Ignoring a player should make your messages invisible to them

Draxys

Ufretin wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

People say the meanest things . I know on Ps4 they do take take this serious as a player told me they got banned for saying political stuff and when He told me exactly what was said it was way more then political and he definetly needed a time out . I told him to rated M means mature and mature doesn't always mean curse words but actually acting mature . The TOS does not allow anything involving harassment .

On PC-EU I've reported players for insults and "political things" that would constitute a criminal offense in most countries but haven't seen anyone ever get banned even temporarily.

Same here, I don't understand it. I've seen things in chat that are legitimately concerning, yet an old guild member got banned for calling someone a pretty tame slang word. It's unfortunate.

Doctordarkspawn

Woeler wrote: »

LOL all these thick skin comments. You are totally missing the point of this topic. I'm suggesting a change to the ignore system based on my experiences with it. In all honesty, reporting does not help at all. A friend of mine has received death threats from another user and those were sent to ZOS with screenshots and all the information. Nothing happened. I'm asking for one of two things. A ) Actually do something with the reports or B ) Make ignore work 2 ways. Either will most likely solve almost all problems.

I'm not crying in my bed because this person is writing *** lol. I'm annoyed by the fact that people I have blocked are still able to see everything I write. This is the same nonsense that I can block person X so he can't whisper me, but I can still whisper person X. This does not make sense at all.

Welcome to the internet. You shouldn't be able to avoid the consequences of your behavior IRL, and you can only do it so much here.

The system we have in place now usually works the way it does because completely altering it is usually more trouble than it's worth, on top of all the ethicanl questions of 'should we block your chat to them and hamper their ability to respond to what you say, thus restricting their speech'. It's worked for generations.

ZOS's response team should do alot more things, and the death threats are horrible, yeah. And they need consequences. But based on your annoyance alone? Your annoyance, is not enough to justify the speech law violation, which ZOS has to uphold. (I believe since their a US company their game abides by US law. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)

zyk

A feature like this would be abused. For example, player Y might ignore player X to talk trash talk about him in zone chat. This would be extremely popular among trolls.

Or it could be used as a tool to exclude people who may be unpopular, but are not malicious.

As others have said, the solution is for ZOS to better enforce its TOS with more consistency.

Woeler

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

LOL all these thick skin comments. You are totally missing the point of this topic. I'm suggesting a change to the ignore system based on my experiences with it. In all honesty, reporting does not help at all. A friend of mine has received death threats from another user and those were sent to ZOS with screenshots and all the information. Nothing happened. I'm asking for one of two things. A ) Actually do something with the reports or B ) Make ignore work 2 ways. Either will most likely solve almost all problems.

I'm not crying in my bed because this person is writing *** lol. I'm annoyed by the fact that people I have blocked are still able to see everything I write. This is the same nonsense that I can block person X so he can't whisper me, but I can still whisper person X. This does not make sense at all.

Welcome to the internet. You shouldn't be able to avoid the consequences of your behavior IRL, and you can only do it so much here.

The system we have in place now usually works the way it does because completely altering it is usually more trouble than it's worth, on top of all the ethicanl questions of 'should we block your chat to them and hamper their ability to respond to what you say, thus restricting their speech'. It's worked for generations.

ZOS's response team should do alot more things, and the death threats are horrible, yeah. And they need consequences. But based on your annoyance alone? Your annoyance, is not enough to justify the speech law violation, which ZOS has to uphold. (I believe since their a US company their game abides by US law. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.)

TOS:

You agree not to use any Service to:

Take any action or upload, post, transmit, promote, or distribute any illegal Content, including, but not limited to, any UGC or any Game Mods;

Take any action or upload, post, transmit, promote, or distribute any Content that infringes or violates any third party rights;

Engage in, take any action associated with, or participate in any type of child solicitation, grooming behavior, pedophilia, or predatory behavior in any form;

Harass, stalk, threaten, embarrass, spam or do anything else to another user of any Services that is unwanted, such as repeatedly sending unwanted messages or making personal attacks or statements about race, sexual orientation, religion, heritage, etc.;

Nobody is talking about speech laws here.

idk

Ignoring a player should only affect what you see and being grouped with him via GF. It should not prevent him form seeing your text chat via shared chat rooms.

jorasupay

I read everything written. I am one of those who consider that by ignoring a user, the action must be bidirectional.

But the worrying thing is that there are no forms of blocking. In my case, I had a bad experience with a player in a random dungeon, and my problem is not solved by "ignoring" the user. I do not want to cross paths with him in any random dungeon ever.
I do not always have a friend or colleague of a guild at my disposal to be in a "functional and respectful" group.

So, what I see is that there is a fundamental problem, and it is the indifference of the company. I can understand that sanctions are not applied, we are all clients after all ... What bothers me is that it can not be cut with the offenses and uncomfortable situations, and that the company does not have concrete solutions to the problems.

LordSemaj

Holy mother of Necro, Batman!

SydneyGrey

What is the freaking point of an ignore button if the person harassing you can still see your posts, and respond to them, only without you being able to see what he writes so you can defend yourself? Holy crap, ZOS. It's like if someone was punching you, and you put a blindfold on, but the attacker could still see you, and continued hitting you.

I always assumed it meant they wouldn't be able to see my posts any more, but apparently I was wrong. There apparently isn't much of a point to set anyone on "ignore" now.

Slick_007

nordsavage wrote: »

Fine the way it is. Maybe you shouldn't be so soft.

theres no concrete in ESO, so....?

zyk

SydneyGrey wrote: »

What is the freaking point of an ignore button if the person harassing you can still see your posts, and respond to them, only without you being able to see what he writes so you can defend yourself? Holy crap, ZOS. It's like if someone was punching you, and you put a blindfold on, but the attacker could still see you, and continued hitting you.

The point of ignore is that if you don't like what that person has to say, you don't have to read it. That's it. If you don't want someone -- anyone -- to read something you have to say, don't write it in a public forum.

Kram8ion

Cinbri wrote: »

Also please increase ignore list limit.

It might be old and yes I got sucked in but think I found thread winner lmfao

Vizier

Probably not a bad idea to have ignore work both ways. Person is choosing to not have contact with someone who is toxic it should be respected by ZoS. I'm kind of surprised ZoS hasn't weighed in on this, especially since there has been a public claim of harassment by another player.

SaintSubwayy

Actually I agree with the OP in this problem.

Ignoring someone has to automaticly remove all messages you sent in chats for him aswell.
Prob add you to their ignorelist, but they cannot remove you form it, unless you remove them from your own ignolist first.

Furthermore there should be a more detailed Reportsystem.
Maybe something towards "legal lawsuits in my country" which would force ZOS to take action. (temp ban, chat ban, permaban...depending on the seriousness of the incident)

Since the Ingame Account is bound to a persons Name, adress, Email ect. , some harrasement could be brought to a legal lawsuit, which could end rly bad for the harrasing peron. (ofc its the last line of defense for certain ppl, but some harrasment need a 100% punish rate)

So fuction as the OP is aksing for could reduce such unfortunate chats.

Derra

Ufretin wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

People say the meanest things . I know on Ps4 they do take take this serious as a player told me they got banned for saying political stuff and when He told me exactly what was said it was way more then political and he definetly needed a time out . I told him to rated M means mature and mature doesn't always mean curse words but actually acting mature . The TOS does not allow anything involving harassment .

On PC-EU I've reported players for insults and "political things" that would constitute a criminal offense in most countries but haven't seen anyone ever get banned even temporarily.

I know of two people that got permabanned bc they made real life death threats in sends.

SaintSubwayy

Derra wrote: »

Ufretin wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

People say the meanest things . I know on Ps4 they do take take this serious as a player told me they got banned for saying political stuff and when He told me exactly what was said it was way more then political and he definetly needed a time out . I told him to rated M means mature and mature doesn't always mean curse words but actually acting mature . The TOS does not allow anything involving harassment .

On PC-EU I've reported players for insults and "political things" that would constitute a criminal offense in most countries but haven't seen anyone ever get banned even temporarily.

I know of two people that got permabanned bc they made real life death threats in sends.

Well they definetly deserved it.
Actually they can say they were lucky to not get a lawsuit for it.
The "annonymity" in games lowers the verbar harrasment barriers dasticly

Peekachu99

FoolishHuman wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

I should be able to control what I see, via ignore, so should you.
I should NOT be able to control what others see, via any means at all, neither should you.

Think about it, instead of responding to you they could just be saying bad things anyway and not be seen by you to report them - at their click, not yours.

You control you. I control me.
The mods and hopefully responsive governance are what has to handle others.

IMO

That doesn't make any sense. I control what others see because I can type into chat whatever I want. Or not. By that logic there shouldn't be any kind of ingame chat at all.

Skcarkden wrote: »

So yes, some people do need a thicker skin, but saying people need manners in return is mis-directed. the people getting ignored usually are the ones in need of manners, not the one saying get a thicker skin.

Those with the "thicker skin" comments are just the apologists of unsocial behavior. I feel that these people are also in need of some manners.
The internet isn't some anarchist nightmare where everyone can do as they please and the others have to learn to live with it.

Awesome reply! A lot of people think that the digital-explosion in ways to communicate across any distance means that all the niceties of social interaction are somehow no longer relevant. We’re still people, and connected and responsible for each other. We have no right to crap on someone simply because we’re likely never to see them in real life.

More on topic. Ignore doesn’t seem to really work, not as it should: complete cessation of all interactions between the offended parties. It’s like a restraining order that doesn’t apply to the victim lol

I just ran a dungeon finder random with an absolutely toxic individual who was on ignore and I could see everything they posted up until the time they were vote kicked (not initiated, though happily voted on, by me).

Or does Ignore only apply to that person not seeing my messages? Really it should be a full and complete block, including conversations and party grouping (first to queue would obviously take priority in matchmaking). Other games do this: FFXIV, WoW.

I adore ESO, but hopefully we see some advanced social tools in 2018.

Doctordarkspawn

Woooooaaaaah baby a necro.

For the record, my answer is the same as it was back then. The system has it's flaws, but it's fine. It'd be too cost ineffective and probably break the game even more to screw with how the ignore list functions in reguards to rendering.

I'd also like to comment that oh golly gee how friggin vague the TOS is. They allways are, so the company can pick and choose what they enforce.

SolidusPrime

I agree with you mostly, OP, but really what does it matter? You can't see their childish posts so why does it bother you so much? Let them waste their time running their mouth while you gradually forget that they even exist.

newtinmpls

Woeler wrote: »

So I basically have a player on ignore, because he has been insulting me and my family members extensively, but I found out via friends that whenever I'm having a normal conversation with someone in zone chat this guy still keeps replying to my comments insulting me and my family members. I can't see it, but it's still there..

I would encourage you to not worry about it.

If people consider him/her annoying, or reportable, they will report him/her. good for them.

Balamoor

jorasupay wrote: »

I read everything written. I am one of those who consider that by ignoring a user, the action must be bidirectional.

But the worrying thing is that there are no forms of blocking. In my case, I had a bad experience with a player in a random dungeon, and my problem is not solved by "ignoring" the user. I do not want to cross paths with him in any random dungeon ever.
I do not always have a friend or colleague of a guild at my disposal to be in a "functional and respectful" group.

So, what I see is that there is a fundamental problem, and it is the indifference of the company. I can understand that sanctions are not applied, we are all clients after all ... What bothers me is that it can not be cut with the offenses and uncomfortable situations, and that the company does not have concrete solutions to the problems.

Interesting that you necro a thread like this.....the issue hasn't and won't change much it's an issue that is going to keep being ignored and the general toxicity of the community will continue to grow. Reporting dose basically nothing, unless it surrounds a perceived cheat so it's not really worth bothering.

Elsonso

Hmm.

1. No, ignoring someone should not hide what you say from them. That is up to them, not you. I can think of a number of abuses, some of which might be rather nasty.
2. Yes, ZOS should deal with this things promptly and efficiently, and with a minimal amount of Ritual Passing of the Buck between ZOS and Microsoft/Sony on the consoles.
3. As an improvement, when grouping or even entering a zone, the game should attempt to avoid placing you with people on your ignore list. However, we have to realize that (1) this might lead to longer load screens, and (2) might not be possible to guarantee.

nnargun

Woeler wrote: »

So I basically have a player on ignore, because he has been insulting me and my family members extensively, but I found out via friends that whenever I'm having a normal conversation with someone in zone chat this guy still keeps replying to my comments insulting me and my family members. I can't see it, but it's still there.

Now this wouldn't be an issue if you actually took care of harassment reports, but I guess people telling you your family members are *** and that you should kill yourself are totally tolerated. So if you're not doing anything about it, at least make my chat messages not appear to the people I have ignored.

Thanks.

Thread TL;DR

However, it kinda makes sense that you cannot hide from a specific player what you write in a public chat, no? For instance, you could publicly talk about another person while everyone in zone chat can read and potentially participate without the person that is talked about knowing or being able to reply/defend/whatever.
What you say in public is public and everyone around should have access to it. If you don't want someone to read what you say you should use a more private chat room. That's how it works and how it should work imo.

Regarding insults and harassment it's on ZOS to deal with it appropriately.

Mureel

Woeler wrote: »

So I basically have a player on ignore, because he has been insulting me and my family members extensively, but I found out via friends that whenever I'm having a normal conversation with someone in zone chat this guy still keeps replying to my comments insulting me and my family members. I can't see it, but it's still there.

Now this wouldn't be an issue if you actually took care of harassment reports, but I guess people telling you your family members are *** and that you should kill yourself are totally tolerated. So if you're not doing anything about it, at least make my chat messages not appear to the people I have ignored.

Thanks.

I agree. Meanwhile at least try to take comfort in how sad and pathetic their own life must be in order to keep banging on that way. A sad sack indeed.

ParaNostram

OP I feel ya on ZOS doing NOTHING during harassment. There is a known DC PvPer who runs a lot of pug groups (I can't say his name because name and shame policy) but the second he found out I was a woman he kept being disgustingly sexually forward and kept ramping it up every time I asked him to stop to the point in which he started threatening sexual assault and finding out where I live. I reported him, nothing happened.

SisterGoat

Usually there are 2 sides of the story when somebody goes out of their way to harass someone like that. I'm not saying it's okay to harass, but you also need to be careful not walk into situations that may provoke bad people like that. Take precautions, limit your use of zone chat, where everyone can see what you typed. You need to create your OWN safe space at what you have available to you. If all else fails, make use of the report function.

Balamoor

ParaNostram wrote: »

OP I feel ya on ZOS doing NOTHING during harassment. There is a known DC PvPer who runs a lot of pug groups (I can't say his name because name and shame policy) but the second he found out I was a woman he kept being disgustingly sexually forward and kept ramping it up every time I asked him to stop to the point in which he started threatening sexual assault and finding out where I live. I reported him, nothing happened.

It's a huge problem that sadly is ignored, a similar issue happened to my guilds 1st officer, she was harassed followed from the game to her social media (To this day she has no idea how they obtained that information) and harassed her family members and friends, by an organized group that has members who are community ambassadors (and some speculate current or former employees) ......her crime was riding a crown Crate mount, and discussing positively what she would like to see in future crates on the forums, this isn't an isolated incident, I have heard countless stories form players that have had similar incidents, I personally have spoken to both community managers and several moderators and GM's about it.

It persist and nothing is ever done, what is happening is a coordinated effort to silence anyone that complains about this.

I believe that Zos just doesn't want to deal with community issues beyond cheating, I don't know why, I just think that is the appearance and it's a shame that is causing folks to leave.

DMuehlhausen

Woeler wrote: »

So I basically have a player on ignore, because he has been insulting me and my family members extensively, but I found out via friends that whenever I'm having a normal conversation with someone in zone chat this guy still keeps replying to my comments insulting me and my family members. I can't see it, but it's still there.

Now this wouldn't be an issue if you actually took care of harassment reports, but I guess people telling you your family members are *** and that you should kill yourself are totally tolerated. So if you're not doing anything about it, at least make my chat messages not appear to the people I have ignored.

Thanks.

In all honesty I'd take him off ignore, get screenshots of what he's saying and report him. If you have keep doing it till something is done.

We don't need aholes like this in the game.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

ParaNostram

SisterGoat wrote: »

Usually there are 2 sides of the story when somebody goes out of their way to harass someone like that. I'm not saying it's okay to harass, but you also need to be careful not walk into situations that may provoke bad people like that. Take precautions, limit your use of zone chat, where everyone can see what you typed. You need to create your OWN safe space at what you have available to you. If all else fails, make use of the report function.

I wouldn't say usually. I mean everyone always likes to think they're in the right but friend you wouldn't believe some of the things that can happen to some people for just existing. There gaming community, and this community in particular (though nowhere near as bad as shooters) have rampant problems with racism, misogyny, homophobia, and transphobia. It's embedded even into a lot of the language (I.E. using words such as "gay" as a negative descriptor).

SisterGoat

ParaNostram wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

Usually there are 2 sides of the story when somebody goes out of their way to harass someone like that. I'm not saying it's okay to harass, but you also need to be careful not walk into situations that may provoke bad people like that. Take precautions, limit your use of zone chat, where everyone can see what you typed. You need to create your OWN safe space at what you have available to you. If all else fails, make use of the report function.

I wouldn't say usually. I mean everyone always likes to think they're in the right but friend you wouldn't believe some of the things that can happen to some people for just existing. There gaming community, and this community in particular (though nowhere near as bad as shooters) have rampant problems with racism, misogyny, homophobia, and transphobia. It's embedded even into a lot of the language (I.E. using words such as "gay" as a negative descriptor).

I realize that and have encountered a lot of jerks on the internet, but to actually go out of one's way in order to harass somebody for days or even weeks? There had to be SOMETHING that provoked that person to that degree. If they're a person who harasses a lot of people, they will be getting a lot of reports and a lot of temp bans.

nnargun

Balamoor wrote: »

ParaNostram wrote: »

OP I feel ya on ZOS doing NOTHING during harassment. There is a known DC PvPer who runs a lot of pug groups (I can't say his name because name and shame policy) but the second he found out I was a woman he kept being disgustingly sexually forward and kept ramping it up every time I asked him to stop to the point in which he started threatening sexual assault and finding out where I live. I reported him, nothing happened.

It's a huge problem that sadly is ignored, a similar issue happened to my guilds 1st officer, she was harassed followed from the game to her social media (To this day she has no idea how they obtained that information) and harassed her family members and friends, by a organized group that has members who are community ambassadors (and some speculate current or former employees) ......her crime was riding a crown Crate mount, and discussing positively what she would like to see in future crates on the forums, this isn't an isolated incident, I have heard countless stories form players that have had similar incidents, I personally have spoken to both community managers and several moderators and GM's about it.

It persist and nothing is ever done, what is happening is a coordinated effort to silence anyone that complains about this.

I believe that Zos just doesn't want to deal with community issues beyond cheating, I don't know why, I just think that is the appearance and it's a shame that is causing folks to leave.

Omg, people^^ That's why my best friend is a dog. Only harasses my leg every once in while. And only one at a time.