Macro slice at will - Secret Pros Hide :)

Sandman929

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Macroslice is a misleading title. It's like calling someone a meta player. It's jargon that means very little.

Sure any pc scrub can macro this like any other skill or rotation, but for good players this would only hinder their play.

Here is complexities of the combat system being handed to you guys on a silver platter and all you do QQ for a nerf.

unbelievable how ungrateful you scrubs are.

You're a strange kind of adult. If you are one.

KingYogi415

You killed a guy not blocking, with no hots or any other buffs up in 3 wrecking cancle weaves. So what?

You will never be able to chain more then 1 against a good payer.

And I could have lined up a gank burst to drop him in about .5 of a second. Maybe we should call that exploiting as well.

Personofsecrets

Alcast wrote: »

Nightwiish wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

this stuff did not happen before theyy changed the animations.

Hey @Alcast big fan man

It's like a wave of skill input. If you catch it at the right time, stuff becomes invisible...

Every patch I tell them to revert the Animation canceling changes. Since they changed it we get:

1. Stuck is **** animation all the time
2. Macroslices

before we did not have those issues. But I guess they know better..... ><

Their animation changes were simply awful.

Sureshawt

This is just a stupid OP variant of animation canceling and we all know how that went. In the near future I expect ZoS to confirm this a feature as well and consider it to be skillfull play.

Gimmicks and Giggles...

Xvorg

Waffennacht wrote: »

Nightwiish wrote: »

CavalryPK wrote: »

Nightwiish wrote: »

CavalryPK wrote: »

as a Magblade who has to start light attacking 5 times before I can properly line up my burst.. I am really jelly on what stambuilds are capable of... to be bale to pull of short bursts in such short amounts of time is amazing.

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_RichLambert @Wrobel , please give magblades something like this too!... I wanna be able to:

animation cancel heavy destro attack in to + spectral bow then ani cancel spectral bow to + swallow soul then any cancel swallow soul to + Soul tether the ani cancel soul tether to + impale....


OR OR OR .... Since we are able to fire off as many spectral bows as possible with in the 20 seconds... how about gives us the ability to store the spectral bow procs???? I can save up 2 spectal bows and then burst down targets in short durations... juuuust like those crazy stam builds....

I

I am fairly certain that this is something that can also be done by magicka builds and not exclusive to stamina builds. I am going to try later tonight with magicka spec and magblade to see if I can get a video.

Probably... let me know if you are able to successfully ani cancel Spectral Bow.

I am also 100% you can not save up 2 spectral bow procs.

Not spectral but so think it should be possible with Frags. So long as it has a cast time and not instant.

.... Lol poor mNBs

Edit, and yes it works with frags

BTW this is the stuff I purposely avoid, the game is suppose to be re actionary, not who's best at bop it and Simon.

in fact it works nicely with hard casting frags and a gap closer

Xvorg

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Lowering the skill cap would only ruin the game.

If your crying about this please just L2P, or go back hello kity island adventure. I don't care which.

Cheers!

So , killing enemies in the old mode is Hello Kitty Island and ani cancelling is Roman Circus?

Things that you stumble upon... sometimes...

yttoks

Nightwiish wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

It works with jabs as a channel?

I have to try this

Yes, it absolutely does. I suggest finding a training dummy in housing and having a go at it. You just have to get the timing right and it does take some time to start "feeling" the flow of it.

I don't think this is correct. I use jabs a lot, and I cancel it a lot. You can definitely cancel the channel and immediately execute a skill (if, for example, you need to interrupt, purify, etc. and waiting for the channel to end is no good). When you cancel the channel, however, there is no more damage going out. If there is a way to cancel the channel and get the damage, my DPS is about to go through the roof...

Edit: NVM. I misunderstood I think. So, this only associated with a broken gap closer? I thought you were saying you can cancel a jab and still get the damage.

rfennell_ESO

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Macroslice is a misleading title. It's like calling someone a meta player. It's jargon that means very little.

Sure any pc scrub can macro this like any other skill or rotation, but for good players this would only hinder their play.

Here is complexities of the combat system being handed to you guys on a silver platter and all you do QQ for a nerf.

unbelievable how ungrateful you scrubs are.

The entire animation system was designed to make for fluid reactive game play.. that's the entire point.

This is the opposite of it... it's not fluid and you can't react to it. It's obviously exploitative behavior for those that the need to succeed at the expense of everything.

Anyways, who really is the scrub... the scrub that gets gibbed because there are no animations or the *** abusing game mechanics to kill a scrub?

MurderMostFoul

Abuse of the animation system in this game is a major problem. The game play is supposed to be fluid and action oriented. Macroslices, and AC in general, are unintuitive, unintended, and force one to play in a way that feels unnatural in order to be highly competitive.

Xvorg

MurderMostFoul wrote: »

Abuse of the animation system in this game is a major problem. The game play is supposed to be fluid and action oriented. Macroslices, and AC in general, are unintuitive, unintended, and force one to play in a way that feels unnatural in order to be highly competitive.

Funny thing? ZoS keeps on nerfing permablocking... Too Stronk!

Nightwiish

MurderMostFoul wrote: »

Abuse of the animation system in this game is a major problem. The game play is supposed to be fluid and action oriented. Macroslices, and AC in general, are unintuitive, unintended, and force one to play in a way that feels unnatural in order to be highly competitive.

The issue is that if Zeni ever did anything with AC to less effective then it would shift the whole combat gameplay of the game. There would be so many people running around in unkillable builds bc the damage would be nerfed by quite a bit. So I kind of understand them staying away from it as it is not as simple as fixing AC and you are done.

SanTii.92

KingYogi415 wrote: »

You killed a guy not blocking, with no hots or any other buffs up in 3 wrecking cancle weaves. So what?

You will never be able to chain more then 1 against a good payer.

And I could have lined up a gank burst to drop him in about .5 of a second. Maybe we should call that exploiting as well.

You serious? He was just showcasing the machinc d*mbass. Nothing to do with 'l2p issue' here, this is a glitch, most likely and unintentionally one, and therefore abusing it is certainly an exploit (which shouldn't be penalized until Zos publicly states so).

Now i'm still a bit on the fence about this until i can try it myself, i wouldn't say so that those players are activly trying to do it, haven't seen anyone pulling this off consistently, which rises the most important question, how reliable is it. @Nightwiish maybe you could upload doing it several times in a row?

timidobserver

KingYogi415 wrote: »

You killed a guy not blocking, with no hots or any other buffs up in 3 wrecking cancle weaves. So what?

You will never be able to chain more then 1 against a good payer.

And I could have lined up a gank burst to drop him in about .5 of a second. Maybe we should call that exploiting as well.

What you are talking about tries to turn it into a build/skill vs build/skill discussion. The objective of the video is to just demonstrate a broken game mechanic not get into a build discussion.

There are also a variety of ways to counter or reduce the impact a stealth gank. The only way to counter what the OP demonstrated is to not PvP lol.

Nightwiish

SanTii.92 wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

You killed a guy not blocking, with no hots or any other buffs up in 3 wrecking cancle weaves. So what?

You will never be able to chain more then 1 against a good payer.

And I could have lined up a gank burst to drop him in about .5 of a second. Maybe we should call that exploiting as well.

You serious? He was just showcasnig the machinc ***. Nothing to do with 'l2p issue' here, this is a glitch, most likely and unnintentional one, and thereforo abusing it is certainly an exploit (which shouldn't be penalized until Zos publicly states so).

Now i'm still a bit on the fence about this, until i can try it myself, i wouldn't say so that those players are activly trying to do it, haven't seen anyone pulling this off consistently, which rises the most important question, how reliable is it. @Nightwiish maybe you could upload doing it several times in a row?

I would say that in a BG environment my succes rate of pulling this off is about 70%. But remember I just discovered this and started using it two days ago compared to someof these guys who have been using it for a long long time.

KingYogi415

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Macroslice is a misleading title. It's like calling someone a meta player. It's jargon that means very little.

Sure any pc scrub can macro this like any other skill or rotation, but for good players this would only hinder their play.

Here is complexities of the combat system being handed to you guys on a silver platter and all you do QQ for a nerf.

unbelievable how ungrateful you scrubs are.

The entire animation system was designed to make for fluid reactive game play.. that's the entire point.

This is the opposite of it... it's not fluid and you can't react to it. It's obviously exploitative behavior for those that the need to succeed at the expense of everything.

Anyways, who really is the scrub... the scrub that gets gibbed because there are no animations or the *** abusing game mechanics to kill a scrub?

I main my magic characters. And I never die to wrecking blow. Only plebs who have no idea how to block or dodge roll think it's OP in any way.

Xvorg

KingYogi415 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Macroslice is a misleading title. It's like calling someone a meta player. It's jargon that means very little.

Sure any pc scrub can macro this like any other skill or rotation, but for good players this would only hinder their play.

Here is complexities of the combat system being handed to you guys on a silver platter and all you do QQ for a nerf.

unbelievable how ungrateful you scrubs are.

The entire animation system was designed to make for fluid reactive game play.. that's the entire point.

This is the opposite of it... it's not fluid and you can't react to it. It's obviously exploitative behavior for those that the need to succeed at the expense of everything.

Anyways, who really is the scrub... the scrub that gets gibbed because there are no animations or the *** abusing game mechanics to kill a scrub?

I main my magic characters. And I never die to wrecking blow. Only plebs who have no idea how to block or dodge roll think it's OP in any way.

Nobody dies at WB... since they use Dizz Swing.

And even in that case, they die to the executioner after dizz swing.

Anyway I found its a very arrogant statement to say that you never die to a WB... it's so arrogant that it is obviously a lie

raasdal

Hey @Nightwiish !

1. Thanks for sharing this, and putting some light on it. What you are doing in the video should not be possible. It is not AC - it's just broken animations is what it is, and needs to be fixed. Post more videos - good work!

2. But honestly, accusing some of the topstreamers of doing this "on purpose" just gives it all that smell of "potato got wrecked and needs to L2P" smell. They are not doing it. Really. If any of those streamers you mentioned was doing what you showed on video, half of their audience would notice it right away. I know i would. I watch them all regularly, and they are not doing what you are showing - at all. The fact you pull up video of Fengrush making fun of it enhances that smell i mentioned. What should be focused on is all those who have also learned this, like you, who are not streaming for a live audience, and are free to abuse it any way they see fit. I am happy to see the streamer bashing died out fast however, so the thread can move on with a better focus.

rfennell_ESO

KingYogi415 wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Macroslice is a misleading title. It's like calling someone a meta player. It's jargon that means very little.

Sure any pc scrub can macro this like any other skill or rotation, but for good players this would only hinder their play.

Here is complexities of the combat system being handed to you guys on a silver platter and all you do QQ for a nerf.

unbelievable how ungrateful you scrubs are.

The entire animation system was designed to make for fluid reactive game play.. that's the entire point.

This is the opposite of it... it's not fluid and you can't react to it. It's obviously exploitative behavior for those that the need to succeed at the expense of everything.

Anyways, who really is the scrub... the scrub that gets gibbed because there are no animations or the *** abusing game mechanics to kill a scrub?

I main my magic characters. And I never die to wrecking blow. Only plebs who have no idea how to block or dodge roll think it's OP in any way.

I guess you haven't seen a bugged out critical charge into a dizzying swing then.

Then again, no one else has either.

Nightwiish

raasdal wrote: »

Hey @Nightwiish !

1. Thanks for sharing this, and putting some light on it. What you are doing in the video should not be possible. It is not AC - it's just broken animations is what it is, and needs to be fixed. Post more videos - good work!

2. But honestly, accusing some of the topstreamers of doing this "on purpose" just gives it all that smell of "potato got wrecked and needs to L2P" smell. They are not doing it. Really. If any of those streamers you mentioned was doing what you showed on video, half of their audience would notice it right away. I know i would. I watch them all regularly, and they are not doing what you are showing - at all. The fact you pull up video of Fengrush making fun of it enhances that smell i mentioned. What should be focused on is all those who have also learned this, like you, who are not streaming for a live audience, and are free to abuse it any way they see fit. I am happy to see the streamer bashing died out fast however, so the thread can move on with a better focus.

Hey dude, thanks for your post.

Baconlad

So is this something that can only be done by a gap closer? If so then how do you explain snipes landing at the same time? Is that legit just lag?

Seems to be something you do with a channeled ability to start the chain. So can this be started by a wrecking blow and not a charge?

raasdal

Nightwiish wrote: »

raasdal wrote: »

Hey @Nightwiish !

1. Thanks for sharing this, and putting some light on it. What you are doing in the video should not be possible. It is not AC - it's just broken animations is what it is, and needs to be fixed. Post more videos - good work!

2. But honestly, accusing some of the topstreamers of doing this "on purpose" just gives it all that smell of "potato got wrecked and needs to L2P" smell. They are not doing it. Really. If any of those streamers you mentioned was doing what you showed on video, half of their audience would notice it right away. I know i would. I watch them all regularly, and they are not doing what you are showing - at all. The fact you pull up video of Fengrush making fun of it enhances that smell i mentioned. What should be focused on is all those who have also learned this, like you, who are not streaming for a live audience, and are free to abuse it any way they see fit. I am happy to see the streamer bashing died out fast however, so the thread can move on with a better focus.

Hey dude, thanks for your post.

I agree maybe it was a bit too much to accuse of them doing this on purpose. However, it is just what I believe and experienced while fighting them... I mean anyone whose ever fought topd dogs immediately realize how fast they pull off skills and rack up damage. Equally though, I would be shocked if any one of them are not aware that this is possible...

Also, you might want to think what made Fengrush continue to input skills when his Crit Rush bugged... Did he know that they would eventually go off? If so how did he know? My initial reaction to something like that would be to stop a bit and wonder what's going on. But he knew exactly that the skills will go off eventually. I really don't care who does it for what purpose. I amsimply trying to shed light to the fact that some players are much more blatantly pulling off skills and putting out damage in a lightning fast pace.

Hey!

For the last part, i have done the same thing a lot of times. I don't understand the problem. You get unintentionally stuck in Crit Rush like 1 out of 10 times you use it - or you used to do. I dont get it anymore. After the first couple of times, you realize how it works with the queing up of skills for the "macroslice". So when it happens to you, in middle of heated combat, are you going to just stand still, and let someone kill you ? No. You are going to laugh - or mostly get angry you got stuck, and smash your keyboard, hoping that he does not kill you, before your macroslice goes off. It's really common sense to me. As mentioned, i have been doing the same whenever it happened to me.

Next, i viewed your videos more. You need to do this with combat log on, and show. Its also a shame combat text was not on for the final one, where the dual WB hit at the same time. And we need this from the other perspective.

Based on the scrolling text, the damages are actually applied CORRECTLY within the cooldowns. So i am wondering, if the opponent might be seeing the damage to his healthpool or not, during the process. Anyhow, that would be my suggestion if you want to show more on this.

Nightwiish

raasdal wrote: »

Hey!

For the last part, i have done the same thing a lot of times. I don't understand the problem. You get unintentionally stuck in Crit Rush like 1 out of 10 times you use it - or you used to do. I dont get it anymore. After the first couple of times, you realize how it works with the queing up of skills for the "macroslice". So when it happens to you, in middle of heated combat, are you going to just stand still, and let someone kill you ? No. You are going to laugh - or mostly get angry you got stuck, and smash your keyboard, hoping that he does not kill you, before your macroslice goes off. It's really common sense to me. As mentioned, i have been doing the same whenever it happened to me.

Next, i viewed your videos more. You need to do this with combat log on, and show. Its also a shame combat text was not on for the final one, where the dual WB hit at the same time. And we need this from the other perspective.

Based on the scrolling text, the damages are actually applied CORRECTLY within the cooldowns. So i am wondering, if the opponent might be seeing the damage to his healthpool or not, during the process. Anyhow, that would be my suggestion if you want to show more on this.

I deleted my post after I wrote it up as I don't want to get into this stuff anymore about who does it for what purposes...

I will be home in a few hours and will try to do a few more videos with combat text, etc.

Dixa

animation canceling on it's own is ok.

balancing the game around it is not ie. the dps requirements currently needed for vet dungeons and higher.

pvp is never balanced so the only proper answer to that is 'git gud'.

Dixa

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

These people been exploiting this crap since it was a thing.

exploit is not the proper term given that animation canceling has been a thing since day 1

does it need to be addressed now that the meta pve and pvp games are so far skewed towards this level of gameplay that Joe Schmoe mmorpg gameplayer has even less of a chance to partake in pve and pvp activities? probably. player perceptions don't help either. "jajajajaja u no do 50k dps single target? joo bad".

Dixa

Nightwiish wrote: »

MurderMostFoul wrote: »

Abuse of the animation system in this game is a major problem. The game play is supposed to be fluid and action oriented. Macroslices, and AC in general, are unintuitive, unintended, and force one to play in a way that feels unnatural in order to be highly competitive.

The issue is that if Zeni ever did anything with AC to less effective then it would shift the whole combat gameplay of the game. There would be so many people running around in unkillable builds bc the damage would be nerfed by quite a bit. So I kind of understand them staying away from it as it is not as simple as fixing AC and you are done.

I don't buy this counter argument given morrowind saw some healing nerfs due to a single templar being able to keep 5 people up forever in cyrodil.

the fixes required to bring the skill level of this game down to something that actually makes this company money in the long run is going to encompass more than just dealing with this level of animation canceling.

Waffennacht

@KingYogi415 you can talk about me and do say what you did about me and you'll be fine because we'll, I'm a nobody.

But when you do that to someone like @Nightwiish oh boy do you open a can of worms!

Nightwiish

Updated with Stamplar cancels

SanTii.92

Nightwiish wrote: »

Updated with Stamplar cancels

Damn dude, those cancels are clean af. This is serious, now i'm worried.

Worth noting, Dark flares for example are hitting within a second or less of difference between each other. Doesn't look like desyinc, or delayed animation, they are actually hitting at the same time. This is game breaking.

Nightwiish

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Nightwiish wrote: »

Updated with Stamplar cancels

Damn dude, those cancels are clean af. This is serious, now i'm worried.

Worth noting, Dark flares for example are hitting with 0.1 seconds of difference between each other. Doesn't look like desyinc, or delayed animation, they are actually hitting at the same time. This is game breaking.

If you look again, it's actually 1 second and not 0.1 so the damage on my end is consistent.

What would be interesting is how the damage is received on the enemy player.

The_Duke

Xvorg wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Nightwiish wrote: »

CavalryPK wrote: »

Nightwiish wrote: »

CavalryPK wrote: »

as a Magblade who has to start light attacking 5 times before I can properly line up my burst.. I am really jelly on what stambuilds are capable of... to be bale to pull of short bursts in such short amounts of time is amazing.

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_RichLambert @Wrobel , please give magblades something like this too!... I wanna be able to:

animation cancel heavy destro attack in to + spectral bow then ani cancel spectral bow to + swallow soul then any cancel swallow soul to + Soul tether the ani cancel soul tether to + impale....


OR OR OR .... Since we are able to fire off as many spectral bows as possible with in the 20 seconds... how about gives us the ability to store the spectral bow procs???? I can save up 2 spectal bows and then burst down targets in short durations... juuuust like those crazy stam builds....

I

I am fairly certain that this is something that can also be done by magicka builds and not exclusive to stamina builds. I am going to try later tonight with magicka spec and magblade to see if I can get a video.

Probably... let me know if you are able to successfully ani cancel Spectral Bow.

I am also 100% you can not save up 2 spectral bow procs.

Not spectral but so think it should be possible with Frags. So long as it has a cast time and not instant.

.... Lol poor mNBs

Edit, and yes it works with frags

BTW this is the stuff I purposely avoid, the game is suppose to be re actionary, not who's best at bop it and Simon.

in fact it works nicely with hard casting frags and a gap closer

Ive used hard casted frags with crit rush on my hybrid stamsoc. Also hard casting frags and hitting WB will make both hit at once.