Wizrad's riposte Readjusting!

Ectheliontnacil

Hello,

With the Morrowind update several new armour sets were introduced, among them the light armour set "wizard's riposte". The set has the following bonuses:

(2 items) Adds 1064 Max Health

(3 items) Adds 129 Spell Damage

(4 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery

(5 items) When you take Critical Damage, you apply Minor Maim to the enemy for 15 seconds, reducing their damage done by 15%

Interesting, in terms of damage reduction certainly top tier for magicka users. I would however argue that the 5-piece bonus has a duration that is way to long. Since it is a debuff to the enemy, it should, in my opinion have the same duration as fasallas guile (2 seconds, maybe even a bit more, ~5 seconds). And here's why: This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless (you wont have enough damage to finish the opponent). Now fine, fine 15% is good but you could also run heavy armour or something equally good at dmg reduction right? No! The long duration allows for 2 things which make it broken in some situations.

1) When one of say 10 people in a group run this set you will have a 100% uptime on the debuff, WITHOUT even focusing the wizards riposte user.

2) A lot of people run the 5 piece on the backbar, now I love backbaring set, however I think wizards is too strong a buff to be able to backbar it.

If the duration was reduced single players getting attacked would still get a 100% uptime of the debuff on their enemies, but zerglings/group players or people who backbar it would observe a slight decrease in the effectiveness of this set. If you agree please comment on this, if you don't...don't comment ( seriously, I know where you live^^).

timidobserver

A Wizard's Riposte nerf thread. That's new.

Sheey

Its currently the only Set reducing proc sets' damage. How in hell you want it nerfed?

Berenhir

If your healer doesn't purge you a nerf for WR won't help you in the long run.

Jawasa

purge it and it's back as soon as you hit some1. @Berenhir

Berenhir

Jawasa wrote: »

purge it and it's back as soon as you hit some1. @Berenhir

Yes, that will always be the case - even with reduced duration^^

Waffennacht

Why must every defensive set be nerfed and proc sets left untouched?

Leave Riposte alone, it's fine in this environment

leepalmer95

Yeah can we not nerf defensive sets please?

Its a minor maim debuff which you can get from number of other sources as well, it's not a unique debuff.

Eweroun

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

Hello,

If the duration was reduced single players getting attacked would still get a 100% uptime of the debuff on their enemies, but zerglings/group players or people who backbar it would observe a slight decrease in the effectiveness of this set. If you agree please comment on this, if you don't...don't comment ( seriously, I know where you live^^).

Anti-Zeg trait upcoming next? cause it's not fair if they're rolling over you 25v1?

Qbiken

It is a very strong set indeed. I first heard it from @Nightblademechanics when he posted a video using Wizard`s Riposte + Transmutation on his magblade. I decided to try that setup my self. Now realise 2 things:
* I´ve no idea how to play magblade, not in PvE or in PvP
* I´m *** at PvP, not the worst but defenetly to the best.

With that setup I managed to survive the proc-set meta in BG. First time I enjoyed BG´s to be honest since I didn´t get 1-2 shoot by everything. Is it a strong set: yes. Do I want it to be nerfed: Not in the current state with the proc-set meta that´s going on. If ZOS adjust the damage output of proc-set then I can get behind a change to Wizard´s riposte set, but otherwise no.

DeHei

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

Hello,

With the Morrowind update several new armour sets were introduced, among them the light armour set "wizard's riposte". The set has the following bonuses:

(2 items) Adds 1064 Max Health

(3 items) Adds 129 Spell Damage

(4 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery

(5 items) When you take Critical Damage, you apply Minor Maim to the enemy for 15 seconds, reducing their damage done by 15%

Interesting, in terms of damage reduction certainly top tier for magicka users. I would however argue that the 5-piece bonus has a duration that is way to long. Since it is a debuff to the enemy, it should, in my opinion have the same duration as fasallas guile (2 seconds, maybe even a bit more, ~5 seconds). And here's why: This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless (you wont have enough damage to finish the opponent). Now fine, fine 15% is good but you could also run heavy armour or something equally good at dmg reduction right? No! The long duration allows for 2 things which make it broken in some situations.

1) When one of say 10 people in a group run this set you will have a 100% uptime on the debuff, WITHOUT even focusing the wizards riposte user.

2) A lot of people run the 5 piece on the backbar, now I love backbaring set, however I think wizards is too strong a buff to be able to backbar it.

If the duration was reduced single players getting attacked would still get a 100% uptime of the debuff on their enemies, but zerglings/group players or people who backbar it would observe a slight decrease in the effectiveness of this set. If you agree please comment on this, if you don't...don't comment ( seriously, I know where you live^^).

I dont understand your problem with these set.. Every Nightblade can hold this debuff nearly 100% of time on his opponents and nobody have stress with that..

Nelson_Rebel

How about nerf proc sets, then we can talk

otherwise, like everyone else said, NO

Ashamray

Problem with Riposte is that it makes cloak useless.

TheDoomsdayMonster

Sheey wrote: »

Its currently the only Set reducing proc sets' damage. How in hell you want it nerfed?

It's not the only set doing that...

DeadlyRecluse

It's a neat set. I could see a duration adjustment, but I don't think it's in need of a serious nerf.

Gothren

Waffennacht wrote: »

Why must every defensive set be nerfed and proc sets left untouched?

Leave Riposte alone, it's fine in this environment

heartly agree and I don't even use the set.

Scyantific

OP is a procblade confirmed. Riposte is good as is and if it gets a change it's not going to happen until at least August or so.

paulsimonps

Sources of Minor Maim:

• One Hand and Shield Ability: Low Slash+Morphs
• Nightblade Shadow Ability: Mass Hysteria (Morph of Aspect of Terror)
• Nightblade Shadow Ability: Summon Shade+Morphs
• Dragonknight Draconic Power Ability: Choking Talons (Morph of Dark Talons)
• Alchemy Poison: Increase Weapon Power (Blessed Thistle, Stinkhorn, Dragonthorn)
• Alchemy Poison/Potion: Lower Weapon Power (Imp Stool, Luminous Russula, Mountain Flower)
• Secondary Damage Type Effect: Frost
• Armor Set: Knightmare
• Armor Set: Shadowrend
• Armor Set: Wizard's Riposte

There are quite a lot of ways to get this debuff, and many of these are actively used in PvP, Choking Talons, Fear and Shades to name a few. And I have seen many more use Shadowrend as well. And so a buff this widely used will be applied by a lot of things, and so I don't see how nerfing the duration of this will change any of that. Even Knightmare has a longer duration then what you are suggesting and so does all of those skills, and knightmare even does it to all targets in an 8m radious around you when you proc it, and it has high proc chance. Shadowrend also has a longer duration then what you are suggesting and it follows you and reapplies it on you if you are the one that it is attacking. Nerfing Wizard's Riposte is not necessary nor would it actually help lowering up times on this very widely used debuff.

exeeter702

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

Hello,

With the Morrowind update several new armour sets were introduced, among them the light armour set "wizard's riposte". The set has the following bonuses:

(2 items) Adds 1064 Max Health

(3 items) Adds 129 Spell Damage

(4 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery

(5 items) When you take Critical Damage, you apply Minor Maim to the enemy for 15 seconds, reducing their damage done by 15%

Interesting, in terms of damage reduction certainly top tier for magicka users. I would however argue that the 5-piece bonus has a duration that is way to long. Since it is a debuff to the enemy, it should, in my opinion have the same duration as fasallas guile (2 seconds, maybe even a bit more, ~5 seconds). And here's why: This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless (you wont have enough damage to finish the opponent). Now fine, fine 15% is good but you could also run heavy armour or something equally good at dmg reduction right? No! The long duration allows for 2 things which make it broken in some situations.

1) When one of say 10 people in a group run this set you will have a 100% uptime on the debuff, WITHOUT even focusing the wizards riposte user.

2) A lot of people run the 5 piece on the backbar, now I love backbaring set, however I think wizards is too strong a buff to be able to backbar it.

If the duration was reduced single players getting attacked would still get a 100% uptime of the debuff on their enemies, but zerglings/group players or people who backbar it would observe a slight decrease in the effectiveness of this set. If you agree please comment on this, if you don't...don't comment ( seriously, I know where you live^^).

Incredible............

acw37162

Yeah, no it doesn't.

WhiteMage

Wizard's Riposte is so darn OPstrong. I want it but I'm worried it'll get a nerf shortly after I can scrape up the gold for it.

How is the best way to nerf it? I'd say reduce the duration down to around 5 seconds, perhaps lower, but this would also be a good opportunity to address how crit can get way too high.

Joy_Division

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

Hello,

With the Morrowind update several new armour sets were introduced, among them the light armour set "wizard's riposte". The set has the following bonuses:

(2 items) Adds 1064 Max Health

(3 items) Adds 129 Spell Damage

(4 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery

(5 items) When you take Critical Damage, you apply Minor Maim to the enemy for 15 seconds, reducing their damage done by 15%

Interesting, in terms of damage reduction certainly top tier for magicka users. I would however argue that the 5-piece bonus has a duration that is way to long. Since it is a debuff to the enemy, it should, in my opinion have the same duration as fasallas guile (2 seconds, maybe even a bit more, ~5 seconds). And here's why: This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless (you wont have enough damage to finish the opponent). Now fine, fine 15% is good but you could also run heavy armour or something equally good at dmg reduction right? No! The long duration allows for 2 things which make it broken in some situations.

1) When one of say 10 people in a group run this set you will have a 100% uptime on the debuff, WITHOUT even focusing the wizards riposte user.

2) A lot of people run the 5 piece on the backbar, now I love backbaring set, however I think wizards is too strong a buff to be able to backbar it.

If the duration was reduced single players getting attacked would still get a 100% uptime of the debuff on their enemies, but zerglings/group players or people who backbar it would observe a slight decrease in the effectiveness of this set. If you agree please comment on this, if you don't...don't comment ( seriously, I know where you live^^).

Look another nerf thread. Resource sustain gone to crap. Damage higher this patch. Heavy armor nerfed. More block nerfs. Procs out of control. And you 're asking for more nerfs?

Get out of here with these nerfs requests!

Zer0_CooL

Sheey wrote: »

Its currently the only Set reducing proc sets' damage. How in hell you want it nerfed?

[quote="Ectheliontnacil;d-356977" This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless

[/quote]

Obviously a nightblade whining because he can't oneshot light armour anymore. Prety rediculos.

Ectheliontnacil

@Zer0_CooL

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

[quote="Ectheliontnacil;d-356977" This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless

Obviously a nightblade whining because he can't oneshot light armour anymore. Prety rediculos.

You moron, I play light armour. I actually use Wizard's riposte and changing the duration won't make one shotting any easier. Please think before you smash your head into the keyboard and post utter nonsense .

leepalmer95

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

show previous quotes

Sheey wrote: »

Its currently the only Set reducing proc sets' damage. How in hell you want it nerfed?

[quote="Ectheliontnacil;d-356977" This debuff is VERY strong, 15% damage reduction is quite a bit especially when it makes your damage combo, designed to take out light/medium armour opponents, useless

your dmg combo is useless because it deals 15% less dmg?

Zer0_CooL

How ever, all i see is another thread of someone unable to deal with new situations. So best thing to do is crying for a nerf just because his build doesn't work as fine as it used to.

HiImRex

OP getting mobbed by a mass of triggered proc survivors lel.

Minor maim on near unlimited targets with 100% uptime is at least worth a closer look, people throw their babies away in ESO for 2-6% damage increase, 15 is a huge amount to discount damage by.

But but but other sources of minor maim?

All which require either specific skills to be slotted and used expending resources and global cd, OR a rng chance to proc for a short duration with frost damage, and bc of this limitation the number of targets you can viably apply this to are limited.

But but but ur also a proctard confirmed?

No

But but but I finally can live 2 seconds longer in BGs if we take a closer look at this set I may die instantly again we must burn any who bring up points of discussion at the stake with false and irrelevant accusations of being a proctard?

Sounds like a L2p issue

IxskullzxI

HiImRex wrote: »

OP getting mobbed by a mass of triggered proc survivors lel.

Minor maim on near unlimited targets with 100% uptime is at least worth a closer look, people throw their babies away in ESO for 2-6% damage increase, 15 is a huge amount to discount damage by.

But but but other sources of minor maim?

All which require either specific skills to be slotted and used expending resources and global cd, OR a rng chance to proc for a short duration with frost damage, and bc of this limitation the number of targets you can viably apply this to are limited.

But but but ur also a proctard confirmed?

No

But but but I finally can live 2 seconds longer in BGs if we take a closer look at this set I may die instantly again we must burn any who bring up points of discussion at the stake with false and irrelevant accusations of being a proctard?

Sounds like a L2p issue

So if riposte only makes you live 2 seconds longer in BG, what's the big deal?

Ectheliontnacil

@HilmRex

HiImRex wrote: »

OP getting mobbed by a mass of triggered proc survivors lel.

Minor maim on near unlimited targets with 100% uptime is at least worth a closer look, people throw their babies away in ESO for 2-6% damage increase, 15 is a huge amount to discount damage by.

But but but other sources of minor maim?

All which require either specific skills to be slotted and used expending resources and global cd, OR a rng chance to proc for a short duration with frost damage, and bc of this limitation the number of targets you can viably apply this to are limited.

But but but ur also a proctard confirmed?

No

But but but I finally can live 2 seconds longer in BGs if we take a closer look at this set I may die instantly again we must burn any who bring up points of discussion at the stake with false and irrelevant accusations of being a proctard?

Sounds like a L2p issue

Ah an insightful and constructive comment! I knew people like you existed on eso forums

Minor maim on an unlimited amount of targets with 100% uptime is indeed worth a closer look ^^.
I get why people accuse me of being a proctard but changing the Duration of this debuff won't affect the strength of the debuff and therefore won't increase the effectiveness of proc sets (since the gank usually takes 2 seconds, not more). In addition proc sets are getting nerfed to the ground (Alamexia be praised!) and will no longer be relevant for ganking.
For anyone who still thinks I am a proctard, I actually posted a discussion on removing proc sets from the game...so take that!
Here it is:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/352326/proc-sets-need-to-go#latest

So to sum up:

-I want the duration of wizards riposte looked at, this won't make ganking easier at all.
-Proc sets are irrelevant next patch so that is no longer an argument.

Also:
The opposite effect to maim (damage reduction) is berserk (damage increase). But minor maim only increases dmg by 8% whereas minor maim decreases it by 15%... so it's very strong. People run 2 piece monster set to get minor berserk, and now a dude backbars wizards and is able to give all enemies in his vicinity minor maim?? Sound right???

GrumpyDuckling

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

@HilmRex

show previous quotes

HiImRex wrote: »

OP getting mobbed by a mass of triggered proc survivors lel.

Minor maim on near unlimited targets with 100% uptime is at least worth a closer look, people throw their babies away in ESO for 2-6% damage increase, 15 is a huge amount to discount damage by.

But but but other sources of minor maim?

All which require either specific skills to be slotted and used expending resources and global cd, OR a rng chance to proc for a short duration with frost damage, and bc of this limitation the number of targets you can viably apply this to are limited.

But but but ur also a proctard confirmed?

No

But but but I finally can live 2 seconds longer in BGs if we take a closer look at this set I may die instantly again we must burn any who bring up points of discussion at the stake with false and irrelevant accusations of being a proctard?

Sounds like a L2p issue

Ah an insightful and constructive comment! I knew people like you existed on eso forums

Minor maim on an unlimited amount of targets with 100% uptime is indeed worth a closer look ^^.
I get why people accuse me of being a proctard but changing the Duration of this debuff won't affect the strength of the debuff and therefore won't increase the effectiveness of proc sets (since the gank usually takes 2 seconds, not more). In addition proc sets are getting nerfed to the ground (Alamexia be praised!) and will no longer be relevant for ganking.
For anyone who still thinks I am a proctard, I actually posted a discussion on removing proc sets from the game...so take that!
Here it is:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/352326/proc-sets-need-to-go#latest

So to sum up:

-I want the duration of wizards riposte looked at, this won't make ganking easier at all.
-Proc sets are irrelevant next patch so that is no longer an argument.

Also:
The opposite effect to maim (damage reduction) is berserk (damage increase). But minor maim only increases dmg by 8% whereas minor maim decreases it by 15%... so it's very strong. People run 2 piece monster set to get minor berserk, and now a dude backbars wizards and is able to give all enemies in his vicinity minor maim?? Sound right???

You're forgetting that Major Brutality and Major Sorcery provide buffs for weapon and spell damage too. You have to consider more than just Minor Berserk and its total damage.

I don't understand why people keep complaining about having a set that counters damage buffs. How is Wizard's Reposte any different than Igneous Weapons? Why isn't this thread complaining that a DK can spam Igneous Weapons in a zerg and EVERYONE can get Major Brutality and Major Sorcery?

Grimhallow

Riposte is absurdly strong. but I don't much like the idea of nerfing a defensive set (especially during the proc meta). That being said I always love changes that help promote solo/small group and scale down in effectiveness with zerging. I think making the riposte buff ten seconds would be a good change so that the buff is still powerful, but maintains better functionality against big zergs than against smaller groups.