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Spear Change, a Step in the Wrong Direction.

utb99
utb99
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Magplars have been begging for either Blazing Spear to be given its stun back or for Luminous to stun bc its disorient is garbage. Instead you remove the disorient entirely and leave Magplars with one less CC. A complete step in the wrong direction.
Edited by utb99 on April 28, 2017 9:36PM
'The gods can turn anything to good' -Martin Septim
  • timidobserver
    timidobserver
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    2 CC left.
    Edited by timidobserver on April 28, 2017 9:01PM
    V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
    V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
    V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
    V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
    V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)

  • wimhwimladimf
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    More like they realized that dmg, CC + self heals was too much of a cancer, so they cut some of it.
  • Ron_Burgundy_79
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    utb99 wrote: »
    Magplars have been begging for either Blazing Spear to be given its stun back or for Luminous to stun bc its disorient is garbage. Instead you remove the disorient entirely and leave Magplars with one less CC. A complete step in the wrong direction.
    I watched the show and came to the conclusion that the people who came up with the vision for the Templar at Launch no longer worked for ZoS.

    It's an asinine change. The devs either don't read our feedback or don't care what we have to say. I'm not sure which is worse.

    I'll go ahead and tag for the hell of it.

    @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_BrianWheeler @Wrobel

  • Ron_Burgundy_79
    Ron_Burgundy_79
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    2 CC left.

    3 cc's down. 2 to go.
  • Poliwrath
    Poliwrath
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    Idk what you were thinking with this change ZOS but please revert it...
  • Firerock2
    Firerock2
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    They've been stepping in the wrong direction since 1.6. I'll check on the forums in the future just to see what they decide to nerf next on Templars
  • Doctordarkspawn
    Doctordarkspawn
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    I watched the show and came to the conclusion that the people who came up with the vision for the Templar at Launch no longer worked for ZoS.

    Fun fact.

    The staff changed and got cut shortly after Craglorn's release. From imperial city forward, the people who created the game usually all went to go develop Camelot unchained.

    In short, no! They dont! And have not for years. Explains -most- of the crappy balance dunit?
    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!

    To me, the measure of a man is whether or not he fights for his principles. It does not matter if you never had a chance to begin with. The deck could be stacked, the game rigged against you. You fight to the bitter end, because it is worth fighting for.

    NA-PC Tank player only.
  • GallantGuardian
    GallantGuardian
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    Why are they doing this and not making it a multi target root/stun what are you thinking zos
  • Marto
    Marto
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    Templars already have a stun... you know, Aurora Javelin.

    If you want an AoE DoT CC ability that restores resources... you're definitely asking for too much.
    "According to the calculations of the sages of the Cult of the Ancestor Moth, the batam guar is the cutest creature in all Tamriel"
  • maxjapank
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    I watched the show and came to the conclusion that the people who came up with the vision for the Templar at Launch no longer worked for ZoS.

    omg! I knew I shouldn't be reading the forums during a meeting. Everyone was wondering why I suddenly burst out laughing.
    Alchuri Templar Healer /dps
  • MehrunesFlagon
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    this works out better for pve honestly.since tanks can now get both back. Could care less about a cc.
  • Lore_lai
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    @Joy_Division
    No - I still use Blazing to this day - I *will* however switch to Luminous if these changes go through.
    I just personally think that with the way they are making the resource returns on Luminous, it will be in a good place and a CC on top of it will be overkill.
    And yes - I would rather have a good CC elsewhere than an oversaturated skill.
    meraki
    Heisenzerg | Adamant
    ~Repentance Abuser~

  • Ron_Burgundy_79
    Ron_Burgundy_79
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    Lore_lai wrote: »
    @Joy_Division
    No - I still use Blazing to this day - I *will* however switch to Luminous if these changes go through.
    I just personally think that with the way they are making the resource returns on Luminous, it will be in a good place and a CC on top of it will be overkill.
    And yes - I would rather have a good CC elsewhere than an oversaturated skill.

    Joy wants the stun added to blazing spear now that luminous returns resources to the templar and a player when synergized along with the damage buff. A stun would make blazing spear a viable choice again.
    Lore_lai wrote: »
    Sorry guys, but I strongly disagree.
    As much as I would love to have a proper CC on shards - the stupid disorient was hurting more than it did good.
    Coupled with the resource changes on synergy they are putting on Luminous Shards, I think they found a very good middle-ground! A CC on it would make the skill too strong!

    I'm actually really happy with how they thought this out! @Wrobel genuine congratulations! :)
    Can you please tell us if the way you change Luminous synergy will work the same for the casting Templar when someone synergizes the shard? AKA - restore main resource and half of secondary resource. (please let this be the case)
    @ZOS_GinaBruno
    • Blazing: AoE, Stuns, DoTs, always returns stamina.
    • Luminous: AoE, returns stamina and some magicka, some resources to templar (since Zos wants to do that and makes up for the disorient loss)

    Edited by Ron_Burgundy_79 on April 29, 2017 3:36PM
  • austinwalter87ub17_ESO
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    The changes that need to occur with Templar is basically an entire overhaul.

    There's no point in asking anymore. The devas want to get paid a full salary for minimal work. I did more work for free as a private server dev then most official game devs do.
    Edited by austinwalter87ub17_ESO on April 29, 2017 10:47PM
    PC and PS4 (bring back character transfers please?)
    Templar Extraordinaire
  • Turelus
    Turelus
    Community Ambassador
    I watched the show and came to the conclusion that the people who came up with the vision for the Templar at Launch no longer worked for ZoS.
    Wasn't Wrobel the one who made pretty much every ability in the game?

    There was a podcast interview with him where he said about how he was tasked to come up with a bunch of cool skills and that's what he did.
    @Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
    :: Unofficial Forums FAQ :: MissBizz ESO Guides :: AlcastHQ Guides :: Tamriel Foundry Forums :: UESP ESO Page :: ESO Sets :: Woeler Tank Guides :: ESO Community Discord ::
    "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."
  • timidobserver
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    @ZOS_RichLambert Nobody is running Luminous Shards for damage. Why are you adding a damage buff to this ability? If you can't fix the disorient and are, for some reason, unwilling to just make it a stun or root, just leave it alone. I'll take a gimped, borked, barely functional disorient over a mediocre damage buff any day.
    V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
    V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
    V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
    V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
    V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)

  • Valkyn_Eltrys
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    Arbitrator wrote: »
    Make Aedric Spear
    More like they realized that dmg, CC + self heals was too much of a cancer, so they cut some of it.

    SOME? LOL

    Templar is a joke class. Its clearly not designed to be anything BUT a healer.

    In pve they're strong. I hit 40k dps how are they a joke class?

    Wanna know a joke class? Magicka Nightblade.
    @Blackbird_V - PC EU

    Blackbird V - DD Magicka Templar / Breton
    Valkyn Fumus - DD Magicka Dragonknight / Breton
    Ąrtorias - DD Stamina Templar / Imperial
    Yannick Eltrys - StamDK / Imperial
    Teløs StamDK / Dunmer
  • Valkyn_Eltrys
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    Marto wrote: »
    Templars already have a stun... you know, Aurora Javelin.

    If you want an AoE DoT CC ability that restores resources... you're definitely asking for too much.

    I agree and i think luminous shards got an amazing change. Probably pvpers qqing as always.

    Want a stun on a Templar? The lighting staff force pulse (or whatever), aurora javelin, their gap closer.. aoe dot resource restore is too strong, and this is coming from me who loves Templar.

    Luminous is great for healers now, and extra damage is better than nothing.
    @Blackbird_V - PC EU

    Blackbird V - DD Magicka Templar / Breton
    Valkyn Fumus - DD Magicka Dragonknight / Breton
    Ąrtorias - DD Stamina Templar / Imperial
    Yannick Eltrys - StamDK / Imperial
    Teløs StamDK / Dunmer
  • Arbitrator
    Arbitrator
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    I'm so sick of hearing this garbage. Why should I have to use another trees AoE CC because the game developers refuse to give me one in my class trees that fits my theme properly? A Templar, wielding the power of the LIGHT should be blinding enemies more than any other class. I don't want to use a damn staff!

    Every. Single. Class. Gets an AoE CC in their class that FITS their class theme EXCEPT Templar! Please tell me how that is alright.

    Tanking in this game requires controlling enemies "PLURAL" to keep your teammates alive. Tanking as a Templar is not tanking to keep other people alive, it's simply surviving using abilities to stay alive.

    It's also not just PvP'ers "QQ'ing." It's every single person who WANTS to play the theme of a Templar since day 1. This class has been badly designed from the get go and it all stems from the fact that we have a healing tree that has been poorly designed since the start of the game.
  • utb99
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    ZoS said they were gonna fix Luminous Shards' useless Disorient when they took out Blazing Spear's stun. I was a little salty but I was content.

    Now that they fully took out the CC from LS instead of turning it into a usable stun, ZoS has no excuse or logic on why they took out Blazing Spear's stun. Our Promised House is being dismembered patch by patch!

    Again, No One ever complained about the stun from BS. Even Templar Haters who bash on the class (Fengrush :heart: ) complain about BoL and Heavy Armor, not their CC from BS.

    For PvE, the only case where the CC got in the way was if you interfered with the tank's chaining in of mobs. There is a solution to this, DON'T STUN THEM. By God with that logic we should take out Frag's stun as well. If anything, this hurt Magplars in vma.

    Toppling Charge and Aurora Javelin are not reliable CCs.

    Toppling can bug out, can be shuffled, you stun yourself while inside an eclipse, has a minimum range, you cant block cast it, and you are vulnerable mid flight.

    Aurora Javelin is shuffable, can be reflected, costs way too much, and is easy to block/D-Roll.

    Blazing Spear's stun went through shuffle, went through D-Roll, and it was centered on you if you wanted it to, and you could block cast it. It's not even comparable to the other two options. It was strong but wasnt OP because you could easily block the ability which was slow or you could move out of the radius which was small. Again, no one complained about how OP the stun was....

    Blazing Spear's CC fit the them of the Templar's House well. It punished players that got close and provided a little AoE dot centered on yourself. Toppling requires you to move away from your house and Aurora pushes ppl out side it. Both don't compliment the grand scheme at all.
    Edited by utb99 on April 30, 2017 1:40PM
    'The gods can turn anything to good' -Martin Septim
  • KingJ
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    @Wrobel do your job for once and give templars back there CC.
  • Narvuntien
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    The problem is that now it gives only the max resource back how can you support your Magicka tank when they need stamina to block?
  • Idinuse
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    Lore_lai wrote: »
    Sorry guys, but I strongly disagree.
    As much as I would love to have a proper CC on shards - the stupid disorient was hurting more than it did good.
    Coupled with the resource changes on synergy they are putting on Luminous Shards, I think they found a very good middle-ground! A CC on it would make the skill too strong!

    I'm actually really happy with how they thought this out! @Wrobel genuine congratulations! :)
    Can you please tell us if the way you change Luminous synergy will work the same for the casting Templar when someone synergizes the shard? AKA - restore main resource and half of secondary resource. (please let this be the case)
    @ZOS_GinaBruno

    Normally I agree with everything you say.

    Like everything about the Templar (except Backlash), it was better the way it once was and I'll will not give ZoS any kudos simply because their hatchet job on this skill is a little less butchered.

    I'm guessing you use Luminous shards exclusively, which is fine, but for those of us who use Blazing Spear this change [email protected]#&king sucks. I use it and not only I am still incapable of stunning anything now I still have no control over of what resource I give back and if I pick up a shard in PvP I'm still going to get back magicka when I need stamina.

    They took the stun off Blazing Spear because they promised us that they would make Luminous have a decent CC. Well they can't figure it out, which then makes their reasoning for the Blazing nerf moot, yet the nerf is still there.

    It's the same thing with the puncturing Sweeps nerf.

    Here is why nerfs should never just be accepted. During the Orsinium patch, I posted that Puncturing Sweeps received an undocumented 5% nerf to healing. Believe or not, I actually had a ZoS representative reply directly to me.
    ZOS_KNowak wrote: »
    Joy_Division,

    Thanks for bringing this to our attention. This change was intended, and we apologize for missing the patch note for it. Ultimately, the rationale was that the change to the Focused Healing passive means Puncturing Sweep is now eligible for that healing bonus and will heal for more than compared to Live. So we reduced Puncturing Sweep's healing by 5% to compensate; in the end, it's still a net buff to total healing.

    In short, it was nerfed because it was counterbalanced due to healing buffs elsewhere, you guessed it: the Major Mending passive! So ZoS took away Major Mending and thus their logic is no longer applicable. This on top of losing it’s chance to crit and will do less damage to begin with in the upcoming update. Of course, they forgot all about the entire justification for the stealth nerf to Puncturing Sweeps and thus the nerf lives on in permanence.

    Both versions of the spell worked fine before ZoS "improved" them and should have remained the basis for adjustment in this patch.
    • Blazing: AoE, Stuns, DoTs, always returns stamina.
    • Luminous: AoE, returns stamina and some magicka, some resources to templar (since Zos wants to do that and makes up for the disorient loss)

    That has very much been the modus operandi for Zos in regards to Templars. They've justified nerfs with reasons that are no longer valid, and yet they still keep nerfing the class instead of going back and fixing what was then broken.

    It's clear that no one currently working at Zos have any sort of idea what the class was and what to do with it.

    They have kept playing and buffing their favourite classes they themselves play. We all remember when the entire office screamed "Boohaaa! This is SPARTAAAA" while flapping wings and playing DKs, then the sneaky era began with IC and TG and the NBs were their favorite toy. After that it has (evidently form screenshots and streams) been the Sorcerers.

    How about they make Templars their favourite toy of the year for once?

    Oh wait, no right.
    The Warden is coming....
    Edited by Idinuse on May 1, 2017 2:57PM
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