Destro ultimate (eye of storm) needs to go

Xsorus

You took vicious death and nerfed it, you took Prox det and gutted it, then you turned around and gave Zerg balls something 10 times better suited for their setup and now that's what we have again...

xeNNNNN

you know there are those of us who use it to stop zergs in combo with proxy and VD right?

take it away and zergs will have it even easier. At least you can survive zergs most of the time with couple of decent healers but survive is alls you're going to do if you dont have something to use against them. you can pick zergs off one by one but they'll just come back one by one and usually have multiple camps up.

Besides Destro ult is not so powerful that you can just run up to people press it and win.

Ive survived it plenty of times alone.

Edit: Even if it gets nerfed they will still use it, I met a proxy train of yellows the other day...I guess the morale of that is, no matter how much you nerf something, if you stack an AoE up enough times in one location or a moving group of individuals it will still shred the crap out of the target.

phairdon

Destro Ulti was also nerfed, by half I think.

Xsorus

phairdon wrote: »

Destro Ulti was also nerfed, by half I think.

You are incorrect, destro out got a buff last patch

Xsorus

xeNNNNN wrote: »

you know there are those of us who use it to stop zergs in combo with proxy and VD right?

take it away and zergs will have it even easier. At least you can survive zergs most of the time with couple of decent healers but survive is alls you're going to do if you dont have something to use against them. you can pick zergs off one by one but they'll just come back one by one and usually have multiple camps up.

Besides Destro ult is not so powerful that you can just run up to people press it and win.

Ive survived it plenty of times alone.

There should be ways to stop zergs; destro ult though is tailor made for Zerg balls though. Alpha strikes are the ways zergs should be killed. Allowing a pbae out that follows you for 8 to 10 seconds just beckons it to be used by Zerg balls

IxSTALKERxI

I think destro ult is in a much better place now. Dawnbreakers/ Tether/ Meteor / leap are viable alternatives in some situations. If you nerf it by much more then there will be no reason to use it over some of the cheaper burst ults.

xeNNNNN

Xsorus wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

you know there are those of us who use it to stop zergs in combo with proxy and VD right?

take it away and zergs will have it even easier. At least you can survive zergs most of the time with couple of decent healers but survive is alls you're going to do if you dont have something to use against them. you can pick zergs off one by one but they'll just come back one by one and usually have multiple camps up.

Besides Destro ult is not so powerful that you can just run up to people press it and win.

Ive survived it plenty of times alone.

There should be ways to stop zergs; destro ult though is tailor made for Zerg balls though. Alpha strikes are the ways zergs should be killed. Allowing a pbae out that follows you for 8 to 10 seconds just beckons it to be used by Zerg balls

Fair but there should never just be a single tactic to deal with a single scenario otherwise the enemy adapts too quickly.

Even if you nerf the destro ult to death they will just spam impulse again like the old days. The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's and that will never happen.

I remember a long long time ago back when pact actually had more than a dozen PvP guilds that actually helped, on pushed on dragonclaw and while on the walls so many of them were using Impulse that the game actually crashed for most people in cyro. Albeit that a lot of others were probably using it at the time but I dont think anyone wants to see a return of impulse spam.

IxSTALKERxI

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

AJ_1988

It just needs to be reworked or tweaked a bit, it's op as hell in the hands of a strong dark elf dk. If roots had a cc immunity attached to them it wouldn't be so bad either.

xeNNNNN

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

well, they wouldnt have any AoE to spam anymore so everyone can just pile on the zerg without fear of getting pulverised from meters away.

Again my point was it wont happen and regardless I dont want to happen either, im not even a zerger myself.

phairdon

Elemental Storm:
Reduced the damage for this ability and its morphs by 5%.
Reduced the damage done by this ability and the Eye of the Storm morph by 10%. The damage from Elemental Rage remains unchanged.


Before the patch my destro ultimate number displayed was 1000, now its 500 for me.

Domander

How does anyone have trouble navigating around a "zerg ball" now? I love it when they group up.


So are you complaining because you're part of the ball? or are you complaining because you like to dive into them? what is the reason for the complaining?

zyk

I have never thought the destro ult was OP. Spread out. The bombers can't chase everyone. They will go for the largest stack of opponents.

Glurin

Xsorus wrote: »

phairdon wrote: »

Destro Ulti was also nerfed, by half I think.

You are incorrect, destro out got a buff last patch

Um, no. The last patch had nothing whatsoever for the destro ult. In fact, the last patch that did anything to it was 2.7.5, which nerfed it.

umagon

Xsorus wrote: »

You took vicious death and nerfed it, you took Prox det and gutted it, then you turned around and gave Zerg balls something 10 times better suited for their setup and now that's what we have again...

ZOS uses an award based retention mechanic, which means that whenever they can make you grind they will. One way they do this is to create problems that require "sets" as the solution. If a player doesn't like aoe well they need the counter sets for it, if they don't like root spam well they have to get the counter set, shields counter set, tanks counter sets, healing counter sets, etc. Always remember everything experienced in-game is an elaborate scheme to get players to pay ZOS more money.

Dral_Shady

The destro ulti does too much dmg but thats not the only problem.
Alle PBAOE and GTAOE should be capped at a 6 metre radius. The huge 10 metre radius makes it so much worse and all we see atm in pvp are zerg running around light attacking and destro ulti/proxy etc and noone gets a chance to even get close to them.
Its a pretty boring gameplay and sadface pvp experience, which really is starting to nag me and Questioning why I pvp in a game like ESO.

NightbladeMechanics

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

xeNNNNN wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

well, they wouldnt have any AoE to spam anymore so everyone can just pile on the zerg without fear of getting pulverised from meters away.

Again my point was it wont happen and regardless I dont want to happen either, im not even a zerger myself.

Absolutely incorrect logic. Zergs would just light attack and single target together, focus firing people down. Meanwhile outnumbered people would do what, single target down the zerg? There is objectively more single target damage coming out of greater numbers at all times. The only way a small group can overcome a zerg with single target alone is if the zerg are absolute potatoes. Aoes can be spammed by zergs, sure, but aoes are absolutely crucial to combating them too. VD, proxy, destro ult -- they've all been abused by zergs at one point or another, but they're also all 100% necessary to keeping the zergs in check, making too many nerfs as detrimental to the game as too many buffs.

The true only way to combat zergs without empowering them at all is removal of aoe caps.

And maybe stronger siege, but even that has its double edge too.

Sharee

The static morph is OK, except maybe make it more obvious you are standing in it in the first 2 seconds after it is placed and does not do damage yet. After that, if you are still in it, it is only your fault.

The mobile morph however needs to go. Nerfing the damage did nothing, as the ball groups simply stack more of them. The whole group pvp has been reduced to who has more EOTS charged. Either change the morph to a static one similar to storm, but with a different special effect, or make multiple EOTS not stackable (target can only take damage from an EOTS once per second).

Xsorus

Sharee wrote: »

The static morph is OK, except maybe make it more obvious you are standing in it in the first 2 seconds after it is placed and does not do damage yet. After that, if you are still in it, it is only your fault.

The mobile morph however needs to go. Nerfing the damage did nothing, as the ball groups simply stack more of them. The whole group pvp has been reduced to who has more EOTS charged. Either change the morph to a static one similar to storm, but with a different special effect, or make multiple EOTS not stackable (target can only take damage from an EOTS once per second).

I will agree the Static one is fine, as its got a counter..Move out of it.

You can't move out of the mobile one though..Its to large and it does far to much damage.

phairdon wrote: »

Elemental Storm:
Reduced the damage for this ability and its morphs by 5%.
Reduced the damage done by this ability and the Eye of the Storm morph by 10%. The damage from Elemental Rage remains unchanged.


Before the patch my destro ultimate number displayed was 1000, now its 500 for me.

At the same time they increased the damage with AOE Lightning by 8% and removed potions of the AOE cap, which means you're going to do more damage in the long run.

and Destro ultimate 1000 vs 500 has no bearing on it....That's just how much saved ultimate you had up

Nutshotz

Everyone that keeps saying the destro ult is OP. Well it's not. On a magblade bomber with the right CP spec yes. We can wipe a good amount of the ball groups in one pass with 2 or 3 bombers. 1 bomber doesn't do it no more.

There are plenty of ways to counter people using the destro ult. You just have to find the right counter that works for you and your group.

Now as for the destro ult getting a nerf. It did but than the destro line got a buff so in return the destro ult actually got a nice buff whether it be single target or group target. Pick your poison

Glory

phairdon wrote: »

Elemental Storm:
Reduced the damage for this ability and its morphs by 5%.
Reduced the damage done by this ability and the Eye of the Storm morph by 10%. The damage from Elemental Rage remains unchanged.


Before the patch my destro ultimate number displayed was 1000, now its 500 for me.

Oh my god the potato

Ghost-Shot

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

LOL, he is one of those that thinks they can single target 24 people, good luck with that!

Ghost-Shot

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

xeNNNNN wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

well, they wouldnt have any AoE to spam anymore so everyone can just pile on the zerg without fear of getting pulverised from meters away.

Again my point was it wont happen and regardless I dont want to happen either, im not even a zerger myself.

Absolutely incorrect logic. Zergs would just light attack and single target together, focus firing people down. Meanwhile outnumbered people would do what, single target down the zerg? There is objectively more single target damage coming out of greater numbers at all times. The only way a small group can overcome a zerg with single target alone is if the zerg are absolute potatoes. Aoes can be spammed by zergs, sure, but aoes are absolutely crucial to combating them too. VD, proxy, destro ult -- they've all been abused by zergs at one point or another, but they're also all 100% necessary to keeping the zergs in check, making too many nerfs as detrimental to the game as too many buffs.

The true only way to combat zergs without empowering them at all is removal of aoe caps.

And maybe stronger siege, but even that has its double edge too.

It pains me to agree with Kena but this is correct, I see so many ideas of ways to artificially reduce the power of groups but that doesn't make any sense, it just makes fighting out numbered insignificant. If you remove the AoE cap everyone is on even footing, if you're good enough you will win outnumbered, if you're not you can come back with more or get better. However if the AoE cap is removed I think some of the more powerful AoEs need to be nerfed.

Xsorus

AOE caps are a separate issue; they should be removed.

Destro ult, specifically the massive pbae one is overturned to hell though and needs to be changed.

There should be more ways to take out Zerg balls without giving Zerg balls an easy mode pbae that's just built for stacking.

Artis

xeNNNNN wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

well, they wouldnt have any AoE to spam anymore so everyone can just pile on the zerg without fear of getting pulverised from meters away.

Again my point was it wont happen and regardless I dont want to happen either, im not even a zerger myself.

wat? So you have a lot of people single targeting a group with fewer people. Can't you say how this will end? AoE gives a chance to smaller groups to handle zergs.

RadioheadSh0t

I'll start caring about Destro Ult when procs are nerfed to the ground. Until then, there are bigger problems.

Satiar

zyk wrote: »

I have never thought the destro ult was OP. Spread out. The bombers can't chase everyone. They will go for the largest stack of opponents.

At this point even the zergs have discovered Alchemist/VD and run a ton of bombers. You start reconsidering your life and decisions when a group of 60 just ran you down, radiating fire and lightning like a Manowar concert.

xeNNNNN

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

xeNNNNN wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

well, they wouldnt have any AoE to spam anymore so everyone can just pile on the zerg without fear of getting pulverised from meters away.

Again my point was it wont happen and regardless I dont want to happen either, im not even a zerger myself.

Absolutely incorrect logic. Zergs would just light attack and single target together, focus firing people down. Meanwhile outnumbered people would do what, single target down the zerg? There is objectively more single target damage coming out of greater numbers at all times. The only way a small group can overcome a zerg with single target alone is if the zerg are absolute potatoes. Aoes can be spammed by zergs, sure, but aoes are absolutely crucial to combating them too. VD, proxy, destro ult -- they've all been abused by zergs at one point or another, but they're also all 100% necessary to keeping the zergs in check, making too many nerfs as detrimental to the game as too many buffs.

The true only way to combat zergs without empowering them at all is removal of aoe caps.

And maybe stronger siege, but even that has its double edge too.

you took what I said way to seriously, as it was mostly sarcasm due to the fact that 1) it would never happen and 2) there has never been an MMO or game that has completely removed AoE's lol

However concerning zergs without AoE's sure they could focus down single targets but if theres enough of you to cause in enough chaos and allow for large amounts of targets with no direct AoE they would need 0 lag and extremely good hand eye coordination to pinpoint every single target around them and single target burst them all down by the time they would of killed everyone there would be so many of the zerg dead that it wouldnt be a zerg anymore it would be chaos for them and considering a lot of zergs arent organised it would be even more chaotic for most. It would also take way more time for them to kill everyone around them.

How do I know this can happen? because ive seen zergs without AoE's believe it or not and they had a much rougher time.

Regardless, Idk why this is even being discussed as it was meant as sarcasm and not meant to be taken this seriously.

tldr; it wasnt meant as an arguing point and I wasnt even saying it should happen again it was sarcasm, read my first post on this thread.

xeNNNNN

Artis wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

The only way to truely stop zergs is to remove AoE's

wat

well, they wouldnt have any AoE to spam anymore so everyone can just pile on the zerg without fear of getting pulverised from meters away.

Again my point was it wont happen and regardless I dont want to happen either, im not even a zerger myself.

wat? So you have a lot of people single targeting a group with fewer people. Can't you say how this will end? AoE gives a chance to smaller groups to handle zergs.

again, please read between the lines. I know it wouldnt work out 100% and I am not even arguing for it to happen i was merely just saying, stop jumping down my throat over nothing.

If I was arguing for it to actually happen then why exactly was I arguing to not remove or further nerf a current AoE in my first post?

Satiar

The thing people never seem to really get is that you can't nerf teamwork. No matter what you do, an organized group of players > disorganized group. Anything you introduce to combat big groups will be used by big groups (destro, prox det, VD, siege, etc).

Destro is an example of ZOS' lack of knowledge or caring: just pump the damage up high enough that everyone dies. Terrible way to balance the game but it's fairly obvious that was the idea. Organized groups abd mobs alike get blown up if the damage is high enough.

Malamar1229

Were you in that zerg ball yesterday huddled up at Front Door on the ram (i think alessia), that i wiped with encase and eye of the flame?