Why everyone hates Mazzatun?

De_Mysteriis

Seriously. It's kinda discouraging when people are leaving at once saying "Ah, Mazzatun again!" or even in the middle of the run without a word. Personally I like it for great mechanics, I don't mind explaining it to new players, I don't mind low-level players. I don't farm it for gear, just got there recently several times doing daily pledges and forced to abandon it due to players leaving and impossibility of finding replacements.

Nidro

because its horrible to Play it with PUGs.
Really disgusting mechanics Overall..

I mean i like dungeon with mechanics, just not These Kind of mechanincs u have in there.

greylox

It's a knightmare.

Far too hard for most pugs.

Toughest 4 man IMO.

Tyrion87

You can pretty much skip most of this dungeon by sneaking past the mobs. The problem is that if you want to do vRoM in hard mode, you need ALL your group members to be really good in their roles. Even one weak link usually dooms the entire group if hard mode is activated. And there is no reason to do it on veteran, if you aren't going to do the HM (2 keys). That's why pugs usually do mazzatun in normal mode, while organized groups aim for vet HM. vRoM is pretty easy except for the final boss in HM which is the most demanding and unforgiving fight among all 4-man dungeons.

Dasovaruilos

First of all, it is too long with too many unecessary trash pulls between bosses. It should have been two dungeons, not one.

Second, mechanics are good, RNG heavy mechanics are not. Try to get No Death there and you will see. If healer get statues on last boss near execute phase, it is most certainly a wipe. Then another 30 minutes to get back there. Damage everywhere and the mechanic is to prevent the healer from healing, totally based on RNG? Bad design, IMO.

Third, no rewards. Before Homestead, you would gain absolutely nothing from doing Vet RoM. Cradle still have a very good Helmet, but RoM? Nothing. People are doing it again for the motifs, but my guess is that it will die down soon after the market is flooded with them.

I hope ZoS learn from this and the next dungeon DLC is a little bit more streamlined and with less totally RNG mechanics that 90% of the time will result in a wipe if one role is affected by it.

Nahtal

Mwah this dungeon is not that difficult for me, Cradle of Shadows is more a challenge then Mazzatuun.

redspecter23

My personal preference for dungeons is 20 minutes or less, minimal mechanics. Go in, zerg it, kill things, have fun, loot and leave. Mazzatun does none of these things for me. Mazzatun is the sort of dungeon that is fun the first time, but dungeons are designed to be grinded in this game. You want loot? Get in that dungeon about 600 times for your shot at what you're looking for. CoA1 is a grindable dungeon. FG1 is a grindable dungeon. Mazzatun? It's a wonderful dungeon to experience for the story, but that only holds up for one run. After that, you're there to grind and it's not a fun grind at all. Some people like longer dungeons with fights you have to think about. I don't like to pug things that require thought. I'm just setting myself up for failure.

DocFrost72

Last night me and the wifey got it for our random normal. I was on a level 15 DK healer, she was on a like-leveled stam templar. I wasn't sure I wanted to stay, but after the first two bosses I saw we'd be fine.

There are exactly two points to worry about in that dungeon: Xal Nur, and the Nakesh (sp?) Burn phase. That's it.

SolarCat02

I love Mazzatun on Normal, it's a lot of fun. My guild went through it without a guide the first time, and figured out the mechanics ourselves.

On veteran... I have not beaten it on veteran yet. I need to find a good group willing to go through it with me. I have been called in to heal the final boss several times (all successful), so I know that I can do it. It's just finding a group to start at the beginning with me.

psxfloh

When it was new you could circumvent the "statue phase" by doing a dodge roll to avoid getting hit by her spit (or whatever).
That's how we finally managed the no-death run..

I read in one of the patch notes that they wanted to make it undodge-able, but later someone stated that it's still possible..
Can anyone confirm the one or the other?

WarpigFunk

There are 2 vet dungeons I have not yet completed in this game. Vet Maw, and Vet RoM.

The first, because I dont think my characters at 390cp are ready for it.
The second because I literally cannot find a capable group that has any interest in doing it. And I belong to 5 guilds - the smallest of which has like 200 members...

Whatever your personal opinions might be on vet RoM, I think theres an issue if a large plurality if not outright majority of veteran ready players have zero interest in even running the content more than once.

Qbiken

The mechanics are nice I think (but almost requires some sort of voicecommunication by teamspeak or discord).

But the overall issue with RoM is that it´s difficulty doesn´t match its rewards

Tan9oSuccka

It requires communication, good builds and perception of others.

PUGS fail at all of these things.

Loicozor

Because ARGONIAN

Solariken

It's sooo stupid long. Much too big of a time investment for the meager rewards it gives.

squinceybones

I like having a dungeon that pays to put together a decent group for. It's pretty enjoyable when you find a few good players to run it with. Feels like people have gotten to used to steamrolling dungeons with *** groups because they're easy.

Ashtaris

hugocbp wrote: »

First of all, it is too long with too many unecessary trash pulls between bosses. It should have been two dungeons, not one.

Second, mechanics are good, RNG heavy mechanics are not. Try to get No Death there and you will see. If healer get statues on last boss near execute phase, it is most certainly a wipe. Then another 30 minutes to get back there. Damage everywhere and the mechanic is to prevent the healer from healing, totally based on RNG? Bad design, IMO.

I've only done Mazz on regular Vet mode, not hard mode, but I read a good tip awhile back that seems to make sense. The last boss doesn't hit all that hard itself, so if you have the boss down to about 15-25% then actually have the healer taunt the boss. Whoever has the boss agro will not get the statues. Seems plausible to me

Amp151

Because it requires more than just tank and spank. Also requires a bit of teamwork.

Sad but, a good amount of ppl assume the other group members won't be able to clear it.

OrphanHelgen

Only reason you can pug hard dungeons, is that your dps can save the group. In mazzatun, there is mechanics which whipes mostly. People say dps are not everything, but really, people with bad dps can't do mechanics either. Either you have the gamer in you or you don't.

Dasovaruilos

Ashtaris wrote: »

hugocbp wrote: »

First of all, it is too long with too many unecessary trash pulls between bosses. It should have been two dungeons, not one.

Second, mechanics are good, RNG heavy mechanics are not. Try to get No Death there and you will see. If healer get statues on last boss near execute phase, it is most certainly a wipe. Then another 30 minutes to get back there. Damage everywhere and the mechanic is to prevent the healer from healing, totally based on RNG? Bad design, IMO.

I've only done Mazz on regular Vet mode, not hard mode, but I read a good tip awhile back that seems to make sense. The last boss doesn't hit all that hard itself, so if you have the boss down to about 15-25% then actually have the healer taunt the boss. Whoever has the boss agro will not get the statues. Seems plausible to me

Interesting! I'll try that out for sure! Thanks!

Trihugger

It's a miserable dungeon that doesn't allow for bad players. Quite simply put it isn't worth the time/aggravation of failure to attempt it with people you don't know. Even less worthwhile to attempt the dungeon with people lower than 450+ CP.

Magdalina

I quite like it but I'm still pretty new to it, only recently bought the dlc. I've been tanking it and I feel I'm slowly getting better but still nowhere near perfect xD I really like the part where it requires people good in their roles AND able to follow the mechanics, I really don't like the part where your success largely depends on the rng gods though. As being mentioned here, healer getting statues in execute is a giant pain in the a...area. I also do like the motif that drops there.

It's not a dungeon that I'd pug though. It can be hard even for decent players, especially on hardmode, which is probably why people don't like it. That and rng.

Ashtaris wrote: »

hugocbp wrote: »

First of all, it is too long with too many unecessary trash pulls between bosses. It should have been two dungeons, not one.

Second, mechanics are good, RNG heavy mechanics are not. Try to get No Death there and you will see. If healer get statues on last boss near execute phase, it is most certainly a wipe. Then another 30 minutes to get back there. Damage everywhere and the mechanic is to prevent the healer from healing, totally based on RNG? Bad design, IMO.

I've only done Mazz on regular Vet mode, not hard mode, but I read a good tip awhile back that seems to make sense. The last boss doesn't hit all that hard itself, so if you have the boss down to about 15-25% then actually have the healer taunt the boss. Whoever has the boss agro will not get the statues. Seems plausible to me

Hm. I'm absolutely sure I have gotten statues while tanking there(and still having aggro, the boss made sure to follow me to the statue and keep cc'ing as I tried to attack it to confirm that lol), but it's possible it was on hardmode. Not sure if it could be different on normal mode.
It does appear to be somewhat less often I think, it's far from every fight that I get them.

visionality

I like vRoM and even do it with randoms occasionally. If they know how to move, have proper gear and skills, it's doable even if they are in for the first time. I think most players who dont like it are just badly out of their depths. And than there's the randoms that go into vRoM, have no idea how to play and expect to be carried. Serious mood-killers, I have to admit.

Once I got grouped with two terribly weak DDs who were sitting at Xal Nur for more than 2 hours, grouping again and again with new healers and tanks thinking that they would be carried on with the right pair if they were only insistent enough. Never occured to them to get out again, practice their gameplay for a month or two and come back when they had improved.

Gave me a good laugh.

Dasovaruilos

The taunt thing doesn't work... Tank and healers aggroing the boss eventually get statues too.

Joshua261

When my group tried veteran Mazzatun, we had a couple of attempts to get through Chudan and Xal Nur but we were at the very last boss for about 3-4 hours and we just couldn't get though it because of 2 things.... 1. The randomness of the Hist statues and 2. The draining totem now that is a pain in the neck to deal with and it is just the fact that it can turn up anywhere, the second you start hitting your resources just drop... Our group eventually just gave up after 4 hours ish of attempts.

Dasovaruilos

Joshua261 wrote: »

When my group tried veteran Mazzatun, we had a couple of attempts to get through Chudan and Xal Nur but we were at the very last boss for about 3-4 hours and we just couldn't get though it because of 2 things.... 1. The randomness of the Hist statues and 2. The draining totem now that is a pain in the neck to deal with and it is just the fact that it can turn up anywhere, the second you start hitting your resources just drop... Our group eventually just gave up after 4 hours ish of attempts.

When I tried it, we just saved ultimates for the totem and the tank went near to get the resource drain. The boss doesn't hit as hard and it was easier for the healer to just help top the tank back up in resources while DPSs kept doing damage.

Adenoma

How easy is this to solo farm on normal? I need to get some amber plasm gear.

phidonk526

Adenoma wrote: »

How easy is this to solo farm on normal? I need to get some amber plasm gear.

Would be rather difficult due to the poisons that have to picked up and cleansed. I want to say impossible but I am sure someone will show that is not as soon as I say that

dagonbeer

hugocbp wrote: »

First of all, it is too long with too many unecessary trash pulls between bosses. It should have been two dungeons, not one.

Second, mechanics are good, RNG heavy mechanics are not. Try to get No Death there and you will see. If healer get statues on last boss near execute phase, it is most certainly a wipe. Then another 30 minutes to get back there. Damage everywhere and the mechanic is to prevent the healer from healing, totally based on RNG? Bad design, IMO.

Third, no rewards. Before Homestead, you would gain absolutely nothing from doing Vet RoM. Cradle still have a very good Helmet, but RoM? Nothing. People are doing it again for the motifs, but my guess is that it will die down soon after the market is flooded with them.

I hope ZoS learn from this and the next dungeon DLC is a little bit more streamlined and with less totally RNG mechanics that 90% of the time will result in a wipe if one role is affected by it.

Totally agree. ZOS, wondering why no one's buying/playing your DLC dungeons? It's this right here. These days I don't play much PvE, but sometimes I get a hankering for a dungeon and I take a chance with the group finder. I don't bother with the DLC dungeons, because they're too long and too risky with a PUG. I don't like bailing on a group once I join, so there's no way I'm going to commit possibly hour+ trying to drudge out a dungeon with scant rewards.

Definitely didn't get my money's worth out of the Hist DLC, will likely not buy the next dungeon pack.

Everything would be improved if there was less mobs and less repetition. (See the dungeons in The Secret World with pretty much only boss fights). It's one thing to PUG and call it quits at a boss, it's another thing to call it quits after you've waded through half an hour of boring, unnecessary trash. And the area with the spikes in Imp Prison, I'm looking at you. I don't need to fight the same fight 3 times.

Also, I know it seems elegant to have multiple phases where mechanics is introduced, and it comes together finally at the end (ie. vMA) but when you're doing it for the 100th time (you do want us to come back and repeat content right?) it's just boring as hell. Save that for the normal/vet split. In vet, throw us in the deep end, but do it quick. With vMA, for example, you could easily cut out the first 2 phases of each stage (stick the bosses in the beginning if you want) and still preserve the challenge, while cutting a good portion of the tedium. Since RNG and only one viable weapon trait seems to be the policy, removing part of the tedium from the grind should help with the complaints.

@ZOS_Finn @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_MattFiror

wolfdoggie_ESO

I like Mazzatun for the most part and haven't really found it unfairly difficult or tedious~ unlike Cradle of Shadow which I already just skip if it's a pledge. Only thing that annoys the crap out of me is when people rush the boss that has the unnecessary gate that locks people out... Happens so often and is just a pointless waste of time.

I've done it a decent amount of times and would more if people existed. DLC for dungeons alone is kind of a bad idea that just makes it take longer for people who own it to enjoy it. It's also not any more impressive or unique compared to non-DLC dungeons. I wouldn't of noticed if I randomed into it without prior knowledge. You also can't really enjoy the story in a group that has no patience so it's kind of a waste and of course there's not much reason to see it the 100 times you run it for a motif.

Mojmir

i dont like it because, theres nothing inside the dungeon i want.