Inappropriate contents and discussion increasing on zone chats..

idk

@GreenhaloX

Ignore zone chat

Guild leaders are responsible for guild chat. Zos has no business there. If guild leadership fosters an environment you don't like you can always look elsewhere.

UrQuan

bertenburnyb16_ESO wrote: »

I always find it so narrowminded of people who come complaining about sucht things, all kinds of people play this game and they cant all think the same way you do, offcourse theres stuff that crosses al lines, but thats just the way it goes with things like this, ignore it and move on

It amazes me how little people know about history. This attitude of "just ignore hate speech and move on" enables the people spewing that nonsense, because it normalizes it. People get used to hearing it, and whether they agree with it or not, they get used to it. Eventually it doesn't seem like such a big deal anymore, and people don't put up a fuss when hate groups start to grow and gain power.

Then suddenly everyone is surprised when those hate groups, who are now in power, start actually acting on the agendas that they always talked about, and that everyone just ignored. Then, because we're so used to just ignoring and moving on, taking real action to stop them seems like an over-reaction, so instead the tactic attempted is appeasement and trying to work with them. This doesn't work.

This has been your history lesson on how we got to World War 2. Ignoring it and moving on is, frankly, dangerous. In the context of ESO, when you see this kind of thing, don't ignore it and move on. Report the offenders and only move on after you've taken that action to stop them.

Cously

We need the resources focused on development and bug fixing, not sugar coating for losers. Just ignore the person and stop trying to control what others say.

Jeremy

CapnPhoton wrote: »

Politics and religion should be off limits. It causes too much controversy. But its hard to eliminate with so many angry people around.

Video games are especially bad about this. There are a lot of younger players who have just discovered politics so they feel a need to berate everyone they come across with their often-times naive and ignorant political view points. It makes them feel important or smart. Something like that.

It is annoying for sure. Many of us who play video games do so to escape the drama of real life and really have no interest in reading some bratty political diatribe.

I usually just tell them to shut up and go find a political chat room if they want to argue with strangers on the internet about politics. Then if they persist I'll start looking for my ignore button. I believe that's the best way to handle it.

SnuggleMePlease

Nestor wrote: »

Its a Mature Game.

Mature People don't insult or put someone down because of race or religion or gender or or origin or physical characteristic

Mature People don't pontificate about the separation of the races.

Mature People don't feel the need to interject real world politics into every discussion.

Mature People don't feel the need to cuss with every post, indeed, cussing is rarely called for

Mature People don't feel the need to dump all over someone when all they did was ask a question.

Just be Mature People.

Adding onto this list, mature people don't feel the need to obstruct a free exchange of ideas because they perceive certain ideas to be "inappropriate." It isn't as if zone chat comes with a handbook that details which topics are appropriate and which aren't.

Zone chat is a commodity that the players can use any way they like as long as it doesn't break the terms of service, and it is annoying that people get so offended by the things people say in the zone chat of a MMORPG. With all that being said, we should be against moderation.

Like @Nestor has written, we should be mature enough to moderate ourselves, as individuals. As soon as you start attempting to regulate the speech of others, whether by direct or indirect means, you need to stop. We have systems in place to make sure these issues are dealt with.

bulbousb16_ESO

Barbet wrote: »

so in the event when people are being foolish in any chat one can quickly switch tabs and not view the language that is offending oneself. To reverberate, even though one doesn't have to read it, one doesn't have to be tempted to see it either.

Instead of limited speech of all, one can remove oneself.

Of course, this is no solution at all. Removing yourself from the zone chat or ignoring the speaker does NOTHING to prevent the offensive chat from continuing. It merely prevents you from seeing it - but others still will.

But reporting people who are ignorant and not speaking to one when expressing their view on debatable ,subjects, hurtful to some to read, should and can just be ignored as well as can be not seen by using the before mentioned. In essence, one can censor for themselves unappreciated language.

This is doing the community a disservice. Keep in mind that the speakers are breaking the rules they agreed to and merely looking the other way is not helping. That would be like switching lines in the bank to avoid the guy wearing the ski mask.

LadyLavina

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

LadyLavina wrote: »

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

Bleh edited the wrong comment.. how is that even possible?!

clumsy khajiit paws?

Pretty sure your stalking me in the loving way

GreenhaloX

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

In the event you come across an inappropriate statement or conversation, please use the in-game reporting tool so the team can review - just right click on the name in chat to find that option. Thank you!

Of course.. but, with all the other reporting to you guys, whether frivolous or with actual concerns, you guys are surely busy.

Stopnaggin wrote: »

titan_cleaver wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Me personally I don't get offended, but there is a line when things cease to be amusing. Fact is its a weak minded individual that doesn't have the enough self control to not make comments. Then we have the trolls that just love to start an argument because they can hide behind a screen without fear of reprisal. Funny thing is every little jab in your above post, weak minded, coddled, infantile are perfect to describe your behavior in the posts you have here.

To the rest of the posters:

This is what a troll looks like in their natural environment. Remeber please don't feed the trolls.

It's unfortunate, the first part of your post started off well and I'd concluded that I'd probably have a reasonable discussion with you...and then I got to the rest of it where you labeled somebody you disagree with as a troll. Sad that your reasoning abilities end at emotion instead of logic. Maybe you'll grow out of it. Also, it is a childish way to live your life to expect that everybody will tailor their speech to accommodate your sensibilities. That's how life works, and it's unfortunate you seemingly can't deal with it.

Sorry but that is exactly what you are doing. Had you not resorted to insults I would have been much more likely to respond in kind. While we have freedom of speech, this is not unlimited, as many who threatened the President have found out. Now being a veteran, I will absolutly stand up for free speech. And yes you can use racial slurs or whatever else you feel like, I'm not offended in the least. Because I have served with many different races and religions, and I know what someone's character is and not just a color, ethnicit or religion, is what makes up a person. I have served with some absolutely great people from different backgrounds, races and such, I have never based my opnion of someone based on the above.

As far as myself, I've seen enough in my lifetime to not get bothered by comments. And as raf as having a reasonable discussion with someone I would point to your first post. It's pretty hard to have a conversation with someone who thinks they are being logical when in fact they are far from it. A logical person does not resort to insults to people without any provocation. There isn't any emotion involved on my end, all of my comments have been very clear. And while the op has good points some of it he/she will need to realize that some people are just that way, and posting in here will bring out more of those types of people.

The bottom line is the ones making the comments that are offensive are the ones who are acting childish. Just because we have free speech doesn't mean it's always a good idea to use it. In fact some should probably learn some restraint when talking period. A wide man once said "it's better to be thought a fool, than open your mouth and remove all doubt".

Ahhh.. a salute to another veteran, then (perhaps, another combat one.)

Personally, cursing, swearing, locker room antics do not bother me much. As a vet, we have been around the block a few times enough. However, as a vet, we seem to have a common theme.. that is seemingly always looking out for other people, while serving or not, and especially when we have worked with so many people from different backgrounds and cultures. So, looking out for other people doesn't stop, just because you have stopped serving. My post, although, yes, it has brought out some opposing views and interesting feedback, is really to bring an awareness that, although, we are online, it is still real people online from different places and perhaps, different cultures. I'm not political, and do not need to bring politic into this or to be politically correct; however, I know enough to realize that certain words or what is being said can be interpreted differently and could be offensive to others. It is true that some may use social media or online chat on ESO as, perhaps, their means of escape and may not say such offensive or derogatory things outside in the real world, it is still no excuse to do such on zone chat; jokingly or not. .. and yes, I'm not in game to police anyone, I'm just there playing a game, trying to enjoy the experience. So, this is just an awareness, and whatever happens or not, is up to ZOS and the developers.

... and to those macho men.. just because a pant is put on, doesn't really make a man, a man.. ha ha.

cyclonus11

I only report racial slurs. The rest, I don't care about.

GreenhaloX

Nestor wrote: »

Its a Mature Game.

Mature People don't insult or put someone down because of race or religion or gender or or origin or physical characteristic

Mature People don't pontificate about the separation of the races.

Mature People don't feel the need to interject real world politics into every discussion.

Mature People don't feel the need to cuss with every post, indeed, cussing is rarely called for

Mature People don't feel the need to dump all over someone when all they did was ask a question.

Just be Mature People.

Thank you! I kind of have the same understanding of what "M" rating and mature means..

GreenhaloX

LadyLavina wrote: »

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

LadyLavina wrote: »

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

Bleh edited the wrong comment.. how is that even possible?!

clumsy khajiit paws?

Pretty sure your stalking me in the loving way

Nice.. hilarious. Ha ha

SnuggleMePlease

bulbousb16_ESO wrote: »

Keep in mind that the speakers are breaking the rules they agreed to and merely looking the other way is not helping. That would be like switching lines in the bank to avoid the guy wearing the ski mask.

Poor analogies aside, I don't remember signing a contract that said, "You agree never to talk about topics that may offend person X, Y, or Z."

We agreed to the terms of service when we signed up to the game, but that is distinct from what Joe Blow looking at the Auridon zone chat gets triggered by. Like previous comments have stated, if there is something that is genuinely inappropriate, then it should be reported using the in-game report function. There is no need for moderation.

jaye63

Wow... just wow. You have a profanity filter and you have ignore. USE THEM! Im not opposed to some colorful methaphors but if some one swears every other word, I block em. Grow up and deal with it using the tools you were given and realize your point of view isnt the only one.

bulbousb16_ESO

SnuggleMePlease wrote: »

We agreed to the terms of service when we signed up to the game, but that is distinct from what Joe Blow looking at the Auridon zone chat gets triggered by.

It depends. If someone says "Mangoes" and Joe Blow is offended by that, then too bad. But I'm thinking most of what people are "triggered by" is a violation of section 8 of the Terms of Service.

Stopnaggin

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

Jeremy

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

Stopnaggin

GreenhaloX wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

In the event you come across an inappropriate statement or conversation, please use the in-game reporting tool so the team can review - just right click on the name in chat to find that option. Thank you!

Of course.. but, with all the other reporting to you guys, whether frivolous or with actual concerns, you guys are surely busy.

Stopnaggin wrote: »

titan_cleaver wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Me personally I don't get offended, but there is a line when things cease to be amusing. Fact is its a weak minded individual that doesn't have the enough self control to not make comments. Then we have the trolls that just love to start an argument because they can hide behind a screen without fear of reprisal. Funny thing is every little jab in your above post, weak minded, coddled, infantile are perfect to describe your behavior in the posts you have here.

To the rest of the posters:

This is what a troll looks like in their natural environment. Remeber please don't feed the trolls.

It's unfortunate, the first part of your post started off well and I'd concluded that I'd probably have a reasonable discussion with you...and then I got to the rest of it where you labeled somebody you disagree with as a troll. Sad that your reasoning abilities end at emotion instead of logic. Maybe you'll grow out of it. Also, it is a childish way to live your life to expect that everybody will tailor their speech to accommodate your sensibilities. That's how life works, and it's unfortunate you seemingly can't deal with it.

Sorry but that is exactly what you are doing. Had you not resorted to insults I would have been much more likely to respond in kind. While we have freedom of speech, this is not unlimited, as many who threatened the President have found out. Now being a veteran, I will absolutly stand up for free speech. And yes you can use racial slurs or whatever else you feel like, I'm not offended in the least. Because I have served with many different races and religions, and I know what someone's character is and not just a color, ethnicit or religion, is what makes up a person. I have served with some absolutely great people from different backgrounds, races and such, I have never based my opnion of someone based on the above.

As far as myself, I've seen enough in my lifetime to not get bothered by comments. And as raf as having a reasonable discussion with someone I would point to your first post. It's pretty hard to have a conversation with someone who thinks they are being logical when in fact they are far from it. A logical person does not resort to insults to people without any provocation. There isn't any emotion involved on my end, all of my comments have been very clear. And while the op has good points some of it he/she will need to realize that some people are just that way, and posting in here will bring out more of those types of people.

The bottom line is the ones making the comments that are offensive are the ones who are acting childish. Just because we have free speech doesn't mean it's always a good idea to use it. In fact some should probably learn some restraint when talking period. A wide man once said "it's better to be thought a fool, than open your mouth and remove all doubt".

Ahhh.. a salute to another veteran, then (perhaps, another combat one.)

Personally, cursing, swearing, locker room antics do not bother me much. As a vet, we have been around the block a few times enough. However, as a vet, we seem to have a common theme.. that is seemingly always looking out for other people, while serving or not, and especially when we have worked with so many people from different backgrounds and cultures. So, looking out for other people doesn't stop, just because you have stopped serving. My post, although, yes, it has brought out some opposing views and interesting feedback, is really to bring an awareness that, although, we are online, it is still real people online from different places and perhaps, different cultures. I'm not political, and do not need to bring politic into this or to be politically correct; however, I know enough to realize that certain words or what is being said can be interpreted differently and could be offensive to others. It is true that some may use social media or online chat on ESO as, perhaps, their means of escape and may not say such offensive or derogatory things outside in the real world, it is still no excuse to do such on zone chat; jokingly or not. .. and yes, I'm not in game to police anyone, I'm just there playing a game, trying to enjoy the experience. So, this is just an awareness, and whatever happens or not, is up to ZOS and the developers.

... and to those macho men.. just because a pant is put on, doesn't really make a man, a man.. ha ha.

Yeah combat vet here as well. Some will never understand. All the bs doesn't bother me until it becomes overwhelming. Locker room chat and such I can ignore. What I hate seeing is when they decide to gang up in an individual. When they refuse to stop. For the most part I just ignore it, lots of people blocked. I laugh most of the time because they have no idea who is behind the screen, or what my backround may be.

I do think the nation does need to toughen up a bit. But sterotyping and racial comments are too far. I'm a white male that grew up in South Baltimore, been to several countries, and now live in Texas. So I've seen plenty of different people. Some good, some bad. I base my opinions of all people on their actions. Serving in the Army was probably the best time of my life. We were all the same, we had a Brotherhood that most won't understand. It didn't depend on color, religion or political differences. None of that mattered when in a war zone. It was I got your back you got mine, and that's all that mattered.

Molydeus

andreasranasen wrote: »

What we do need is NA to be split into two servers. Midwest and the south get their own servers. East coast and West coast get their own. It would be great

I know what you're getting at, but you're pushing a stereotype that hasn't been true in decades. It has been proven that the places along the coasts considered liberal holdouts are in fact far more heavily segregated than the South, with people of different ethnicities more likely to live in groups of their own kind instead of mixing with those of different races. Down here we actually live alongside one another in the same houses and neighborhoods. Please stop believing everything the media feeds you and update your understanding of the times.

Jeremy

Molydeus wrote: »

andreasranasen wrote: »

What we do need is NA to be split into two servers. Midwest and the south get their own servers. East coast and West coast get their own. It would be great

I know what you're getting at, but you're pushing a stereotype that hasn't been true in decades. It has been proven that the places along the coasts considered liberal holdouts are in fact far more heavily segregated than the South, with people of different ethnicities more likely to live in groups of their own kind instead of mixing with those of different races. Down here we actually live alongside one another in the same houses and neighborhoods. Please stop believing everything the media feeds you and update your understanding of the times.

As someone who has lived both in the south and the north (Florida, North Carolina, New York) I can vouch for your comments here.

The most racist/bigoted and segregated community I've ever lived in was the Bronx, New York City.

JKorr

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"? Murdering any and all muslims in the U.S. is "subjective"? Saying that females shouldn't be allowed to play video games because all females are good for is non-consensual sex is "subjective"?

Sorry. Subjective or not, I will continue to report "subjective" statements like the above. Unless ZOS revokes the TOS and code of conduct that all of us agreed to abide by, reporting the problematic idiots and allowing ZOS to decide what they want to consider "hate speech". We are on a private server. The "freedom of speech" does not apply here.

Jeremy

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

UrQuan

Jeremy wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

So advocating setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Jeremy

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

So advocating setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

All opinions are subjective.

No matter how offensive you may find a certain point of view - there is likely someone else on the planet who agrees with it.

My point was if someone is voicing an opinion you find offensive you can simply put them on ignore. There is no need to restrict speech on ESO because we have the tools available to do it ourselves. That's more effective and fair then trying to enforce arbitrary standards.

UrQuan

Jeremy wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

So advocating setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

All opinions are subjective.

No matter how offensive you may find a certain point of view - there is likely someone else on the planet who agrees with it.

My point was if someone is voicing an opinion you find offensive you can simply put them on ignore. There is no need to restrict speech on ESO because we have the tools available to do it ourselves.

See my earlier post about people not knowing history. Your attitude has real world consequences. Failing to fight against hate speech leads to normalizing it. Normalizing it leads to more people starting to agree with it, and leads to people acting on it.

Jeremy

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

So advocating setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

All opinions are subjective.

No matter how offensive you may find a certain point of view - there is likely someone else on the planet who agrees with it.

My point was if someone is voicing an opinion you find offensive you can simply put them on ignore. There is no need to restrict speech on ESO because we have the tools available to do it ourselves.

See my earlier post about people not knowing history. Your attitude has real world consequences. Failing to fight against hate speech leads to normalizing it. Normalizing it leads to more people starting to agree with it, and leads to people acting on it.

The answer to speech you don't like is more speech. Censorship is what has real world consequences. As an example, it was the abolitionists who were censored and denied their free speech rights in our history. It's hard to fight against injustice if your right to speak out against it has been taken away because some one else has deemed it inappropriate or offensive.

No one is suggesting that you normalize setting women on fire. I know I certainly am not. So that comment was absurd.

What I am suggesting is that people simply put others who's speech offends them on ignore. And ignoring people does not give them a greater voice or more legitimacy that it might cause people to act out on it. In fact, it does the opposite.

bulbousb16_ESO

Jeremy wrote: »

My point was if someone is voicing an opinion you find offensive you can simply put them on ignore. There is no need to restrict speech on ESO because we have the tools available to do it ourselves. That's more effective and fair then trying to enforce arbitrary standards.

If it's an opinion that doesn't contradict the Terms of Service, than I agree. If it contradicts the Terms of Service, then it should be reported and discipline enforced. Zone chat is not a free speech area, and never will be. It is censored by its very nature. This isn't the real world.

UrQuan

Jeremy wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

So advocating setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

All opinions are subjective.

No matter how offensive you may find a certain point of view - there is likely someone else on the planet who agrees with it.

My point was if someone is voicing an opinion you find offensive you can simply put them on ignore. There is no need to restrict speech on ESO because we have the tools available to do it ourselves.

See my earlier post about people not knowing history. Your attitude has real world consequences. Failing to fight against hate speech leads to normalizing it. Normalizing it leads to more people starting to agree with it, and leads to people acting on it.

The answer to speech you don't like is more speech. Censorship is what has real world consequences. As an example, it was the abolitionist who were censored and denied their free speech rights in our history. It's hard to fight against injustice if your right to speak out against it has been taken away because some one else has deemed it inappropriate or offensive.

No one is suggesting that you normalize setting women on fire. I know I certainly am not. So that comment was absurd.

What I am suggesting is that people simply put people who's speech offends them on ignore. And ignoring people does not give them a greater voice or more legitimacy that it might cause people to act out on it.

The bold part is the part that shows that you don't know your history. I urge you to study the decade prior to World War II.

Shad0wfire99

When it comes to politics or religion, everyone on all side of those conversations already have their minds made up. Unless your goal is to cause conflict, there's no reason to discuss them.

Jeremy

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

SGT_Wolfe101st wrote: »

This the hallmark of why censorship is bad. Who approves what is okay? You, and your moral compass? Waving with either hand is normal and customary in the US, doing so with your left hand in some middle eastern countries is considered an insult, should we then outlaw waving in all manners so at not offend anyone? Freedom, in all forms, exists at its zenith when it protects the things you the detest you the most, not when your beliefs are upheld. It is slippery slope when an individual becomes the decider of what is allowable and what it not. For the things that are truly inappropriate take the opportunity to utilize the report function, the block/ignore function, and ultimately the don't let pixels on a screen bother you function. What I find funny and what you find inappropriate could be the same thing and neither of us are wrong.

Not wanting sensorship at all. Do you know why waving your left hand is not ok in the middle east? Same goes for shaking hands. I agree sensorship is not the way to go. Teaching those who abuse it would be ideal, but we know that will not happen. I'm not talking about religion, police or anything where opposing views are involved. Hate speech is ignorance, and while they are entitled to their opnion and are allowed to voice their opinions, eso isn't the place for it.

Having a discussion these days isn't civil. If someone disagrees with your opinion we resort to name calling and trying to belittle them, accuse them of being racist, homophobic or any other buzz words that appeal to the masses. There was a time when having a debate was a civil exercise, not so much anymore. There is a lack of respect for anyone who doesn't share your views or idiology. While I may disagree with people here, I certainly respect their opinions. A disconnect between generations values and standards has started in the US.

But who decides what is hate speech and what isn't?

It's all subjective.

Generally the best any of us can do is make up our own rules as to what kind of speech we want to listen to and what kind of speech we don't. And where that option is available to us (as it is here) I don't see a need for censorship or restrictions on speech.

um...about that "subjective"...Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

Setting women on fire because of the way they dress is not speech. That is murder - and illegal here in the United States.

My comments were in reference to hate speech. Not setting people on fire.

So advocating setting women on fire because of the way they dress is "subjective"?

All opinions are subjective.

No matter how offensive you may find a certain point of view - there is likely someone else on the planet who agrees with it.

My point was if someone is voicing an opinion you find offensive you can simply put them on ignore. There is no need to restrict speech on ESO because we have the tools available to do it ourselves.

See my earlier post about people not knowing history. Your attitude has real world consequences. Failing to fight against hate speech leads to normalizing it. Normalizing it leads to more people starting to agree with it, and leads to people acting on it.

The answer to speech you don't like is more speech. Censorship is what has real world consequences. As an example, it was the abolitionist who were censored and denied their free speech rights in our history. It's hard to fight against injustice if your right to speak out against it has been taken away because some one else has deemed it inappropriate or offensive.

No one is suggesting that you normalize setting women on fire. I know I certainly am not. So that comment was absurd.

What I am suggesting is that people simply put people who's speech offends them on ignore. And ignoring people does not give them a greater voice or more legitimacy that it might cause people to act out on it.

The bold part is the part that shows that you don't know your history. I urge you to study the decade prior to World War II.

Ignoring speech and opinions you do not agree with is not nearly the same as ignoring the genocide ofJews.

You are conflating two very different concepts. And if everyone had simply ignored *** and his propaganda then he would have never rose to power to begin with.

If you want to combat rhetoric you don't approve of - then again: censorship is not the answer. More speech is the answer - as it enables you to actually confront and challenge the views being expressed.

My suggestion to simply ignore posters was in reference to a video game chat. You are trying to warp the context of this thread into some kind of political discourse. I doubt many people play ESO in order to challenge the political views of others. I know I certainly don't. And ignoring these people is certainly not going to have them any political power.

UrQuan

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

When it comes to politics or religion, everyone on all side of those conversations already have their minds made up. Unless your goal is to cause conflict, there's no reason to discuss them.

The bold part isn't really true, but it's close enough to being true... In the context of discussing these things in an online game, anyway. There are appropriate forums for discussing such things with people who hold different views in a constructive manner where causing conflict is anything but a foregone conclusion. An online game isn't one of those forums, and discussing things like politics or religion in-game will never be constructive.