Don't Understand Planar Inhibitor Mechanics on Vet!

bhagwad

Today I decided to try vet WGT on my tank with a PUG (Dungeon Finder), since I figured out how to beat it in normal. Predictably, the biggest problem was the Planar Inhibitor, but I on normal, this strategy works.:

1. I (the tank) grab the pinion. Hold it until it's blue
2. Then player B takes the pinion.
3. As soon as it's available, I take the pinion back. Rinse and repeat.
4. When my screen goes black and white, I switch to a bow and 1 or 2 shot the portals.

End of story. This also works on Dungeon Finder PUGs because I only need to co-ordinate with 1 person (Player who has a mic. Otherwise, on console I have to painfully type out all the instructions. Generally, it takes 15 minutes for me to even type and explain the strategy on console.

On vet however, this fails miserably for the following reasons:

1. I start off by taking the pinion. I wait till the blue phase. So far so good.
2. Player B takes the pinion when it's about to turn blue. (If it actually turns blue, I seem to die within seconds).
3. THIS TIME however, when I take the pinion back from Player B, I end up dying almost instantly!

I thought that with player B taking the pinion, the DoT on me would be reset. But no! As soon as I grab the pinion after player B, I take hundreds of thousands of damage.

To make matters worse:

1. My bow is no longer enough to one or two shot the portals. I take around 8 seconds to kill a single portal with a bow.
2. There are simply too many of them for me to handle. Much more than on normal.

So question - how do I adapt to killing the Planar Inhibitor on vet WGT as a tank? How do the mechanics work? Why do I die to heat stroke after I take the pinion back from player B? Does the DoT not "reset" once someone else takes the pinion? Why am I able to easily beat this on normal? What is happening here??

Also, I need to take into consideration that PUG groups on Dungeon Finder will probably not have people with mics. I need a strategy where I only need to coordinate with maybe 1 or 2 more people. Today I spent 2 hrs in vet WGT painfully typing instructions on console, trying to coordinate since the others didn't have mics. I had to actually stop taking the inhibitor to open up the console text screen and say "Take the pinion now!".

How do you guys do it as a tank with PUGs?

UrbanMonk

@bhagwad -
1. Anyone can take pinion. It doesn't have to be Tank.
2. You don't hold pinion on 1 person till it goes blue. You switch pinion between players as soon as they are open again. Longer the wait, more intense heat stroke becomes.
3. On blue phase just run to the longer end of room. That should give enough time for pinion to reopen and someone else to grab it.
4. Bring a DD gear setup for this fight as a tank. You really don't Tank this boss. She has 3-4 damage skills which does fairly low damage which can be healed. The main boss to handle here is pinion. So on your tank, with DD setup u can easily close portals in one sho or 2. You can choose to run Bow with LA+ poison combo or 2H with Crit rush. Both work fine.
5. For the Moth Vision phase, portal management is really important. If healer gets it, then other players should have enough survivability to stay alive or keep others alive for 15 sec. DO NOT LET THOSE ADDS COME OUT.
6. And last if you have enough burst damage you can ignore all mechanics and burst the boss even before she goes to blue phase. We usually do this with all 4 of us switching to DD and go ham on her. But this takes a lot of practise.

Hope this helps.

Magdalina

The strat you mentioned(tank holds til blue, swap and back to tank) is viable on vet but only in groups with rather high dps(and good heals). The DoT on you resets after the blue phase, once the Planar falls down on the ground and stays there for a few seconds. The DoT will keep stacking on the person holding the boss as long as the pinion is open until then(you won't get more DoT if you don't have agro but you will keep the old DoT and get more DoT the second you close pinion). If your dps is high enough(I can't tell you exact numbers but something like 20k+ each dps at least), this is not much of an issue because she will generally reset before you inevitably die(healer can only do so much when Heat Stroke starts ticking for like 20k+ a tick, plus if healer gets portal healing you becomes much harder as they also need to kill portals).

If your dps is not high enough, no biggie, just slot some dps-y gear/skills(you do need some dps as a tank there. I know a lot of tanks bring separate dps setup just for this, but honestly I've been able to do it just fine in my tanky setup with slotting DW and jesus beaming the portals on my 45k health templar. Sometimes 1 or 2 ads got through but that's no biggie. Keep in mind than once she's low on health there will be moar portals but also 2 people will be able to close them) and trade pinion with everyone else. That way, the idea is to never let the pinion stay open. Remember, the longer it stays open, the more of the DoT it will put on the person having opened it last and it can and will majorly screw you over eventually. So basically, if you see it open and don't have portals, go close it. It should never be open for more than a few seconds. This is especially true in blue phase where she will annihilate whoever she is on eventually(but you probably know this already).

Edit: Also it's a pug killer boss because pugs refuse to take pinion or kill portals 90% of time and noting you say and no amount of dying can convince them otherwise. However it's not a hard boss at all with a half decent group that's capable of listening to each other(textchat works for that). They're nerfing it next patch which imo is silly. It's been nerfed like 10 times already, high time people start following the mechanics>.<

bhagwad

Thanks for the strats guys. I didn't know that the DoT DOESN'T reset after you lose aggro. Yes, I can see why this would be a problem in PUGs. I guess I'm also going to have to learn how to DPS a bit on my DK, because all I know is tanking and I have no weapon damage skills or spell damage stats...

kylewwefan

When blue phase, run to other side of room. The someone else picks up the pinion and runs to other side of room. Then someone else picks up the pinion and runs to other side of room.

You can use chains on pinion if DK tank. Or fully charged heavy Bow attack should do the trick. Or maybe fire you Bow like a machine gun.

Used to tank and healer take pinion in turn so not get portals.

Reverb

I can do the tank method you mentioned in vet on my Templar tank, but not my traditional DK tank. My Templar has the self heals to get through the heatstroke dot, and Jesus Beam for the portals, and I wait 2 pinion swap cycles to take it back. With good dps, that's the only time I have to drop the boss, and she's dead before the next blue phase.

On my DK I have to switch to a dps setup and have the group alternate portals equally, or between me and the healer. You may want to consider trying that strategy.

jaws343

One thing to keep in mind regarding mics: Players do not need mics to listen to what is being said in chat. Just ask everyone to join group chat and they can at least hear you.

That fight is definitely hard to PUG. I have found that the more my group struggles on that fight, the more they end up struggling on the Molag Kena fight. It may take a few tries but it is very satisfying to finish it with a PUG. Now, ICP is a dungeon that I have never beaten in a PUG. Most groups barely make it through the Overfiend and if they do, the mechanics of the Flesh Sculptor seem to throw everyone off.

Qbiken

If you´ve enough dps (around 42-45k/dd) you can bypass the mechanics xD

bhagwad

Qbiken wrote: »

If you´ve enough dps (around 42-45k/dd) you can bypass the mechanics xD

This is with a PUG. I've noticed that the group DPS is around 10-15k...

Drummerx04

There is a neat little mechanic which is slightly harder to notice. The moth vision allowing you to kill portals is randomly assigned to anyone NOT holding the pinion. If you try the pure tanking method, your team DOES NOT pick up the pinion as soon as it turns blue. Instead, they grab it once the portals vision mechanic is assigned. Which is around 5-8 seconds after blue phase.

Using this slight tanking modification you don't even have to worry about portals as tank.

Unfortunately, this requires your team to know the specific strategy.

Sunah

You need more weapon damage if you are not one shotting the portals. Use poisen injection if you have to.. most bow users use that for that phase.

bhagwad

Sunah wrote: »

You need more weapon damage if you are not one shotting the portals. Use poisen injection if you have to.. most bow users use that for that phase.

Thanks for the advice!

SirCritical

Maybe an useful advice: when NOT in blue phase, you shouldn't run around, just keep the boss standing in the same position, for your AoE attacks to be more effective.

Magdalina

Drummerx04 wrote: »

There is a neat little mechanic which is slightly harder to notice. The moth vision allowing you to kill portals is randomly assigned to anyone NOT holding the pinion. If you try the pure tanking method, your team DOES NOT pick up the pinion as soon as it turns blue. Instead, they grab it once the portals vision mechanic is assigned. Which is around 5-8 seconds after blue phase.

Using this slight tanking modification you don't even have to worry about portals as tank.

Unfortunately, this requires your team to know the specific strategy.

That's a sensible idea but it still implies your team has enough dps and heals to push Planar to blue before tank dies. This is normally not the case in pugs so it's easier for tank to grab some dps and trade pinion with everyone.

xRIVALENx

If you are a DK you can still hold the pinion until the blue phase easily enough, just slot a self heal and Magma Shell. Ideally your group members will swap the pinion but PUGS aren't always ideal. As for the portals I always found using a Destruction Staff and slotting force pulse to be much more efficient on the portals than the bow.

Drummerx04

Magdalina wrote: »

Drummerx04 wrote: »

There is a neat little mechanic which is slightly harder to notice. The moth vision allowing you to kill portals is randomly assigned to anyone NOT holding the pinion. If you try the pure tanking method, your team DOES NOT pick up the pinion as soon as it turns blue. Instead, they grab it once the portals vision mechanic is assigned. Which is around 5-8 seconds after blue phase.

Using this slight tanking modification you don't even have to worry about portals as tank.

Unfortunately, this requires your team to know the specific strategy.

That's a sensible idea but it still implies your team has enough dps and heals to push Planar to blue before tank dies. This is normally not the case in pugs so it's easier for tank to grab some dps and trade pinion with everyone.

This doesn't require a burn from 100% to 0% before blue phase. The dot actually caps out at around 10k dps, so with some self heals/shields + healer help you can survive it. Tank will have to run around a little during blue, but after portals show up, aggro gets taken by another member so you don't get 100% snared and then instant killed by boss oblivion damage.

Then you just repeat. This is a good option for a tank/healer duo that is decent if your pug dps is kind of bad.

pizzaow

The advice above is the "right" way to do this, but if you're struggling you might want to try the "tank sacrifice" strategy.

With this strategy you hold the pinion until you die. You should be able to keep the boss in one spot until the blue phase, then run to the edge the room until she kills you. The 2 players without portals will alternate pinion until the end of the blue phase (which should be 1 grab each). When the boss goes down, one player will rez you, then its just rinse & repeat. Using this technique you will never get portals, and it's much easier on the healer since they won't have to keep you alive throughout the blue phase.

Again, it's not the ideal way, but it's better than not finishing

On a side note, for portal closing you might want to try a gap closer like shielded assault. If the assault isn't enough damage an additional light attack should do the trick.

bhagwad

pizzaow wrote: »

The advice above is the "right" way to do this, but if you're struggling you might want to try the "tank sacrifice" strategy.

With this strategy you hold the pinion until you die. You should be able to keep the boss in one spot until the blue phase, then run to the edge the room until she kills you. The 2 players without portals will alternate pinion until the end of the blue phase (which should be 1 grab each). When the boss goes down, one player will rez you, then its just rinse & repeat. Using this technique you will never get portals, and it's much easier on the healer since they won't have to keep you alive throughout the blue phase.

Again, it's not the ideal way, but it's better than not finishing

On a side note, for portal closing you might want to try a gap closer like shielded assault. If the assault isn't enough damage an additional light attack should do the trick.

Thanks for that advice! I'll try it next time.

DIAB33TUZ

Use purge

code65536

DIAB33TUZ wrote: »

Use purge

Pretty sure that Heat Stroke is unpurgeable. (None of the effects in the game that are designed to make you respect mechanics are purgeable.)

max_only

So many people don't understand this fight.

Once while tanking this she kept slowing and stunning me. No burst from healer. No one else taking the pinion. A Dps got mad at me for getting stunned and dying. When we finished the dungeon without that person I asked in zone what that was all about and they legit told me I had to use immovability potions for that fight. Lol?! Weak dps is so used to strong dps bursting her down quickly that they never had to learn mechanics and team work.

pizzaow

max_only wrote: »

they legit told me I had to use immovability potions for that fight.

Wait, does this work?.. I thought the slow/stun from blue phase was unavoidable. Will immovable pots allow me to kite the boss the entire time?

I do agree with you max_only, I've never run with a tank who used immovable pots for this fight... it's definitely not the norm. The only way I've survived the blue phase was to either use the wall glitch or on a sorc with streak (with clever use of first-person).

Magdalina

pizzaow wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

they legit told me I had to use immovability potions for that fight.

Wait, does this work?.. I thought the slow/stun from blue phase was unavoidable. Will immovable pots allow me to kite the boss the entire time?

I do agree with you max_only, I've never run with a tank who used immovable pots for this fight... it's definitely not the norm. The only way I've survived the blue phase was to either use the wall glitch or on a sorc with streak (with clever use of first-person).

Immov pots make you immune to hard cc. Snare is soft cc(besides being a mechanical snare, not just a skill-related one, so you aren't gonna cleanse it or anything either). I mean I haven't personally tested this but I see no reason that it'd work.

Only way you're kiting her all the way through blue phase is on a streaking sorc(don't need first person for this either I think ).

max_only

pizzaow wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

they legit told me I had to use immovability potions for that fight.

Wait, does this work?.. I thought the slow/stun from blue phase was unavoidable. Will immovable pots allow me to kite the boss the entire time?

I do agree with you max_only, I've never run with a tank who used immovable pots for this fight... it's definitely not the norm. The only way I've survived the blue phase was to either use the wall glitch or on a sorc with streak (with clever use of first-person).

Immovability potions don't work. It's just an example of how clueless people are about boss mechanics because they've been carried the whole time without realizing it.

Kanar

I've only rarely gotten past planar inhibitor with pugs. Next time I will try this strategy: two people (healer and tank) alternate pinion, grabbing it as soon as it opens. Other two (damage dealers) have portal priority and then of course doing boss damage. I think this will work better because it gives clear responsibility (everyone knows their role) and also in pugs tanks and healers seem to not have the right skills for killing portals.

Two important observations I've made, which I think are true: 1 the pinion does damage when it's open; it should always be closed. 2 the more you have the pinion, the less likely that you will get portals

QuebraRegra

bhagwad wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

If you´ve enough dps (around 42-45k/dd) you can bypass the mechanics xD

This is with a PUG. I've noticed that the group DPS is around 10-15k...

holy F!@&amp;#^%~?? only 15k for the whole group!?!?! LOL! wow... that would not go well.

as a side note, I was always told that the healer does NOT pick up the orb... a good healer keeps the tank alive thru the blue phase. A MAGBLADE healer can also close portals with their xtra DPS.

Kanar

QuebraRegra wrote: »

bhagwad wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

If you´ve enough dps (around 42-45k/dd) you can bypass the mechanics xD

This is with a PUG. I've noticed that the group DPS is around 10-15k...

holy F!@&amp;#^%~?? only 15k for the whole group!?!?! LOL! wow... that would not go well.

as a side note, I was always told that the healer does NOT pick up the orb... a good healer keeps the tank alive thru the blue phase. A MAGBLADE healer can also close portals with their xtra DPS.

I think that healer advice is one cause of troubles for pugs. I've never seen a healer able to keep the tank alive through a whole blue phase, or a healer able to keep the whole group alive while simultaneously closing portals fast enough.
Taking the pinion is the easy role, and it prevents you from getting portals.

Magdalina

Kanar wrote: »

I've only rarely gotten past planar inhibitor with pugs. Next time I will try this strategy: two people (healer and tank) alternate pinion, grabbing it as soon as it opens. Other two (damage dealers) have portal priority and then of course doing boss damage. I think this will work better because it gives clear responsibility (everyone knows their role) and also in pugs tanks and healers seem to not have the right skills for killing portals.

Two important observations I've made, which I think are true: 1 the pinion does damage when it's open; it should always be closed. 2 the more you have the pinion, the less likely that you will get portals

That usually goes worse with pugs:/ One of the 2 closing pinion will eventually get portal duty and pinion will stay open forever because the other 2 won't think to pick it up. You will also have pretty high dot between the 2 of you probably.

You just really need people capable of reading and understanding what they read. I usually just tell them "When pinion opens whoever is closest CLOSES IT, it should NEVER stay open". You really only need like 5k dps to kill portals. I've gotten portals there as a 40-50k health tank a lot, it's very possible.

bhagwad

Magdalina wrote: »

Kanar wrote: »

I've only rarely gotten past planar inhibitor with pugs. Next time I will try this strategy: two people (healer and tank) alternate pinion, grabbing it as soon as it opens. Other two (damage dealers) have portal priority and then of course doing boss damage. I think this will work better because it gives clear responsibility (everyone knows their role) and also in pugs tanks and healers seem to not have the right skills for killing portals.

Two important observations I've made, which I think are true: 1 the pinion does damage when it's open; it should always be closed. 2 the more you have the pinion, the less likely that you will get portals

That usually goes worse with pugs:/ One of the 2 closing pinion will eventually get portal duty and pinion will stay open forever because the other 2 won't think to pick it up. You will also have pretty high dot between the 2 of you probably.

You just really need people capable of reading and understanding what they read. I usually just tell them "When pinion opens whoever is closest CLOSES IT, it should NEVER stay open". You really only need like 5k dps to kill portals. I've gotten portals there as a 40-50k health tank a lot, it's very possible.

I think this is a general problem with complicated dungeon mechanics. We need a strategy that is:

1. Easy to understand
2. Not too long to type (On console, it can take me 1 full minute to write a single sentence)
3. Doesn't require "on the fly" prompts during the fight. I can't stop tanking a boss/avoiding AoE to open my console window and take 10 seconds to type "Now!"
4. Allocates a clear line of action at every point during the fight without needing prompts.

We all know that the Inhibitor can be killed using groups with mic and coordination. The idea is to find a strategy that can work without mics, without real time communication, and that is easy to understand.

Jawasa

The problem with planar inhibitor is that one or two bad players can realy wipe the group especially dd's. So playing this boss as a healer in pugs can be bad. But now most pugs on PC EU can complete both vwgt, vicp, vcos (non hm) the new dungeons and vrom will probably see pugs struggel.