Veliderth + Viper combo need some adjustment asap

Psilent

Velidreth and Viper are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to balance in ESO. While these sets are very powerful; it really comes down to the gameplay style of ESO and how easy the barrier is to acquire gear more than the sets themselves.

1. ESO’s Play How You Want style – While I do love this style of play, to a degree, it has its flaws. When the meta changes to favor either magicka or stamina, it’s extremely easy to flip your character to it. Now granted, you might not be min/maxed, but you can change from stamina to magicka or vice versa by paying some gold to change your attributes and reset your morphs. Then another bit of gold to change your champion points around to reflect the change as well. Barrier to changing your playstyle is virtually non-existent, only if you want to min/max do you even remotely have to put in time by rerolling, however with race change now available even that isn’t much of an obstacle.

2. Ease of Acquiring Gear – Obtaining gear in ESO is extremely easy, the only remotely difficult hurdle to getting Velidreth is having Undaunted Keys to open chests for the shoulder. Viper is BoE and easily acquired, pretty cheap in Guild Stores.

This overall causes everyone to switch to the go to setup for PvP, currently Stamina, and uses the best sets to min/max. If the barrier to obtaining gear was more difficult you would see a lot less viper/velidreth players running around Cyrodiil.

There are a lot of other issues that cause imbalance, but I feel these are two of the major issues with ESO currently, at least from my point of view.

TL;DR

Changing characters between Magicka and Stamina is to cheap/easy and acquiring gear sets requires minimal effort on the player.

olsborg

Destyran wrote: »

My friend 1 shot a stealthed nb with caltrops the other day we didnt even know he was there lol

lol yea, exactly. @Wrobel should really read this thread.

Ghost-Shot

Cinbri wrote: »

Will be fixed in Update 13, just wait a bit.

Game balance is not a task to be done twice a year, it needs to be addressed when issues come up, especially when so many new sets are being added that make it even worse. You know its a problem when 1vX isn't even that impressive anymore because everything about stam builds is so out of control.

KisoValley

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

I am happy to report I run neither of these sets.

Thank god. Can't imagine how OP you would be with them.

Ghost-Shot

KisoValley wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

I am happy to report I run neither of these sets.

Thank god. Can't imagine how OP you would be with them.

Nobody's body would be ready for Pubes with viper/veli!

s7732425ub17_ESO

ZOS keeps releasing sets with more and more damage capabilities, but our health and damage mitigation has stayed the same.

Publius_Scipio

KisoValley wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

I am happy to report I run neither of these sets.

Thank god. Can't imagine how OP you would be with them.

They don't sell Greek yogurt in the European Union?

Agrippa_Invisus

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

KisoValley wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

I am happy to report I run neither of these sets.

Thank god. Can't imagine how OP you would be with them.

They don't sell Greek yogurt in the European Union?

You can only get it there if you're broke.

Qbiken

Wait so now a combo of 2 sets is broken?? C´mon people, velidreth = works as intended, strong but nothing wrong with it. Viper= works as intended, strong but not bugged. Viper+ velidreth= For some reason people think it´s broken.......The logic is real

I´m out, so done with people on the forums....XD

Vaoh

I remember when they nerfed Magicka Sorcerer Dual Wield burst damage because it was too high. Truthfully, it was a bit too effective.

The burst in question was:
Magicka Detonation --> Velocious Curse --> Mages Fury --> Entropy --> Crystal Frags --> Dawnbreaker

There were many intricacies to it. Did the Frags proc?.... did Curse get purified?.... did you land the Frag?.... was you burst blocked?..... Did your Frag get dodged?.... etc etc.

This is how they chose to balance Dual Wield Mag Sorcs, along with the skills themselves:
• Magicka Detonation damage reduced by 50%.
• Magicka Detonation and Velocious Curse no longer scale with Thaumaturge (-25% damage)
• Dawnbreaker made to deal Physical damage (-25% base damage for Magicka builds, no longer scale for Magicka builds)
• Reworked Trapping Webs, so it is a weak, unusable Stamina ability

This is only with regards to burst. Nothing else in terms of Magicka Sorc nerfs.

Velidreth+Viper's+Surprise attack is instant, requires 1 skill slotted/cast to proc, can be procced from stealth to gank. Also puts out more burst.

#StaminaIsWeakPlzBuff -_-

Psilent

Qbiken wrote: »

Wait so now a combo of 2 sets is broken?? C´mon people, velidreth = works as intended, strong but nothing wrong with it. Viper= works as intended, strong but not bugged. Viper+ velidreth= For some reason people think it´s broken.......The logic is real

I´m out, so done with people on the forums....XD

Not broken; just very bursty. People don't like dying fast, but they like killing fast. They don't like instant procs either.

This causes people to run more heavy armor builds, to survive. This in turn gets more rage because someone couldn't burst someone down who was tired of being burst down.

Qbiken

Psilent wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Wait so now a combo of 2 sets is broken?? C´mon people, velidreth = works as intended, strong but nothing wrong with it. Viper= works as intended, strong but not bugged. Viper+ velidreth= For some reason people think it´s broken.......The logic is real

I´m out, so done with people on the forums....XD

Not broken; just very bursty. People don't like dying fast, but they like killing fast. They don't like instant procs either.

This causes people to run more heavy armor builds, to survive. This in turn gets more rage because someone couldn't burst someone down who was tired of being burst down.

ESO community logic. It´s ok to kill someone with 2 shots but if you survive with a tankbuild more than 5 seconds their gear needs to be nerfed XD

Mustard

Q1 - 2017

Joy_Division

ZoS was sure quick to nerf lightning heavy attacks that weren't killing anyone in PvP. Viper-widowmaker-veliderth? Not so much!

Sandman929

I don't like damage procs from armor, as a general rule. Armor that gives damage potential is fine. Extra weapon/spell damage, buffed stats...things like that still require the player to make use of them in the time that they have the proc.
Insta-damage death-by-armor is stupid...and now we're getting more of it.

BruhItsOver9000

I use viper in pvp, it's really not that effective. 4 seconds in pvp is to long, when 1v1ing a sorc, you need alot of burst damage to get their health down before they recast their shield, if you rely on viper In pvp you're gonna die alot. I'm switching viper for hundings soon.

Velidreth is op but when you mix it with viper, you create a insta kill build, you could be a bad player and still be op.
If you see someone running that combo, tbag him/her.

zerosingularity

Hey! Viper+Veli isn't OP at all... owait, I use that. nvm ignore me.


...

Remember though, when using this set, your ranged snipes and your AoE zerg damage is much lower.

Destyran

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

My friend 1 shot a stealthed nb with caltrops the other day we didnt even know he was there lol

Wat ? Seriously ?

Yes lol. I get the vid if i remember after work. Haha

Mr_Nobody

Better nerf Radiant Destruction ~

LegendaryChef

I'll take a nerf to both velidrith and viper anyday as long as reactive + malubeth gets nerfed.

No worries btw, viper will be even more op next patch for those who forgot

GreenSoup2HoT

@LegendaryChef Them physical penetrations

Skander

Viper needs a serious nerf.
Or it must come only in armor+weapons.

themdogesbite

Never been much of a fan of damage procc sets. I prefer to kill people with the skills i have slotted rather then proccs. When are we going to see similar sets for magica builds?

Essiaga

Psilent wrote: »

Velidreth and Viper are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to balance in ESO. While these sets are very powerful; it really comes down to the gameplay style of ESO and how easy the barrier is to acquire gear more than the sets themselves.

1. ESO’s Play How You Want style – While I do love this style of play, to a degree, it has its flaws. When the meta changes to favor either magicka or stamina, it’s extremely easy to flip your character to it. Now granted, you might not be min/maxed, but you can change from stamina to magicka or vice versa by paying some gold to change your attributes and reset your morphs. Then another bit of gold to change your champion points around to reflect the change as well. Barrier to changing your playstyle is virtually non-existent, only if you want to min/max do you even remotely have to put in time by rerolling, however with race change now available even that isn’t much of an obstacle.

2. Ease of Acquiring Gear – Obtaining gear in ESO is extremely easy, the only remotely difficult hurdle to getting Velidreth is having Undaunted Keys to open chests for the shoulder. Viper is BoE and easily acquired, pretty cheap in Guild Stores.

This overall causes everyone to switch to the go to setup for PvP, currently Stamina, and uses the best sets to min/max. If the barrier to obtaining gear was more difficult you would see a lot less viper/velidreth players running around Cyrodiil.

There are a lot of other issues that cause imbalance, but I feel these are two of the major issues with ESO currently, at least from my point of view.

TL;DR

Changing characters between Magicka and Stamina is to cheap/easy and acquiring gear sets requires minimal effort on the player.

1. Play your way should really mean if you want to PVP then do it as much as you like with out having to go into other content you would rather not. PVPers are super happy with how live works now. You can get with out wasting time getting. It's like a free market. They can trade what they get for money to buy what they want and PVEers can do the same.

2. Sets need to be easy to acquire or you end up with cancer remaining longer. If 10 people are wrecking face across 3 campaigns how likely is the population going to pick up on it unless they're posting on youtube, twitch, etc? It could take MONTHS for enough feed back then another few MONTHS for ZOS to consider a change, and then a few more MONTHS to release a change ... while these luck few have an easy button because balance comes so slow.

Balance comes faster when people have access to gear. Gaps between players in PVP is a terrible thing for many reasons. Many people don't do vet Trials because they don't feel they have the gear. Normal Trials and BOE have been closing that gap AND BOE is closing the gap between PVP players as well. More testers for builds on Live since unbalanced stuff is getting past PTS.

FearlessOne_2014

CapuchinSeven wrote: »

KenaPKK wrote: »

Ankael07 wrote: »

It feels like we're talking against a wall here. Not only theyve buff Velindreth's cooldown by 1 second we have another set coming named Selene's Visage which will probably hit more than Velindreth since its single target.

Much lower cooldown and comparable if not higher damage. I just can't even...

It's past the point of comedy now.

I've known people in the games industry for years and every one of them says the same thing. The problem is, game companies actually think this stuff is a good idea. It's an old game design view but one that ZOS clearly stick to, they think that if there is a FOTM or meta people will play the game more/reroll/respec and spend more time in the game.

Nah it only pushes core once dedicated players like myself to go do something else with my time. Then once the core and dedicated players leave they always find out the hard way. You know those players who play the game because of it's Elder Scrolls title and setting, not anymore setting because "stamina/rouge win mode" meta is clearly not a Elder Scrolls setting.

A Elder Scrolls universe where being a Mage, means you are absolutely gimped. On top of that you have to work and be 3 times better then the Rouge to have equal results in combat. In up front combat! This is not a Elder Scrolls friendly title at all. Meaning now in my eyes ESO is this copy paste game of your tradition MMO of Mage hate to the extreme.

I'll happily now go take that long break. I mean come on Mage hate from the developers in a Magic based series. Seems like a good time to go back and play some more Oblivion and Skyrim. Then completely ditch any farther attempt of playing something that strays so far, from what made me fall in love with the series in the first place. Many many other typical Mage hating MMOs on the markets.

At least in Oblivion and Skyrim I can enjoy being a Mage once more till TES 6 comes out. Hopefully not under the care of Zenimax this time.

Docmandu

maxjapank wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

Please don't ask @Wrobel to fix stuff... god knows what abomination he comes up with next... just look at what happened when people asked for a malutard fix.

Another blame Wrobel for everything. When you didn't have bacon for breakfast, I bet he stole those, too.

Ofcourse he is.. he's the combat LEAD.. he's the one that takes responsibility for what the team does... same like how a CEO can explain why crap went wrong to the share holders.. That's why he earns the big bucks! (well it's game dev.. so 'big bucks' probably isn't the correct wording :P )

DHale

Wow is there any thing forum warrior won't complain about?

Jaiden

Imagine if camo hunter hadn't been nerfed when these sets came out.

FearlessOne_2014

I have some nice recorded ESO videos on my
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUWMXCj7_NPFuLI78xGDtWA
https://www.twitch.tv/zaruda_0/manager/past_broadcasts

Edited for cancerous content.

thankyourat

I miss when the armor in PvP use to be boring back when I ran 5 seducer 4 mangus on my magblade.