Any plans to adjust AP "rewards" for repairing keeps?

Cavedog

So, as has been discussed before, it currently costs AP to perform repairs to keep walls and doors. The AP that it costs is notably more than you recieve as a "reward" for doing the repairs.

Shouldn't the "reward" for repairing the keep at least be economically neutral?....rather than cost AP that you don't get back?

Does anyone know, are there any plans to balance this inequality in pvp? (my understanding is this issue has not been addressed with Morrowind)

doublestuffed

Considering the amount of AP gained from offensive and defensive ticks, I don't think you should get more AP for repairing walls. Repairing walls is a team related aspect of the game and should cost a minimal amount of AP when multiple people are repairing. Just like sieging and putting down forward camps, it should cost AP.

Elsterchen

Well, if you really like to play without walls just ask for a cost related to rebuilding. Even now there are so many drawn down postern doors, half set-up walls and towers that its a shame.

So no, i do not feel it should change, it rewards what... 30 AP ? Its not like one can go "farm" AP this way. ;D

IcyDeadPeople

just buy them with gold instead of AP

NBrookus

Doesn't need changing. AP gets handed out like candy.

Hempyre

Go get a delve buff.

Profit.

Cavedog

doublestuffed wrote: »

Considering the amount of AP gained from offensive and defensive ticks, I don't think you should get more AP for repairing walls. Repairing walls is a team related aspect of the game and should cost a minimal amount of AP when multiple people are repairing. Just like sieging and putting down forward camps, it should cost AP.

Now isn't that just like an ex; show up out of the blue just to be contradictory.

It's true that there is plenty of AP to be had.....my complaint was that this part of how the AP is awarded be adjusted to encourage people to do repairs, not discourage doing repairs.....but I guess it just depends on the effect the developers are trying to create.

Lieblingsjunge

Cavedog wrote: »

doublestuffed wrote: »

Considering the amount of AP gained from offensive and defensive ticks, I don't think you should get more AP for repairing walls. Repairing walls is a team related aspect of the game and should cost a minimal amount of AP when multiple people are repairing. Just like sieging and putting down forward camps, it should cost AP.

Now isn't that just like an ex; show up out of the blue just to be contradictory.

It's true that there is plenty of AP to be had.....my complaint was that this part of how the AP is awarded be adjusted to encourage people to do repairs, not discourage doing repairs.....but I guess it just depends on the effect the developers are trying to create.

Well. You can invest 1 million into building something - it doesn't always mean you'll get 1 million back, does it? If it would, everyone who invested in something, would profit. But they don't. Investing in repair kits is something you do for your alliance => You get a small amount of AP back => You climb leaderboards, HYPE!

Glamdring

I get 115 AP for each repairtick still i loose AP repairing. Lower the cost at merchant to atleast 100 AP pls.

kijima

Is this even a thread?

Cahnces are, if you can't get the AP you want from repairing, then you sure as hell won't get it from actuallly PvP'ing.

mvffins

kijima wrote: »

Is this even a thread?

Cahnces are, if you can't get the AP you want from repairing, then you sure as hell won't get it from actuallly PvP'ing.

The problem is that someone eventually needs to step up and buy repair kits to defend a keep successfully, and someone also needs to eventually step up and buy siege weapons in order to successfully take a keep, however there is no AP incentive for that individual as in actuality he is essentially giving up his AP for the profit of others. Ya you get AP by repairing walls, but while you're the one repairing it another player is getting kills, and it is not that strange to think that in the time spent buying and setting up siege equipment you could of roughly killed someone also.

I see people setting up sieges and repairing the wall as necessary sacrifices, and selfishly try to push that role onto others as much as possible for the simple reason that it is not worth it as an individual if someone else is willing to do it.

NightbladeMechanics

You gain rank and leaderboard standing for pressing Q a hundred times in a row -- and not even at a player, either. If you don't like repairing, then don't do it, but it's already plenty rewarding.

Cavedog

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

Cavedog wrote: »

doublestuffed wrote: »

Considering the amount of AP gained from offensive and defensive ticks, I don't think you should get more AP for repairing walls. Repairing walls is a team related aspect of the game and should cost a minimal amount of AP when multiple people are repairing. Just like sieging and putting down forward camps, it should cost AP.

Now isn't that just like an ex; show up out of the blue just to be contradictory.

It's true that there is plenty of AP to be had.....my complaint was that this part of how the AP is awarded be adjusted to encourage people to do repairs, not discourage doing repairs.....but I guess it just depends on the effect the developers are trying to create.

Well. You can invest 1 million into building something - it doesn't always mean you'll get 1 million back, does it? If it would, everyone who invested in something, would profit. But they don't. Investing in repair kits is something you do for your alliance => You get a small amount of AP back => You climb leaderboards, HYPE!

ESO is a game, it's not real life.

Getting AP is not the issue....it's not....but equitable rewarding of AP is not happening at present. If you do the math, you lose AP to do repairs, you don't gain it. You shouldn't gain a lot of AP for doing repairs, but the result should be a positive number, not a negative one. That's all. At present, you lose AP to do repairs. That doesn't make any sense.

Cavedog

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

You gain rank and leaderboard standing for pressing Q a hundred times in a row -- and not even at a player, either. If you don't like repairing, then don't do it, but it's already plenty rewarding.

You lose AP when you do repairs, you don't gain it. Check the costs vs. rewards.

Turelus

I don't think we need a system which means two players of opposite factions can turn AP into more AP without any issues.

Go to quiet resource, siege tower to 55%, friend repairs turning the AP they made into even more AP, buys more kits, repeat.

CyrusArya

Ehh..if we're talking economics, repairing broken assets is not very profitable. Nor should it be when that entails standing there and spamming a button. But making sacrifice for the good of your faction is in itself the greatest reward conceivable, is it not alliance war role players?

Korpsy666

Sorry repairing Wall and door is just a little aspect of the war, considering then a REAL PVP GROUP Always repair the building as a group before they left for an other castle, I never have to use more then 5 ressource and the wall is repaire. I really anjoy repairing stuff as CyriusArya said. Its a little sacrifice for th faction.

Just hope you don't think the a purple item should be a great reward for the little sacrefice.

Makato

I don't get this , you want more ap for spamming 1 button at a wall and farming your way up the leaderboards with the lame excuse of defending your keep ?... You repairing keeps is ur own choice, you know what you will get for it... if you dont like the amount you get for it don't do it try actual pvp maybe ,spend your ap to get full akaviri instead of rocks and wood... this way of gaining does not need a buff , it will only screw over the ppl who actually kill and defend stuff and try to get on the leaderboards by PvPing and not PvWalling ,come with a better excuse than "balance" cuz it's just a selfish post to make sure YOU get rewarded for spamming your E button in a keep that no enemy gas been for two days...

Makato

Cavedog wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

You gain rank and leaderboard standing for pressing Q a hundred times in a row -- and not even at a player, either. If you don't like repairing, then don't do it, but it's already plenty rewarding.

You lose AP when you do repairs, you don't gain it. Check the costs vs. rewards.

Read it again cuz it's he's talking bout leaderboard scores not ap differences...

Cavedog

Makato wrote: »

I don't get this , you want more ap for spamming 1 button at a wall and farming your way up the leaderboards with the lame excuse of defending your keep ?... You repairing keeps is ur own choice, you know what you will get for it... if you dont like the amount you get for it don't do it try actual pvp maybe ,spend your ap to get full akaviri instead of rocks and wood... this way of gaining does not need a buff , it will only screw over the ppl who actually kill and defend stuff and try to get on the leaderboards by PvPing and not PvWalling ,come with a better excuse than "balance" cuz it's just a selfish post to make sure YOU get rewarded for spamming your E button in a keep that no enemy gas been for two days...

Math much?

It costs more ap to do repairs than you get back. That's the only discrepancy I'm talking about. It doesn't make any sense that you LOSE AP to do repairs, you don't gain it. The repair item costs more in AP than is "refunded" by doing the repair. I'm not complaining about not getting enough AP. Read it again, because I'm not talking about the overall amount of AP doled out, only that this one aspect doesn't make any sense. You will never get on the leader board by doing repairs.

This is not about the leaders, this is about the pug's that use AP as an excuse not to siege or repair.

Makato

@Cavedog

Cavedog wrote: »

You will never get on the leader board by doing repairs.

you will with ap buff and/or major mending ... i dunno if u know but everyone on top 10 is reparing walls the second there is no fight going on ...
And math much lol ... it's a fact not a calculation
and let's face it you spent ap and you expect the same amount in return or more ...
it's like going to the lottery and blaming them for you not winning enough ..
mate you gain rank and leaderboard position with repairing walls that's 2 plusses on ur one minus that isn't even a minus in my opinion...
i mean let's say you get the same amount for a repair as u spend on it .. so one rock = 300ap , then add ap buff 20% more ap and major mending 25% more healing wich applies to walls = 435 ap for one repair that's 135 ap more
and fully repairing a keep will take let's say 100 stones cuz u like math and stuff 135x100 ... 13500 ap gained with the 30k ap you will get from repairing that's a 43.5k jump of ap and you will know how long it takes to use 100 stones even if u capped the gain at 300 ap for 1 rep so u get back what you spent you will still jump 30k up leads for doing nothing , do that 10 times wich will prolly take like 1h max and u have 300k up leads...

A didn't math before but u didn't either .. i still think ur idea doesn't make sense and be honest it's more a farm then it is to "help" ur campaign...

Sanctum74

The reward you get for repairing walls is not having the enemy storm back in and take your keep. The ap is just a bonus. I could also complain about how much ap i lose from seiging, but its a necesary part of the game and there are some people that will just never repair or seige no matter how much incentive you give.

As a mostly solo player i still repair and seige yet i am still able to make millions in ap profit each campaign. I think this is fair and working as intended.

NirnStorm

@Cavedog

I totally get what you're saying, I play on the same campaign and faction as you, and am well aware how few people actually bother to repair keep walls, while most players just leave them down and run away chasing another potato.
Upping the rewards you get from repairing would sure help getting more people to repair their damn walls.

On the other hand, I can easily see how people can take advantage of this.
Without naming anyone specifically, we all know some players don't bother to PvP and just want to get the rank without hard work. Those would just sit in keeps and repair non stop, never having to do anything active and just get their high PvP ranks and leaderboard ranks for absolutely no contribution to the campaign and without participating in fights.
I think we need to find a better solution than just 'fixing' the rewards.

Prince_of_all_Pugs

Lothar wolf

Cavedog

Sanctum74 wrote: »

The reward you get for repairing walls is not having the enemy storm back in and take your keep. The ap is just a bonus. I could also complain about how much ap i lose from seiging, but its a necesary part of the game and there are some people that will just never repair or seige no matter how much incentive you give.

As a mostly solo player i still repair and seige yet i am still able to make millions in ap profit each campaign. I think this is fair and working as intended.

Earning AP is not a problem. Earning AP is not the point I'm trying to make. There is plenty of AP to go around.....I buy everything I need with AP, and still have more than 5 million ap banked. (yes, I have all the Akiviri motifs too)

The focus of my post is to encourage lowbies that don't have much AP to work with to repair and siege, rather than hang back and claim they don't have enough AP to participate.

And, I agree with nirnstorm and other posters too, that giving too much AP for repairs could encourage "ap mining" by repairing.....but I was only addressing the compartmentalized issue of how to encourage those with very little AP to participate with repairing and seiging. So I guess if they fix the discrepancy I am discussing, changes will need to be made in other ways to help balance the rewards system.