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Major Brutality/Sorcery Buffs (Originally about Stamblade Major Brutality)

  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    The real issue is that Rally is the only BUFF that grants Major Brutality for all classes except Sorc and DK (Molten Weapons as a buff, shouldn't break stealth- should be fixed).

    Templars, I'm on board for you getting access to it too. Magicka classes, you need more options than Entropy also.

    I probably mistitled my thread. It's not so much about Nightblades or their skills, as the scarcity of a necessary buff in the game.

    This isn't really a buff to Nightblades. Many people would still likely use Rally because it's a fantastic heal.

    AGAIN, adding Major Brutality in some way to one of Nightblades' other buffs, wouldn't be a huge change at all. People ARE NOT playing without it. You are NOT going to be ganked harder than you already are. Clever Alchemists are probably using Major Brutality potions, if they're not running Rally already, because it's so good.

    Dreugh King Slayer is a cool set. I have a 5 piece set myself (chest/helm/jewelry). Not a fan of losing the Medium armor bonuses to recovery, skill cost, roll dodge, sprinting. While you did mention weapons, you'd need two weapons equipped at all times, meaning no Bow.

    Keyword is OPTIONS. I'd be game for Major Brutality on Blade Cloak if it didn't break stealth. Or throw it on Evil Hunter and Major Sorcery on Inner Light. I don't care where it is, as long as it I don't HAVE to run 2H for Rally or blow gold fixing poor game design.
    Edited by Spearblade on July 25, 2016 3:28PM
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    Spearblade wrote: »
    As a Nightblade, we often initiate combat from Stealth/Cloak. It's kind of our thing. As is, if we want Major Brutality before we launch a sneak attack, we have to use Rally or use fancy potions. It's very limiting.

    Maybe change NB's Master Assassin passive, remove the 5%/10% damage bonus and change it to granting minor sorcery/brutality at rank one and both minor and major sorcery/brutality at rank two.

    Who's going to QQ about a 5/10% stealth nerf to NB's?

    That is OP. And a lot of people would only put 1 point in, because Minor Brutality/Sorcery are pretty rare. Then you could stack Minor/Major Brutality (Sorcery).
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    acw37162 wrote: »
    Yeah, no.

    Your trade off for being otherwise godlike is a class skill that requires you to be in melee range to get the buff otherwise slot a 2H or DW and throw the dagger.

    To the guy who posted I can't ******* believe this ****

    I fell over laughing.

    Slotting 2H isn't a punishment. It's a good skill line (except Cleave...). Exe/Reverse Slice is a better execute than Killer's Blade, Dizzying Blow remains strong, and of course...Rally. 2H isn't uncommon on ANY stamina char, especially in PVP.

    I don't really know what you're scared of. People with a lot of gold running Major Brutality pots already exist.

    And having weapon choices being restricted as a "trade off" is just poor game design, and not the vision of ESO.
  • juhasman
    juhasman
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    susmitds wrote: »
    juhasman wrote: »
    Yay Let's give nb's everything they want in the easiest way to get. Why major brutality only You should want to get major berserk... And for real You have power extraction which gives it. The fact You cannot use it outside of fight sounds fair for me due to fact You have 9% more wep/spell dmg in hide and minor berserk also. Stamplars dont have ANY class major blutality and dont cry.

    Stamplars have a lot going for them. The only stam class with a class purge now that cloak no longer purges. Major Mending, 10% crit dmg, 6% wep dmg, etc. They are OP af.

    Stam nb have - 10% crit dmg ,2% crit for each assasination ability, 8% more dmg, class empower , 9% more wep dmg in hide, 15% all regens + additional 10% more stam regen , auto crit from cloak , spammable class instant cast high dmg stamina based ability(supprise attack), stamina based gap closer , stamina based execute , stamina based AoE, stamina based OP ulti ,reducing target armor , reducing target heal , reducing target dmg, reducing target speed , best CC in the game, best escape skill in the game , passive with major resists , unlimited resources (siphoning attacks), more healing take , more max hp etc.
    Poor stam nb cant evet get close to that OP AF stamplar....
    Edited by juhasman on July 25, 2016 4:28PM
    Lv 50 magicka sorc high elf
    Lv 50 stamina sorc orc
    Lv 50 magicka dk dark elf
    Lv 50 stamina dk redguard
    Lv 50 magicka templar breton
    Lv 50 stamina templar redguard
    Lv 50 magicka nb high elf
    Lv 50 stamina nb imperial
    CP 750
  • FullBlownBeast
    FullBlownBeast
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    What poor game design? It's about making choices.

    [Edit to remove flaming]
    Edited by ZOS_AntonioP on July 25, 2016 6:01PM
    Plain and Simple
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    What poor game design? It's about making choices.

    Freedom.

    One of the only reasons I really ever liked my Stamina Sorcerer was because of Surge. Not the heals from the skill, but simply because I could use whatever weapon I wanted. I wasn't married to Rally for Major Brutality.

    I think that FREEDOM is what ESO intended for all classes, but has fallen short on. Too many builds and classes look nearly identical because of where important buffs fall. Like Rally.

    I'm still confused as to why you oppose it. I'm not just pro-Nightblade here; I think every class needs a solid skill with access to it.

    Nobody is currently playing without it. Do you want 2H to be one of most stamina classes' bars? What is your angle here?


    -Side note, before anybody posts Major Brutality/Sorcery from Surge as one of the defining traits of Sorcerer...sadly you're right atm. Sorcerer is totally screwed up atm imho. It needs a lot of help, if not an entire rework.
    Edited by ZOS_AntonioP on July 25, 2016 6:17PM
  • Erock25
    Erock25
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    Part of the allure of stamina sorc is we don't have to rely on rally. There are a ton of buffs nb has access to that I do not. Bottom line is stamina nb is very powerful so only way IMO they get major brutality is with significant nerf to whatever ability that it attaches to.
    You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
    You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    Erock25 wrote: »
    Part of the allure of stamina sorc is we don't have to rely on rally. There are a ton of buffs nb has access to that I do not. Bottom line is stamina nb is very powerful so only way IMO they get major brutality is with significant nerf to whatever ability that it attaches to.

    I'm not opposed to adjustments to skills to accomodate Major Brutality.

    But again, I agree Sorcerers are FUBAR'ed right now. Marrying other classes to Rally/2H, just so Sorcerer feels special isn't a solution though. They need something else to make them feel more unique, and ZOS keeps diddling with pets with poor results.

    I contributed to Stam Sorc threads for a couple months before DB release before giving up on em.
  • Vythri
    Vythri
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    Spearblade wrote: »
    acw37162 wrote: »
    Yeah, no.

    Your trade off for being otherwise godlike is a class skill that requires you to be in melee range to get the buff otherwise slot a 2H or DW and throw the dagger.

    To the guy who posted I can't ******* believe this ****

    I fell over laughing.

    Slotting 2H isn't a punishment. It's a good skill line (except Cleave...). Exe/Reverse Slice is a better execute than Killer's Blade, Dizzying Blow remains strong, and of course...Rally. 2H isn't uncommon on ANY stamina char, especially in PVP.

    I don't really know what you're scared of. People with a lot of gold running Major Brutality pots already exist.

    And having weapon choices being restricted as a "trade off" is just poor game design, and not the vision of ESO.

    I think the issue is that some people don't want to be FORCED into using a 2H. Yeah, it's a great skill line, and you're almost gimping yourself by not using it. Why does it have to be this way? What's the problem with freeing up more builds to be as viable as 2H is?
  • potirondb16_ESO
    potirondb16_ESO
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    Nowaday with throwing knives also giving acces to major brutality it's really to anyone to choose how they want to play it. Personnally I know I would go with 2h most of the time and then dw when I need a better dps (as for trial and such) and then agreed to boost myself with potion (as I'm playing a Stemplar).

    The fact that there isn't any class skill for major brutality as a Templar is yes an issue, only one class don't have acces to it and it's ours. Does that mean that we lack huge bonus... Nope, simply means that we have to learn to deal with it because we have other stuff that really helps (repentance for stamplar is awesome).

    So overall, I do feel like it's not that important to me.

    Maybe one day if fighter and mage guild get more active skill I would seek for a major brutality acces outside of weapon choice for every class but for now... I prefere to keep what I have then start getting what I don't wanna :smile: .
  • Erock25
    Erock25
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    Spearblade wrote: »
    Erock25 wrote: »
    Part of the allure of stamina sorc is we don't have to rely on rally. There are a ton of buffs nb has access to that I do not. Bottom line is stamina nb is very powerful so only way IMO they get major brutality is with significant nerf to whatever ability that it attaches to.

    I'm not opposed to adjustments to skills to accomodate Major Brutality.

    But again, I agree Sorcerers are FUBAR'ed right now. Marrying other classes to Rally/2H, just so Sorcerer feels special isn't a solution though. They need something else to make them feel more unique, and ZOS keeps diddling with pets with poor results.

    I contributed to Stam Sorc threads for a couple months before DB release before giving up on em.

    Stam sorc is in a good place right now. Hardly fubar.
    You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
    You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    Stam sorc is in a good place right now. Hardly fubar.

    Stam Sorc has the potential for a few very strong builds, but they rely on a double barred toggle, Hurricane, and Surge. Hurricane is the only stam sorc skill that actually does damage.

    It's a lot better than it was before Hurricane and passive boosts, but still needs help in the utility department. Another Stamina damage skill wouldn't hurt em either.
  • GreenSoup2HoT
    GreenSoup2HoT
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    They should just make a Monster Set that gives you Major Brutality/Sorcery. Boom fixed.
    PS4 NA DC
  • Vythri
    Vythri
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    They should just make a Monster Set that gives you Major Brutality/Sorcery. Boom fixed.

    That won't solve anything. Then you're losing out on a valuable set bonus that you can otherwise still get, AND get Major Brutality/Sorcery from a skill/potion. That's why I don't understand why people like Dreugh King Slayer. You're missing out on a valuable 5 piece bonus to get something that's already obtainable in other ways. It's a net loss.
  • GreenSoup2HoT
    GreenSoup2HoT
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    ✭✭
    Vythri wrote: »
    They should just make a Monster Set that gives you Major Brutality/Sorcery. Boom fixed.

    That won't solve anything. Then you're losing out on a valuable set bonus that you can otherwise still get, AND get Major Brutality/Sorcery from a skill/potion. That's why I don't understand why people like Dreugh King Slayer. You're missing out on a valuable 5 piece bonus to get something that's already obtainable in other ways. It's a net loss.

    You would not need to slot a skill or use a potion for your source of these Major Buffs though. Sure its a net loss on one hand but on the other you get a free skill slot with your choice of potion and weapons to use.

    I personally would love a monster set like this. Two gear slots for Major Brutality/Sorcery is not much of a sacrifice. I could use Dw/Bow in pvp very effectively.

    Dreugh King is a little more punishing in my opinion, i wouldnt use it.

    Also note you can combo many 5 piece sets and wear 2 with dw or 1h+s on one of your bars with this monster set.

    I already use DW/Bow in pvp. I use potions and shrouded daggers dw skill for my major brutality. Since i aready use clever alchemist it works well but with a monster set that gives me Major Brtuality.. i could use a different potion and slot somthing else then shrouded dagger if i wanted to.

    Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on July 26, 2016 10:27PM
    PS4 NA DC
  • Anti_Virus
    Anti_Virus
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    Suggestions:

    Siphoning Attacks:
    New effect: casting grants major brutality and major sorcery.

    In addtion you restore 700 magicka and stamina each light and heavy attack this effect has a cool down of 1 sec and have a 10% of restoring an addtional 2300 magic and stamina

    increase duration to 30 sec

    -Or-


    Relentless Focus
    New effect: grants major brutality increasing WD by 20% and minor endurance 10% stam recov increase

    Merciless Resolve
    New effect: grants major sorcery increasing SD by 20% and increases base dmg of spectral bow proc.


    I personally like the first option better and if implemented I wouldn't mind a nerf compensation to Relentless Focus. SA would be perfect it falls in line with other class dmg buffs

    Sorcs have surge which heals them in addtion to WD/SD buffs

    DKs have igneous Weps which add minor brutality stamina and buffs the whole group plus one morph gives 40% Heavy attack dmg

    As for templars im open for suggestions I want that class to also have a WD/SD buff.
    Edited by Anti_Virus on July 27, 2016 11:39AM
    Let the sun melt your body so that you may flow through the rivers of time.
  • Vythri
    Vythri
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    Anti_Virus wrote: »
    Suggestions:

    Siphoning Attacks:
    New effect: casting grants major brutality and major sorcery.

    In addtion you restore 700 magicka and stamina each light and heavy attack this effect has a cool down of 1 sec and have a 10% of restoring an addtional 2300 magic and stamina

    increase duration to 30 sec

    -Or-


    Relentless Focus
    New effect: grants major brutality increasing WD by 20% and minor endurance 10% stam recov increase

    Merciless Resolve
    New effect: grants major sorcery increasing SD by 20% and increases base dmg of spectral bow proc.


    I personally like the first option better and if implemented I wouldn't mind a nerf compensation to Relentless Focus. SA would be perfect it falls in line with other class dmg buffs

    Sorcs have surge which heals them in addtion to WD/SD buffs

    DKs have igneous Weps which add minor brutality stamina and buffs the whole group plus one morph gives 40% Heavy attack dmg

    As for templars im open for suggestions I want that class to also have a WD/SD buff.

    As a NB, I wouldn't want either of those changes. I'd prefer to not nerf the resources gained from Siphoning Attacks, and I don't want to give up Minor Berserk from Relentless Focus.
    Edited by Vythri on July 27, 2016 6:26PM
  • Espica
    Espica
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    Everybody use Major Brutality and Sorcery all the time, so it's more like a nuisance for certain classes or lack of freedom.

    They could tie it to food. Health + Stamina gives MB, and Health + Magicka gives MS.

    They could make a secondary Mundus Buff 'slot' where players could pick any Minor or Major buff. Although it could lead to some imbalances, most DPS would pick Major Berserk, unless devs nerf it a bit.

    They could implement a special ability bar that only gives any buff attached to the abilities sloted there.
    It would be only 3 slots, any abilities in that bar won't be accessible to slot in the 2 regular bars.
    For example, you put Rally in that bar you get MB. Then you put Expert Hunter you get Major Savagery. Then you put Radiant Aura and you get the buffs attached to it.
    It could take a lot of work to balance it properly, or decide what part/buff of the ability would be active in case it gives multiple buffs.

    Or just make hour-long buffs. Give each class a Major Brutality/Sorcery/Savagery/Prophecy that they can cast on target.
    I remember in Everquest Online Adventures on PS2 all classes had a buff, either combat or utility, that lasted 30 minutes. It was a chore for Clerics and Shamans to buff everyone during a raid, but later they got Class Mastery "morphs' that made those buffs group-cast.
  • mildlylucid
    mildlylucid
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    My personal opinion based of experience and what I would like to see in the game:
    Nightblades are probably the most balanced class (At least stamina nightblades, haven't seen to many magicka ones and I'm still levelling mine). Sure they're not perfect and don't have access to everything in their class abilities however I believe this should be the case, for nightblades and for all classes. This is an MMO and so teamwork and variety should be rewarded. In a group each class should be able to bring something unique to the table. So what if only nightblades can't give themselves major brutality whilst staying stealth without using rally, that's a challenge to be worked around and isn't really an issue if it's true for most of the classes in the game.
    Another day, another deathtrap.
    PC | NA | CP: 690+
    Main: Littlewill (50) - Khajiit Dragonknight Tank
    Alts:
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    Tlanir Dro'flayn (23) - Dunmer Magicka Nightblade DPS
    Morgayne Dalodrel (21) - Breton Magicka Templar Healer
    Tumande Stormwatch (20) - Altmer Magicka Sorcerer DPS
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    Bjorngrim Ingensen (5) - Nord Warden Tank
    Gwynereth Bonecrusher (4) - Bosmer Stamina Warden DPS
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    My personal opinion based of experience and what I would like to see in the game:
    Nightblades are probably the most balanced class (At least stamina nightblades, haven't seen to many magicka ones and I'm still levelling mine). Sure they're not perfect and don't have access to everything in their class abilities however I believe this should be the case, for nightblades and for all classes. This is an MMO and so teamwork and variety should be rewarded. In a group each class should be able to bring something unique to the table. So what if only nightblades can't give themselves major brutality whilst staying stealth without using rally, that's a challenge to be worked around and isn't really an issue if it's true for most of the classes in the game.

    I see and respect what you're saying, but it's not an issue that requires problem solving. It MEANS Rally, or throw gold into Major Brut potions.

    Tanks in EQ didn't run around without Temperance, Virtue, Conviction, etc...because they were gimped if they did. While that was a "weakness" of theirs, those buffs lasted a long time...an hour to several hours. So yes, another class filled their void without any game changing consequences.

    Buffing party members doesn't really exist in ESO in the classical MMO sense. Most, if not all, classes have Minor buffs that proc passively for the group, adding incentive for groups to be more diverse. Not so for Major Brutality.

    We have a good source of Major Brutality. Arguably the best. But Rally is married to a set playstyle, and THAT is the issue...imho.

    I can see Minor buffs being more unique to certain classes- maybe even the less critical majors. But Major Brutality/Sorcery are simply too important.
  • Strider_Roshin
    Strider_Roshin
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    I don't *** believe this ***...
    Lava_Croft wrote: »
    I think buffing StamBlades should be top priority.
    Orchish wrote: »
    No. Just no.
    Draxys wrote: »
    Loooooool

    I think it's funny. The focus of this forum is to have a means of acquiring major brutality (and now major sorcery) through the means of a class ability for the sake of convenience, and build diversity, and everyone flips their lid. It's not even a buff lol. I swear, you could ask for a cosmetic change for the stamblade, and people will freak out.
    Edited by Strider_Roshin on July 28, 2016 5:32PM
    And when I vest my flashing sword, and my hand takes hold in judgement, I will take vengeance upon mine enemies, and I will repay those who hase me. O Lord, raise me to Thy right hand and count me among Thy saints.
  • AfkNinja
    AfkNinja
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    I don't *** believe this ***...
    Lava_Croft wrote: »
    I think buffing StamBlades should be top priority.
    Orchish wrote: »
    No. Just no.
    Draxys wrote: »
    Loooooool

    I think it's funny. The focus of this forum is to have a means of acquiring major brutality (and now major sorcery) through the means of a class ability for the sake of convenience, and build diversity, and everyone flips their lid. It's not even a buff lol. I swear, you could ask for a cosmetic change for the stamblade, and people will freak out.

    Lets just give everyone every buff/debuff. woooo~
  • Spearblade
    Spearblade
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    Well, Stamblades already have access to Major Brutality; it's just in a stupid spot (Power Extraction). Especially given the fact that Nightblades often initiate combat from stealth. (Again, we use Rally atm...so having Major Brutality elsewhere won't change anything)



  • Lava_Croft
    Lava_Croft
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    People aren't flipping their lid, they're just wondering why StamBlades need even more damage. Sometimes it seems like StamBlades are turning into the Templars of ESO. Very strong but always act like you need buffs.
    Edited by Lava_Croft on July 29, 2016 11:36AM
    Xuth.
  • Vythri
    Vythri
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    The people that are complaining about Stamblades getting MB, are neglecting the fact that those Stamblades are most likely already using MB with Rally or pots, just like every other class. MB needs to be available as a specific buff outside of one weapon skill line. Put it in Expert Hunter and be done with it.
  • KingYogi415
    KingYogi415
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    Yah lets also nerf magic sorcs dks's while we are at it!
    Lord of the Vale Templar V16 Master Crafter VMA VDSA VAA
    Fancy Tiger of Cornwood Nightblade V8
    Zedd Zorander Fist Order Sorc V6
    Unreasonable Lobster DragonKnight V6
    Lobster Boi MagBladeV4
    Thor Odinson PoisonKnight V2
  • Anti_Virus
    Anti_Virus
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    I don't *** believe this ***...
    Lava_Croft wrote: »
    I think buffing StamBlades should be top priority.
    Orchish wrote: »
    No. Just no.
    Draxys wrote: »
    Loooooool

    I think it's funny. The focus of this forum is to have a means of acquiring major brutality (and now major sorcery) through the means of a class ability for the sake of convenience, and build diversity, and everyone flips their lid. It's not even a buff lol. I swear, you could ask for a cosmetic change for the stamblade, and people will freak out.

    There will always be Nightblade Hate. Accoring to Anti NBs

    Incap > DBoS

    Allowing NBs to have more build diversity instead of the 5 hundings 1 kena 1 blood spawn 3 agility robust WD jewelry shuffle dodge rolling vigor builds is an insult to them.
    Edited by Anti_Virus on July 30, 2016 5:32AM
    Let the sun melt your body so that you may flow through the rivers of time.
  • Toc de Malsvi
    Toc de Malsvi
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    Some of you just suggested giving up Minor Berserk for Major Brut... I suggest you learn more about the game before advocating a massive nerf to your class. Minor Berserk is not only better than Major Brutality but you can stack it with Major Brutality and no one else has it. Hundings as the only set....SMH
    Legendary Archer of Valenwood
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    Templar's are evil..
  • Anti_Virus
    Anti_Virus
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    Some of you just suggested giving up Minor Berserk for Major Brut... I suggest you learn more about the game before advocating a massive nerf to your class. Minor Berserk is not only better than Major Brutality but you can stack it with Major Brutality and no one else has it. Hundings as the only set....SMH


    If you were referring to me this post is for you if not ignore it.

    Minor berserk is supperior if and I definitely don't want to give it it since its the only class that has access to it.

    Buy major brutality increase WD which increases both your dmg and your healing this is the important part here. IIRC minor berserk is calculated after all all buffs

    I don't know the full formula but the higher your WD the more WD you gain when the buff is active the more effective your dmg AND healing is.

    I personally Wouldn't mind if I could keep both buffs on relentless focus but that would cause so much Anti NB QQ cyrodil would drown in tears.

    Don't treat me like an idiot bruh
    Let the sun melt your body so that you may flow through the rivers of time.
  • Anti_Virus
    Anti_Virus
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Vythri wrote: »
    Anti_Virus wrote: »
    Suggestions:

    Siphoning Attacks:
    New effect: casting grants major brutality and major sorcery.

    In addtion you restore 700 magicka and stamina each light and heavy attack this effect has a cool down of 1 sec and have a 10% of restoring an addtional 2300 magic and stamina

    increase duration to 30 sec

    -Or-


    Relentless Focus
    New effect: grants major brutality increasing WD by 20% and minor endurance 10% stam recov increase

    Merciless Resolve
    New effect: grants major sorcery increasing SD by 20% and increases base dmg of spectral bow proc.


    I personally like the first option better and if implemented I wouldn't mind a nerf compensation to Relentless Focus. SA would be perfect it falls in line with other class dmg buffs

    Sorcs have surge which heals them in addtion to WD/SD buffs

    DKs have igneous Weps which add minor brutality stamina and buffs the whole group plus one morph gives 40% Heavy attack dmg

    As for templars im open for suggestions I want that class to also have a WD/SD buff.

    As a NB, I wouldn't want either of those changes. I'd prefer to not nerf the resources gained from Siphoning Attacks, and I don't want to give up Minor Berserk from Relentless Focus.

    The relentless focus suggestion is over the top I agree.

    SA suggestion though could use more tweaking.

    New suggestion:

    Casting grants major brutality and major sorcery

    In addition you restore 2000 magicka and stamina each light and heavy attack this effect has a cooldown of 1 sec and a 10% chance to restore an addtional 3000 magic and stam.

    Increase the duration to 30 secs
    Let the sun melt your body so that you may flow through the rivers of time.
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