No CP PvP is stupid

Ragnaroek93

Deny it or not, but the gap between metabuilds and non metabuilds is even higher than on a CP campaign. My craft only builds (who are not BIS, I know) at least work in CP PvP kinda well but no CP ist just a pain in the ass, it's completely pointless to join such a campaign without using broken stuff. I hope that at least all the whiners who complain over and over again about CP will be happy now and have a cool competition out of busted sets, because the brah with the cheesiest build wins in no CP.

AhPook_Is_Here

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Deny it or not, but the gap between metabuilds and non metabuilds is even higher than on a CP campaign. My craft only builds (who are not BIS, I know) at least work in CP PvP kinda well but no CP ist just a pain in the ass, it's completely pointless to join such a campaign without using broken stuff. I hope that at least all the whiners who complain over and over again about CP will be happy now and have a cool competition out of busted sets, because the brah with the cheesiest build wins in no CP.

I think a lot of people were having fun on the 30 day no cp campaign on the NA servers. It had almost as many people as the CP campaign, and I thought the game play was nice. faster paced for sure and less forgiving than CP but still fun.

Vapirko

Try building for sustain. Sustain is king in no cp. you should be able to craft/buy sets to make a viable build. However, there are some farmed sets that help a lot and monster sets, even the right one pc, helps a lot. Also if you come up against someone with a vma weapon you can pretty much say goodbye.

Malibulove

No CP is more unforgiving that's why people like it, you don't get access to passive Damage mitigation or Cost reductions for actions like blocking or cc. So if you misplay a situation you can absolutely be taken advantage of. Likewise you can't build for 100% offense and rely on CP to be your builds defense so inevitably you see a lot more 2-dimensional builds.

There's a reason many no CP builds kind of ignore sheet DPS.

Yeah you can still just go full glass cannon and try to out burst people, but you're gonna get smoked the first time somebody else is faster.

KingJ

No CP is resources poisons and Proc set heaven ,I think that's the OP point.I agree with him some of the more broken things in CP is even worst

Mazbt

Hah I thought Op was someone else due to their name. A blazing shield tank in PC NA. I really don't think that guy has sustain issues so i was confused for a sec.

Rickter

I wear crafted sets. I do fine in noCP.

I really dont run into too many people using poisons. maybe im not paying attention but i think its been grossly exaggerated. I regularly play in groups smaller than 5 and i regularly camp at Bruma and Vlastrus as well as taking part in larger scale fights like Ales Farm, Bleakers, Nikel you name it and very seldom to i fall victim to resource draining poisons, or poisons in general.

like, seriously? i pvp 5-6 nights a week. its a regular thing for me. I am not getting hit by poisons. i swear on everyone i hold dear this is the truth. like, roll a DC character and come pvp with me if you dont believe it. @Rickter2049

im sick and tired of the propaganda.

proc sets are different. poisons? no.

Ghost-Shot

I don't really think you get to complain if you aren't going to go out and get gear.

Durham

Still why separate the community like this? How do balance effectively with 2 PVP meta's?

BroanBeast1215

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Deny it or not, but the gap between metabuilds and non metabuilds is even higher than on a CP campaign. My craft only builds (who are not BIS, I know) at least work in CP PvP kinda well but no CP ist just a pain in the ass, it's completely pointless to join such a campaign without using broken stuff. I hope that at least all the whiners who complain over and over again about CP will be happy now and have a cool competition out of busted sets, because the brah with the cheesiest build wins in no CP.

"broken stuff"

"cheese builds"

why does everyone throw around these buzzwords? if you cant kill someone who's relying on proc sets to win...L2P!

CatchMeTrolling

This post literally makes no sense. The biggest problems with builds comes from cp, the cheesiest & most broken builds are because of CP. And I laughed when I seen no cp is less forgiving as if cp doesn't carry scrubs way more.

Expecting to run the same thing in no cp & still compete is a l2p issue and if anything shows the lack of theory crafting people have.

FlyLionel

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

This post literally makes no sense. The biggest problems with builds comes from cp, the cheesiest & most broken builds are because of CP. And I laughed when I seen no cp is less forgiving as if cp doesn't carry scrubs way more.

Expecting to run the same thing in no cp & still compete is a l2p issue and if anything shows the lack of theory crafting people have.

^ Here is one baby tip...Engine Guardian.

DeadlyRecluse

Rickter wrote: »

like, seriously? i pvp 5-6 nights a week. its a regular thing for me. I am not getting hit by poisons. i swear on everyone i hold dear this is the truth. like, roll a DC character and come pvp with me if you dont believe it. @Rickter2049

im sick and tired of the propaganda.

With you on this, 100%. I can't count on one hand the number of times where I died, it didn't feel right, and I could fairly blame poisons. TBH I don't think they are as strong in noCP as people think, as they are a sustain hurdle and most people in noCP are used to dealing with sustain issues.

Especially with the nerf to them. If I see a magicka cost poison on me, that's a great time to heavy attack...

Kartalin

Rickter wrote: »

I really dont run into too many people using poisons. maybe im not paying attention but i think its been grossly exaggerated. I regularly play in groups smaller than 5 and i regularly camp at Bruma and Vlastrus as well as taking part in larger scale fights like Ales Farm, Bleakers, Nikel you name it and very seldom to i fall victim to resource draining poisons, or poisons in general.

like, seriously? i pvp 5-6 nights a week. its a regular thing for me. I am not getting hit by poisons. i swear on everyone i hold dear this is the truth. like, roll a DC character and come pvp with me if you dont believe it. @Rickter2049

im sick and tired of the propaganda.

proc sets are different. poisons? no.

I get poisoned on my AD all the time. Maybe one faction participates more heavily in this than the others? Thank goodness for extended ritual.

DeHei

For good PvPler it really doesnt matter to have CP or not..

I know @Ragnaroek93 from duelling and he dont need any tips like "L2P".. really not..

I agree with him to 100% that there is a problem and need to be fixed... On non CP that crazy *** with procc sets is as much stronger as on CP campains. I like non CP too for around a month.. then i had more then 1 time a meeting with some guys, who played full damage on this non CP campain too and there was really no possibility to kill them or survive. A small group of Stamina guys in heavy armor, a small group of magicka sorcs, which only uses full damage builds or this procc set guys bring the death to everybody and you cant handle it.. On CP maps you are able to survive and fight with any build against them. So CP is much more fair.
The only reason to stay on non CP maps --> There are much weak guys, who dont have much experience like player have, who play since the beta! You feel like a wolf in a horde of sheeps

Brutusmax1mus

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Deny it or not, but the gap between metabuilds and non metabuilds is even higher than on a CP campaign. My craft only builds (who are not BIS, I know) at least work in CP PvP kinda well but no CP ist just a pain in the ass, it's completely pointless to join such a campaign without using broken stuff. I hope that at least all the whiners who complain over and over again about CP will be happy now and have a cool competition out of busted sets, because the brah with the cheesiest build wins in no CP.

I think a lot of people were having fun on the 30 day no cp campaign on the NA servers. It had almost as many people as the CP campaign, and I thought the game play was nice. faster paced for sure and less forgiving than CP but still fun.

Non cp faster paced??? What are you taking about...

Docmandu

BroanBeast1215 wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Deny it or not, but the gap between metabuilds and non metabuilds is even higher than on a CP campaign. My craft only builds (who are not BIS, I know) at least work in CP PvP kinda well but no CP ist just a pain in the ass, it's completely pointless to join such a campaign without using broken stuff. I hope that at least all the whiners who complain over and over again about CP will be happy now and have a cool competition out of busted sets, because the brah with the cheesiest build wins in no CP.

"broken stuff"

"cheese builds"

why does everyone throw around these buzzwords? if you cant kill someone who's relying on proc sets to win...L2P!

Indeed.. throwing around buzzwords like that is "cancer" !!

see what I did there

Sigtric

/shrug

I like no-CP pvp a whole lot more, myself.

NightbladeMechanics

What you mean to say is, "nerf proc sets and Troll King."

Magıc

Decent.

Joy_Division

Rickter wrote: »

I wear crafted sets. I do fine in noCP.

I really dont run into too many people using poisons. maybe im not paying attention but i think its been grossly exaggerated. I regularly play in groups smaller than 5 and i regularly camp at Bruma and Vlastrus as well as taking part in larger scale fights like Ales Farm, Bleakers, Nikel you name it and very seldom to i fall victim to resource draining poisons, or poisons in general.

like, seriously? i pvp 5-6 nights a week. its a regular thing for me. I am not getting hit by poisons. i swear on everyone i hold dear this is the truth. like, roll a DC character and come pvp with me if you dont believe it. @Rickter2049

im sick and tired of the propaganda.

proc sets are different. poisons? no.

You are right in that it happens infrequently. But that doesn't mean the complaints about resource poisons are propaganda.

Most of the people who PvP are just kind of there and don't min-max, don't spend a lot of resources on gear, poisons, etc., they are just average players. They aren't likely to be using resource poisons and even if that somehow do, more experienced players will be able to overcome that. So most of the time no poisons and no matter.

It's a lot like getting ganked by bad NB or dealing with a shield stacking sorc who isn't very good. Even though the mechanics are potentially OP in the right hands, it wont help them enough to overcome a good player.

The problem is when you run into someone of equal or higher skill. Now when they hit you with cost draining poisons and proc sets, your margin for error is much slimmer in no CP. So even though a player who is skilled and experienced is not going to be effected much by poisons, the times they do, it's going to leave an awful taste in their mouths because those are the fights that matter; they will beat PUGs pretty much regardless.

Subversus

Can't download the game atm (and don't really want to either tbh) but has the oblivion set + torugs and oblivion enchant + troll/bloodspawn cancer found it's way into pvp and duels yet? Gotta come soon, ***'s broken af

Malic

The problem is ZOS cant really come out and say that CP is breaking the game because of the investment they made into it after VR. They are to deep into it but anyone who has PVP'd for more then a month (and for those of us for 3 years forget it) can see clearly how silly the CP system became.

So they are trying to pull it back now. My issue is simply the dim wits that got it to this point are the ones who are charged with fixing it. Certainly not inspiring IMHO, I mean I have no faith in them at this point. The NO CP push is essentially a mia culpa "the CP system we designed is bad".

They'll never admit it but why would you invest and develop a trait tree system thats the heart of your end game char development and then implement end game content that excludes it?

AbraXuSeXile

Malic wrote: »

The problem is ZOS cant really come out and say that CP is breaking the game because of the investment they made into it after VR. They are to deep into it but anyone who has PVP'd for more then a month (and for those of us for 3 years forget it) can see clearly how silly the CP system became.

So they are trying to pull it back now. My issue is simply the dim wits that got it to this point are the ones who are charged with fixing it. Certainly not inspiring IMHO, I mean I have no faith in them at this point. The NO CP push is essentially a mia culpa "the CP system we designed is bad".

They'll never admit it but why would you invest and develop a trait tree system thats the heart of your end game char development and then implement end game content that excludes it?

Pretty much it, their long term grind system was a mistake now they will gradually wean you off it.

Derra

Harness magica and trollking still need to get pummeled. Stupid bullpoo requiring no second thoughts.

Brrrofski

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

What you mean to say is, "nerf proc sets and Troll King."

No CP isn't the issue, stupid crap like what Kena said and poisons are the issue.

Derra

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

What you mean to say is, "nerf proc sets and Troll King."

Still without those nonCP is still not as fast paced as the prepatch CP combat.

The game has slowed down considerably - again only for experienced players. I have no idea how zos manages to make the game less fun for their existing playerbase without actually improving it for new players.

Rickter

@Joy_Division

I agree with you. But what you said can be said about everything. Anything in this game in the right hands can be "OP" - there are people crying in the General Discussion right now about STAMPLARS - stamplars are extremely deadly in the right hands and ive experienced this first hand post patch in bgs and wayrest duels.

The point is though: that the "right hands" are few. ZOS has talked about the 1%, players have referred to the 1% - i believe the individuals you speak of (the ones that have the right hands to utilize an OP set up) are even less than 1%

I mean, ultimately i agree with you. in the right hands, certain setups are really OP. how common that is may be irrelevant now that im reading your argument a little better. But do i think you should swear off noCP PvP because of it? no. I think youd be surprised at how fast youd melt people in a noCP campaign. Siege? so what? im dipping and dodging siege all day every day. its up to the individual player to press the alt key, shield up, heal up and hop back on siege in between shots.

Prince_of_all_Pugs

Rickter wrote: »

I wear crafted sets. I do fine in noCP.

I really dont run into too many people using poisons. maybe im not paying attention but i think its been grossly exaggerated. I regularly play in groups smaller than 5 and i regularly camp at Bruma and Vlastrus as well as taking part in larger scale fights like Ales Farm, Bleakers, Nikel you name it and very seldom to i fall victim to resource draining poisons, or poisons in general.

like, seriously? i pvp 5-6 nights a week. its a regular thing for me. I am not getting hit by poisons. i swear on everyone i hold dear this is the truth. like, roll a DC character and come pvp with me if you dont believe it. @Rickter2049

im sick and tired of the propaganda.

proc sets are different. poisons? no.

if your running around with 8 plus at all times and with templar purge bots you wont notice poisons like this lovely gentleman.

Joy_Division

Rickter wrote: »

@Joy_Division

I agree with you. But what you said can be said about everything. Anything in this game in the right hands can be "OP" - there are people crying in the General Discussion right now about STAMPLARS - stamplars are extremely deadly in the right hands and ive experienced this first hand post patch in bgs and wayrest duels.

The point is though: that the "right hands" are few. ZOS has talked about the 1%, players have referred to the 1% - i believe the individuals you speak of (the ones that have the right hands to utilize an OP set up) are even less than 1%

I mean, ultimately i agree with you. in the right hands, certain setups are really OP. how common that is may be irrelevant now that im reading your argument a little better. But do i think you should swear off noCP PvP because of it? no. I think youd be surprised at how fast youd melt people in a noCP campaign. Siege? so what? im dipping and dodging siege all day every day. its up to the individual player to press the alt key, shield up, heal up and hop back on siege in between shots.

Not everything. I can compete against an equally or even more skilled person trying to min-max Blood Alter, the Jailbreaker set, a Bow oriented build, a magicka DK, etc. The whole concept of 'imbalance" means that certain mechanics are overperforming as such whereas what had been previously competitive is now no longer.

Besides, you aren't refuting the existence of OP poisons, merely how often you come across them. If they are OP, then they are OP. Am I too believe that you are so skilled that less than 1% of the PvP population presents are problem for you when using OP stuff? Well, for us mere mortals, the issue is more prevalent and representative of the entire problem with this patch: the totality of these nerfs have biased the "ceiling" of the ESO community.

To be clear I don't swear of no-CP because of resource poisons. I dislike no-CP because the game has been designed with CP in mind (such as proc sets, the very nerfs that have come with Morrowind update), certain rules have been implemented because of CP (such as BattleSprirt) dodge penalty, blocking, etc,), combat mechanics have been change because of CP (Spells have increased in cost multiple times since the 1.5 release: off the top of my head, the implementation of the CP system, the "normalization" ZoS did when removing veteran ranks, the adjustment for VR14 to VR16), and that every class is running around in a neutered state because every patch since the Imperial City has been one giant nerf-fest because of CPs, which are no longer accessible (albeit some that wont be named less than others). At least people have stopped trying to claim no-CP is like 1.5 because it's nothing like 1.5.

No they just claim that no-CP fixes a lot of what's wrong with CP. But they downplay the new problems no-CP creates.

Asgari

My issue with no cp is that every is running the same builds. They made all of these cp changes and base game changes and then just push for less build diversity.