Costume Dying Should Be Free! (RANT)

Neirymn

Square Enix sells their "best" looking dyes in their cash shop in FFXIV and it's a subscription based MMO... If you missed some seasonnal events, you have to pay for the rewards with real money, before you used to be able to buy them with in game gil but not anymore. Exclusive mounts, pets, housing furnitures and beautiful wedding ceremonies cost real money too. World transfers, name changes, race changes, everything cost real money, I am ok with those last 3 options though but in my opinion when you pay to play, every items should be obtainable in game. It's one of the reasons I quit FFXIV.

As for ESO, you don't have to subscribe anymore but if you do, you don't have additinal costs to dye your costumes, it seems fair to me. But the stamps are lame though. At least they don't sell exclusive dyes in the crown store.

Ep1kMalware

petraeus1 wrote: »

Ep1kmalware wrote: »

lmfao bo2?

right, so this mmo comes out and drops their mandatory sub. Then they open a store for completely optional cosmetic purchases. Then low, and behold, every time something cosmetic is introduced everyome flails in agony demanding free cosmetid adjustments because if they can't have it for free the game is ruined.

if you don't like it shut up and go play something else. entitlist scab on societie's back. I'd bet you'd go to a movie theatre and demand free popcorn with your ,movie, huh?

no one wants your attitude amd I doubt zos would care if you stopped loitering.

xD Yes, exactly. I can sense your indignation.

You brought no new argument to the table, except the same old 'entitlement' argument.

Of course ZOS is not morally or logically obliged to give anything away for free. No one is saying that. It would be silly.

Yet as a paying customer (who has bought the box price and thousands of Crowns), there is reasonable expectation, based upon industry practice and the functionality of the product. Mine is different than yours.

I see Costume Dyes in its current implementation as nickle-and-diming. So I simply won't buy them, nor any costumes going forward. I stated my reasons above (did you even read it? My main plead was against increasing microtransactification and for a better dye system for B2P users), which is a legitimate use of these forums.

I did not call you names, I did not 'flail in agony' (though I do not know how you read my post in your mind), but then again I quoted you and attacked your 'argument' which on the internet means rudeness will ensue, I suppose.

Cheers buddy.

They could definitely add dye packs to world boss loot or treasure chests as a rare find (mayne the outdated ones?).

however the entitle,ent argument kinda sticks for a reason. Although I do admit they should just add dye packs as ingame loot for people not wanting to spend money, and sell individual or packaged dye bundles (color it how you want) in crownstore.

I can't see any reason dye kits specifica;ly can't be obtained in game. Though full customization should have some sort of incentive. They've got to recover costs for it somehow, and then pay off staffing/elecrical/profits etc.

Niastissa

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Graydon wrote: »

Stop what? Or you'll cancel your subscription?

hahaha so good.

I should go into the mall amd demand free wares since I paid for parking xD

Stores will validate parking if you spend enough money in the store.

petraeus1

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

petraeus1 wrote: »

Ep1kmalware wrote: »

lmfao bo2?

right, so this mmo comes out and drops their mandatory sub. Then they open a store for completely optional cosmetic purchases. Then low, and behold, every time something cosmetic is introduced everyome flails in agony demanding free cosmetid adjustments because if they can't have it for free the game is ruined.

if you don't like it shut up and go play something else. entitlist scab on societie's back. I'd bet you'd go to a movie theatre and demand free popcorn with your ,movie, huh?

no one wants your attitude amd I doubt zos would care if you stopped loitering.

xD Yes, exactly. I can sense your indignation.

You brought no new argument to the table, except the same old 'entitlement' argument.

Of course ZOS is not morally or logically obliged to give anything away for free. No one is saying that. It would be silly.

Yet as a paying customer (who has bought the box price and thousands of Crowns), there is reasonable expectation, based upon industry practice and the functionality of the product. Mine is different than yours.

I see Costume Dyes in its current implementation as nickle-and-diming. So I simply won't buy them, nor any costumes going forward. I stated my reasons above (did you even read it? My main plead was against increasing microtransactification and for a better dye system for B2P users), which is a legitimate use of these forums.

I did not call you names, I did not 'flail in agony' (though I do not know how you read my post in your mind), but then again I quoted you and attacked your 'argument' which on the internet means rudeness will ensue, I suppose.

Cheers buddy.

They could definitely add dye packs to world boss loot or treasure chests as a rare find (mayne the outdated ones?).

however the entitle,ent argument kinda sticks for a reason. Although I do admit they should just add dye packs as ingame loot for people not wanting to spend money, and sell individual or packaged dye bundles (color it how you want) in crownstore.

I can't see any reason dye kits specifica;ly can't be obtained in game. Though full customization should have some sort of incentive. They've got to recover costs for it somehow, and then pay off staffing/elecrical/profits etc.

Sure they got to make money. I would much rather however they raise all the DLC by a 1000 Crowns and leave all this crap (including the bloody barber shop) in the base game. And make Motifs less of a grind, horse training less of a hassle while they're at it. Just sell horses and pets and costumes and leave it at that.

I just hate excessive amounts of microtransactions, especially ones with bad functionality like these dye stamps which double up on other microtransactions (i.e. costumes), and my playtime is too irregular for me to feel good about a subfee when weeks go by I don't visit Tamriel. Which is why I chose a B2P game with paid DLC and not a F2P title.

I guess this is the most profitable route for them, however.

But I should not derail this topic, even though it says rant up there.

craybest

I think we free players should be able to dye costumes once, when we buy them, for future dyes I would have no problem with the current system.

Wolfchild07

I agree that it shouldn't be free for non-subs, but it shouldn't be like EA's SWTOR and mostly likely other games, either. There are better ways to do it.

Necrelios

I understand why they are doing it this way, I may not entirely agree with it, but from a forward looking perspective it makes sense so new players coming along will get more value out of ESO+. Older players who have been waiting for this since launch and already spent a bunch of money on the game with limited edition items, costumes and DLC can't help but feel a little cheated I think.

Forestd16b14_ESO

Corret me if I am wrong but werent players asking for more to ESO+ ? Like crafting bags and costume dye sure seems like more reasoning for eso+

nine9six

One of these threads again...

moiraleafcull

I die in costumes all the time...for free...
on Trueflame...

Abeille

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Corret me if I am wrong but werent players asking for more to ESO+ ? Like crafting bags and costume dye sure seems like more reasoning for eso+

Yes, okay, all good, no problem here.

But Dye Stamps are still the worst possible way to implement an alternative. It is barely an alternative, really, because it sucks so much.

Moonscythe

The arguments are exhausting sometimes. Each side has a point but it all comes down to money and whether you have it to spare. It's like the economic parallel to might makes right. It does seem to me that those who have paid their entry fee, i.e bought a costume, should be able to have a complete experience, i.e. costume dyes that can be changed. Subs are then welcome to fancier dyes or more variety. Personally, I would love to dye the costumes I have because I'm tired of seeing them everywhere looking just the same, which is the way I felt about armor before we could dye it; but, it's not enough to make me sub because I am subbed out. Everyone these days wants me to sub to get access to anything and then they continually raise the price to the point where I have to decide whether to keep it or not. ESO has yet to move their sub perks to the top of my want list.

Graydon

Abeille wrote: »

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

To me it seems very counter productive. As costume dyes are not something that I feel would lead people to sub, and certainly not something that would keep players subbed either. I think that they would most certainly make more money from the costume dyes if they were purchasable tokens and not something tied to a subscription.

I am a subscriber and can honestly say that this isn't something I care about or will ever make use of. But I can only imagine the amount of people that would be willing to fork out many once off payments to dye thier costumes.

I agree. I think it is possible that this actually hurts the sales of costumes in general.

If that happens, I hope ZOS is able to identify the issue and react accordingly.

I'm pretty sure ZOS's decision isn't based on what you think.

They think there is a demand for costume dyeing, so they will make it a perk for subscribers. It's not price gouging and it's not an essential feature.

I love how some people in this thread think ZOS made the game purely out of the goodness of their hearts. ZOS is a company that is expected to earn profits.

Funkopotamus

This is simply a cosmetic thing so yes.. Yes it should cost money and yes ESO plus should get more perks like this more often.

Sorry but the world is not a freebie handout regardless of what social media has led the population to believe..


If it was giving players advantages then yes I would stand with you, but ranting over colors is not going to get you much support here..

Egade

I don't agree (with OP). ZoS has running costs and it's clearly not pay2win, so they need to leverage cosmetic items and systems.

The alternatives are:
- pay2win store (e.g. non-cosmetics) or
- no subscription-less playing.

Soooo.... I prefer the way it is now.

Ep1kMalware

Niastissa wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Graydon wrote: »

Stop what? Or you'll cancel your subscription?

hahaha so good.

I should go into the mall amd demand free wares since I paid for parking xD

Stores will validate parking if you spend enough money in the store.

we call that eso+

I think op wants the parking to validate the store

newtinmpls

Again, I don't like the dye stamp system .... a lot.

But kudos for ZoS charging money (once again) for something that is NOT P2W.

Oh @petraeus1 that was a really insightful analogy.

I went back and gave you an insightful.
.

notimetocare

BalticBlues wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

another one jealous of eso+ perks.
Get used to it, there will be more.

So we all should get used to even less customers/players?

Nothing spreads faster than bad news:

1. The unacceptable performance on consoles already caused a mass exodus of players.

2. The exorbitant new item pricing in the Crown Store already is a hot topic. 5000 Crowns for a single new assistant or 5000 Crowns for a single new motif is almost twice as expensive as even the biggest and greatest DLC so far (Orsinium at 3000 Crowns).

3. Locking upcoming dye station functionality behind a paywall finally means locking core functionality away from players for the first time. People hate this. At least people should be able to buy an option to enable full dye station functionality... Selling fixed tier-one-colors instead seems like a plain rip-off, I am sorry to say that.

Lately, everything drives people alway from the game. Player numbers are down so badly on consoles that it gets hard to find people, for example for trials. Guild store sales overall fell about 75% since introction of the game-crippling DB. Many people are fed up. Players need reasons to start or come back, not reasons to stay away from the game.

1. Meh, console players stole year of content form PC. I have no sympathy...
2. Why is this an issue? You can get motifs ingame for gold or free. The bankers are not requires, you dont need to dye a costume. Would you rather they sell Tempers?
3. *core functionality* How is it core? Its a vanity thing. Pretty sure it isnt vital to playing the game.

Lately crybabies are leaving the game because they cant understand a company needs money to function. Companies need money to make a game, not hopes and dreams.

Ep1kMalware

notimetocare wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

another one jealous of eso+ perks.
Get used to it, there will be more.

So we all should get used to even less customers/players?

Nothing spreads faster than bad news:

1. The unacceptable performance on consoles already caused a mass exodus of players.

2. The exorbitant new item pricing in the Crown Store already is a hot topic. 5000 Crowns for a single new assistant or 5000 Crowns for a single new motif is almost twice as expensive as even the biggest and greatest DLC so far (Orsinium at 3000 Crowns).

3. Locking upcoming dye station functionality behind a paywall finally means locking core functionality away from players for the first time. People hate this. At least people should be able to buy an option to enable full dye station functionality... Selling fixed tier-one-colors instead seems like a plain rip-off, I am sorry to say that.

Lately, everything drives people alway from the game. Player numbers are down so badly on consoles that it gets hard to find people, for example for trials. Guild store sales overall fell about 75% since introction of the game-crippling DB. Many people are fed up. Players need reasons to start or come back, not reasons to stay away from the game.

1. Meh, console players stole year of content form PC. I have no sympathy...
2. Why is this an issue? You can get motifs ingame for gold or free. The bankers are not requires, you dont need to dye a costume. Would you rather they sell Tempers?
3. *core functionality* How is it core? Its a vanity thing. Pretty sure it isnt vital to playing the game.

Lately crybabies are leaving the game because they cant understand a company needs money to function. Companies need money to make a game, not hopes and dreams.

\o/ and good riddance. less crybabies = better content. I'm getting eso+ next month. I'm seeing alot of good things this summer tbh.

notimetocare

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

notimetocare wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

another one jealous of eso+ perks.
Get used to it, there will be more.

So we all should get used to even less customers/players?

Nothing spreads faster than bad news:

1. The unacceptable performance on consoles already caused a mass exodus of players.

2. The exorbitant new item pricing in the Crown Store already is a hot topic. 5000 Crowns for a single new assistant or 5000 Crowns for a single new motif is almost twice as expensive as even the biggest and greatest DLC so far (Orsinium at 3000 Crowns).

3. Locking upcoming dye station functionality behind a paywall finally means locking core functionality away from players for the first time. People hate this. At least people should be able to buy an option to enable full dye station functionality... Selling fixed tier-one-colors instead seems like a plain rip-off, I am sorry to say that.

Lately, everything drives people alway from the game. Player numbers are down so badly on consoles that it gets hard to find people, for example for trials. Guild store sales overall fell about 75% since introction of the game-crippling DB. Many people are fed up. Players need reasons to start or come back, not reasons to stay away from the game.

1. Meh, console players stole year of content form PC. I have no sympathy...
2. Why is this an issue? You can get motifs ingame for gold or free. The bankers are not requires, you dont need to dye a costume. Would you rather they sell Tempers?
3. *core functionality* How is it core? Its a vanity thing. Pretty sure it isnt vital to playing the game.

Lately crybabies are leaving the game because they cant understand a company needs money to function. Companies need money to make a game, not hopes and dreams.

\o/ and good riddance. less crybabies = better content. I'm getting eso+ next month. I'm seeing alot of good things this summer tbh.

Yea, I mean there are problems, but nothing gets fixed with 'well i wont pay until they fix it'. They just ignore what you complain about for the people that do pay.

Vangy

1. Costume dyeing dosent need to be free. We all bought costumes knowing full and well that costume dyeing may never be possible.

2. That being said, the way the implemented the pay to dye system is bullcrap. Why not let people buy a token to let them dye a costume once with any of the dyes they have unlocked??? Why complicate matters with the whole dye pack system... So much man-hours wasted on a cash-grab......

This is coming from a ESO+ sub.....

Ep1kMalware

Vangy wrote: »

1. Costume dyeing dosent need to be free. We all bought costumes knowing full and well that costume dyeing may never be possible.

2. That being said, the way the implemented the pay to dye system is bullcrap. Why not let people buy a token to let them dye a costume once with any of the dyes they have unlocked??? Why complicate matters with the whole dye pack system... So much man-hours wasted on a cash-grab......

This is coming from a ESO+ sub.....

I agree. make the preselected crap drop from master chests or something. make 1 time use dye kits for like 750 crowns (expensive enough to offer incentive for eso+, but also makes it so people will buy them for their favorite costume or teo.

can't we just have both?

Woeler

Alright, I'll explain how the world works one more time: Stuff costs money.

Duiwel

It is free... for me

(cause I sub)

p.s. your tears are delicious & salty

notimetocare

Vangy wrote: »

1. Costume dyeing dosent need to be free. We all bought costumes knowing full and well that costume dyeing may never be possible.

2. That being said, the way the implemented the pay to dye system is bullcrap. Why not let people buy a token to let them dye a costume once with any of the dyes they have unlocked??? Why complicate matters with the whole dye pack system... So much man-hours wasted on a cash-grab......

This is coming from a ESO+ sub.....

Eh, if you really want it simple just make costume dying 100% sub only. No need for dyepacks in the crownstore or as drops. No need for an extra token to let someone dye a costume.

drakhan2002_ESO

BalticBlues wrote: »

1. The unacceptable performance on consoles already caused a mass exodus of players.

This has not affected PC players...

theher0not

Do like me. Don't spend a single dime on ANYTHING in this game. Since ZoS obviously doesn't care about the players why should we support them?

Also to the players saying "get ESO+" you are part of the problem. People like you are the reason companies like EA and now ZoS makes everything about milking the players on all their money.

Transairion

Zenimax loses out on making MORE money and here's why:

1) Only desperate morons* will buy the terrible dye stamps and I can't see the majority of the playerbase being that dumb (why buy some terrible premade coloration, when you can sub and for free dye basically ANY colour combination you want?) so really only ESO+ members will even use it

2) Instead of potentially every player being able to buy costumes (to then dye, even if they don't like the original color you can dye it something else) this is limited to ESO+ members only. Non ESO+ members won't bother. There's load of costumes I'd buy if I could dye them freely but I'm not paying twice (either to sub or to buy some terribly stamp) for that "right", so I just won't buy them. It's the entire reason I skimped over Altmer Hero, it's colors looked terrible ingame

3) Word of mouth from what I wager is a significantly larger non-ESO+ playerbase who basically can't use the "new feature" at all only makes Zeni look bad and certainly doesn't offer any positive outlook for the game if stuff this simple is being monetized instead of being QoL. Just having it in the base game would've been a huge QoL feature nobody sane would talk down against, instead we've got this "I've a sub I deserve more, you're not a sub you're worthless!" debacle (which is just stupid since this game has no free option to begin with)


It was a feature I was looking forward to, now I just won't use it, won't buy any costumes to dye either. If Zenimax doesn't want my money so be it, people like costumes and mounts and stuff... you know how many of those Dro'matha mounts I've seen? Tons. And far from it, not everyone who bought them were ESO+ members. Tons and tons of players spend cash on Crown stuff, but limiting a feature like Costume Dyeing to sub only just removes potential customers from the equation.


Or, you know, just make Dye Stamps a one-off "you can freely dye one costume" thing: we'll gladly pay Crowns for that, not just to get "Vomit Green/Urine Yellow" because Zeni think that's a desirable combination. Look at SWTOR's dye system, almost all the store-bought Dyes are awful abominations.


*Note: No offense to anyone who actually likes Dye Stamps, but paying Crowns instead of 1 months sub is just really, really dumb unless you have no Dyes at all, and I'm pretty sure the default Dye section is huge as well. Buying the stamps is only ripping yourself off

notimetocare

theher0not wrote: »

Do like me. Don't spend a single dime on ANYTHING in this game. Since ZoS obviously doesn't care about the players why should we support them?

Also to the players saying "get ESO+" you are part of the problem. People like you are the reason companies like EA and now ZoS makes everything about milking the players on all their money.

Got proof they don't care outside of assumptions?
Have any understanding of business and bottom lines?
People that makes these arguments are the reason I wish it was a sub only game. Don't want to support the game? Don;t play it.

Forestd16b14_ESO

Abeille wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Corret me if I am wrong but werent players asking for more to ESO+ ? Like crafting bags and costume dye sure seems like more reasoning for eso+

Yes, okay, all good, no problem here.

But Dye Stamps are still the worst possible way to implement an alternative. It is barely an alternative, really, because it sucks so much.

Uh nit really cause the stamps use all the dyes including ones you the player have not unlocked. So like so and so color but dont have it? Use stamp.