Removal of cp in trueflame

O_LYKOS

I dont think you fully understand whats happening right now

UrQuan

binho wrote: »

There are no CP campaigns that are empty on EU PS4 Please feel free to play those campaigns rather then asking all campaigns to be no CP.
It seems a bit selfish that people expect everyone to play the way they want

It seems a bit selfish that people are so tied up in playing the way they want that they're getting upset about ZOS doing a 1 week test to help get to the bottom of Cyrodiil performance issues in order to improve PVP permanently for everyone.

cjthibs

UrQuan wrote: »

binho wrote: »

There are no CP campaigns that are empty on EU PS4 Please feel free to play those campaigns rather then asking all campaigns to be no CP.
It seems a bit selfish that people expect everyone to play the way they want

It seems a bit selfish that people are so tied up in playing the way they want that they're getting upset about ZOS doing a 1 week test to help get to the bottom of Cyrodiil performance issues in order to improve PVP permanently for everyone.

Muh sweet kills doe!
How dare you introduce any mechanism that takes away from my ability to wreck faces with my exact build and unwillingness to play in a balanced environment!

Malamar1229

makeumrage wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

This is good. If it helps with performance great.

Siege will actually have a greater impact, as it should. Will cut into a lot of these invincible builds. Shouldnt have brought CP crutches into PvP from the start....

Eww no. No low life power bosting to 50 in 6 hours should have the same stats as my 2612 hours. CP is going anywhere. This is just a test. To see if it is the issue and if so rework the system.

2612 hours should have given you more skill, not arbitrary stats.
A system that rewards tenure (cp) is a system that deters new players. Is that what you really want...

Malamar1229

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

@Malamar1229

You need to make a DC Mag Sorc so we can do Sorc things together! Could be really really fun!

You know you miss the Blueberry Faction!

Secret. I have 3 sorcs. One of them is Blue.

Currently a stam sorc but only one respec away, name is Orsinium Track Star.

May have seen me moving like lightning

qsnoopyjr

You know why they do this?

Because too many people play on Trueflame, and their way of getting people to spread out onto other servers is 'taking away'.

You see here, as a bachelor in marketing graduate with highest honors, lemme tell ya something. When you got people liking stuff and you have too much demand, you go and get more and meet and exceed demands. You dont take away stuff.

Example, Pokemon Go, they had too many people lagging servers, they take away the find feature. Now that the game is dead, they bring it back and make all this cool and fancy stuff.... Hype is gone, game is dead. They should have invested in future, made MORE... Not get rid of nice features like they did after day 1 aka the find feature, which outraged players because thats whole point, now its just aimlessly wandering.

Typical, ESO online move, typical 'red ocean strategists', they make houses for sake of houses, they get rid of good features for sake of balancing. If people like CP server, make another CP server to get people to move around, getting rid of it is stupid way.

BTW, 'red ocean strategy' is nothing but trying to one up another game. You make prices low I make prices low, you have housing system, I make housing system.
'blue ocean strategy' is being innovative, I'm not going to have static mobs like every MMORPG, people realize it gets old fast, I'm going to make monsters dynamic, they will actually attack the towns, they will path all over the place. Heck this means I have to bring in a class that has a tracking skill, heck this makes people play with each other more. Heck this brings back the true genre of what it is to be an "MMORPG". Classic Everquest, World of Warcraft games are true MMORPG's.
Blue ocean strategy is basically you dont consider anyone competition because you are new, you dont mimic others and try to be a better version of other games.

ESO, nothing special about it, EQ2 has a bunch of quests, raids, housing system... Its just... Who can make new zones, new skills, new mobs better every year... Thats red ocean.

Blue ocean is bringing something new into the game, making your game unique. Making new zones, doesnt do jack, its what can us, the players DO with those zones.

If there would have been a innovative MMORPG, believe me, it would have been EQNEXT. Because before they went away due to money issues, they was in process of having players make the zones, giving players the tools to change the world and the world is truly "yours".

bowmanz607

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

You know why they do this?

Because too many people play on Trueflame, and their way of getting people to spread out onto other servers is 'taking away'.

You see here, as a bachelor in marketing graduate with highest honors, lemme tell ya something. When you got people liking stuff and you have too much demand, you go and get more and meet and exceed demands. You dont take away stuff.

Example, Pokemon Go, they had too many people lagging servers, they take away the find feature. Now that the game is dead, they bring it back and make all this cool and fancy stuff.... Hype is gone, game is dead. They should have invested in future, made MORE... Not get rid of nice features like they did after day 1 aka the find feature, which outraged players because thats whole point, now its just aimlessly wandering.

Typical, ESO online move, typical 'red ocean strategists', they make houses for sake of houses, they get rid of good features for sake of balancing. If people like CP server, make another CP server to get people to move around, getting rid of it is stupid way.

BTW, 'red ocean strategy' is nothing but trying to one up another game. You make prices low I make prices low, you have housing system, I make housing system.
'blue ocean strategy' is being innovative, I'm not going to have static mobs like every MMORPG, people realize it gets old fast, I'm going to make monsters dynamic, they will actually attack the towns, they will path all over the place. Heck this means I have to bring in a class that has a tracking skill, heck this makes people play with each other more. Heck this brings back the true genre of what it is to be an "MMORPG". Classic Everquest, World of Warcraft games are true MMORPG's.
Blue ocean strategy is basically you dont consider anyone competition because you are new, you dont mimic others and try to be a better version of other games.

ESO, nothing special about it, EQ2 has a bunch of quests, raids, housing system... Its just... Who can make new zones, new skills, new mobs better every year... Thats red ocean.

Blue ocean is bringing something new into the game, making your game unique. Making new zones, doesnt do jack, its what can us, the players DO with those zones.

If there would have been a innovative MMORPG, believe me, it would have been EQNEXT. Because before they went away due to money issues, they was in process of having players make the zones, giving players the tools to change the world and the world is truly "yours".

your basic premise is flawed. they didnt take something away to get people to spread out. they took it away to test on all pvp instances on all platforms. it was not to get people to spread out. in fact, that does not make sense. there was only one non cp campaing and multiple cp campaigns. both cp campaigns are never full. people dont go to tf because it is cp only. people go to tf because it is a 30 day campaign that counts all points.

In fact, people still are not spreading out. they are just all queing for same campaign.

Additionally, cp was taken away as a test to see what needs to be changed, it is coming back. So really they never took anything away in the end.

Your marketing theories mean nothing when your basic premise is flawed. you must have missed that class in your pursuit for highest honors.

UrQuan

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

You know why they do this?

Because too many people play on Trueflame, and their way of getting people to spread out onto other servers is 'taking away'.

You see here, as a bachelor in marketing graduate with highest honors, lemme tell ya something. When you got people liking stuff and you have too much demand, you go and get more and meet and exceed demands. You dont take away stuff.

Example, Pokemon Go, they had too many people lagging servers, they take away the find feature. Now that the game is dead, they bring it back and make all this cool and fancy stuff.... Hype is gone, game is dead. They should have invested in future, made MORE... Not get rid of nice features like they did after day 1 aka the find feature, which outraged players because thats whole point, now its just aimlessly wandering.

Typical, ESO online move, typical 'red ocean strategists', they make houses for sake of houses, they get rid of good features for sake of balancing. If people like CP server, make another CP server to get people to move around, getting rid of it is stupid way.

BTW, 'red ocean strategy' is nothing but trying to one up another game. You make prices low I make prices low, you have housing system, I make housing system.
'blue ocean strategy' is being innovative, I'm not going to have static mobs like every MMORPG, people realize it gets old fast, I'm going to make monsters dynamic, they will actually attack the towns, they will path all over the place. Heck this means I have to bring in a class that has a tracking skill, heck this makes people play with each other more. Heck this brings back the true genre of what it is to be an "MMORPG". Classic Everquest, World of Warcraft games are true MMORPG's.
Blue ocean strategy is basically you dont consider anyone competition because you are new, you dont mimic others and try to be a better version of other games.

ESO, nothing special about it, EQ2 has a bunch of quests, raids, housing system... Its just... Who can make new zones, new skills, new mobs better every year... Thats red ocean.

Blue ocean is bringing something new into the game, making your game unique. Making new zones, doesnt do jack, its what can us, the players DO with those zones.

If there would have been a innovative MMORPG, believe me, it would have been EQNEXT. Because before they went away due to money issues, they was in process of having players make the zones, giving players the tools to change the world and the world is truly "yours".

You know maybe if you have no clue what you're talking about you just shouldn't say anything.

They're doing this as a test for one week in order to get baseline data for future tests so that they can get to the bottom of what things are contributing the most to poor performance in Cyrodiil and work on improving PVP performance.

Of course, if you'd bothered to read any of this thread, or any of the other threads on the topic you'd know that and you could have prevented yourself from looking foolish.

qsnoopyjr

Dude there is no reason for them to punish a server just to test there balance.

People running BSW with CP, and now no CP... Going to fare just the same as those on Azura Star.
You dont need to sample the entire population when it comes to balance. Azura Star is a good enough sample.

And bruh, dont even try and talk about sample sizes to me, thats one thing us marketing degree folks are good at, that people who dont have degree in marketing are not good at.

You balance with no CP and expect the people with CP to do similiar to whatever they concluded from the test of everyone with no CP??
Thats why balance is broke, you gotta figure it out between no CP and with CP.

bowmanz607

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

Dude there is no reason for them to punish a server just to test there balance.

People running BSW with CP, and now no CP... Going to fare just the same as those on Azura Star.
You dont need to sample the entire population when it comes to balance. Azura Star is a good enough sample.

And bruh, dont even try and talk about sample sizes to me, thats one thing us marketing degree folks are good at, that people who dont have degree in marketing are not good at.

You balance with no CP and expect the people with CP to do similiar to whatever they concluded from the test of everyone with no CP??
Thats why balance is broke, you gotta figure it out between no CP and with CP.

you really dont get it do you?

this is not being done for balance or to take things away. this is being done to figure out where they can fine tune code or change some cp passives to help. it is not and end all be all magic bullet.

they already said azuras was not enough and they need more. but i guess you know better then them dont you? with your fancy bachelors degree.

guess what, when you do tests you do more then one or use more then one sample. you use multiple. plus they want to strees the servers out which wont happen in azuras. there is also less zerging in azuars cause most big guilds inTf. so they want to get those big guilds involved.

your way of point here and dont understand what the test is for.

Egonieser

If you're that bad that you can only play relying on CP, there are bigger issues than that, like l2p issues.
It can be easily remedied by something so simple as a switch of Mundus boon or jewelry glyphs. It makes a huge difference and doesn't require full respecs or gear changes.

bowmanz607

Egonieser wrote: »

If you're that bad that you can only play relying on CL, there are bigger issues than that, like l2p issues.
It can be easily remedied by something so simple as a switch of Mundus boon or jewelry glyphs. It makes a huge difference and doesn't require full respecs or gear changes.

exactly. mundus stone and glyphs are great options. espeially for a temp fix.

still having problems? craft yourself eternal hunt for stam or seducer for mag. cheap and easy for temp fix. Further, maybe people can stop wearing full heavy. without cp, heavy armor becomes balanced because you dont have cp to fall back on to keep your sustain up.

Bam_Bam

Personally I'm not sure CP will prove to be the issue. I think player inventories and character inventories and craft bags all have a massive impact on performance. Just my opinion

bowmanz607

Baranthus wrote: »

Personally I'm not sure CP will prove to be the issue. I think player inventories and character inventories and craft bags all have a massive impact on performance. Just my opinion

I don't think it is THE issue. But I think it contributes.

Dragonking06

Leandor wrote: »

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

I'll do the no cp test just to see what happens. I haven't played non cp for so long it might be fun, or at the very least interesting. Please stop with the Azuras for no CP campaign bit ok, there's no more than 20 people total on that campaign at any given time. Odds are the devs will find out that cp or non cp makes little or no difference in lag. Then they can move on to fixing things that are likely causing lag, like proc sets and aoe spaming.

Azura is packed full on PC-EU, second only to trueflame.

But more importantly, ZOS needs to learn that the majority of players does not bother with reading forums. @ZOS_GinaBruno , please get the sever guys to send informational server messages on all campaigns that temporarily have CP removed. Otherwise these threads will not stop.

This.

Should also probably mention that they have DOUBLED ALL SOURCES OF AP to make up for the TEMPORARY removal of CP.

And because I know someone will likely ask, I'll preemptively answer: No. That does not include Tel Var Stones.

EDIT: Some of the comments on here are stunningly arrogant. Like 'Able to see the back of their own teeth' level. I wonder if any of them saw what they said about why they're doing this on their Live Stream...

Here. I'll save you half the trouble of tracking it down. Do some research before you go firing your mouths off.

Volrion

Sythen88411 wrote: »

No cp will weed out the good from the bad.

Not necessarily.

Most people won't bother changing their CP reliant builds for just one week.

Jeremy

Baranthus wrote: »

Personally I'm not sure CP will prove to be the issue. I think player inventories and character inventories and craft bags all have a massive impact on performance. Just my opinion

I doubt it has anything specifically to do with CP as well. There is just a larger abundance of people playing on the campaigns that allow for CP because players understandably want to make use of their extra passives.

So I am guessing True Flame lags more because there are more people.

This game generally has been having serious performance problems for months now. So if I was the developers - I would start focusing my attention on any changes they may have implemented back during that botched maintenance episode. The game just hasn't been the same since then.

To be honest with you - the most persuasive theory I have read on this forum is that Zuckerberg hacked them as revenge for the lawsuit. ^^

UrQuan

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

Dude there is no reason for them to punish a server just to test there balance.

People running BSW with CP, and now no CP... Going to fare just the same as those on Azura Star.
You dont need to sample the entire population when it comes to balance. Azura Star is a good enough sample.

And bruh, dont even try and talk about sample sizes to me, thats one thing us marketing degree folks are good at, that people who dont have degree in marketing are not good at.

You balance with no CP and expect the people with CP to do similiar to whatever they concluded from the test of everyone with no CP??
Thats why balance is broke, you gotta figure it out between no CP and with CP.

Oh please. I analyze data for a living. I aggregate industry data and internal data with macro-economic trends, demographic data, and layered industry-specific risk criteria in order to provide segmented risk trending for a $12.5 billion retail loan portfolio. I also used to do software development/testing. Don't sit here and tell me that it takes marketing people to understand sample sizes. It's 100% clear you have no idea what you're talking about.

Let me spell it out for you.

You need to stress test the servers under controlled conditions. The lack of CP is the controlled condition. The non-CP campaign alone is not a sufficient data point to get this baseline stress test, because the conditions there are not reflective of all of the different campaign conditions, and the population isn't high enough (although the comparison of normal AP conditions there to double AP conditions is good for control purposes).

In order to do a stress test you have to ensure the highest population possible over a reasonable time frame that will include prime weekday & prime weekend times. Getting that high population is why they're doing double AP.

This first test gives them the baseline performance data that they will then use to compare performance data from future tests that include CP, while keeping the non-CP campaign as a control throughout. That's how you narrow down whether CP calculations are truly causing performance issues (which seems highly likely but can't be said definitively without such testing), and if so by performing different tests with different CP conditions you narrow down specifically what CP-related calculations are the worst offenders. Then you can work on addressing the underlying issues in those calculations causing the performance issues.

It's not rocket science.

bowmanz607

UrQuan wrote: »

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

Dude there is no reason for them to punish a server just to test there balance.

People running BSW with CP, and now no CP... Going to fare just the same as those on Azura Star.
You dont need to sample the entire population when it comes to balance. Azura Star is a good enough sample.

And bruh, dont even try and talk about sample sizes to me, thats one thing us marketing degree folks are good at, that people who dont have degree in marketing are not good at.

You balance with no CP and expect the people with CP to do similiar to whatever they concluded from the test of everyone with no CP??
Thats why balance is broke, you gotta figure it out between no CP and with CP.

Oh please. I analyze data for a living. I aggregate industry data and internal data with macro-economic trends, demographic data, and layered industry-specific risk criteria in order to provide segmented risk trending for a $12.5 billion retail loan portfolio. I also used to do software development/testing. Don't sit here and tell me that it takes marketing people to understand sample sizes. It's 100% clear you have no idea what you're talking about.

Let me spell it out for you.

You need to stress test the servers under controlled conditions. The lack of CP is the controlled condition. The non-CP campaign alone is not a sufficient data point to get this baseline stress test, because the conditions there are not reflective of all of the different campaign conditions, and the population isn't high enough (although the comparison of normal AP conditions there to double AP conditions is good for control purposes).

In order to do a stress test you have to ensure the highest population possible over a reasonable time frame that will include prime weekday & prime weekend times. Getting that high population is why they're doing double AP.

This first test gives them the baseline performance data that they will then use to compare performance data from future tests that include CP, while keeping the non-CP campaign as a control throughout. That's how you narrow down whether CP calculations are truly causing performance issues (which seems highly likely but can't be said definitively without such testing), and if so by performing different tests with different CP conditions you narrow down specifically what CP-related calculations are the worst offenders. Then you can work on addressing the underlying issues in those calculations causing the performance issues.

It's not rocket science.

This. Your right it's not rocket science. It is basic understanding of things taught to you in middle school science class. Maybe earlier. Not sure why his marketing degree has anything to do with what is happening here haha.

Turelus

Turelus wrote: »

OhAmex wrote: »

Doing this makes me want to quit pvp now.

There was Azuras for no CP campaign.

Should bring cp back to trueflame

Show me on the target skeleton where the experienced no CP players wrecked you.

Jeez, I make constructive debates and help answer questions every day on these forums and it's the stupid skeleton comment that apparently gets 34 awesome votes... you people...

Mayrael

Didnt played on Azura for... About six months... half an hour in cyrodiil without CPs to make some tweaks in setup and TBH i want it to stay like that Its amazing how squishy and defenseless people have became without CPs shame its just for a week...

Or maybe lets completly rework CPs?
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/325679/champion-points-aka-spell-crafting#latest