Why are MagPlars Perma-Op even after dozens of nerf's?

Jamascus

WTF are you talking about? Magplars are not OP. Mudcrabs are.

Brutusmax1mus

DeHei wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Every single update people claim "Templars OP". But exact same people don't play Templar/don't have experience of playing Templar; because just when they trying to play this "op" class, they stomped constantly/unable to kill any decent enemy/can't do absolutely anything solo.
And always they ending to not play this "op" class because they "don't like such style", or just playing a healbot nanny for group; yet still trying to claim how strong this class is.
Thats why everytime i hear that templar is one of strongest class it cause nothing but laugh.

Nearly everytime i find a enemy Templar, who starts spaming puncturing sweep to me, i am happy to have an easy to kill target... Everybody else with think the same...

What platform do you play on

DeHei

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

DeHei wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Every single update people claim "Templars OP". But exact same people don't play Templar/don't have experience of playing Templar; because just when they trying to play this "op" class, they stomped constantly/unable to kill any decent enemy/can't do absolutely anything solo.
And always they ending to not play this "op" class because they "don't like such style", or just playing a healbot nanny for group; yet still trying to claim how strong this class is.
Thats why everytime i hear that templar is one of strongest class it cause nothing but laugh.

Nearly everytime i find a enemy Templar, who starts spaming puncturing sweep to me, i am happy to have an easy to kill target... Everybody else with think the same...

What platform do you play on

PC/EU

DisgracefulMind

Bonzodog01 wrote: »

Magplars are not OP, they certainly take a LOT more skill to play in PvP than they used to. In PvE, yes, they can faceroll the game with one button push and nothing more.

But in PvP, it now requires a decent rotation, keeping your range and dodge-rolling till the cows come home (and thats on a full magicka build with only 10K stamina.....). Guess where we are having to put CP? yeah, in the star that reduces cost of dodge-rolling as much as possible.

BoL is no longer the go-to heal.

A magplar rotation is more likely to be - Ritual of Retribution (places a DoT on enemy), Jav x 2, Heavy attack, switch bar, grand healing, switch bar, sweeps until mag almost drained, heavy attack, switch bar for grand healing, back to main bar, and so on and on...

-___________-

CatchMeTrolling

I'd like to add to this since most like to comment on group support for Templar's.

Wardens are the better overall choice for support not Templars.

Drdeath20

Subversus wrote: »

@Joy_Division lmfao are you serious? Did you really just fire the l2p shot at me? Literally all my stam classes run sword and board with reverb as their only stun ('xcept for my stamblade), my magblade runs incap. I've been playing this game for a LONG time, I don't need some Templar hero salty that his precious fotm class isn't fotm anymore trying to lecture me on how to play.

Your argument on how BoL is weak is just pure bias and ignorance. I am dueling templars every day, and not a single one heals for 2k.

And please, telling me to run defile to counter a Templar when you yourself said that you purge the debuff right before healing? Mate just drop it, breath of life did get nerfed and I agree on that, but calling it weak? You know very well yourself that it isn't weak.

Oh yeah and let's not forget about purge, the single most overpowered skill in the whole game. Templars may be weak open world, but that's pretty much it.

Purge is the single most ovetpowered skill in the whole game??

Allright ill bite. How do you figure?

Kay1

They are not OP.

They are very good in duels, especially in duels and they are a big cancer at zerging.

In solo PvP the most skilled magplars struggle to 1v3.

DeHei

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

@Joy_Division lmfao are you serious? Did you really just fire the l2p shot at me? Literally all my stam classes run sword and board with reverb as their only stun ('xcept for my stamblade), my magblade runs incap. I've been playing this game for a LONG time, I don't need some Templar hero salty that his precious fotm class isn't fotm anymore trying to lecture me on how to play.

Your argument on how BoL is weak is just pure bias and ignorance. I am dueling templars every day, and not a single one heals for 2k.

And please, telling me to run defile to counter a Templar when you yourself said that you purge the debuff right before healing? Mate just drop it, breath of life did get nerfed and I agree on that, but calling it weak? You know very well yourself that it isn't weak.

Oh yeah and let's not forget about purge, the single most overpowered skill in the whole game. Templars may be weak open world, but that's pretty much it.

Purge is the single most ovetpowered skill in the whole game??

Allright ill bite. How do you figure?

Isnt overpowered. Do a duell against some good Stamina DKs for example, then you can press your purge every 2 seconds... or you stop this and try to make pressure on the DK too... I prefer Ritual of Retribution, because its senseless trying to purge everything...

Kay1 wrote: »

They are not OP.

They are very good in duels, especially in duels and they are a big cancer at zerging.

In solo PvP the most skilled magplars struggle to 1v3.

I am really not bad with my Magplar, but "very good, especially in duells"??? The best guys from any class will allways beat the best Templar player... that is my experience!

Ariades_swe

Subversus wrote: »

@Joy_Division lmfao are you serious? Did you really just fire the l2p shot at me? Literally all my stam classes run sword and board with reverb as their only stun ('xcept for my stamblade), my magblade runs incap. I've been playing this game for a LONG time, I don't need some Templar hero salty that his precious fotm class isn't fotm anymore trying to lecture me on how to play.

Your argument on how BoL is weak is just pure bias and ignorance. I am dueling templars every day, and not a single one heals for 2k.

And please, telling me to run defile to counter a Templar when you yourself said that you purge the debuff right before healing? Mate just drop it, breath of life did get nerfed and I agree on that, but calling it weak? You know very well yourself that it isn't weak.

Oh yeah and let's not forget about purge, the single most overpowered skill in the whole game. Templars may be weak open world, but that's pretty much it.

This guy.
Moron of the week.
Congrats!

Telel

Have you tried stabbing them instead of firing your bow into the wall they're using to avoid your arrows?

That seems to be how templars avoid most of the 'damage' new players think they're doing.

Drdeath20

As a templar im too reliant on world skills

ataggs

Subversus wrote: »

@Joy_Division lmfao are you serious? Did you really just fire the l2p shot at me? Literally all my stam classes run sword and board with reverb as their only stun ('xcept for my stamblade), my magblade runs incap. I've been playing this game for a LONG time, I don't need some Templar hero salty that his precious fotm class isn't fotm anymore trying to lecture me on how to play.

Your argument on how BoL is weak is just pure bias and ignorance. I am dueling templars every day, and not a single one heals for 2k.

And please, telling me to run defile to counter a Templar when you yourself said that you purge the debuff right before healing? Mate just drop it, breath of life did get nerfed and I agree on that, but calling it weak? You know very well yourself that it isn't weak.

Oh yeah and let's not forget about purge, the single most overpowered skill in the whole game. Templars may be weak open world, but that's pretty much it.

I'm not sure who you are Subversus but when it comes to any class Joy Division is an authority. This is not just based on reputation , he literally tests everything. His most recent findings....pugs die in oil

Dr.NRG

Bad timing for this! Sit tight and wait untill tomorrow cause around 2pm CST we will see new balance changes as announced!

WhiteMage

ataggs wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

@Joy_Division lmfao are you serious? Did you really just fire the l2p shot at me? Literally all my stam classes run sword and board with reverb as their only stun ('xcept for my stamblade), my magblade runs incap. I've been playing this game for a LONG time, I don't need some Templar hero salty that his precious fotm class isn't fotm anymore trying to lecture me on how to play.

Your argument on how BoL is weak is just pure bias and ignorance. I am dueling templars every day, and not a single one heals for 2k.

And please, telling me to run defile to counter a Templar when you yourself said that you purge the debuff right before healing? Mate just drop it, breath of life did get nerfed and I agree on that, but calling it weak? You know very well yourself that it isn't weak.

Oh yeah and let's not forget about purge, the single most overpowered skill in the whole game. Templars may be weak open world, but that's pretty much it.

I'm not sure who you are Subversus but when it comes to any class Joy Division is an authority. This is not just based on reputation , he literally tests everything. His most recent findings....pugs die in oil

Can confirm: Pugs die in oils.

Grumble_and_Grunt

Subversus wrote: »

@Joy_Division lmfao are you serious? Did you really just fire the l2p shot at me? Literally all my stam classes run sword and board with reverb as their only stun ('xcept for my stamblade), my magblade runs incap. I've been playing this game for a LONG time, I don't need some Templar hero salty that his precious fotm class isn't fotm anymore trying to lecture me on how to play.

Your argument on how BoL is weak is just pure bias and ignorance. I am dueling templars every day, and not a single one heals for 2k.

And please, telling me to run defile to counter a Templar when you yourself said that you purge the debuff right before healing? Mate just drop it, breath of life did get nerfed and I agree on that, but calling it weak? You know very well yourself that it isn't weak.

Oh yeah and let's not forget about purge, the single most overpowered skill in the whole game. Templars may be weak open world, but that's pretty much it.

Emphasis on the bold. Because that's the majority of PvP believe it or not. Most people who go to PvP are going to be in Cyrodiil. So please stop crying all the time on the forums about duels, duels, duels. Duels and 1v1s will never be balanced because everything in this game has enough accessible hard counters to stalemate whatever dueling cheese build is all the rage at the moment. Surprised duels are even relevant anymore or that people even still care for balancing around them.

Literally every thread I read from you @Subversus is orientated around duels and I can respect that and some of what you say has carry over and I agree with, but the other half of it is just pure mindless QQ about how your probably 9000 weapon DMG HA stam build or 48738273891821 max magicka sorc can not kill a Templar or pet sorc and what not in a 1v1 scenario anymore.

Every class is strong in a 1v1 every class is weak in 1v1 so lets keep the balancing of sets, abilities and classes as a whole to open world PvP please, which it seems most forget the struggles of playing a Magplar open world this patch when they're not building for an absolute potato zerg healbot.

Ultimate_Overlord

@Grumble_and_Grunt Zergplar defender spotted

Grumble_and_Grunt

Ultimate_Overlord wrote: »

@Grumble_and_Grunt Zergplar defender spotted

Lol Putin, when was last time you touched your Templar? xD Probs still sitting in that white akaviri gear and Engine Guardian whilst you re roll in non vet PvP all the time xD?

Ultimate_Overlord

@Grumble_and_Grunt I wont feed your ego and tell you if you guessed right or not

Baconlad

Magplars arent weak. I feel that magplar has the best burst, or the best sustained damage. And many different ways to play. Most magplars build one way. Heavy armor, sweep spam, skoria, sword and board backbar. And when played that way, the defense is amazing since we rely on mitigating damage to armor, then healing up. Heavy armor passive work great on that.

But if you think outside the box, you can build a magplar that is incredibly bursty, to the point that if you forget to to counter one time, your toast...

Now...i will say i hate how much we rely on vampire. Take away my mist form and vamp damage reduction passives, i'd cry...

Vampires the only class line we really need...oh and a good class ultimate XD

DeHei

Baconlad wrote: »

Magplars arent weak. I feel that magplar has the best burst, or the best sustained damage. And many different ways to play. Most magplars build one way. Heavy armor, sweep spam, skoria, sword and board backbar. And when played that way, the defense is amazing since we rely on mitigating damage to armor, then healing up. Heavy armor passive work great on that.

But if you think outside the box, you can build a magplar that is incredibly bursty, to the point that if you forget to to counter one time, your toast...

Now...i will say i hate how much we rely on vampire. Take away my mist form and vamp damage reduction passives, i'd cry...

Vampires the only class line we really need...oh and a good class ultimate XD

Its true, we can do much burst, but other classes too. The difference, we dont have good CC options like the others! In PvP you need 3 things to have success: Survivalbility, Pressure and CC. Templar is very good in Survivalbility and Pressure, but on the other hand we nearly dont have good CC. Some use the vampirestun, some that from 1H+shield or that from lightningstaff. Dawnbreaker is a option, but nothing of that is a classskill. And pls forget charge or javelin, both are ok, but we would need a skill like blazing spear was with good damage, stun and flexible in practise.

Trinity_Is_My_Name

They are not OP.

Minno

Baconlad wrote: »

Magplars arent weak. I feel that magplar has the best burst, or the best sustained damage. And many different ways to play. Most magplars build one way. Heavy armor, sweep spam, skoria, sword and board backbar. And when played that way, the defense is amazing since we rely on mitigating damage to armor, then healing up. Heavy armor passive work great on that.

But if you think outside the box, you can build a magplar that is incredibly bursty, to the point that if you forget to to counter one time, your toast...

Now...i will say i hate how much we rely on vampire. Take away my mist form and vamp damage reduction passives, i'd cry...

Vampires the only class line we really need...oh and a good class ultimate XD

I always felt our resto tree directly countered the benefits of vamp:
- resto staff+ resto tree we can get 15% extra healing under 30% health. And another 12% on low health via our resto passive. Vamp gives DMG mitigation, but my understanding it starts at 1% around the 50% Mark and you need to be at 1% health to get the full 33%. But the time you get 8% mitigation, it's possible we will be in execute range. Restoring rune gives us this buff for 1.5k mag quickly.
- we can get 8% mitigation+8% healing which are overshadowed by the 20-25% extra fire DMG for being vamp.
- ice staff allows for similar DMG mitigation through block but have access to healing which is turned off using mist form. Speed gained via pots or smuggler set which can use Sprint to run faster (purge to remove snares, two hander to give cheap snare immunity).

Only thing vamp gives us that we need, is the extra ulti generation/minor speed + undodgeable/unblocked cc stun via drain. Resto, unless rolling a HA vamplar, is much better for survivability/defense since all we need to do is purge the debuffs and not get caught with or pants down with a Zerg.

DeHei

Trinity_Is_My_Name wrote: »

They are not OP.

They are at the first 15 lvl
In endgame they are only strong as healer, but surely not OP.. you are right

Baconlad

Wtf is wrong with javelin anyway? I hear this often, but have always thought it a *** excuse. Javelin is fkn amazing. Blazing spear stun was much worse. Only thing it had going for it was to drop it on a choke when you were trying to LOS, without having to aim it at your target. Which javelin will do a better job getting ur target off of you anyway. Are you mad you dont have a stun that goes through block? Is that the problem?

You also mentioned other stuns that players use...so whats wrong with them? Do other classes not have to go outside their class to get buffs/ cc/ execute/ heals/ defense/ damage?
Thank god we arent dragonknights...who dont even get a magick execute at ALL...
All in all i think magplar is the most well rounded class, we can tank, heal, support, damage. Any multiple different ways of doing each. I would say as templar, we lack one thing we NEED. Thats is mobility. The game has shown that being able to be mobile and reset the fight is king in cyrodil atleast. And guess what! We get that too...through being a vampire. It would be nice to not have to rely on vamp...but im not gonna complain when other classes lack so much more than magplar do. We seriously get to have our cake and eat it too.

Strongest spec in game? Nah. Deff not. But you take a player who knows what hes doing with the class, you can wreck any spec in game.

Magplar is great. Dont deny it. Im glad for being a templar over any other class. We have so many more (successful) build options/ playstyles, no class can compete with us

DeHei

Baconlad wrote: »

Wtf is wrong with javelin anyway? I hear this often, but have always thought it a *** excuse. Javelin is fkn amazing. Blazing spear stun was much worse. Only thing it had going for it was to drop it on a choke when you were trying to LOS, without having to aim it at your target. Which javelin will do a better job getting ur target off of you anyway. Are you mad you dont have a stun that goes through block? Is that the problem?

You also mentioned other stuns that players use...so whats wrong with them? Do other classes not have to go outside their class to get buffs/ cc/ execute/ heals/ defense/ damage?
Thank god we arent dragonknights...who dont even get a magick execute at ALL...
All in all i think magplar is the most well rounded class, we can tank, heal, support, damage. Any multiple different ways of doing each. I would say as templar, we lack one thing we NEED. Thats is mobility. The game has shown that being able to be mobile and reset the fight is king in cyrodil atleast. And guess what! We get that too...through being a vampire. It would be nice to not have to rely on vamp...but im not gonna complain when other classes lack so much more than magplar do. We seriously get to have our cake and eat it too.

Strongest spec in game? Nah. Deff not. But you take a player who knows what hes doing with the class, you can wreck any spec in game.

Magplar is great. Dont deny it. Im glad for being a templar over any other class. We have so many more (successful) build options/ playstyles, no class can compete with us

Dont understand me wrong. My main is templar, i play him since the beta and love this class. But i said allready that we need more CC possibilitys before the stun was gone and nobody thought about it. Javelin is a bad joke against that! A skill for low damage and just a low CC.. sry man i dont agree. When you really are a templarplayer, you will understand, that you only need skills which do more then 1 thing, because we allready need enough slots for surviving!
Just try that guys, everybody is talking, they are the strongest players in duell on there class, then you will never slot crapskills like javelin again...

Brutusmax1mus

DeHei wrote: »

Baconlad wrote: »

Wtf is wrong with javelin anyway? I hear this often, but have always thought it a *** excuse. Javelin is fkn amazing. Blazing spear stun was much worse. Only thing it had going for it was to drop it on a choke when you were trying to LOS, without having to aim it at your target. Which javelin will do a better job getting ur target off of you anyway. Are you mad you dont have a stun that goes through block? Is that the problem?

You also mentioned other stuns that players use...so whats wrong with them? Do other classes not have to go outside their class to get buffs/ cc/ execute/ heals/ defense/ damage?
Thank god we arent dragonknights...who dont even get a magick execute at ALL...
All in all i think magplar is the most well rounded class, we can tank, heal, support, damage. Any multiple different ways of doing each. I would say as templar, we lack one thing we NEED. Thats is mobility. The game has shown that being able to be mobile and reset the fight is king in cyrodil atleast. And guess what! We get that too...through being a vampire. It would be nice to not have to rely on vamp...but im not gonna complain when other classes lack so much more than magplar do. We seriously get to have our cake and eat it too.

Strongest spec in game? Nah. Deff not. But you take a player who knows what hes doing with the class, you can wreck any spec in game.

Magplar is great. Dont deny it. Im glad for being a templar over any other class. We have so many more (successful) build options/ playstyles, no class can compete with us

Dont understand me wrong. My main is templar, i play him since the beta and love this class. But i said allready that we need more CC possibilitys before the stun was gone and nobody thought about it. Javelin is a bad joke against that! A skill for low damage and just a low CC.. sry man i dont agree. When you really are a templarplayer, you will understand, that you only need skills which do more then 1 thing, because we allready need enough slots for surviving!
Just try that guys, everybody is talking, they are the strongest players in duell on there class, then you will never slot crapskills like javelin again...

I've got great success with javalin in cyro and bg. Using it to take someone out of a fight using terrain is stronger than any damage at times. Ex. Keep defense, central bg areas. It cab be used to take ppl off a flag even.

It doesn't hurt that with a burning light proc ive crit for 9k just for ccing some one. Ranged cc stun can stop ppl from rezzing in the distance as well and may be the difference in the battle during small scale out numbered scenarios.

I play ps4 so i don't have opponents with add-on components telling them what to do. I also think you don't give javalin enough credit where it's due. The only time i can't land a javalin is against block tanks, and guess who dies last anyway. Plus your group should have you're gaps covered.

DeHei

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

DeHei wrote: »

Baconlad wrote: »

Wtf is wrong with javelin anyway? I hear this often, but have always thought it a *** excuse. Javelin is fkn amazing. Blazing spear stun was much worse. Only thing it had going for it was to drop it on a choke when you were trying to LOS, without having to aim it at your target. Which javelin will do a better job getting ur target off of you anyway. Are you mad you dont have a stun that goes through block? Is that the problem?

You also mentioned other stuns that players use...so whats wrong with them? Do other classes not have to go outside their class to get buffs/ cc/ execute/ heals/ defense/ damage?
Thank god we arent dragonknights...who dont even get a magick execute at ALL...
All in all i think magplar is the most well rounded class, we can tank, heal, support, damage. Any multiple different ways of doing each. I would say as templar, we lack one thing we NEED. Thats is mobility. The game has shown that being able to be mobile and reset the fight is king in cyrodil atleast. And guess what! We get that too...through being a vampire. It would be nice to not have to rely on vamp...but im not gonna complain when other classes lack so much more than magplar do. We seriously get to have our cake and eat it too.

Strongest spec in game? Nah. Deff not. But you take a player who knows what hes doing with the class, you can wreck any spec in game.

Magplar is great. Dont deny it. Im glad for being a templar over any other class. We have so many more (successful) build options/ playstyles, no class can compete with us

Dont understand me wrong. My main is templar, i play him since the beta and love this class. But i said allready that we need more CC possibilitys before the stun was gone and nobody thought about it. Javelin is a bad joke against that! A skill for low damage and just a low CC.. sry man i dont agree. When you really are a templarplayer, you will understand, that you only need skills which do more then 1 thing, because we allready need enough slots for surviving!
Just try that guys, everybody is talking, they are the strongest players in duell on there class, then you will never slot crapskills like javelin again...

I've got great success with javalin in cyro and bg. Using it to take someone out of a fight using terrain is stronger than any damage at times. Ex. Keep defense, central bg areas. It cab be used to take ppl off a flag even.

It doesn't hurt that with a burning light proc ive crit for 9k just for ccing some one. Ranged cc stun can stop ppl from rezzing in the distance as well and may be the difference in the battle during small scale out numbered scenarios.

I play ps4 so i don't have opponents with add-on components telling them what to do. I also think you don't give javalin enough credit where it's due. The only time i can't land a javalin is against block tanks, and guess who dies last anyway. Plus your group should have you're gaps covered.

PC player are just harder mate. Against noobs that maybe work but good player dont get stress when you hit your javelin...

Idinuse

Prince_of_all_Pugs wrote: »

i just dont get it, someone enlighten me.

Oh this is a recoil from all the, accurate, Sorcerers OP and Dev favs, need well due nerf threads huh? Good there.

Baconlad

@DeHei breh...aurora does more than just stuns.

It knocks back, it deals GREAT damage, it stuns.

Ive used it 1vX in towers, soon as a player gets up the stairs, BOOM. they go back down to the bottom, standing too close on the outer wall while im on the inner top? Boom, get off the wall and walk back to the breach. Dont underestimate the power of a great knockback. As for damage. Sucker crits for massive damage, got 9k on a kid with zero impen and low resists. That doesnt include the burning light proc. Two in a row before you can break free? Even at 6k crit with 1.5k burning light crit, thats 15k right there.

Javelin is friggin amazing, once i started using it, if i try to take it off my bar...it always finds its way back. Its that good. Sorry your too busy thinking your leet because you played since beta. Sorry ive been playing magplar since beta 2014 and am still willing to try things you "leetists" cant...im showing severe success with my build.

DeHei

Baconlad wrote: »

@DeHei breh...aurora does more than just stuns.

It knocks back, it deals GREAT damage, it stuns.

Ive used it 1vX in towers, soon as a player gets up the stairs, BOOM. they go back down to the bottom, standing too close on the outer wall while im on the inner top? Boom, get off the wall and walk back to the breach. Dont underestimate the power of a great knockback. As for damage. Sucker crits for massive damage, got 9k on a kid with zero impen and low resists. That doesnt include the burning light proc. Two in a row before you can break free? Even at 6k crit with 1.5k burning light crit, thats 15k right there.

Javelin is friggin amazing, once i started using it, if i try to take it off my bar...it always finds its way back. Its that good. Sorry your too busy thinking your leet because you played since beta. Sorry ive been playing magplar since beta 2014 and am still willing to try things you "leetists" cant...im showing severe success with my build.

Its nice that you have success with that. I play since beta too. I tested it every patch again and sry that skill isnt great. The damage is really low. It can procc burning light (ok thats fine). The knockback is in tower fights good or while sieging and shot the guys from roof, but sry i dont only fight in tower or siege all the time.
When you find enough noobs, who die because of javelin, its fine. You will not find this kind of player on PC very often... When i had success with that, i would not say anything against, but my experience is another. The skill is a wasted slot on Pc..