Welcome to ESO, where cp 160s must choose stats over style...

Tapio75

WalksonGraves wrote: »

Good thing we have costumes. Diablo was hugrly improved by transmogs, I don't understand people's obsession with being denied visual customization. Are you that unimaginative that you would rather everyone be ugly?

It really is a bad thing we have costumes. Costumes as they are, will always keep the crown store full of stuff ZOS thinks we want to buy and in the meantime, creativity driven cosmetic outfit/Transmog/Wardrobe will not happen as long as people buy the stuff in the store.

Though they could also sell special armor looks and clothing pieces in the store like SWTOR and LOTR, DDO does with cosmetic system but people would have more choice and room for real creativity.

Costumes are just way too restrictive.

Gandrhulf_Harbard

Tapio75 wrote: »

Thankis to investors dream called "Costume slot" we will never see proper wardrobe system like in LOTRO or Transmog like in WOW.

Why let people make their own "costumes" in cosmetic slot system when they can just fill the crown store with number of premade sets that they can just sell to.. Less financially aware people.

I mean i would love to see a proper wardrobe system like in LOTRO but that will not happen i fear because some people really think that costume is better than a set you make with your own creativity.

There has never been a costume in the Crown Store I would consider paying even 5 Crowns for.
But I'd happily pay 100-200 Crowns for a Cosmetic Slot like LOTRO has; in fact one of my LOTRO toons unlocked 3 extra slots, and the other 6 toons all have at least one extra slot unlocked.

All The Best

STEVIL

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

rxhymn wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Unique to drops - 2pc sets, 3pc sets, jewelry for any set.
Unique to crafted - choose motif.


Against any new "let crafting support drop sets more" giveaways until crafting gets its own unique and potent capabilities.

Right now control over appearance is all equip crafting has uniquely its own... will not give that away.

See sig for needed chgs but definitely we need crafted 4pc sets.

This..they are two different kinds of gear to connect them I think is stupid. It's my opinion.


The solution is to modify crafted sets so there are ones that are comparable to helms and shoulders with different benefits and drawbacks. Maybe instead of a proc you have a nice 2 set stat bonus that is a nice alternative to the monster helms...

The problem I have with zos now is the easy solutions that delute the content, instead of fixing pvp gear they let pvp give you the same drops as pve.. same thing here

The thing is... If we're talking about endgame setups, there will always be a set that is better than the rest. Doesnt matter if its just 1-2%, every little bit matters if you're pushing for highscores.
So either crafted sets would be marginally superior (which would devalue all dropped gear and would remove the incentive to farm it and its reward value), or crafted sets would still be placeholders and people would only use them while farming for BiS. Unless they dont care for stats of course.

Unless, crafted and non-crafted provided different options... unique options.

Right now, as i point out above drops have 2-3 and 5 pc sets at their disposal as well as weapon sets which are 1-2pc. they also have a monopoly on jewels.

So, give crafting 4pc sets to go along with 5pc sets and even left them build existing 5pc craft sets as 4pc sets by dropping a 2-3-4 bonus of their choice.

Now you have more unique options that only come from use of crafted gear.

heck, if you added 4pc crafted sets and 3pc crafted sets then you have the possibility of sets with...
2pc monster drops, 3 pc crafted armor, 3-4pc crafted arm+wpn and 3pc jewelry drops.

There are openings right now for giving unique capabilities for crafted and having drops keep their already existing unique elements - 2pc monster 3 pc jewels/wpn sets, all jewels anywhere and let them share 5pc.

Thats how you keep both in play - give them unique options the other alone cannot just step in for.

Sure, there will still be "optimal" depending on content de jour - trials, pvp, 4 man groups, vmsa, etc. buty ytou can have it that EVERY "optimal build" has a combo of crafted and drops with very easy simple additions.

Then crafted is for more than just looks and convenience.

Tapio75

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Tapio75 wrote: »

Thankis to investors dream called "Costume slot" we will never see proper wardrobe system like in LOTRO or Transmog like in WOW.

Why let people make their own "costumes" in cosmetic slot system when they can just fill the crown store with number of premade sets that they can just sell to.. Less financially aware people.

I mean i would love to see a proper wardrobe system like in LOTRO but that will not happen i fear because some people really think that costume is better than a set you make with your own creativity.

There has never been a costume in the Crown Store I would consider paying even 5 Crowns for.
But I'd happily pay 100-200 Crowns for a Cosmetic Slot like LOTRO has; in fact one of my LOTRO toons unlocked 3 extra slots, and the other 6 toons all have at least one extra slot unlocked.

All The Best

Yeah, i have quite a wardrobe collection in LOTRO as well. Especially my wealthy dwarf likes to have stuff on the wardrobe. Similar system here would really add up to sales on my part as well.

Regretfully, i bought a few costumes because i wanted certain looks but they grew boresome and restrictive very soon and i have not used them since. Only costume i regularly use is the cheerful slaughter thing which i always put on characters im about to delete

I dont understand why people even talkk about changing sets so that one could craft a set that looks like they want while they could just use what ever look they wish with proper cosmetic system like in LOTRO, perphaåps they should wish for that instead.

Anthony_Arndt

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

I will never choose stats over appearance.

My main in LOTRO is a Loremaster, he got sent to a convalescence home for 5 months once because I couldn't keep up with stat progression and get a look I was happy with. Spent a lot of time expanding my Wardrobe, and farming drops with specific looks on other toons, and only when I could make my LM look how I wanted him to look did I let him back out in the world.

I like how my Nord looks, and that is that.

I am sure that will mean some other players will say I am rubbish and they will refuse to group with me... ...so what. I'll lose no sleep over that.

All The Best

LOTRO was my favourite fantasy MMO until ESO beta came out. I loved their costuming system and outfit tabs. Best in any game I've encountered. SWTOR and AoC being good ones too. I am the same, appearance always overrules stats. Luckily in LOTRO, SWTOR, and AoC, you never have to display your real armour if you don't want to so it doesn't matter so much.

If ESO would introduce a system like these other games, then I could wear something other than my costumes and disguises. As it stands now, I have three quick slots filled with costumes, while wishing that disguises were still quick slottable, and have not displayed my equipped armour since sometime in my second zone. It's the same for seven of my eight characters, they all have a costume or disguise equipped. Only my level 7 bank alt is showing his real equipment.

Tapio75

Mu current Nord is supposed to Reachman so i use the Barbaric style which is basically the right look.. But for my Khajit, i just dont have the clothing i want that i could use, i mean i yhave these clothes i robbed from people in my bank with wich, i can get the proper raggedy look for him but i cant because i have to use at least some armor

Many other characters are similarly oin problematic position. Only 2 out of 8 characters have the proper look.

Blacksmoke

I agree take for example my healer who runs the SPC set and the Worm cult set together. Its my ugliest character while being the highest level and had the most play time. Then look at my new character I made two days ago which is level 10 and runs around in awesome Daggerfall covenant armor. that should be the otherway around. It sucks having to choose either beauty or power. And at least update fix how the current sets look I mean have you seen the wormcult set?! You cant even properly dye it to make it look okayish. Though in my opinion the monster helms are kinda cool but they still need some work.

DM_ESO

It's very disappointing that I feel I have no control over anything on my character from looks to stats or even what abilities I can slot.

In Guild Wars 2 we use a consumable drop (that is also sold cheap in the store) that lets us re-skin any of our armor pieces on the fly to any appearance we have unlocked(within the weight tier). A big part of the end game is finding pieces to make up different looks. People tend to gather around crowded spots and show off whatever they came up with and there is a LOT of variation. Enough that anyone can approximate any character look they want.

Grab any random group of players, and they all have their own looks and personalities. In ESO we have a *** monoculture.

JKorr

DM_ESO wrote: »

It's very disappointing that I feel I have no control over anything on my character from looks to stats or even what abilities I can slot.

In Guild Wars 2 we use a consumable drop (that is also sold cheap in the store) that lets us re-skin any of our armor pieces on the fly to any appearance we have unlocked(within the weight tier). A big part of the end game is finding pieces to make up different looks. People tend to gather around crowded spots and show off whatever they came up with and there is a LOT of variation. Enough that anyone can approximate any character look they want.

Grab any random group of players, and they all have their own looks and personalities. In ESO we have a *** monoculture.

Yes, but apparently changing the look of gear would make everything "boring". According to rxhymn, anyway.

Why seeing a group of players going into a delve/trial/pledge with all the same monster helms isn't the same/boring, I don't know. If the items were super rare, like the emperor's outfit, then maybe not allowing them to be changed would be okay. They aren't that rare however, so you do see a lot of the same thing over and over and over.... which to me would be boring.

Artemiisia

Blacksmoke wrote: »

I agree take for example my healer who runs the SPC set and the Worm cult set together. Its my ugliest character while being the highest level and had the most play time. Then look at my new character I made two days ago which is level 10 and runs around in awesome Daggerfall covenant armor. that should be the otherway around. It sucks having to choose either beauty or power. And at least update fix how the current sets look I mean have you seen the wormcult set?! You cant even properly dye it to make it look okayish. Though in my opinion the monster helms are kinda cool but they still need some work.

I would even make the armor of the faction im in, for when im in cyrodil if it was possible to wear it as vanity, that would make it more immersive and fun, feeling you are part of a "real" army, going to battle with guild tabard and looking the part

damn, now I need it even more waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

crying out load

Weasel_Tunneler

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

I will never choose stats over appearance.

My main in LOTRO is a Loremaster, he got sent to a convalescence home for 5 months once because I couldn't keep up with stat progression and get a look I was happy with. Spent a lot of time expanding my Wardrobe, and farming drops with specific looks on other toons, and only when I could make my LM look how I wanted him to look did I let him back out in the world.

I like how my Nord looks, and that is that.

I am sure that will mean some other players will say I am rubbish and they will refuse to group with me... ...so what. I'll lose no sleep over that.

All The Best

Me too pal.

I'm missing a monster set to make my Templar more tankish than he already is, but I don't want to lose the look of a true Paladin I gave to him to wear an ugly shoulders (I can hide the helmet)

Lotro cosmetic system is the best cosmetic system of any MMORPG I know.

Also did you know Turbine implemented melee/ranged weapons, staves/runes and shields cosmetic as well? Now you can wear a dagger while equipping a sword, the only thing is you can only put in cosmetic that cover the right weapon equipped.

So One handed - one handed cosmetics

Two handed - two handed cosmetic

Shields - shield cosmetic

Bows - bows cosmetics

Javelins - javelins cosmetics

Staffs - staffs cosmetic

Runes - runes cosmetic

Back in the day Turbine's developers said that weapon cosmetic was too hard to implement, now we have it, and they are still using the same engine (only with a few upgrades) they were using since 2006. So basically a game made in 2006 have more cosmetic features using a outdated engine, than a game made in 2013 with a way better and updated engine.

L2develop I'd say.

qsnoopyjr

rxhymn wrote: »

No diablo scrolls.

Whenever they fulfill promise of spellcrafting...
It will be spellcrafting in scrolls... Not actual spells.

That 1000 acrobatic increase scroll u been itching for? May come true someday.

zaria

Hagrett wrote: »

It could be so simple. Make a system usable at the craft station where you would select two items, one for the stats, the second for the looks. Give it a cost, something like the style material for the second item and a few of the base material from the first. This way people with the fancy motifs will have requests to actually craft them, and style materials would still be needed, it would also take materials out of the economy.

Whipped up a crappy pic in ms paint to show my line of thought:

WOW has an system like this and it works as simple as this.
Best example in ESO is the upgrade function, you here get an icon of the new item and the stats so its hard to mess up.
You can even try out the armor you use for style first.

Weasel_Tunneler

It a shame having this game with so much lore stuff and yet lack 100% of character appeal costumization.

richfshrwb17_ESO

While leveling an alt I got a shield at lvl 15 that I would love to use on my lvl 50 Templar...alas it will never be and will be stuck with the stat shield I hate the look of. I feel sorry for the artist who created the look of the shield only to have it used for an hour or two while leveling then locked out forever.

Many games with good customization let me wardrobe small low level shoulders so I don't have to show the oversized monstrosities that develop with rising levels.

How to monetize a wardrobe system and still be respectful to paying customers has been solved by many MMO's so that is a solved problem that presents no barrier to ZoS doing the same.

Necrelios

Hah Banetek, you hit the nail right on the head. When they first introduced purchasable costumes everyone pretty much called this. Then they stopped making it so you could convert the new gear sets to Imperial Style. Bunch of mean cheapskates. The flagrant, right in our face audacity of the marketing team, I swear.

Oh! And then they expect you to purchase the collectors edition of Morrowind DLC for the transmorph to Morag Tong style. To do what exactly? Not be able to use it just like Imperial style? Okay.

Tannus15

The most useful thing for "convert to imperial" is to convert trash and then decon it for the nickle.

I agree with the above posters that LOTRO has far and away the best cosmetic system of any MMO to date and ESO would do well to copy it in some way.

In fact that only thing I disagree with in this thread is the "how hard could it be" ***. *** is complicated and just because you can articulate what you want doesn't mean it's easy to do in code.

SFDB

Necrelios wrote: »

Oh! And then they expect you to purchase the collectors edition of Morrowind DLC for the transmorph to Morag Tong style. To do what exactly? Not be able to use it just like Imperial style? Okay.

"Convert to Morag Tong style" is going to prove about as useful as "turn columbine into fleshfly larvae". I saw that as a selling point and actually laughed.

Here's hoping that it's part of an overall effort to help us customize appearance, I would love to be proven wrong about its value.

Necrelios

SFDB wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

Oh! And then they expect you to purchase the collectors edition of Morrowind DLC for the transmorph to Morag Tong style. To do what exactly? Not be able to use it just like Imperial style? Okay.

"Convert to Morag Tong style" is going to prove about as useful as "turn columbine into fleshfly larvae". I saw that as a selling point and actually laughed.

Here's hoping that it's part of an overall effort to help us customize appearance, I would love to be proven wrong about its value.

It's becoming some sort of ongoing trope with ZenitharMax to sell you something and then take away it's main selling point later on or at some point introducing something much better.

Nerouyn

Style before stats for me.

It sucks that we're forced to choose between them but when that's the choice, I choose to look good.

Tuxi

They should consider implementing something similar to the way that DCUO uses and modifying it to fit here. Each piece of armour/weapon you ever collected you can select or leave empty (or could if I remember rightly, been years since I played DCUO). So you could essentially mix and match anything you ever tried on... mix that in with a more robust (please more outfits) style section of the store and you could have all sorts of looks.

lookstwice

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Seeing many players with the *exact same monster helm and shoulder* no matter what other style of armor they have ISN'T boring? If this "reduces the incentive and reward", why are so many players going after the gear in the first place? The look would change, not the stats.

Its not just boring... There's nothing really "epic" about those endgame sets, they look bland at best,especially the ones that use old motifs, like Mother's Sorrow or Burning Spellweave. Some pieces are outright ugly (especially Grothdarr and Ilambris).
Behold, a max cp trial conqueror in full golden BiS gear! Looks cool, isnt it?

And yeah, I see an armor set and want to paint it blaaack... Because all other colors look like *** on these outdated textures.
Not to mention they all look dirty and tattered for some reason... I understand that low level dropped gear might look this way, but max level legendary items?

Lol I had to do a double take. I thought that shoulder piece was part of the background. Wow...

But yeah, +1 on everything the OP said.

I don't like it when I'm asked what I'm wearing when tanking a dungeon. I have to preface with saying I will not wear anything that looks like crap even if it's an upgrade.

So for now I'm just sticking with normals. I would like to progress and move up to vet, but I refuse to equip the stuff that drops. I mean some of the monster helms are absolutely hideous. I can't believe that person that created it still has a job or the person that signed off on it.

STEVIL

Necrelios wrote: »

Hah Banetek, you hit the nail right on the head. When they first introduced purchasable costumes everyone pretty much called this. Then they stopped making it so you could convert the new gear sets to Imperial Style. Bunch of mean cheapskates. The flagrant, right in our face audacity of the marketing team, I swear.

Oh! And then they expect you to purchase the collectors edition of Morrowind DLC for the transmorph to Morag Tong style. To do what exactly? Not be able to use it just like Imperial style? Okay.

not to rain on your crownspiracy #altfacts on parade but am i mistaken that not being able to convert drop sets did not come after they introduced crown store costuming but iircmay have come day one of release? i seem to recall not being able to alter Warlock gear way way way back in the day.

zaria

STEVIL wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

Hah Banetek, you hit the nail right on the head. When they first introduced purchasable costumes everyone pretty much called this. Then they stopped making it so you could convert the new gear sets to Imperial Style. Bunch of mean cheapskates. The flagrant, right in our face audacity of the marketing team, I swear.

Oh! And then they expect you to purchase the collectors edition of Morrowind DLC for the transmorph to Morag Tong style. To do what exactly? Not be able to use it just like Imperial style? Okay.

not to rain on your crownspiracy #altfacts on parade but am i mistaken that not being able to convert drop sets did not come after they introduced crown store costuming but iircmay have come day one of release? i seem to recall not being able to alter Warlock gear way way way back in the day.

Pretty sure it have never been able to transform sets. Probably as dropped sets tend to have an fixed style.
Most of the costumes are town wear not something you would wear in combat.
Tank in pink dress and long beard

Necrelios

STEVIL wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

Hah Banetek, you hit the nail right on the head. When they first introduced purchasable costumes everyone pretty much called this. Then they stopped making it so you could convert the new gear sets to Imperial Style. Bunch of mean cheapskates. The flagrant, right in our face audacity of the marketing team, I swear.

Oh! And then they expect you to purchase the collectors edition of Morrowind DLC for the transmorph to Morag Tong style. To do what exactly? Not be able to use it just like Imperial style? Okay.

not to rain on your crownspiracy #altfacts on parade but am i mistaken that not being able to convert drop sets did not come after they introduced crown store costuming but iircmay have come day one of release? i seem to recall not being able to alter Warlock gear way way way back in the day.

I don't recall it that way, but that was before I started wearing my shiny tinfoil hat so I could have easily been fed false memories via satellite or any SMART device in my house.

Necrelios

<deleted double post>

ArrerBoy

Why not just extend the wardrobe function to be like something in GW2? You have your basic stat slot which lets you equip whatever you need to be optimized for your build, but each slot has an alternative 'wardrobe' slot which changes the appearance of that armor to whatever you put in.

You can keep the monster slot but put in whatever crafted motif you want, or keep that one shield with the talking daedra and not have to worry about it's stats not being used to their fullest.