Impenetrable Too Necessary?

GrumpyDuckling

I tried a Well-Fitted medium armor build last night because I'm tired of having to run Impenetrable all of the time to stay alive. I thought it would be fun to run around roll-dodging, but I quickly discovered that in this undodgeable AOE meta, a build without much crit resistance (all I had was 38 CP points into crit resist node) gets massacred.

I'm currently going to make a run at 5 pc Impregnable for the time being so I can avoid Impenetrable, but it seems like something is wrong when I have to use a 5 piece set just to feel comfortable using other armor traits. Is Impen too necessary in PVP? The only players I have talked to who don't use Impen on some of their builds are either shield-stacking or ganking/bombing, everything else is at least 5 Impen.

Solariken

I feel like I can forego some impen while using heavy armor, but definitely not with medium. Honestly though I think the problem is exasperated by all the insta-proc damage you take. We might feel a little more relief and flexibility after HotR drops when certain proc damage is a little bit tamed and Sharpened gets brought down to earth a bit. I guess we'll see...

starlizard70ub17_ESO

Hopefully HotR will change things but right now if you're not wearing at least 5 impenetrable armor pieces, you're just AP folder for the other guys.
^ This is part of the reason why I PvP as little as I do right now. It's boring with everyone running around with only 2 or 3 slightly different class variations of the same type of meta build.

leepalmer95

You dont need full impen 4-5 is enough usually depending on the build.

well fitted/ infused/ sturdy as good off traits for the 2-3 piece that aren't impen;

Lord-Otto

The game is balanced around crits in PvE. Since this game is another hybrid between PvE and PvP mechanics, compromises must be made. I can't see crits going anywhere.

However, Impregnable is a great set. CPs are more forgiving now. Four golden impen pieces give you good crit resist.
Mix and match between those three and you should have enough freedom for the rest of your build.

Zordrage

players that PvP without impen get instantly deleted by a spam of 8k - 10k crits

GrumpyDuckling

Zoliru wrote: »

players that PvP without impen get instantly deleted by a spam of 8k - 10k crits

Well said ^

Vaoh

It is Critical Resistance in general. You need to have some is all.

This comes from either wearing 7/7 Impenetrable, investing in the Crit Resist CP star, getting a Transmutation buff, or wearing the Impregnable set.

You don't need a ton of Impen.... you just need to use these sources to boost up your Critical Resistances to reasonable numbers. Impen is just super convenient.

DeHei

With medium armor you allready a kind of glass canon. I am not sure if impen makes more sense then a full damage build to burst your targets.

I personally would prefer heavy armor with impen..

ParaNostram

@Vaoh what is a good amount of impen to be aiming for?

DKsUnite

ParaNostram wrote: »

@Vaoh what is a good amount of impen to be aiming for?

2.5k+ is the general rule that most follow

Vaoh

DKsUnite wrote: »

ParaNostram wrote: »

@Vaoh what is a good amount of impen to be aiming for?

2.5k+ is the general rule that most follow

Yep^^^ I wrote a post on this sort of recently where I calculated everything out - I'll dig it up and post it here. You'll see how everything adds up pretty clearly

Lexxypwns

Crit resist is very necessary.

However, there is a case for getting only some of it from impen. Sturdy and well
Fitted are both very strong defensive traits, though both more niche and limited than impen.

If, for example, you're running impregnable armor to cover your crit resist then you can stack sturdy and also have the option to block to relieve heavy pressure. Or you could run impregnable and stack well fitted, this way crits wouldn't still melt you as you experienced but you would have the increased Stam sustain.

Transmutation gives you a group buff that allows everyone to shift into more profitable traits.

There's also a case to be made for less crit resist on shield stacking or permablock builds

NightbladeMechanics

And here I was all excited to answer a question. @Vaoh covered it. Get your crit resistance from somewhere, or get blown up. There are several sources to choose from.

If you want to play with lots of well-fitted on a medium armor rolly polly build, I recommend Impregnable. If you want to run a destro resto magicka build without relying too heavily on shielding, you can survive well with Transmutation on your back bar, heals over time, and other mitigation sources like Riposte, Blood Spawn, Pirate, dodge chance, and resistance buffs. I don't recommend committing heavily into the Resistant CP star anymore since we now have some juicy new raw mitigation stars which scale better against general damage.

the_broo11

ParaNostram wrote: »

@Vaoh what is a good amount of impen to be aiming for?

From my experience as a 7x medium stam sorc for the past 2 years (including during the heavy armor meta):

CP (cyrodiil): 2000
No-CP (cyrodiil, BGs): 1200

I'd also advise to take this with a grain of salt and add as needed for your class/build and experience level. I've had a lot of game time to develop strong proactive damage reduction/avoidance habits (i.e. major resistances & evasion buffs near 100% uptime, treating vigor like a "buff", dodge/block/LOS mechanics, spatial awareness for incoming destro ults, etc.). I also have access to self heals as a stam sorc (dark deal, crit surge) that not all classes have, so I can recover a bit easier.

Vaoh

Found the post! Here it is:

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Your opponent has a base critical damage modifier of 1.5, meaning a Critical Hit will deal 150% of a skill's base damage. This is assuming they do not use The Shadow mundus, and that they are not buffing their critical damage modifier other ways (class passives, etc).

Critical Resistance reduces their critical hit modifier on Critical Hits that strike you. Essentially, 66 points of Critical Resistance equals 1% damage mitigation toward Critical Hits.

• 1 Gold Impenetrable trait - 258 Critical Resistance - 3.91% mitigation
• 7/7 Gold Impenetrable traits - 1806 Critical Resistance - 27.36% mitigation
• 5-piece Gold Impregnable Armor - 2500 Critical Resistance - 37.88% mitigation
• 5-piece Transmutation Set - 1304 Critical Resistance - 19.76% mitigation

As long as you have 7/7 impenetrable, or 5-piece Impregnable Armor, you have enough Critical Resistance and should build into other stats. Having either of these is sufficient. If Transmutation is applied to you as well, you become practically immune to critical hits.

You can slot other traits as much as you want but only if Impregnable is slotted too. Hope that helped.

---

HeathenDeacon

i run zero impen, 7 well fited, in non cp...so bascially zilch for crit resist.
but with smart stam management and imovable pots i do pretty dern good keeping my shields up 100% of the time.
though a bit tricky at first, its a really fun playstyle cycling thru shield spam and roll dodge.
and TBh i survive really well, though in cp cyrodil its hella harder when outnumbered.

deepseamk20b14_ESO

I find I'm very comfortable with 2000 crit. I do think 7 of 7 pieces need to be impen, not by a long shot. I wouldn't go below 4 though. 5 is ideal honestly and the other two can be whatever you want depending on what your build and play style call for.

Zordrage

HeathenDeacon wrote: »

i run zero impen, 7 well fited, in non cp...so bascially zilch for crit resist.
but with smart stam management and imovable pots i do pretty dern good keeping my shields up 100% of the time.
though a bit tricky at first, its a really fun playstyle cycling thru shield spam and roll dodge.
and TBh i survive really well, though in cp cyrodil its hella harder when outnumbered.

now try to play something that is not an uncritable shield spamming sorc.......

just try to play basicaly any other class without crit resist.... do it.....