Is Cheat Engine making a return

Bouldercleave

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People are going to cheat. Those same people will stab you in the back IRL to get ahead - it's just life. I've never played a game; single player or MMO, that someone didn't figure out a way to get an edge.

There is only so much you can do.

Your defeatist attitude does not apply here. There is a lot ZOS can do mitigate cheating. If everyone demanded they take cheating as seriously as Valve and Blizzard do, they would probably comply.

My "realist" attitude (not defeatist) knows that the people that cheat are going to find a way to cheat. I'm all for banning, shaming, etc, but the TRUTH of the matter is someone who wants to cheat WILL find a way. It may be as simple as exploiting landscape mechanics, but they will find a way to exploit every advantage.

I don't know how long you have been around ZoS gaming, but I can tell you that if everyone DEMANDED they take it seriously, it would simply go ignored like it is now. This is not a Blizzard game and never will be.

Yeah someone finds a way and they get permabanned, not a 3-day warning "discipline action".

That's not a "realist attitude" that's definitely a defeatist attitude. We all know that people will try to cheat but we want cheaters to be banned permanently from the first attempt to cheat.

re·al·ist
ˈrēəlist/Submit
noun
1.
a person who accepts a situation as it is and is prepared to deal with it accordingly.
"I am a realist, with no time for your world of make believe"



de·feat·ist
dəˈfēdəst/Submit
noun
noun: defeatist; plural noun: defeatists
1.
a person who expects or is excessively ready to accept failure.
synonyms: pessimist, fatalist, cynic, prophet of doom, doomster



Yeah, I'm the first one.....

hmsdragonfly

Bouldercleave wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People are going to cheat. Those same people will stab you in the back IRL to get ahead - it's just life. I've never played a game; single player or MMO, that someone didn't figure out a way to get an edge.

There is only so much you can do.

Your defeatist attitude does not apply here. There is a lot ZOS can do mitigate cheating. If everyone demanded they take cheating as seriously as Valve and Blizzard do, they would probably comply.

My "realist" attitude (not defeatist) knows that the people that cheat are going to find a way to cheat. I'm all for banning, shaming, etc, but the TRUTH of the matter is someone who wants to cheat WILL find a way. It may be as simple as exploiting landscape mechanics, but they will find a way to exploit every advantage.

I don't know how long you have been around ZoS gaming, but I can tell you that if everyone DEMANDED they take it seriously, it would simply go ignored like it is now. This is not a Blizzard game and never will be.

Yeah someone finds a way and they get permabanned, not a 3-day warning "discipline action".

That's not a "realist attitude" that's definitely a defeatist attitude. We all know that people will try to cheat but we want cheaters to be banned permanently from the first attempt to cheat.

re·al·ist
ˈrēəlist/Submit
noun
1.
a person who accepts a situation as it is and is prepared to deal with it accordingly.
"I am a realist, with no time for your world of make believe"

defeatist
dɪˈfiːtɪst/Submit
noun
1.
a person who expects or is excessively ready to accept failure.

Although I don't support your point of view, I take my words back, that was rude, my apology. I don't support the attitude "nah people will always cheat we have to live with that", I refuse to play in an environment that is easy to be exploited by cheaters, that's why I stopped playing CSGO and moved to Overwatch. I am not changing my view either, we need to push ZOS to be more active in finding cheaters to ban them.

hmsdragonfly

Bouldercleave wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

People are going to cheat. Those same people will stab you in the back IRL to get ahead - it's just life. I've never played a game; single player or MMO, that someone didn't figure out a way to get an edge.

There is only so much you can do.

Your defeatist attitude does not apply here. There is a lot ZOS can do mitigate cheating. If everyone demanded they take cheating as seriously as Valve and Blizzard do, they would probably comply.

My "realist" attitude (not defeatist) knows that the people that cheat are going to find a way to cheat. I'm all for banning, shaming, etc, but the TRUTH of the matter is someone who wants to cheat WILL find a way. It may be as simple as exploiting landscape mechanics, but they will find a way to exploit every advantage.

I don't know how long you have been around ZoS gaming, but I can tell you that if everyone DEMANDED they take it seriously, it would simply go ignored like it is now. This is not a Blizzard game and never will be.

Yeah someone finds a way and they get permabanned, not a 3-day warning "discipline action".

That's not a "realist attitude" that's definitely a defeatist attitude. We all know that people will try to cheat but we want cheaters to be banned permanently from the first attempt to cheat.

re·al·ist
ˈrēəlist/Submit
noun
1.
a person who accepts a situation as it is and is prepared to deal with it accordingly.
"I am a realist, with no time for your world of make believe"



de·feat·ist
dəˈfēdəst/Submit
noun
noun: defeatist; plural noun: defeatists
1.
a person who expects or is excessively ready to accept failure.
synonyms: pessimist, fatalist, cynic, prophet of doom, doomster



Yeah, I'm the first one.....

No offence, but your point was "nah people will always cheat we have to live with that", so the second one is more correct.
"Some people will always try to cheat" is a realist attitude.
"Some people will always try to cheat so there's nothing we can do" is a defeatist attitude. There are things we can do, keep pushing ZOS to be more active in combating against cheaters.

Again, no offence.

Octopuss

How can you be so sure cheaters weren't ever banned?

snakester320

Even though it's against tos they should only IF found guilty should be named and shamed far to long has scammers and botters been aloud to get away with shady stuff with out repercussions only to move on to the next victim!

While this isn't a fix it's step in the right direction and ZOS should publish the names of these players themselves!! It's not like you have multiple servers with multiple names to deal with!!

KingMagaw

Octopuss wrote: »

How can you be so sure cheaters weren't ever banned?

Because people who were well known for Cheating - Cant name or i will be suspended again, but LegendaryS**y who was suspended multiple times, then there was ZoS letting players back who emailed them saying there is no software on there computer now and welcome to scan it.


Its the new players to the game that cant reference what happened in ESO years simply because of the forum mods here sweep away any negative topic on them, regardless if giving constructive feedback or not. Players got fed up and exposed Cheat Engine and what it could actually do.

ZoS has yet to address this. They dont even reply to tagging employees in the Cheating and Exploiting thread in over a year. Its proven ZoS lets Gold Sellers and Exploiters back into ESO after being caught (I use this term loosely because it is players driving most of the bans on exploiters, not ZoS). Ask yourself why this is.


@Bouldercleave - You can call yourself anything but acting like its a problem that cant be addressed is stupid. Will it take another decent lad to fly around Cyrodill to shame you fools in how bad this problem is? Easier to keep the head in the sand.

Lastly - your only exposed to what you know. Dont be fooled you have seen or know all/most glitches or exploits in ESO.

Phantorang

Seems to be very hard for ZOS to take real action against cheaters, problem with this is the message it sends to the community:

"If you cheat and we catch you, its not certain we ban you, and we for sure does not perma ban you, we will give you unlimited chances"

ZOS should at least permaban accounts caught cheating 3 times, if someone is caught that many times, there is zero chance they will ever stop cheating.

Its just very frustrating to know ZOS is so weak with cheaters, it ruins the experience, it does not help to put a cheater on ignore, you know the cheater is there no matter what you do, its only ZOS who can resolve the issue, with firm action.

Elsonso

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

It's not about developing and implementing some crazy hardware ban systems, it's about you actually permaban cheaters who you are sure that they are cheating. This is not a shooter, there's no excuse that "nah this guy just has insane aim", if you have more regen than your gear and your passives provide you are definitely cheating, if you are having dodge chance without shuffle/mirage you are cheating, if you light attack exactly 0.6969 seconds after every skills consistently, you are cheating. ZOS can tell how much gold players have, what sets that are popular and what skills people are using, so they definitely can tell if someone is cheating. It's just a question if you permaban those d***** or you don't. As far as I know, ZOS did ban cheaters permanently and that's what they should continue to do.

The detection of what you are talking about requires programmers that will write the software necessary to detect it... money.

Ultimately, I think it is the lack of money that is the issue. The amount they are spending on security is well below what is required to meet the level of infringement.

A huge problem seems to be that ZOS has a tendency to get it wrong. They might be able to tell when someone is cheating, but they have a problem telling when someone is not. This leads to reports of innocents being banned, and in the appeals that come from that, claims from guilty people that they got unbanned.

Phantorang wrote: »

ZOS should at least permaban accounts caught cheating 3 times, if someone is caught that many times, there is zero chance they will ever stop cheating.

What ZOS says is that, depending on the level of infraction, it is Warning the first time, Suspension the second time, then a Ban. What ZOS actually does is between them and the player.

I do have to say that I am less concerned about who gets warnings, suspensions, and bans, and by what criteria these are used, than I am about the fact that they appear to take so long to get around to using them that the players benefit royally from the cheating before ZOS wanders by and slaps them. Timeliness in addressing this is a bigger issue to me than the punishment they use.

I probably feel this way because it is the automated farmer bots that bug me the most. For them, a month of farming is worth a lot more than the account.

alainjbrennanb16_ESO

yep its still there in all its glory, all zos need to do is make the game sever based and not client side and put a anti cheat shield guard on, which scans your system first and keeps scanning when playing its not that hard

DeathHouseInc

So the game is pretty much worthless as far as any competitive play goes?...wonderful. Guess I will just do the PVE story lines and move on.

Elsonso

DeathHouseInc wrote: »

So the game is pretty much worthless as far as any competitive play goes?

This game cannot be used for a e-Sport, and the competitive play has to be just for fun, not seriously competitive. You have to be able to accept that people are going to cheat at this game and that the game itself could be working against you in both balance and performance. The game is for casual entertainment purposes. It will never rise to any level of serious competitive play.

Yeah, they might take some measures to improve things, but such measures will be for the benefit of casual competition, not serious competitive play.

ESO is the sort of competitive play you see among a group of friends at a Saturday gaming party.

You are never going to see the Elder Scrolls Online Championship Battleground Tournament happen.

Doctordarkspawn

KingMagaw wrote: »

Octopuss wrote: »

How can you be so sure cheaters weren't ever banned?

Because people who were well known for Cheating - Cant name or i will be suspended again, but LegendaryS**y who was suspended multiple times, then there was ZoS letting players back who emailed them saying there is no software on there computer now and welcome to scan it.


Its the new players to the game that cant reference what happened in ESO years simply because of the forum mods here sweep away any negative topic on them, regardless if giving constructive feedback or not. Players got fed up and exposed Cheat Engine and what it could actually do.

ZoS has yet to address this. They dont even reply to tagging employees in the Cheating and Exploiting thread in over a year. Its proven ZoS lets Gold Sellers and Exploiters back into ESO after being caught (I use this term loosely because it is players driving most of the bans on exploiters, not ZoS). Ask yourself why this is.


@Bouldercleave - You can call yourself anything but acting like its a problem that cant be addressed is stupid. Will it take another decent lad to fly around Cyrodill to shame you fools in how bad this problem is? Easier to keep the head in the sand.

Lastly - your only exposed to what you know. Dont be fooled you have seen or know all/most glitches or exploits in ESO.

There's no real use arguing with him, he's just going to resort to personal attacks if he responds at all.

For what it's worth, I think cheating is a problem that needs to be adressed, but I dont count on ZOS to do it. With a history of ignoring feedback, what the hell can I trust them to do at the best of times?

Demycilian

DeathHouseInc wrote: »

So the game is pretty much worthless as far as any competitive play goes?...wonderful. Guess I will just do the PVE story lines and move on.

Pretty much. Theres no competitive scene in ESO as its a complete farce. The game is all about being eye candy.

Phantorang

The problem for me with cheating like this, is that I dont want to invest any money into buying stuff when I know I at any time can get fed up of all the cheaters around, and just move on, thus waste money.

If I were confident ZOS did everything they could, and we saw some real and firm action against cheaters and exploiters, it would be a lot easier to spend some money and support the game.

It seems though that ZOS dont think its worth it to go after cheaters in a serious way. Cheating has been a huge problem since launch, which means if ZOS has not taken any serious action by now, they are not going to do it either.

For some reason ZOS is convinced it does not pay off economically to go firmly after the cheaters, or else they would have done it by now.

Bouldercleave

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

KingMagaw wrote: »

Octopuss wrote: »

How can you be so sure cheaters weren't ever banned?

Because people who were well known for Cheating - Cant name or i will be suspended again, but LegendaryS**y who was suspended multiple times, then there was ZoS letting players back who emailed them saying there is no software on there computer now and welcome to scan it.


Its the new players to the game that cant reference what happened in ESO years simply because of the forum mods here sweep away any negative topic on them, regardless if giving constructive feedback or not. Players got fed up and exposed Cheat Engine and what it could actually do.

ZoS has yet to address this. They dont even reply to tagging employees in the Cheating and Exploiting thread in over a year. Its proven ZoS lets Gold Sellers and Exploiters back into ESO after being caught (I use this term loosely because it is players driving most of the bans on exploiters, not ZoS). Ask yourself why this is.


@Bouldercleave - You can call yourself anything but acting like its a problem that cant be addressed is stupid. Will it take another decent lad to fly around Cyrodill to shame you fools in how bad this problem is? Easier to keep the head in the sand.

Lastly - your only exposed to what you know. Dont be fooled you have seen or know all/most glitches or exploits in ESO.

There's no real use arguing with him, he's just going to resort to personal attacks if he responds at all.

For what it's worth, I think cheating is a problem that needs to be adressed, but I dont count on ZOS to do it. With a history of ignoring feedback, what the hell can I trust them to do at the best of times?

Nope @Doctordarkspawn , I reserve the personal attacks for just you. It gives me great joy because I know that I annoy the crap out of you..

The bottom line is that it appears that ZoS has done all that they are going to do to address the botters and cheaters. No one is getting Perma banned, the botters still roam freely, and we still come here and wail against the deaf wall of ZoS.

Is that Defeatist? Maybe. But after 3 years of it, I have accepted it as the reality of this game. When that becomes too tiresome - I'll move on. To take it (or ANY game) any more serious than that is plain idiotic.