhand. to me, the answer is no. whichever weapon hits should proc. and abilities should be made to use whatever you got.
so if you use a class ability it will use whatever weapons you got. so it will have a staff attack, a 2h attack, and a dw attack version etc

Avran_Sylt

@Dr.NRG @Slick_007

Currently weapon enchantments can proc independently of what weapon swings. Also, heavy attacks only proc one enchantment, not both.

Thogard

Other

Thogard wrote: »

OP, you don't know what you're talking about and you haven't done your research.

DW light attacks go in this order: Main, off, main, main, off, main (repeat). That's plenty of room for offhand enchant proc.

Furthermore, rending slashes and it's morphs will always proc the offhand weapon enchant.

Let it never be said that I can't admit when I'm wrong. Looks like I'm the one who doesn't be know what he's talking about. There'll be more testing I'll need to do.

It uses to be that the 10s procs couldn't be activated if they were in the offhand slot. Apparently the dmg shield was an exception, but that info was coming from someone else, not me. Curious to see if this is still true.

paulsimonps

Dr.NRG wrote: »

This thread is simpy BS. DW does proc both enchants! You heavy attck it procs both, you light att it prcos with whatever weapon hits. The only thing that does not work is you cant stack some enchants such as weapon dmg glyphs.

Your abilities, even those that use both weapons will only proc main hand, or at least most of them. Which is a problem.