What exactly makes Radiant powerful enough to where everyone hates it?

vyndral13preub18_ESO

ArchMikem wrote: »

I just wanna note, just came back from Cyrodiil, and not only did a low health Nightblade survive through my Jesus Beam, but a Meteor as well.

But if there had been 5 of you Jesus beaming him, he would never had a chance! What more proof do you need! It is OP!

idk

Lord-Otto wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Finally you get it...

slot the wrong skills against a given setup means you likely are at a disadvantage and may well lose unless you seriously outplay the opposition.

Slot the right skills against a given setup and gain a significant advantage and likely win unless you are seriously outplayed.

And of course you cannot have one setup that is the right one for all adversaries.

Just Like i said a few posts ago.

Why you dont seem to think that should apply to radiant or maybe to you is still baffling though

Unfortunately, YOU don't get it. You suggest slotting very specialized skills in an open environment where you have to deal with everything. Yeah, do it, see how far that gets you.
Anyway, from your worthless comment I can already see you want this game to be like Pokémon. *sigh*

@Lord-Otto

In a manner of speaking the person you quoted is correct and your remarks are certainly off the mark.

Players generally build for what they plan to do in Cyrodiil. A ganker will build differently than someone running with a small group and even differently than one running with a large zerge. This includes skills and gear all the way down to traits.

In many cases part of the build is defensive and part is offensive. With all of this, some players have what they think is a great build, yet it hits like a wet noodle and leaves them just a paper shell that dies fast.

Add in tactics, how to view the area and deal with differing styles of players and PvP is not that simple.

That brings us to discussions like this thread. Most players do not have a good idea of what works best. When they keep dying and especially see the same skills in their death report they come here to qq rather than figure out what works better. Add in the ones that qq about a skill and add in they were being attacked by 6 people at the same time and most were using the same skill.

Much of this merely shows a lack of knowledge rather than a skill being OP.

And yes, I have been on the receiving end of RD many times yet rarely die to it for some odd reason. Maybe my build and how I approach the situation makes a difference.

Lord-Otto

Giles:
You bring a very bad example to the table.
When a ganker builds his skills for ganking, he is actively setting up his playstyle, which is fine and the point of classes.
But when you have to slot very specific counters to another person's playstyle, you become passive. Continue this trend and you will have all people specifically countering only select builds, and otherwise being poop. That leads to a rock, paper, scissor situation which no one wants and has ruined games before.
You know how people complain these days that they got beaten by gear, by procs, not by skillful play? If we take some people's advice here, we'll soon hear complaints about how sorcs lost because a mag DK came along. How NBs lost because there was a temp. And so on.
Hard counters are fine, but they shouldn't be the only solution to a powerful skill, item or whatever.

maxjapank

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

That brings us to discussions like this thread. Most players do not have a good idea of what works best. When they keep dying and especially see the same skills in their death report they come here to qq rather than figure out what works better. Add in the ones that qq about a skill and add in they were being attacked by 6 people at the same time and most were using the same skill.

Much of this merely shows a lack of knowledge rather than a skill being OP.

And yes, I have been on the receiving end of RD many times yet rarely die to it for some odd reason. Maybe my build and how I approach the situation makes a difference.

Well said. Exactly this!

Lord-Otto

maxjapank wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

That brings us to discussions like this thread. Most players do not have a good idea of what works best. When they keep dying and especially see the same skills in their death report they come here to qq rather than figure out what works better. Add in the ones that qq about a skill and add in they were being attacked by 6 people at the same time and most were using the same skill.

Much of this merely shows a lack of knowledge rather than a skill being OP.

And yes, I have been on the receiving end of RD many times yet rarely die to it for some odd reason. Maybe my build and how I approach the situation makes a difference.

Well said. Exactly this!

And six people spamming the very same skill doesn't make your alarm go off? Sounds balanced? Maybe there is a reason why everyone spams it, hm?

maxjapank

Lord-Otto wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

That brings us to discussions like this thread. Most players do not have a good idea of what works best. When they keep dying and especially see the same skills in their death report they come here to qq rather than figure out what works better. Add in the ones that qq about a skill and add in they were being attacked by 6 people at the same time and most were using the same skill.

Much of this merely shows a lack of knowledge rather than a skill being OP.

And yes, I have been on the receiving end of RD many times yet rarely die to it for some odd reason. Maybe my build and how I approach the situation makes a difference.

Well said. Exactly this!

And six people spamming the very same skill doesn't make your alarm go off? Sounds balanced? Maybe there is a reason why everyone spams it, hm?

People spam all sorts of skills. Not sure what you're up about. Don't get upset when people offer advice of how to play against or counter RD. But you don't seem to want to take such advice. So you come here and qq, just like Giles said.

thankyourat

maxjapank wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

That brings us to discussions like this thread. Most players do not have a good idea of what works best. When they keep dying and especially see the same skills in their death report they come here to qq rather than figure out what works better. Add in the ones that qq about a skill and add in they were being attacked by 6 people at the same time and most were using the same skill.

Much of this merely shows a lack of knowledge rather than a skill being OP.

And yes, I have been on the receiving end of RD many times yet rarely die to it for some odd reason. Maybe my build and how I approach the situation makes a difference.

Well said. Exactly this!

And six people spamming the very same skill doesn't make your alarm go off? Sounds balanced? Maybe there is a reason why everyone spams it, hm?

People spam all sorts of skills. Not sure what you're up about. Don't get upset when people offer advice of how to play against or counter RD. But you don't seem to want to take such advice. So you come here and qq, just like Giles said.

But spamming Jesus beam is far too effective. if you get 4 people spamming snipe or dizzying swing that's usually free ap, but good luck dealing with 4 Jesus beam spammers.

maxjapank

thankyourat wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

That brings us to discussions like this thread. Most players do not have a good idea of what works best. When they keep dying and especially see the same skills in their death report they come here to qq rather than figure out what works better. Add in the ones that qq about a skill and add in they were being attacked by 6 people at the same time and most were using the same skill.

Much of this merely shows a lack of knowledge rather than a skill being OP.

And yes, I have been on the receiving end of RD many times yet rarely die to it for some odd reason. Maybe my build and how I approach the situation makes a difference.

Well said. Exactly this!

And six people spamming the very same skill doesn't make your alarm go off? Sounds balanced? Maybe there is a reason why everyone spams it, hm?

People spam all sorts of skills. Not sure what you're up about. Don't get upset when people offer advice of how to play against or counter RD. But you don't seem to want to take such advice. So you come here and qq, just like Giles said.

But spamming Jesus beam is far too effective. if you get 4 people spamming snipe or dizzying swing that's usually free ap, but good luck dealing with 4 Jesus beam spammers.

Nope. This just isn't true. But keep making excuses. It's easier than learning counter play

Sugaroverdose

maxjapank wrote: »

People spam all sorts of skills. Not sure what you're up about. Don't get upset when people offer advice of how to play against or counter RD. But you don't seem to want to take such advice. So you come here and qq, just like Giles said.

Yeah, but they actually have disadvantages, RD zerg spam don't, so it must be fixed.

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

What you guys aren't getting when you get all hyper defensive like this, is that you don't need to. Classes need unique abilities for diversity. RD is a unique, and powerful skill. When put side by side with other executes it does tend to rise above the rest, but there are counters - especially against someone who knows how to block and bash. Despite it being such a strong skill, that's part of what makes templars unique, and is not a case for nerfing it. I'm sure templars would love the mobility that sorcerers and nightblades enjoy, and I'm sure they would love the tremendous CC advantage that DKs enjoy... but they get their own toolset instead.

Seriously, when you reach so hard like you did in this post you're just doing yourself a disservice - someone with time could pick this apart with all the exaggeration and fallacy. I guess what I'm saying is chill out a little.

Any interrupt is not a counter, RD potato will recast it instantly, don't pretend idiot.

So you dont ever dodge anything? Since it isnt a counter or anything. They will just recast...

Dodge is 2.5s evasion of almost all damage, it's not even nearly the same

maxjapank wrote: »

Nope. This just isn't true. But keep making excuses. It's easier than learning counter play

Nah, it's you who search for excuses here, people point is extremely clear: RD must be nerfed.

Or by making it's effective distance around 20m, or by implementing cooldown which will prevent spamming.

First variant will do nothing to not zergspamming people.
Second variant is radical but experienced people still can deal with it, spammers will just stay as dummy or at least check out how other Templar skills looks like.

Kutsuu

Jaronking wrote: »

Kutsuu wrote: »

Jaronking wrote: »

Cloak is so broken that any skill you use will break him out of cloak on a Templar all you have to do is jab and your find him make a better counter argument.Then comparing cloak to RD cloak breaks if you breath on a NB.

I don't think you read my post before flipping out about how OP'd you think templars are. Let's try to break it down: "Let's say you walk into a fight with a magicka nightblade without a single AOE attack or any type of stealth reveal on your bars"

Does that statement mention templars in any way? No. But it does very specifically mention that you walked into a fight without any aoe attacks or stealth reveals. It was an example with the simple point that choosing not to counter something is far different than something having no counters.

There are certainly lots of issues with cloak. I hate how badly they broke it with the "cloak no longer cancels projectiles" thing. However, that issue has no bearing on the example that I presented. Reach harder.

Did I say templars were OP in my post all I said you can't use cloak as a example.Maybe you should try reading and not assuming.As I said you can't compare cloak since the current version is so broken you don't need any of those to break a NB of our cloak.As I said pick something you actually will have a argument about cloak isn't a good example since you don't need anything to counter it.

Come on the discussion is about a ability only templars have access to why wouldn't I use templars as a example? I can use any build and break cloak I don't need a counter like I said pick something else to use as a argument. Only option on a stambuild I have is a ability that won't help me and just hinder my ability to use others abilities.Of purge was cheaper and had a stam morph you have a point until then saying use purge is not a real argument since only magic builds can use it and even for them its expensive.

You're still completely missing the point in your blind ambition to whine about cloak. I'll try repeating it one more time for you - "It was an example with the simple point that choosing not to counter something is far different than something having no counters."

That said.... yeah man, I get it. Cloak sucks right now. I've mained a Nightblade since beta and it's disappointing for me too.

Minalan

People hate RD because you never seem to have fewer than six of them on you at any given time.

It's like a potato chip, you can't eat just one! One Templar beams you at full health, and it's like a magnet. You laugh at the 100% health execute spamming Zerg-tato, but then every other Templar joins in the stupid.

Now you've got five or six beams on you , and you're not EXACTLY at full health anymore. And it's definitely no longer funny.

Sugaroverdose

Minalan wrote: »

People hate RD because you never seem to have fewer than six of them on you at any given time.

It's like a potato chip, you can't eat just one! One Templar beams you at full health, and it's like a magnet. You laugh at the 100% health execute spamming Zerg-tato, but then every other Templar joins in the stupid.

Now you've got five or six beams on you , and you're not EXACTLY at full health anymore. And it's definitely no longer funny.

6 beams hitting for 2k is 12k dps, most of the builds if they don't counter will be varnished on third tick