Magicka sorc damage

Methariorn

BTW: shield lasting few sec is not a problem for me: when focussed my shield never lasted six seconds I need to streak out and put distance. The nerf I don't understood at all is the shield at half value when stamina dps have gone mad (and I never shield stack. It's not like my sorc become gimp since DB patch...but some stamina build just burst too much dps and can heal too fast to score a kill, at last for me.

ToRelax

Methariorn wrote: »

BTW Elo'dryel: long time I don't see you around Cyro, man: it's all running fine?

Yes, thank you. I'm playing another Sorc I made on Azura currently.

Makkir

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

loki547

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

Try dueling @Lord_Hev

FriedEggSandwich

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

+1

5 seducer, 3 willpower, 1 kena, 1 blood spawn, 1 maelstrom with one cost reduction glyph plus vampire, and I never run out of magicka or stamina, even when outnumbered (maybe not severely outnumbered). My damage is lacklustre but it's worth it.

Minalan

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I've give a try to Alchemist and Kagrenack...simply is not working for the way I play my sorc: I need high magicka recovery to keep moving and doing dps. Oh and I'm a very bad sorc belive me...but full dps without any sustain in not working for me: I play most solo or with a couple of friends. Well I'll try to learn to play my sorc and pick my target better

With the shields lasting so little, and the increased costs in dark brotherhood - I've gone seducer and Magnus. It gives me most of what I'm looking for sustain wise.

The DPS sets just can't keep up unless you're running full lich on the back bar and get the proc every minute. That's probably next for me because lich/DPS can kill an all sustain build - sustain can't keep up with the damage.

You only gotta survive a dps sorc for a minute or so, then they run out of mag and can't keep up anymore. Their damage is not that higher either, maybe 5-10% max, nothing you can't deal with if your backbar has at least 40k magicka and decent CPs.

That's it though, with lich every minute the DPS guy gets a huge boost for 20 seconds just for being under a third Magicka. The five piece is effective.

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

2500? You need to run a Kena shoulder and all spell damage enchants on an arcane willpower set. That should be closer to 2800 or so, more with an offensive scroll, and then top 3.1K easy when you trigger a spell damage enchant.

And with 40.5K Magicka, you should hit fairly hard. Not like those black rose heavy armor Kena sorc setups with 30K Magicka.

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

LegendaryMage

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I've give a try to Alchemist and Kagrenack...simply is not working for the way I play my sorc: I need high magicka recovery to keep moving and doing dps. Oh and I'm a very bad sorc belive me...but full dps without any sustain in not working for me: I play most solo or with a couple of friends. Well I'll try to learn to play my sorc and pick my target better

With the shields lasting so little, and the increased costs in dark brotherhood - I've gone seducer and Magnus. It gives me most of what I'm looking for sustain wise.

The DPS sets just can't keep up unless you're running full lich on the back bar and get the proc every minute. That's probably next for me because lich/DPS can kill an all sustain build - sustain can't keep up with the damage.

You only gotta survive a dps sorc for a minute or so, then they run out of mag and can't keep up anymore. Their damage is not that higher either, maybe 5-10% max, nothing you can't deal with if your backbar has at least 40k magicka and decent CPs.

That's it though, with lich every minute the DPS guy gets a huge boost for 20 seconds just for being under a third Magicka. The five piece is effective.

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

2500? You need to run a Kena shoulder and all spell damage enchants on an arcane willpower set. That should be closer to 2800 or so, more with an offensive scroll, and then top 3.1K easy when you trigger a spell damage enchant.

And with 40.5K Magicka, you should hit fairly hard. Not like those black rose heavy armor Kena sorc setups with 30K Magicka.

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

I'm ready for next patch, got the gear and everything - it's doing awesome.

oRioNoTime

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

LegendaryMage

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

oRioNoTime

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

psychotic13

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

LegendaryMage

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

psychotic13

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

Hmm, not sure if it's worth it. I use kags and have around 1.5-1.6k unbuffed regen myself.

Minalan

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

By "tricky to play", Alex means that you need to have insane reflexes, thousands of duels worth of practice, and animation cancel everything. If you watch his videos all his toon does is wiggle and twitch while he casts spell after spell and people fall.

A more honest assessment would be that the sorc class really isn't playable at a competitive level for most of us mere mortals. But many of us still try regardless, and hopefully these new gear sets will help a little.

I'd say 90% of my deaths are the 'stun/fear him until he runs out of stamina' or 'Oops out of Magicka'. 300 Stam/Magicka regen is big gift.

Of course it won't help the 10% 'one shot gank' type deaths, but ZOS isn't ever going to muzzle the rabid Stam nightblades. Dying before you can hit one button is part of their game.

oRioNoTime

Minalan wrote: »

...

Well I didn't play for a while and i have a mag NB and Sorc, I'm trying both of them and sorc seems much more viable, both in survivability and burst.

Fear is always op but for small scale pvp mag NB seems kinda bad compared to sorc...

LegendaryMage

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

By "tricky to play", Alex means that you need to have insane reflexes, thousands of duels worth of practice, and animation cancel everything. If you watch his videos all his toon does is wiggle and twitch while he casts spell after spell and people fall.

A more honest assessment would be that the sorc class really isn't playable at a competitive level for most of us mere mortals. But many of us still try regardless, and hopefully these new gear sets will help a little.

I'd say 90% of my deaths are the 'stun/fear him until he runs out of stamina' or 'Oops out of Magicka'. 300 Stam/Magicka regen is big gift.

Of course it won't help the 10% 'one shot gank' type deaths, but ZOS isn't ever going to muzzle the rabid Stam nightblades. Dying before you can hit one button is part of their game.

Yeah, I think a good sorc who kills a solid stam setup nowadays totally proves that the sorc is skilled. Hell, I took my argonian heavy armor stam dk that didn't even have finalized gear, and didn't die a single time in literally a 100 duels in a row. At worst it was a stalemate vs a stam setup, all mag setups died. Wrobel needs to increase mag sorc's arsenal of things, passives and everything - we need more damage plain and simple.

FriedEggSandwich

psychotic13 wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

Hmm, not sure if it's worth it. I use kags and have around 1.5-1.6k unbuffed regen myself.

I used kags with 1500 regen before DB patch and rarely ran oom. After DB though the same setup left me oom after 10 seconds of weaving. I just switched to seducer which gave the 8% cost reduction and bumped my regen up to 1700 and now I never run oom. It's definitely worth it, I was also sceptical before I tried it.

Derra

Waffennacht wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

loki547 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally however. It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful.

Sounds like an L2P issue for you then. Been dual wield since 1.6 and haven't had a problem killing good players at all this patch (aside maybe from permablocking tanks that do no damage)

Also been running the same armor setup since IC. 5 Kag's, 4 Magnus Gift, 3 Willpower. Thought about trying the Lich/Julianos setup but I don't want to farm for it and it's still too expensive. Running the numbers my setup has more max magicka and spell dmg but less regen, which suits my play style just fine. Next patch I'll be able to change from Breton to High Elf so that should help with regen as well.

Gotta love l2p comments. Automatically jumping to the conclusion i don´t kill opponents with it (which happens to be correct - because i don´t play it as it offers nothing compared to a staff build apart from doing something different and sadly less effective). My point was i never died to such a setup since 1.6 and even back then it was in duels where i was stupid enough to show up as vampire during dbos meta.
I can count the times i´ve died to a DW sorc on one hand (and that is not an exaggeration to prove my point - i mean it as i say it).
Even with tbs, elegance and dw full overload pve dmg - you don´t kill an opponent who knows how to handle the situation.

Any competent player that knows how a dw sorc is functioning keeps you from ever getting him into dangerous HP territory.

If you are assuming all DW builds are the old shield stackers then that's why you haven't lost.

You don't need sustain when you burst over 30k (after PvP reduction) without crit in 1 sec.

How can you say l2p sorcs? It's pretty freakin straight forward for magicka. Curse, weave, frag, weave, flex, ward, wrath frag etc etc etc.

Did you even read? What are you even trying to say. @Waffennacht

I did not tell anybody to l2p. It was directed towards me.

I merely point out that since patch 1.6 which was over 15 months ago the number times a DW sorc has managed to kill me is still below 5 (and those were 1.6 dawnbreaker duels with me playing vamp all on the same evening by the same player).

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

Well my comment was more general utility oriented. You can fix both Kagrenac and julianos to keep up with seducer in terms of sustain but you can´t get maximum dmg with seducer.

Purely for pvp i´d always use seducer for a solo sorc setup but if you´re looking to do anything else with the gear i´d go for kags or julianos.

Personally i´m toying around with something completely different at the moment.

Waffennacht

@Derra sorry, I'm thinkin I just mis read. Anyway, the only thing I meant about PvP magicka sorc - you seen one, you've seen em all.

Minalan

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

By "tricky to play", Alex means that you need to have insane reflexes, thousands of duels worth of practice, and animation cancel everything. If you watch his videos all his toon does is wiggle and twitch while he casts spell after spell and people fall.

A more honest assessment would be that the sorc class really isn't playable at a competitive level for most of us mere mortals. But many of us still try regardless, and hopefully these new gear sets will help a little.

I'd say 90% of my deaths are the 'stun/fear him until he runs out of stamina' or 'Oops out of Magicka'. 300 Stam/Magicka regen is big gift.

Of course it won't help the 10% 'one shot gank' type deaths, but ZOS isn't ever going to muzzle the rabid Stam nightblades. Dying before you can hit one button is part of their game.

Yeah, I think a good sorc who kills a solid stam setup nowadays totally proves that the sorc is skilled. Hell, I took my argonian heavy armor stam dk that didn't even have finalized gear, and didn't die a single time in literally a 100 duels in a row. At worst it was a stalemate vs a stam setup, all mag setups died. Wrobel needs to increase mag sorc's arsenal of things, passives and everything - we need more damage plain and simple.

In your case, it's definitely the player.

Derra wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

loki547 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally however. It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful.

Sounds like an L2P issue for you then. Been dual wield since 1.6 and haven't had a problem killing good players at all this patch (aside maybe from permablocking tanks that do no damage)

Also been running the same armor setup since IC. 5 Kag's, 4 Magnus Gift, 3 Willpower. Thought about trying the Lich/Julianos setup but I don't want to farm for it and it's still too expensive. Running the numbers my setup has more max magicka and spell dmg but less regen, which suits my play style just fine. Next patch I'll be able to change from Breton to High Elf so that should help with regen as well.

Gotta love l2p comments. Automatically jumping to the conclusion i don´t kill opponents with it (which happens to be correct - because i don´t play it as it offers nothing compared to a staff build apart from doing something different and sadly less effective). My point was i never died to such a setup since 1.6 and even back then it was in duels where i was stupid enough to show up as vampire during dbos meta.
I can count the times i´ve died to a DW sorc on one hand (and that is not an exaggeration to prove my point - i mean it as i say it).
Even with tbs, elegance and dw full overload pve dmg - you don´t kill an opponent who knows how to handle the situation.

Any competent player that knows how a dw sorc is functioning keeps you from ever getting him into dangerous HP territory.

If you are assuming all DW builds are the old shield stackers then that's why you haven't lost.

You don't need sustain when you burst over 30k (after PvP reduction) without crit in 1 sec.

How can you say l2p sorcs? It's pretty freakin straight forward for magicka. Curse, weave, frag, weave, flex, ward, wrath frag etc etc etc.

Did you even read? What are you even trying to say. @Waffennacht

I did not tell anybody to l2p. It was directed towards me.

I merely point out that since patch 1.6 which was over 15 months ago the number times a DW sorc has managed to kill me is still below 5 (and those were 1.6 dawnbreaker duels with me playing vamp all on the same evening by the same player).

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

Well my comment was more general utility oriented. You can fix both Kagrenac and julianos to keep up with seducer in terms of sustain but you can´t get maximum dmg with seducer.

Purely for pvp i´d always use seducer for a solo sorc setup but if you´re looking to do anything else with the gear i´d go for kags or julianos.

Personally i´m toying around with something completely different at the moment.

How would you fix Kagrenac and Julianos? I mean, even if you switched out all three jewelry enchants from spell damage to regen or cost reduction. It's still not enough.

Seducer gives all of the regen and cost reduction that you need alone in five pieces. Everything else can go either spell damage or (Wherever possible if you're smart) max Magicka. A seducer build should main bar about 42-43K max Magicka without wasting any bar slots on Mage light or bound aegis (unless you want to, then you're around 45K). It should also be around 2900 spell damage without the weapon enchant.

That leaves room to use utility spells like radiant light (because f*** nightblades), rune prison (defensive morph), mines (against Stam), group heals (resto bar), lightning form (defense and mobility), Mage wrath (execute), volcanic rune (hilarious), or double slotted frags (more procs). The more USEFUL you are as a Mage in any situation, the better Mage you are. You need to do more than just frags, pulse, curse, shield, and streak.

That's why pet builds and max Magicka stacker builds mostly suck this last patch. They just can't *do* enough. Every bar slot wasted is an extra 'thing' up above that you CANT do. Even if you overload bar a few of those, its not easy enough to get to in a pinch (meaning you won't realistically use it). Or even if you do, if you blow your ultimate you're cut off from all of it.

Derra

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

By "tricky to play", Alex means that you need to have insane reflexes, thousands of duels worth of practice, and animation cancel everything. If you watch his videos all his toon does is wiggle and twitch while he casts spell after spell and people fall.

A more honest assessment would be that the sorc class really isn't playable at a competitive level for most of us mere mortals. But many of us still try regardless, and hopefully these new gear sets will help a little.

I'd say 90% of my deaths are the 'stun/fear him until he runs out of stamina' or 'Oops out of Magicka'. 300 Stam/Magicka regen is big gift.

Of course it won't help the 10% 'one shot gank' type deaths, but ZOS isn't ever going to muzzle the rabid Stam nightblades. Dying before you can hit one button is part of their game.

Yeah, I think a good sorc who kills a solid stam setup nowadays totally proves that the sorc is skilled. Hell, I took my argonian heavy armor stam dk that didn't even have finalized gear, and didn't die a single time in literally a 100 duels in a row. At worst it was a stalemate vs a stam setup, all mag setups died. Wrobel needs to increase mag sorc's arsenal of things, passives and everything - we need more damage plain and simple.

In your case, it's definitely the player.

Derra wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

loki547 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally however. It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful.

Sounds like an L2P issue for you then. Been dual wield since 1.6 and haven't had a problem killing good players at all this patch (aside maybe from permablocking tanks that do no damage)

Also been running the same armor setup since IC. 5 Kag's, 4 Magnus Gift, 3 Willpower. Thought about trying the Lich/Julianos setup but I don't want to farm for it and it's still too expensive. Running the numbers my setup has more max magicka and spell dmg but less regen, which suits my play style just fine. Next patch I'll be able to change from Breton to High Elf so that should help with regen as well.

Gotta love l2p comments. Automatically jumping to the conclusion i don´t kill opponents with it (which happens to be correct - because i don´t play it as it offers nothing compared to a staff build apart from doing something different and sadly less effective). My point was i never died to such a setup since 1.6 and even back then it was in duels where i was stupid enough to show up as vampire during dbos meta.
I can count the times i´ve died to a DW sorc on one hand (and that is not an exaggeration to prove my point - i mean it as i say it).
Even with tbs, elegance and dw full overload pve dmg - you don´t kill an opponent who knows how to handle the situation.

Any competent player that knows how a dw sorc is functioning keeps you from ever getting him into dangerous HP territory.

If you are assuming all DW builds are the old shield stackers then that's why you haven't lost.

You don't need sustain when you burst over 30k (after PvP reduction) without crit in 1 sec.

How can you say l2p sorcs? It's pretty freakin straight forward for magicka. Curse, weave, frag, weave, flex, ward, wrath frag etc etc etc.

Did you even read? What are you even trying to say. @Waffennacht

I did not tell anybody to l2p. It was directed towards me.

I merely point out that since patch 1.6 which was over 15 months ago the number times a DW sorc has managed to kill me is still below 5 (and those were 1.6 dawnbreaker duels with me playing vamp all on the same evening by the same player).

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

Well my comment was more general utility oriented. You can fix both Kagrenac and julianos to keep up with seducer in terms of sustain but you can´t get maximum dmg with seducer.

Purely for pvp i´d always use seducer for a solo sorc setup but if you´re looking to do anything else with the gear i´d go for kags or julianos.

Personally i´m toying around with something completely different at the moment.

How would you fix Kagrenac and Julianos? I mean, even if you switched out all three jewelry enchants from spell damage to regen or cost reduction. It's still not enough.

Seducer gives all of the regen and cost reduction that you need alone in five pieces. Everything else can go either spell damage or (Wherever possible if you're smart) max Magicka. A seducer build should main bar about 42-43K max Magicka without wasting any bar slots on Mage light or bound aegis (unless you want to, then you're around 45K). It should also be around 2900 spell damage without the weapon enchant.

That leaves room to use utility spells like radiant light (because f*** nightblades), rune prison (defensive morph), mines (against Stam), group heals (resto bar), lightning form (defense and mobility), Mage wrath (execute), volcanic rune (hilarious), or double slotted frags (more procs). The more USEFUL you are as a Mage in any situation, the better Mage you are. You need to do more than just frags, pulse, curse, shield, and streak.

That's why pet builds and max Magicka stacker builds mostly suck this last patch. They just can't *do* enough. Every bar slot wasted is an extra 'thing' up above that you CANT do. Even if you overload bar a few of those, its not easy enough to get to in a pinch (meaning you won't realistically use it). Or even if you do, if you blow your ultimate you're cut off from all of it.

As i´ve written for a pure pvp build i would always choose seducer (or lich if that´s an option).

The stats seem a little optimistic though. 41k mag with 3.5 max magica bonuses(1seducer, 1.5 willp + x) aswell as ~2700 spelldmg is what i´m seeing with that setup without mages guild abilities.

Minalan

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

oRioNoTime wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Once the patch hits in a few days, Seducer is no longer BIS. You stack a DPS set (Kags, Jules, Scathing Mage, destruction mastery, elegance, etc) top of Amberplasm.

What's new with the patch for magicka sorc to go full dps instead of sustain?

Until skills go back to original costs, anyone going full dps in pvp will suffer great sustain issues if they go full kag/kena/julianos combos.

When I make my builds, I always fix sustain first and then slowly subtract and shift power towards dps until a balance is made that feels optimal to me.

I sometimes go a bit extreme but in this current state of the game, unless something new opens up real fast, seducer/lich will pretty much be mandatory for competitive sorc pvp gameplay. Willpower is also too strong to miss out on.

For me personally, I will be going with a more top tier gear such as mael/master weapons, monster masks etc. and this will enable best bonuses, require a bit more work to get - but pay off in the end. I will also switch traits on small pieces to well-fitted for my sorcerer.

I just restart playing, I have money only for 1 equipt set, need to decide magicka Sorc or magicka NB
It seems sorc is still doing well after the shield "nerf"

Sorc is doing ok but it's a bit tricky to play sometimes due to shields lasting less. So you have to be faster, and on NB at least you get some other cool utility that you don't have on the sorc.

psychotic13 wrote: »

To all of you guys using seducer, how much recovery do you run with? I know you get the 8% reduce cost also.

But as mentioned, I think amberplasm may become very strong for sorcs because you get the Stam regen too which is a godsend when break free is our biggest weakness

I run with about 1.6k regen unbuffed on PTS (shadow of hist), on live I'm about 1.9k right now.

By "tricky to play", Alex means that you need to have insane reflexes, thousands of duels worth of practice, and animation cancel everything. If you watch his videos all his toon does is wiggle and twitch while he casts spell after spell and people fall.

A more honest assessment would be that the sorc class really isn't playable at a competitive level for most of us mere mortals. But many of us still try regardless, and hopefully these new gear sets will help a little.

I'd say 90% of my deaths are the 'stun/fear him until he runs out of stamina' or 'Oops out of Magicka'. 300 Stam/Magicka regen is big gift.

Of course it won't help the 10% 'one shot gank' type deaths, but ZOS isn't ever going to muzzle the rabid Stam nightblades. Dying before you can hit one button is part of their game.

Yeah, I think a good sorc who kills a solid stam setup nowadays totally proves that the sorc is skilled. Hell, I took my argonian heavy armor stam dk that didn't even have finalized gear, and didn't die a single time in literally a 100 duels in a row. At worst it was a stalemate vs a stam setup, all mag setups died. Wrobel needs to increase mag sorc's arsenal of things, passives and everything - we need more damage plain and simple.

In your case, it's definitely the player.

Derra wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

loki547 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally however. It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful.

Sounds like an L2P issue for you then. Been dual wield since 1.6 and haven't had a problem killing good players at all this patch (aside maybe from permablocking tanks that do no damage)

Also been running the same armor setup since IC. 5 Kag's, 4 Magnus Gift, 3 Willpower. Thought about trying the Lich/Julianos setup but I don't want to farm for it and it's still too expensive. Running the numbers my setup has more max magicka and spell dmg but less regen, which suits my play style just fine. Next patch I'll be able to change from Breton to High Elf so that should help with regen as well.

Gotta love l2p comments. Automatically jumping to the conclusion i don´t kill opponents with it (which happens to be correct - because i don´t play it as it offers nothing compared to a staff build apart from doing something different and sadly less effective). My point was i never died to such a setup since 1.6 and even back then it was in duels where i was stupid enough to show up as vampire during dbos meta.
I can count the times i´ve died to a DW sorc on one hand (and that is not an exaggeration to prove my point - i mean it as i say it).
Even with tbs, elegance and dw full overload pve dmg - you don´t kill an opponent who knows how to handle the situation.

Any competent player that knows how a dw sorc is functioning keeps you from ever getting him into dangerous HP territory.

If you are assuming all DW builds are the old shield stackers then that's why you haven't lost.

You don't need sustain when you burst over 30k (after PvP reduction) without crit in 1 sec.

How can you say l2p sorcs? It's pretty freakin straight forward for magicka. Curse, weave, frag, weave, flex, ward, wrath frag etc etc etc.

Did you even read? What are you even trying to say. @Waffennacht

I did not tell anybody to l2p. It was directed towards me.

I merely point out that since patch 1.6 which was over 15 months ago the number times a DW sorc has managed to kill me is still below 5 (and those were 1.6 dawnbreaker duels with me playing vamp all on the same evening by the same player).

Makkir wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

You won´t kill any opponent that knows what you´re doing with a DW build.
DW is for scrubkilling (a species of which you´re finding less and less these days - and you actually don´t need a self limiting build to kill those).

I would not run elegance personally (apart from very specific situations). It´s too situational. Julianos or Kag are both more all around useful. Even seducer in my opinion outperforms it (not in terms of dmg).

On the contrary I would argue Seducers does outperform in damage if you consider that you are doing NO damage if you are dead or out of magicka.

Running Seducers on my set up allows me to NEVER run out of magicka unless I am severely out numbered and I have to spam shields/streak to get distance, and allows me to run Stamina Immovable pots. Against another magicka sorc is lolz GG in terms of sustain, because Harness.

My spell dmg may hover around 2500 but I don't think I have EVER died to a DW magicka sorc.

Well my comment was more general utility oriented. You can fix both Kagrenac and julianos to keep up with seducer in terms of sustain but you can´t get maximum dmg with seducer.

Purely for pvp i´d always use seducer for a solo sorc setup but if you´re looking to do anything else with the gear i´d go for kags or julianos.

Personally i´m toying around with something completely different at the moment.

How would you fix Kagrenac and Julianos? I mean, even if you switched out all three jewelry enchants from spell damage to regen or cost reduction. It's still not enough.

Seducer gives all of the regen and cost reduction that you need alone in five pieces. Everything else can go either spell damage or (Wherever possible if you're smart) max Magicka. A seducer build should main bar about 42-43K max Magicka without wasting any bar slots on Mage light or bound aegis (unless you want to, then you're around 45K). It should also be around 2900 spell damage without the weapon enchant.

That leaves room to use utility spells like radiant light (because f*** nightblades), rune prison (defensive morph), mines (against Stam), group heals (resto bar), lightning form (defense and mobility), Mage wrath (execute), volcanic rune (hilarious), or double slotted frags (more procs). The more USEFUL you are as a Mage in any situation, the better Mage you are. You need to do more than just frags, pulse, curse, shield, and streak.

That's why pet builds and max Magicka stacker builds mostly suck this last patch. They just can't *do* enough. Every bar slot wasted is an extra 'thing' up above that you CANT do. Even if you overload bar a few of those, its not easy enough to get to in a pinch (meaning you won't realistically use it). Or even if you do, if you blow your ultimate you're cut off from all of it.

As i´ve written for a pure pvp build i would always choose seducer (or lich if that´s an option).

The stats seem a little optimistic though. 41k mag with 3.5 max magica bonuses(1seducer, 1.5 willp + x) aswell as ~2700 spelldmg is what i´m seeing with that setup without mages guild abilities.

Yep, that's the key! Run 5/1/1 armor with undaunted, two piece Magnus, two Mage guild abilities (degeneration/meteor), and 501CP, you can get about 42K.

(You can see 41887 here, 42K Monday easily with more CP and a master fire staff)
https://youtu.be/h-GmiDYha9M

LegendaryMage uses cost reduction and recovery glyphs. Throw on a Kena helmet and willpower with all damage enchants, then you're at around 2900 buffed (less recovery though!). Weave with light attacks and a spell damage enchant, then you get 3200+ That's really good for spell damage with that much max Magicka.

Methariorn

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Derra

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Minalan

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Methariorn

Lich is an uber pain in the ass to farm, but I'll give a try to get the pieces.

Derra

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Minalan

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Lol! I only count my stats IN Cyrodiil because I don't play anywhere else!

I see what you mean by pressuring an enemy with entropy, it's like a three second cast (leaving you with a 17 second major sorcery buff). However, you can cancel the animation and immediately follow up with an empowered frag.

LegendaryMage

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

Derra

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Methariorn wrote: »

I quote Derra: 2.8/2.9 spell damage and 41k magicka with seducer is not possible and, belive me, I've try all the combinations. Till seducer for me is a top set for small scale/solo (mandatory if I run in no cp campain). Next patch will bring warlock 160cp if I recal well and could be worth a try to replace seducer. I got no hope Wrobel will give more dps to sorc: his wet dream is to just see stam dk/templar running in Cyro and he's doind a fine job that way. I alway refuse to use animation canceling on every pg (as well as shields stack on sorc) so killing some stamina builds become a nightmare.

Warlock will be strictly inferior to both seducer and lich when only looking at the provided magica. The only reason to consider warlock would be it´s availability on jewelry slots.

The set ranking for magica sustain is:

Lich > Seducer > Warlock

Lich offers unmodified 10k magica (with regeneration bonuses a lich procc will net you between 18 to 25k magica extra per minute).
Seducer offers in a best case scenario where you´re permanently casting high cost (~3k magica) spells on gcd ~13 to 14k magica saved a minute.
Warlock will provide a one time burst of ~9k magica a minute.


@Minalan - you won´t get 2900 spelldmg with 2p magnus 5p sed 3p willp 1 Maelstrom (atleast for me this setups yields something around 2750 sd with 10% from expert mage - you need 1p kena for more which results in less than 41k magica). I exluded mages guild abilities as i feel they limited my utility as is. Surge is superior to entropy bc of prebuffing and better healing despite of the nerf. Negate is prefered over meteor as it´s once again one if not the strongest ultimate for pvp in the game.

Entropy gives you a more reliable heal than surge, more health, and empowered frags. Between that and meteor it puts me over the 41K top. What ultimate/skills are you running on your bar?

Plus Empowering your crystal fragments gives you a 20% bonus to that spell when it hits, entropy->proc->frags->curse hits like a truck. Our build is about bursting people down, and you can't do that without empower.

Are you counting the 5% offensive scroll bonus buff as well? Without the bonus I'm seeing 2700 with Kena, 2800 something with. That assumes that your
Home campaign even has the scroll to begin with. People night cap it all the time.

Entropy healing is in every way inferior to surge simply bc if you want reliable heals you have to stop pressuring the opponent and cast entropy more than once. Also you don´t get the heal when the target dodges entropy.

I only take into account selfbuffed stats out of cyrodiil. With continuous attack and scrolls stats are much higher anyways.

I can´t comment on my build any further bc reasons

Entropy is the only thing that will make you pressure someone up a notch when nothing else is working. Once you build your char, the only way to get a massive damage increase is to learn to use entropy as effectively as possible. It also adds passive benefits via magicka controller so that's good too. I'd use it even if it didn't, 20% on next attack is massive.

Or it´s actually less pressure to an experienced opponent because if you want to empower your most powerful attack you´re giving away your timing by having to use entropy before.