ANIMATION CANCELING IS NOT AN INTENDED FEATURE ZOS, WHY LIE?

DemonDruaga

Garwulf wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

They have commented on it before. It was NOT intended, but they are "happy" with it. The reality is that it allows for a layer of skill that makes the game interesting. They have also balanced all PVE content for the last 2 years around weaving. It is 100% required in PVE, and you are doing yourself a disservice if you dont do it PVP.

I suspect you have a low ping . Try doing it with a 250+ ping that many have to play with and if you can succesfully do it then you definitely have skill. Otherwise you essentially have an exploit that others cannot use.

i would never play an online game with a minimum ping of 250. Like there is no one that go with an old car against a new high speed car for a grand prix.

altemriel

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from
The Not so skilled, leave it alone

There SHOULD be something separating them you shouldn't be able to pull the same DPS because you looked up a guide online and it told
You to press 1-3-2-5-1 and then repeat

Who cares if it was intended or not? Is here and it's a good thing, as far as I remember they never said it was intended just that they won't be changing it

Also throwing a list of threads that people have wrote complaining about it doesn't prove a thing,

If a bunch on scrubs/ noobs complained constantly about something doesn't mean they are right, it just means they want it easier,

Anyone who can't learn basic weave or animation cancelling should learn to play or accept they are not going to be as good as people who can,

... WTF did I just read? Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from the not so skilled? What? WTF does animation cancelling have to do with your overall understanding of: Class strengths and weaknesses, situational awareness, build strengths and weaknesses, content mechanics, etc.? WTF does that even mean? If a bunch of "noobs and scrubs"? Excuse me? Um... There's no such a thing as a noob or a scrub in ESO. This is ELDER SCROLLS online. Not World of Warcraft. Not League of Legends. Not Call of Duty. Take that elitist bs elsewhere, bruh. Because that "über 1337" isn't really for this game.

Damn, it's like this thread is really bringing out the worst in people. Or rather bringing out a hell of a lot of: Elitist, toxic, and overall arrogant people. Hot damn. How much deeper into the rabbit hole will things go. Now supposedly animation cancelling shows whether or not you're 'skilled' in ESO. SMFH.

Edit: By the way, if animation calling shows who's a noob or a scrub — why do I know Flawless Conquerors and those who've beaten VMOL without animation cancelling (they genuinely have no clue how). Are you implying they're "noobs" and "scrubs"? My first MagPlar VMA clear was done without any animation cancelling as a bet made with guildies. And my first StamNB clear of VMA. Am I noob or scrub?

Lol! Triggered,

Firstly there ARE noobs and scrubs in this game, they are in every game, regardless of what the games called just because this is elder scrolls doesn't change that lol

Did I say animation cancelling is the only thing that makes someone good? No I don't believe I did however it IS a part of that skill, it just is it you want to be truly skilled and the best you can be at the game then you'd use all available things to do that (short of cheating obv) you need all the things you listed aswel true I'm not denying That and never would, it takes more than just one thing to make a great player,

So I say again I never said anyone who doesn't animation cancel is a noob or a scrub I'm saying noobs and scrubs come on the forums constantly and ask for stuff to be nerfed, so showing me a bunch of threads asking for something to be needed doesn't prove anything, if I listed a bunch of threads asking for city of ash to be nerfed does that mean it should be nerfed?

If you wanna put words in my mouth be my guest I don't really care but just for clarity I shall say I don't believe anyone who has flawless is a noob, and I don't believe anyone who has genuinely completed mol is either HOWEVER those people
Who paid a guild to take you through MoL for the skin you don't count lol

However just because your a flawless and a good player does that mean you can't get better? You've got flawless so you can't improve? Everyone can improve no matter how good and should always keep trying to do so

You're still not getting it. Animation cancelling =\= skill. Not even in the slightest. It doesn't even make you better either, just because you do utilize it. All it does is potentially add more moves into your rotation(s). But, without the things I listed — it all boils down to nothing.

When I did make that bet with some guildies about doing VMA without animation cancelling, do you know how many people failed that challenge? Do you know how many people couldn't even clear the 2nd stage of VMA, all because they couldn't animation cancel? Out of 30 or so people who agreed to take up the challenge, only like 4 or 5 were able to actually complete VMA with no animation cancelling. So what does that tell you? Well... It told me that a lot of people who thought they understood a lot of the things that they claimed they did, truly didn't. It also showed me that animation cancelling is a crutch for those people, and a means of covering-up for weaknesses that exist in their overall ability as a player. o_o

well so what? vMA is an endgame thing, same as trials. AC is in the game and will not be removed in the near future. So it is similar to running a goog build - you either run it or you die very often. So the same goes for AC, you either master it, or you die very often in PVP and in engame content!

***end of discussion***

Ch4mpTW

altemriel wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from
The Not so skilled, leave it alone

There SHOULD be something separating them you shouldn't be able to pull the same DPS because you looked up a guide online and it told
You to press 1-3-2-5-1 and then repeat

Who cares if it was intended or not? Is here and it's a good thing, as far as I remember they never said it was intended just that they won't be changing it

Also throwing a list of threads that people have wrote complaining about it doesn't prove a thing,

If a bunch on scrubs/ noobs complained constantly about something doesn't mean they are right, it just means they want it easier,

Anyone who can't learn basic weave or animation cancelling should learn to play or accept they are not going to be as good as people who can,

... WTF did I just read? Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from the not so skilled? What? WTF does animation cancelling have to do with your overall understanding of: Class strengths and weaknesses, situational awareness, build strengths and weaknesses, content mechanics, etc.? WTF does that even mean? If a bunch of "noobs and scrubs"? Excuse me? Um... There's no such a thing as a noob or a scrub in ESO. This is ELDER SCROLLS online. Not World of Warcraft. Not League of Legends. Not Call of Duty. Take that elitist bs elsewhere, bruh. Because that "über 1337" isn't really for this game.

Damn, it's like this thread is really bringing out the worst in people. Or rather bringing out a hell of a lot of: Elitist, toxic, and overall arrogant people. Hot damn. How much deeper into the rabbit hole will things go. Now supposedly animation cancelling shows whether or not you're 'skilled' in ESO. SMFH.

Edit: By the way, if animation calling shows who's a noob or a scrub — why do I know Flawless Conquerors and those who've beaten VMOL without animation cancelling (they genuinely have no clue how). Are you implying they're "noobs" and "scrubs"? My first MagPlar VMA clear was done without any animation cancelling as a bet made with guildies. And my first StamNB clear of VMA. Am I noob or scrub?

Lol! Triggered,

Firstly there ARE noobs and scrubs in this game, they are in every game, regardless of what the games called just because this is elder scrolls doesn't change that lol

Did I say animation cancelling is the only thing that makes someone good? No I don't believe I did however it IS a part of that skill, it just is it you want to be truly skilled and the best you can be at the game then you'd use all available things to do that (short of cheating obv) you need all the things you listed aswel true I'm not denying That and never would, it takes more than just one thing to make a great player,

So I say again I never said anyone who doesn't animation cancel is a noob or a scrub I'm saying noobs and scrubs come on the forums constantly and ask for stuff to be nerfed, so showing me a bunch of threads asking for something to be needed doesn't prove anything, if I listed a bunch of threads asking for city of ash to be nerfed does that mean it should be nerfed?

If you wanna put words in my mouth be my guest I don't really care but just for clarity I shall say I don't believe anyone who has flawless is a noob, and I don't believe anyone who has genuinely completed mol is either HOWEVER those people
Who paid a guild to take you through MoL for the skin you don't count lol

However just because your a flawless and a good player does that mean you can't get better? You've got flawless so you can't improve? Everyone can improve no matter how good and should always keep trying to do so

You're still not getting it. Animation cancelling =\= skill. Not even in the slightest. It doesn't even make you better either, just because you do utilize it. All it does is potentially add more moves into your rotation(s). But, without the things I listed — it all boils down to nothing.

When I did make that bet with some guildies about doing VMA without animation cancelling, do you know how many people failed that challenge? Do you know how many people couldn't even clear the 2nd stage of VMA, all because they couldn't animation cancel? Out of 30 or so people who agreed to take up the challenge, only like 4 or 5 were able to actually complete VMA with no animation cancelling. So what does that tell you? Well... It told me that a lot of people who thought they understood a lot of the things that they claimed they did, truly didn't. It also showed me that animation cancelling is a crutch for those people, and a means of covering-up for weaknesses that exist in their overall ability as a player. o_o

well so what? vMA is an endgame thing, same as trials. AC is in the game and will not be removed in the near future. So it is similar to running a goog build - you either run it or you die very often. So the same goes for AC, you either master it, or you die very often in PVP and in engame content!

***end of discussion***

No. It's not end of discussion. It's end of discussion if a staff member of this forum classifies it as such. Also, where are you getting this whole thing about animation cancelling being so mandatory? Have you gotten so comfortable and set in stone with animation cancelling, that you yourself as a player can't achieve and perform superbly without it...? Because that's what it is appearing to me as. You're getting all in a tizzy, and for what?

Hypothetically speaking, if ZOS implemented a hot-fix this very day for ALL platforms that removed animation cancelling — what would you as a player do about it? Quit the game? Make a thread about how it's a ridiculous change? Say how ESO is becoming more "casual-friendly"? Or, would you pause for a few moments and rely on the basic tools needed to be a 'solid' player..? Certainly you can do end-game content, and be a superstar in PVP without animation cancelling, can't you...?

Lumbermill_Emperor

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

No. It's not end of discussion. It's end of discussion if a staff member of this forum classifies it as such.

blind newbie?

Ch4mpTW

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

No. It's not end of discussion. It's end of discussion if a staff member of this forum classifies it as such.

blind newbie?

The only thing your screen shot showed was of @ZOS_JessicaFolsom classifying the technique of animation cancelling as something unintended, and not an exploit. That's all it showed.

Also, who are you calling a blind newbie...? I'm just wondering. Mind telling me, bruh?

Lumbermill_Emperor

because you defending a worst part of any MMO - the casuals

thank you for faceroll content

Lolssi

I'll use it but it is stupid as hell. Makes no sense attack happening without animation for it.
I think it should go but if it is gonna stay include it in the tutorial.
And don't even get me started about those animation lags it causes..

Decado

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from
The Not so skilled, leave it alone

There SHOULD be something separating them you shouldn't be able to pull the same DPS because you looked up a guide online and it told
You to press 1-3-2-5-1 and then repeat

Who cares if it was intended or not? Is here and it's a good thing, as far as I remember they never said it was intended just that they won't be changing it

Also throwing a list of threads that people have wrote complaining about it doesn't prove a thing,

If a bunch on scrubs/ noobs complained constantly about something doesn't mean they are right, it just means they want it easier,

Anyone who can't learn basic weave or animation cancelling should learn to play or accept they are not going to be as good as people who can,

... WTF did I just read? Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from the not so skilled? What? WTF does animation cancelling have to do with your overall understanding of: Class strengths and weaknesses, situational awareness, build strengths and weaknesses, content mechanics, etc.? WTF does that even mean? If a bunch of "noobs and scrubs"? Excuse me? Um... There's no such a thing as a noob or a scrub in ESO. This is ELDER SCROLLS online. Not World of Warcraft. Not League of Legends. Not Call of Duty. Take that elitist bs elsewhere, bruh. Because that "über 1337" isn't really for this game.

Damn, it's like this thread is really bringing out the worst in people. Or rather bringing out a hell of a lot of: Elitist, toxic, and overall arrogant people. Hot damn. How much deeper into the rabbit hole will things go. Now supposedly animation cancelling shows whether or not you're 'skilled' in ESO. SMFH.

Edit: By the way, if animation calling shows who's a noob or a scrub — why do I know Flawless Conquerors and those who've beaten VMOL without animation cancelling (they genuinely have no clue how). Are you implying they're "noobs" and "scrubs"? My first MagPlar VMA clear was done without any animation cancelling as a bet made with guildies. And my first StamNB clear of VMA. Am I noob or scrub?

Lol! Triggered,

Firstly there ARE noobs and scrubs in this game, they are in every game, regardless of what the games called just because this is elder scrolls doesn't change that lol

Did I say animation cancelling is the only thing that makes someone good? No I don't believe I did however it IS a part of that skill, it just is it you want to be truly skilled and the best you can be at the game then you'd use all available things to do that (short of cheating obv) you need all the things you listed aswel true I'm not denying That and never would, it takes more than just one thing to make a great player,

So I say again I never said anyone who doesn't animation cancel is a noob or a scrub I'm saying noobs and scrubs come on the forums constantly and ask for stuff to be nerfed, so showing me a bunch of threads asking for something to be needed doesn't prove anything, if I listed a bunch of threads asking for city of ash to be nerfed does that mean it should be nerfed?

If you wanna put words in my mouth be my guest I don't really care but just for clarity I shall say I don't believe anyone who has flawless is a noob, and I don't believe anyone who has genuinely completed mol is either HOWEVER those people
Who paid a guild to take you through MoL for the skin you don't count lol

However just because your a flawless and a good player does that mean you can't get better? You've got flawless so you can't improve? Everyone can improve no matter how good and should always keep trying to do so

You're still not getting it. Animation cancelling =\= skill. Not even in the slightest. It doesn't even make you better either, just because you do utilize it. All it does is potentially add more moves into your rotation(s). But, without the things I listed — it all boils down to nothing.

When I did make that bet with some guildies about doing VMA without animation cancelling, do you know how many people failed that challenge? Do you know how many people couldn't even clear the 2nd stage of VMA, all because they couldn't animation cancel? Out of 30 or so people who agreed to take up the challenge, only like 4 or 5 were able to actually complete VMA with no animation cancelling. So what does that tell you? Well... It told me that a lot of people who thought they understood a lot of the things that they claimed they did, truly didn't. It also showed me that animation cancelling is a crutch for those people, and a means of covering-up for weaknesses that exist in their overall ability as a player. o_o

Edit: I realized that I only spoke from a PVE perspective. Here. Let me break things down for you from a PVP perspective. If you can do well in PVP with animation cancelling, certainly you should be able to do just fine without it. And yet! We see so many posts about how much animation cancelling is mandatory in PVP, and how you're not going to go far at all without it. Hm... Why is this? Because others do it, and without doing it yourself you essentially are giving your opponent a competitive edge? Well then. Already a lot of people have edges over you, whether or not you like it or not. That's just the way the game goes. People are better than others.

But, a lot of people on PC/Mac utilize macros. And it's obvious, as there are tons of videos and threads about this. And while that in itself is a topic all on its own, I'm curious. If animation cancelling WAS removed — how many of the so-called "skilled" people who rely on it to in PVP would still be as skilled? Yes, how many people would be so "elite" without chaining in 2-3 attacks within fractions of seconds together? Hmmmmm.... I truly wonder. . .

Oh I agree it comes down to nothing without the things you listed, i always tell my friends/ guildies if they ask for my build or builds on YouTube/ forums always take them as a template I can give you my exact build and rotation doesn't mean you will get same results you should understand the build and why certain skills are on bars etc, if using someone else's build always make it fit you and your play style

However with that being said if they have all the things you listed and are a genuinely good played If they correctly utilise all of that AND animation cancelling then they will see results from it

Ch4mpTW

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

because you defending a worst part of any MMO - the casuals

thank you for faceroll content

And thus, I give you all here on the forums what the ESO Community is becoming more like day by day. Whether it be on the forums, or in-game. Take a good look at this comment, and study it. Learn it, and do not memorize it. Take note of this individual's words of how, "The worst part of any MMO, is the casual group."

And yet, people wonder why so many others of the so called "majority" don't want anything to do with: Dungeons, trials, PVP, etc. Keep in mind, I'm not speaking for this "group". Only shedding a tad bit of insight.

Keep it up, ESO community. Keep it right up. And I promise you, the ESO community as a whole will rival: Guild Wars 2, League of Legends, World of Warcraft, etc. for having an extremely toxic and elitist player base and environment. The atmosphere will become so filled with poison, that not even the moderators will want to deal with it. As have many on numerous gaming forums, that end-up making Reddit posts about how the community they moderated became too much for them to put-up with any further. Mark my words veeeeeery closely.

Lumbermill_Emperor

the begginer casual is ok, because he can learn and play

but casual who cant L2P and who can only WHINE about NERFS - its worst part of any mmo community

many games become dead because of them
and if you protecting them - you not better

Draxys

Top notch thread

altemriel

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

altemriel wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from
The Not so skilled, leave it alone

There SHOULD be something separating them you shouldn't be able to pull the same DPS because you looked up a guide online and it told
You to press 1-3-2-5-1 and then repeat

Who cares if it was intended or not? Is here and it's a good thing, as far as I remember they never said it was intended just that they won't be changing it

Also throwing a list of threads that people have wrote complaining about it doesn't prove a thing,

If a bunch on scrubs/ noobs complained constantly about something doesn't mean they are right, it just means they want it easier,

Anyone who can't learn basic weave or animation cancelling should learn to play or accept they are not going to be as good as people who can,

... WTF did I just read? Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from the not so skilled? What? WTF does animation cancelling have to do with your overall understanding of: Class strengths and weaknesses, situational awareness, build strengths and weaknesses, content mechanics, etc.? WTF does that even mean? If a bunch of "noobs and scrubs"? Excuse me? Um... There's no such a thing as a noob or a scrub in ESO. This is ELDER SCROLLS online. Not World of Warcraft. Not League of Legends. Not Call of Duty. Take that elitist bs elsewhere, bruh. Because that "über 1337" isn't really for this game.

Damn, it's like this thread is really bringing out the worst in people. Or rather bringing out a hell of a lot of: Elitist, toxic, and overall arrogant people. Hot damn. How much deeper into the rabbit hole will things go. Now supposedly animation cancelling shows whether or not you're 'skilled' in ESO. SMFH.

Edit: By the way, if animation calling shows who's a noob or a scrub — why do I know Flawless Conquerors and those who've beaten VMOL without animation cancelling (they genuinely have no clue how). Are you implying they're "noobs" and "scrubs"? My first MagPlar VMA clear was done without any animation cancelling as a bet made with guildies. And my first StamNB clear of VMA. Am I noob or scrub?

Lol! Triggered,

Firstly there ARE noobs and scrubs in this game, they are in every game, regardless of what the games called just because this is elder scrolls doesn't change that lol

Did I say animation cancelling is the only thing that makes someone good? No I don't believe I did however it IS a part of that skill, it just is it you want to be truly skilled and the best you can be at the game then you'd use all available things to do that (short of cheating obv) you need all the things you listed aswel true I'm not denying That and never would, it takes more than just one thing to make a great player,

So I say again I never said anyone who doesn't animation cancel is a noob or a scrub I'm saying noobs and scrubs come on the forums constantly and ask for stuff to be nerfed, so showing me a bunch of threads asking for something to be needed doesn't prove anything, if I listed a bunch of threads asking for city of ash to be nerfed does that mean it should be nerfed?

If you wanna put words in my mouth be my guest I don't really care but just for clarity I shall say I don't believe anyone who has flawless is a noob, and I don't believe anyone who has genuinely completed mol is either HOWEVER those people
Who paid a guild to take you through MoL for the skin you don't count lol

However just because your a flawless and a good player does that mean you can't get better? You've got flawless so you can't improve? Everyone can improve no matter how good and should always keep trying to do so

You're still not getting it. Animation cancelling =\= skill. Not even in the slightest. It doesn't even make you better either, just because you do utilize it. All it does is potentially add more moves into your rotation(s). But, without the things I listed — it all boils down to nothing.

When I did make that bet with some guildies about doing VMA without animation cancelling, do you know how many people failed that challenge? Do you know how many people couldn't even clear the 2nd stage of VMA, all because they couldn't animation cancel? Out of 30 or so people who agreed to take up the challenge, only like 4 or 5 were able to actually complete VMA with no animation cancelling. So what does that tell you? Well... It told me that a lot of people who thought they understood a lot of the things that they claimed they did, truly didn't. It also showed me that animation cancelling is a crutch for those people, and a means of covering-up for weaknesses that exist in their overall ability as a player. o_o

well so what? vMA is an endgame thing, same as trials. AC is in the game and will not be removed in the near future. So it is similar to running a goog build - you either run it or you die very often. So the same goes for AC, you either master it, or you die very often in PVP and in engame content!

***end of discussion***

No. It's not end of discussion. It's end of discussion if a staff member of this forum classifies it as such. Also, where are you getting this whole thing about animation cancelling being so mandatory? Have you gotten so comfortable and set in stone with animation cancelling, that you yourself as a player can't achieve and perform superbly without it...? Because that's what it is appearing to me as. You're getting all in a tizzy, and for what?

Hypothetically speaking, if ZOS implemented a hot-fix this very day for ALL platforms that removed animation cancelling — what would you as a player do about it? Quit the game? Make a thread about how it's a ridiculous change? Say how ESO is becoming more "casual-friendly"? Or, would you pause for a few moments and rely on the basic tools needed to be a 'solid' player..? Certainly you can do end-game content, and be a superstar in PVP without animation cancelling, can't you...?

well it is not mandatory at all, I bet there are good skilled players, who can keep themselves alive and kill other players or do end game content even without it...

but as I said, it is in the game and ZOS is supporting it, confirmed it is not intended, but welcome, not an exploit, not a bug, so there are only 3 options that you can do now with it:

1. learn how to do it - not that hard really
2. do not learn it and learn to deal with it
3. whine....


What is it actually that makes you so angry about this topic???



I can imagine that for example disabled people could have problems with it (no pun or irony intended), but so what...nerf everything in the game and make it totally easy for non-disabled people because of that???

Ch4mpTW

Decado wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Decado wrote: »

Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from
The Not so skilled, leave it alone

There SHOULD be something separating them you shouldn't be able to pull the same DPS because you looked up a guide online and it told
You to press 1-3-2-5-1 and then repeat

Who cares if it was intended or not? Is here and it's a good thing, as far as I remember they never said it was intended just that they won't be changing it

Also throwing a list of threads that people have wrote complaining about it doesn't prove a thing,

If a bunch on scrubs/ noobs complained constantly about something doesn't mean they are right, it just means they want it easier,

Anyone who can't learn basic weave or animation cancelling should learn to play or accept they are not going to be as good as people who can,

... WTF did I just read? Animation cancelling seperates the skilled from the not so skilled? What? WTF does animation cancelling have to do with your overall understanding of: Class strengths and weaknesses, situational awareness, build strengths and weaknesses, content mechanics, etc.? WTF does that even mean? If a bunch of "noobs and scrubs"? Excuse me? Um... There's no such a thing as a noob or a scrub in ESO. This is ELDER SCROLLS online. Not World of Warcraft. Not League of Legends. Not Call of Duty. Take that elitist bs elsewhere, bruh. Because that "über 1337" isn't really for this game.

Damn, it's like this thread is really bringing out the worst in people. Or rather bringing out a hell of a lot of: Elitist, toxic, and overall arrogant people. Hot damn. How much deeper into the rabbit hole will things go. Now supposedly animation cancelling shows whether or not you're 'skilled' in ESO. SMFH.

Edit: By the way, if animation calling shows who's a noob or a scrub — why do I know Flawless Conquerors and those who've beaten VMOL without animation cancelling (they genuinely have no clue how). Are you implying they're "noobs" and "scrubs"? My first MagPlar VMA clear was done without any animation cancelling as a bet made with guildies. And my first StamNB clear of VMA. Am I noob or scrub?

Lol! Triggered,

Firstly there ARE noobs and scrubs in this game, they are in every game, regardless of what the games called just because this is elder scrolls doesn't change that lol

Did I say animation cancelling is the only thing that makes someone good? No I don't believe I did however it IS a part of that skill, it just is it you want to be truly skilled and the best you can be at the game then you'd use all available things to do that (short of cheating obv) you need all the things you listed aswel true I'm not denying That and never would, it takes more than just one thing to make a great player,

So I say again I never said anyone who doesn't animation cancel is a noob or a scrub I'm saying noobs and scrubs come on the forums constantly and ask for stuff to be nerfed, so showing me a bunch of threads asking for something to be needed doesn't prove anything, if I listed a bunch of threads asking for city of ash to be nerfed does that mean it should be nerfed?

If you wanna put words in my mouth be my guest I don't really care but just for clarity I shall say I don't believe anyone who has flawless is a noob, and I don't believe anyone who has genuinely completed mol is either HOWEVER those people
Who paid a guild to take you through MoL for the skin you don't count lol

However just because your a flawless and a good player does that mean you can't get better? You've got flawless so you can't improve? Everyone can improve no matter how good and should always keep trying to do so

You're still not getting it. Animation cancelling =\= skill. Not even in the slightest. It doesn't even make you better either, just because you do utilize it. All it does is potentially add more moves into your rotation(s). But, without the things I listed — it all boils down to nothing.

When I did make that bet with some guildies about doing VMA without animation cancelling, do you know how many people failed that challenge? Do you know how many people couldn't even clear the 2nd stage of VMA, all because they couldn't animation cancel? Out of 30 or so people who agreed to take up the challenge, only like 4 or 5 were able to actually complete VMA with no animation cancelling. So what does that tell you? Well... It told me that a lot of people who thought they understood a lot of the things that they claimed they did, truly didn't. It also showed me that animation cancelling is a crutch for those people, and a means of covering-up for weaknesses that exist in their overall ability as a player. o_o

Edit: I realized that I only spoke from a PVE perspective. Here. Let me break things down for you from a PVP perspective. If you can do well in PVP with animation cancelling, certainly you should be able to do just fine without it. And yet! We see so many posts about how much animation cancelling is mandatory in PVP, and how you're not going to go far at all without it. Hm... Why is this? Because others do it, and without doing it yourself you essentially are giving your opponent a competitive edge? Well then. Already a lot of people have edges over you, whether or not you like it or not. That's just the way the game goes. People are better than others.

But, a lot of people on PC/Mac utilize macros. And it's obvious, as there are tons of videos and threads about this. And while that in itself is a topic all on its own, I'm curious. If animation cancelling WAS removed — how many of the so-called "skilled" people who rely on it to in PVP would still be as skilled? Yes, how many people would be so "elite" without chaining in 2-3 attacks within fractions of seconds together? Hmmmmm.... I truly wonder. . .

Oh I agree it comes down to nothing without the things you listed, i always tell my friends/ guildies if they ask for my build or builds on YouTube/ forums always take them as a template I can give you my exact build and rotation doesn't mean you will get same results you should understand the build and why certain skills are on bars etc, if using someone else's build always make it fit you and your play style

However with that being said if they have all the things you listed and are a genuinely good played If they correctly utilise all of that AND animation cancelling then they will see results from it

See, now you're getting it. Or rather if you already got the point I was making, I can tell now. Good. I can agree with you from that point-of-view, from how you worded it. We may come to an agreement of sorts now.

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

the begginer casual is ok, because he can learn and play

but casual who cant L2P and who can only WHINE about NERFS - its worst part of any mmo community

many games become dead because of them
and if you protecting them - you not better

Brodie, just stop while you're ahead. You're coming off more, and more elitist by the post. And would you like to know what's worse than a so-called "casual who can't L2P" is...? An arrogant, elitist, jerk, who can't stop belittling others and trying to make themselves seem bigger than what they are. Animation cancelling using, best-in-slot gear wearing, etc. You'll still be "that guy", that no one wants to be around.

And to keep it 100 with you...? I've beaten all dungeons and trials on normal and veteran, and on hard mode (except MoL as I've not beaten it on vet or hard mode). And you know what? I would STILL rather take a "casual who refuses to L2P" along with me for the ride, more so than an elitist jerk who talks down to others and labels them as "casual". You know why? Because that "casual" is "good money", in my opinion. They won't make a jerk of himself, and try and put people down. They won't belittle others, and try and come off as a stuck-up jerk when we're trying to get things done. And that is who I'd rather be around, and in my company. Even if the squad had to carry them, and pull their weight for them. They're still good peoples, and probably a positive person to be around.

Malitias

Ch4mp for president!

Wollust

The entitled "can't be asked to l2p" crowd will ruin this game even more

ZOS_JohanaB

We've closed this thread for over all lack of constructive conversation, there's just a lot of batting, and flaming going on. In the future please remember to be civil, constructive, and follow the community rules.