Soul Strike is OP

BRogueNZ

AFrostWolf wrote: »

Libonotus wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

There are counters for it.

Also, non-vet PvP is generally new players still getting on their feet.

If you head to a vet server where players are more seasoned, you'll quickly find it's not OP ...

Some seasoned pvpers only do non vet bc of proc sets

Pretty much. Blackwater Blade is basically crafting sets and the occasional 1T set ATM. Everywhere else you have monster helms, proc sets, dungeon sets, champ points, ECT ECT ECT. BwB is simple and sweet. Not super complex and more enjoyable.

well that's a rosey picture, its essentially the same except its like getting zerged by a horde of teenagers

srfrogg23

*pulls out notepad*

"Put points into Soul Strike...got it!"

AFrostWolf

BRogueNZ wrote: »

AFrostWolf wrote: »

Libonotus wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

There are counters for it.

Also, non-vet PvP is generally new players still getting on their feet.

If you head to a vet server where players are more seasoned, you'll quickly find it's not OP ...

Some seasoned pvpers only do non vet bc of proc sets

Pretty much. Blackwater Blade is basically crafting sets and the occasional 1T set ATM. Everywhere else you have monster helms, proc sets, dungeon sets, champ points, ECT ECT ECT. BwB is simple and sweet. Not super complex and more enjoyable.

well that's a rosey picture, its essentially the same except its like getting zerged by a horde of teenagers

Then you're doing it wrong.

Myyth

Ive been trying it out lately, but the channel time is way to long. You could probably do more damage with other attacks in the time it takes to channel.

avelopolcakb14a_ESO

I find the posts in this thread hilarious given all the qq surrounding radiant oppression, despite it being a longer channel, and doing 1/3 the tool tip damage over its' duration. If people are shrugging off soul strike, how can they not realize radiant was fine?

This community man.....

Syiccal

soul strike is very gd in 1v1 it's forces the block/ heal causing them to go on defensive and use up alot of resources while my resources return.
i use soulshine and it absolutely melts anybody not blocking and the ones that do block don't usually have alot of stam left to block follow up attacks.its especially potent if used while there are knocked down or stunned

UrQuan

avelopolcakb14a_ESO wrote: »

I find the posts in this thread hilarious given all the qq surrounding radiant oppression, despite it being a longer channel, and doing 1/3 the tool tip damage over its' duration. If people are shrugging off soul strike, how can they not realize radiant was fine?

This community man.....

Um, there are just a few things you're ignoring in that comparison.

1. Soul Strike is an ultimate. Radiant Oppression is not. You can get a group of templars spamming Radiant Opression. You can't get a group spamming Soul Strike - at best everyone gets to use it all at once and then they all have to build their ultimate back up to use it again.
2. Radiant Oppression has modifiers to it that can make it hit much, much harder than the tooltip damage. If my Templar's at full magicka and the target is below 50% health, my Radiant Oppression does 20K DPS without any buffs or crits. The same character's Soul Strike only does 16K DPS without any buffs or crits. This is post-patch. Pre-patch my Radiant Oppression would have been hitting harder.

Pallio

That is disheartening, when this is the only thing left fir pvpers to complain about.

Rohamad_Ali

Myyth wrote: »

Ive been trying it out lately, but the channel time is way to long. You could probably do more damage with other attacks in the time it takes to channel.

Ya it really feels like forever when casting and you can't let go of the stream . You have to hold on .

avelopolcakb14a_ESO

UrQuan wrote: »

avelopolcakb14a_ESO wrote: »

I find the posts in this thread hilarious given all the qq surrounding radiant oppression, despite it being a longer channel, and doing 1/3 the tool tip damage over its' duration. If people are shrugging off soul strike, how can they not realize radiant was fine?

This community man.....

Um, there are just a few things you're ignoring in that comparison.

1. Soul Strike is an ultimate. Radiant Oppression is not. You can get a group of templars spamming Radiant Opression. You can't get a group spamming Soul Strike - at best everyone gets to use it all at once and then they all have to build their ultimate back up to use it again.
2. Radiant Oppression has modifiers to it that can make it hit much, much harder than the tooltip damage. If my Templar's at full magicka and the target is below 50% health, my Radiant Oppression does 20K DPS without any buffs or crits. The same character's Soul Strike only does 16K DPS without any buffs or crits. This is post-patch. Pre-patch my Radiant Oppression would have been hitting harder.

you are inflating radiants tool tip by an absurd margin. President patch it was doing 13k for me, while soul strike was doing 31k. Yup get bonus dmg, yes, but the 300% increased dmg is only reached at such low health percentages as to make the high dmg tick you'd get almost irrelevant. It over kills at very low health, but deals moderate to heavy dmg through execute range. It's dmg was balanced for pvp.

your claim that you could be hit by multiple radiants has nothing to do with a balance issue with the skill itself. All players can be ganged and targetted. This is not an issue innate to radiant, but a result of zerg pvp. If you got hit by multiple players at the same time and didn't block, get healed or attempt to get away in some fashion, you should die, no exceptions

ArchMikem

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

There are counters for it.

Also, non-vet PvP is generally new players still getting on their feet.

If you head to a vet server where players are more seasoned, you'll quickly find it's not OP ...

Tell that again to the players in Blackwater, I went in there once and it seems like they're all "professional low levels".

UrQuan

avelopolcakb14a_ESO wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

avelopolcakb14a_ESO wrote: »

I find the posts in this thread hilarious given all the qq surrounding radiant oppression, despite it being a longer channel, and doing 1/3 the tool tip damage over its' duration. If people are shrugging off soul strike, how can they not realize radiant was fine?

This community man.....

Um, there are just a few things you're ignoring in that comparison.

1. Soul Strike is an ultimate. Radiant Oppression is not. You can get a group of templars spamming Radiant Opression. You can't get a group spamming Soul Strike - at best everyone gets to use it all at once and then they all have to build their ultimate back up to use it again.
2. Radiant Oppression has modifiers to it that can make it hit much, much harder than the tooltip damage. If my Templar's at full magicka and the target is below 50% health, my Radiant Oppression does 20K DPS without any buffs or crits. The same character's Soul Strike only does 16K DPS without any buffs or crits. This is post-patch. Pre-patch my Radiant Oppression would have been hitting harder.

you are inflating radiants tool tip by an absurd margin. President patch it was doing 13k for me, while soul strike was doing 31k. Yup get bonus dmg, yes, but the 300% increased dmg is only reached at such low health percentages as to make the high dmg tick you'd get almost irrelevant. It over kills at very low health, but deals moderate to heavy dmg through execute range. It's dmg was balanced for pvp.

your claim that you could be hit by multiple radiants has nothing to do with a balance issue with the skill itself. All players can be ganged and targetted. This is not an issue innate to radiant, but a result of zerg pvp. If you got hit by multiple players at the same time and didn't block, get healed or attempt to get away in some fashion, you should die, no exceptions

So the crux of your argument is that you don't understand the difference between an ultimate and a skill that can be spammed over and over and over?

Because that is the primary reason why Radiant needed to be nerfed while Soul Strike is fine (which is why I listed it first). The fact is that Radiant can do far more DPS in the right circumstances, and it's spammable. Remember that the numbers I gave are post-nerf. Pre-nerf it was simply too high due to the spammable nature of it. As soon as a target is at or below 50%, a group of templars can spam Radiant over and over to virtually guarantee a kill.

Odds are most good players can block through/heal through one round of being below 50% and getting hit by simultaneous Soul Strikes from a group. Odds are most good players can block through/heal through one round of being below 50% and getting hit by simultaneous Radiant Oppressions from a group. Odds are that those same people can't survive the same group continuing to hit them with Radiant Oppressions over and over. Because Radiant Oppression isn't an ultimate, and it gets more effective the more you hit the same target with it. The "overkill" at low health isn't irrelevant as you claim, because that makes all the difference in finishing someone off when they're trying to out-block/out-heal the incoming damage.

But I don't really know why I'm bothering to explain this to someone who doesn't understand what an ultimate is...

Myyth

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Myyth wrote: »

Ive been trying it out lately, but the channel time is way to long. You could probably do more damage with other attacks in the time it takes to channel.

Ya it really feels like forever when casting and you can't let go of the stream . You have to hold on .

the worst is when you make a mistake of which ultimate is on which bar and accidently click Soulstrike thinking its another ultimate, move breaking the channel, and then waste all those ultimate points.

avelopolcakb14a_ESO

UrQuan wrote: »

avelopolcakb14a_ESO wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

avelopolcakb14a_ESO wrote: »

I find the posts in this thread hilarious given all the qq surrounding radiant oppression, despite it being a longer channel, and doing 1/3 the tool tip damage over its' duration. If people are shrugging off soul strike, how can they not realize radiant was fine?

This community man.....

Um, there are just a few things you're ignoring in that comparison.

1. Soul Strike is an ultimate. Radiant Oppression is not. You can get a group of templars spamming Radiant Opression. You can't get a group spamming Soul Strike - at best everyone gets to use it all at once and then they all have to build their ultimate back up to use it again.
2. Radiant Oppression has modifiers to it that can make it hit much, much harder than the tooltip damage. If my Templar's at full magicka and the target is below 50% health, my Radiant Oppression does 20K DPS without any buffs or crits. The same character's Soul Strike only does 16K DPS without any buffs or crits. This is post-patch. Pre-patch my Radiant Oppression would have been hitting harder.

you are inflating radiants tool tip by an absurd margin. President patch it was doing 13k for me, while soul strike was doing 31k. Yup get bonus dmg, yes, but the 300% increased dmg is only reached at such low health percentages as to make the high dmg tick you'd get almost irrelevant. It over kills at very low health, but deals moderate to heavy dmg through execute range. It's dmg was balanced for pvp.

your claim that you could be hit by multiple radiants has nothing to do with a balance issue with the skill itself. All players can be ganged and targetted. This is not an issue innate to radiant, but a result of zerg pvp. If you got hit by multiple players at the same time and didn't block, get healed or attempt to get away in some fashion, you should die, no exceptions

So the crux of your argument is that you don't understand the difference between an ultimate and a skill that can be spammed over and over and over?

Because that is the primary reason why Radiant needed to be nerfed while Soul Strike is fine (which is why I listed it first). The fact is that Radiant can do far more DPS in the right circumstances, and it's spammable. Remember that the numbers I gave are post-nerf. Pre-nerf it was simply too high due to the spammable nature of it. As soon as a target is at or below 50%, a group of templars can spam Radiant over and over to virtually guarantee a kill.

Odds are most good players can block through/heal through one round of being below 50% and getting hit by simultaneous Soul Strikes from a group. Odds are most good players can block through/heal through one round of being below 50% and getting hit by simultaneous Radiant Oppressions from a group. Odds are that those same people can't survive the same group continuing to hit them with Radiant Oppressions

over and over. Because Radiant Oppression isn't an ultimate, and it gets more effective the more you hit the same target with it. The "overkill" at low health isn't irrelevant as you claim, because that makes all the difference in finishing someone off when they're trying to out-block/out-heal the incoming damage.

But I don't really know why I'm bothering to explain this to someone who doesn't understand what an ultimate is...

But what you are stating is patently false. Radiants tool tip is 1/3 of soul strikes. Under ideal circumstances it can tick for maybe 15 if the target is exceptionally low health. This is not out of line with other executes in the game. TO can't be "spammed" as you say to guarantee a kill where other skills couldn't be said to the same.

In your cherry picked scenario you imagine 4 templars beaming someone at 50% health over and over to eventually kill that person. How many volleys would they need? More than likely any other combinations of skills could have done comparable dmg up until execute range. If you are seeing a 20k tick that means the target was near death and any execute in the game would have done the same thing

Take 4 nbs spamming their execute at under 50% health and the target dies. 4 crystal frags, 4 wrecking blows. Your argument is disingenuous and doesn't represent a typical use for the skill.

That you've been zerg rushed and died to a bunch of noobs spamming a skill when it was inefficient for them to do so, is not evidence of the skill being op. You would have died quicker to any other combination of skills by more seasoned players. RO just happens to be a templars only semi decent ranged skill. Now, not so much.

now we've got jabs, and uhhh, more jabs

BRogueNZ

OT