Back Bar - Is there ever any, ANY scenario where non sharp is OK?

WarpigFunk

Maybe charged for lightning to proc off balance? But that's not relevant for me.

decisive lightning, powered inferno, defending ice ... those are the only Maelstrom staffs I've gotten.

The excuse machine in my head says "oh, well powered will give me more healing from surge... or oh, well decisive will mean more ultis ... or oh defending ice will be good for a warden..."
etc ...

But I've read exhaustively that it's sharpened or bust with these things.
My real question is - sharp lightning rando staff back bar, or decisive maelstrom lightning back bar. Am I really not better off with the Maelstrom weapon?
I'm itching to gold this thing out ... but the DPS *** in me is saying, nope- looks nice but it's worthless. Can I make up for the mitigation with buffed LA weaves and spell damage?

Am I deluding myself? Stick with the rando staff on the back?

dpencil

I tested precise vMA fire vs random sharp. Sharp won.

WarpigFunk

... so lame.

but there's always next time.

Nolic1

Unless your playing min max you can use what ever trait on the weapon you want its just the min max that says sharp is best in slot.

Cronopoly

I Tank with non sharp but then my DPS is not what I'm there for primarily. I've long ago given up on sharpened farming.

Oddly enough I got a BWS sharpened sword when I finally gave up trying to get it and had respecced Destro broom for PVP on my DK. Now it's sitting in my bank. Wish I could sell it but ZOS screwed that up. Wonder what it would have been worth if we were still in a BOE world..?

TARAFRAKA

Short answer NO. Long answer NOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

Masel

Using the spinner 5-piece allows you to use non-sharpened staffs and get very good results too.

In solo and 4-man play, that can be better than sharpened by a mile, E.g. With charged staffs, lightning blockade and a shock enchant to keep off-balance up all the time with the exploiter passive or with a fire enchant and fire blockade to keep the enemy burning all the time and benefit from the 20% damage buff from blockade.
And no, don't tell me all healers run lightning blockade now, because that is far from the case and most healers that do don't keep the lightning blockade up nearly 100% of the time.

Plus you don't need to farm sharpened vMA staffs that way. Min-Maxers will probably roast me for this again but you can do very good dps with this setup.

SolarCat02

In PvE, you can forego Sharpened if:
- You are a tank or healer
- Your group stacks penitration debuffs
- You stack penitration debuffs
- Special circumstances depending on your build and rotation (example: a stamDK with DoT-heavy rotation and Twice-Fanged Serpent can get more damage with Infused Maelstrom dual-wield weapons than Sharpened ones with the right weapons and rotation).

In PvP, you can forego Sharpened weapons if:
- You are a tank or healer

I think that's pretty much it?

Lieblingsjunge

Powered or Defending back bar is usually decent, on magicka classes anyway.

I know some nightblades go Powered on their 2h bow, since that's where they got Vigour and stuff.
So ye, it's definitely viable. And I've seen more people use Decicive as well.

WarpigFunk

Just as a side note.... I ran Maelstrom 4 times yesterday.

decisive lightning staff, powered greatsword, sharpened bow, sharpened greatsword. 0_o

I'm really proficient at looting maelstrom weapons for stam builds. In the (probably under 30) runs I've done, I've gotten a precise bow, a sharpened bow, a sharpened maul, a sharpened greatsword, and a sharpened dagger.
But I get **** all for staffs, lol.

Tempah

I don't have a good answer. but when I tried it out my precise lightning ma staff did more damage then my random inferno sharp. this might be because I am only on my backbar to quickly reapply my aoe.

AAbrigo

I use powered on my backbar(magplar) since all my buffs and healing are there and powered is better for the purpose..

WarpigFunk

Tempah wrote: »

I don't have a good answer. but when I tried it out my precise lightning ma staff did more damage then my random inferno sharp. this might be because I am only on my backbar to quickly reapply my aoe.

If I found a precise one I'd use it. I stack mag for max scamp dmg, so Im lacking crit - I use potions for crit mostly. but yea my back bar is just for AOE and power surge. Ticks of LL and EB will hit for marginally less with precise vs sharpened, but I think the spell damage and LA buffs makes it a net positive. I dunno though, cant find one anyway so for me it's moot lol.

DjMuscleboy02

I think it depends on what you're playing. I main a magdk and the only things affected by the off trait vma are back bar light attacks, first tick of eruption, the first tick of foo after a reapplication, the last 3 ticks of blockade when you reapply back bar dots, and traps dot. Blockade takes on the trait of your front bar when you swap so that's fine. But the light attack damage you gain is huge and not missing any light attacks definitely makes it net more damage. I am on console so I can't really say for certain the exact numbers, but my dummy parses lose quite a bit using a sharpened random staff back bar over a non-sharp vma.

For a sorc however, curse and LL both take on the trait of whichever bar it was casted on. Blockade still switches, but you still lose alot of LL and curse damage from the off trait. I haven't tested this one at all pretty much and since I don't have a sharpened Vma/they're bugged I run two MD staves for trials. But in the short tests I did a few days ago I was averaging 37kish with double inferno and no pet with defending vma back bar (moved curse to front) and 36k with a sharpened random back bar.

You absolutely have to have sharpened main bar though.

WarpigFunk

I was under the impression that blockade takes the trait from the bar it's cast on ... this is not the case?

DjMuscleboy02

WarpigFunk wrote: »

I was under the impression that blockade takes the trait from the bar it's cast on ... this is not the case?

No, use blockade with a non sharpened staff and watch the tick then switch. You'll notice it increases.

Edit: I believe blazing spears are the same.

Masel

Single target dots use the impact bar, so the bar where the initial hit arrives. Ground AoEs use the current bar, so they adapt their damage to the bar you're currently on.

So if you use the back bar only as a buff bar and don't spend much time on it, having a non-sharpened vma staff there won't have that much effect and the additional damage from weaving will outperform that. Problem with vMA staffs is that the enchantment is bugged so that only one crushing wall blockade can affect an enemy at once. Simply try to put all single target dots on your front bar.

Or you can put one single target dot (such as poison injection) on the back bar and bar swap cancel it on distance because it will then use your front bar. Gotta practice it a little and it gets difficult in close range, bur it works.

STEVIL

if your backbar is not something you linger on - quickly re-apply buffs - and its where your busrt heal is then powered backbar may be good for you.

or in like 99% of the content that isn't end game trials.

Jitterbug

I use powered on my resto back bar for pvp.

It makes a little sense, but mostly it's because snip it! I will not spend my play time hovering over a boss spawn to do 1.5k more dps for 2 months.

Apherius

this depend of your class . if you are Magsorc for exemple , you only stay 5 sec for put your dots on your back bar with your Decisive lightning maesltrom weapon . there is no problem as long as your main weapons is sharpened . you will just lose a liitle amount of dps on your first dot tick .