Scaling Mechanics NEED Improvements

Bidaum92

Whilst scaling is very good for allowing everyone to play together easier. I've noticed in a few areas there are major bugs in the way scaling works.

Story Quests - BUG Fix
My story quests levels are showing as my level (39) in my quest log - I go to do them and I'm actually fighting against level 43 mobs.
Why is this happening? Surely if I'm fighting against level 43 mobs this is a level 43 quest?
All I can assume is that ESO have set the quest level in the quest log will scale down to the player but the quest itself will only scale up the mob levels.

This is definitely a bug, as the quest level of the story quest should never be able to go below the level of the mobs you're fighting..
Either set the minimum level of the story quest in the quest log to minimum mob level.. or allow story quests to scale below.


Dungeons - LFG Scaling Fixes
If a low level player uses LFG to join a dungeon that gets scaled to VR16 they are EXTREMELY underscaled for it.
A couple of days ago me and my fiance (level 39 again) did Blackheart Haven. First we tried LFG and joined a VR16 healer and VR1 tank.
The amount of damage we had to deal and received made it super difficult for a dungeon that really shouldn't be.
Once we left that group and looked for a normal group in the zone chat we cake walked it.

Instead I think non veteran dungeons should scale players down to the dungeon level instead of scaling up.
And to ensure players are actually going to join then be scaled as they currently are to the player's level.


Questing Zones - Quality of Life Change
One of my major annoyances with questing is how easily I actually out-level everything and therefor just want to skip that zone.
Also I'm unable to play questing content with my friends at times because I've out leveled them.

A really simple fix for that would be a toggle-able option to scale your stats and gear level down to the zone.

i.e You land in Sentinel in Alik'r Desert. The area level is 33.
Now if the player is level 35 or lower. No scaling happens.
The player is above level 35. Their attributes get scaled back down to what they would be if level 35.

You then go into the Sandblown Mine Delve. Which is level 37.
Now the numbers are changed to level 39 as the scaling max.

You also still gain experience at your true level. So if a quest is grey for you when not scaled you get grey experience.

Bidaum92

Please give your opinions below!

Honestly the quality of life changes for questing zones, isn't important but would be a great addition.

However the dungeon scaling and story quests bugs really should have been fixed a long time ago.

Junipus

Story quests aren't a bug. The level you see is the minimum recommended level to complete that quest, whereas you fight mobs at your level thanks to the scaling.

Dungeon scaling up, if you're scaled to VR16, isn't too bad of a problem unless you're running without any CP. Your regen, damage and resource pools are all scaled appropriately so if you're below VR16, you're still capable of doing the same damage as them if you're high enough with passives etc unlocked.

Bidaum92

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Story quests aren't a bug. The level you see is the minimum recommended level to complete that quest, whereas you fight mobs at your level thanks to the scaling.

No the level you see is your current level, as when you level up the quest level increases with it. However mobs are not scaled below the original level of the quest (before they started scaling story quests) So you get story quests about 5 levels below the original quest level, but mobs are still the original level.

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Dungeon scaling up, if you're scaled to VR16, isn't too bad of a problem unless you're running without any CP. Your regen, damage and resource pools are all scaled appropriately so if you're below VR16, you're still capable of doing the same damage as them if you're high enough with passives etc unlocked.

Except it's not scaled proportionally properly as I've given in the example above. We did the dungeon in LFG with everything scaled to VR16 and mobs hit harder, you do less damage proportionally and healing is harder. We then did it with people in the zone and scaled to a normal level and we cake walked it.


I wish people would read before commenting...

Enodoc

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Story quests aren't a bug. The level you see is the minimum recommended level to complete that quest, whereas you fight mobs at your level thanks to the scaling.

That's not true. The Journal won't show the minimum level if you are below it, it will show your level, and mobs don't scale to your level if you are below the minimum. In a scaled story quest, the Journal level is always equal to your level, even if your level is below the mob level for that zone. That's the situation the OP is in, and I agree that (bug or not) it should be changed.

For example, the enemies on Stirk are Level 43 minimum, but if you do The Weight of Three Crowns at Level 39, it will appear as a Level 39 quest instead of a Level 43 quest, even though the enemies are all Level 43. The quest should match the enemy level, so the quest should be showing Level 43.

I would also like to see optional downscaling. I think the sweet spot for scaling would be 3-5 levels above the content.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Bidaum92 wrote: »

Questing Zones - Quality of Life Change
One of my major annoyances with questing is how easily I actually out-level everything and therefor just want to skip that zone.
Also I'm unable to play questing content with my friends at times because I've out leveled them.

A really simple fix for that would be a toggle-able option to scale your stats and gear level down to the zone.

i.e You land in Sentinel in Alik'r Desert. The area level is 33.
Now if the player is level 35 or lower. No scaling happens.
The player is above level 35. Their attributes get scaled back down to what they would be if level 35.

You then go into the Sandblown Mine Delve. Which is level 37.
Now the numbers are changed to level 39 as the scaling max.

You also still gain experience at your true level. So if a quest is grey for you when not scaled you get grey experience.

improvements and gamewide implementation is needed. i want to revisit dungeons in non-vet zones. i dont want to kill everything in a single hit when i explore my home faction

laksikus

Bidaum92 wrote: »

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Story quests aren't a bug. The level you see is the minimum recommended level to complete that quest, whereas you fight mobs at your level thanks to the scaling.

No the level you see is your current level, as when you level up the quest level increases with it. However mobs are not scaled below the original level of the quest (before they started scaling story quests) So you get story quests about 5 levels below the original quest level, but mobs are still the original level.

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

Dungeon scaling up, if you're scaled to VR16, isn't too bad of a problem unless you're running without any CP. Your regen, damage and resource pools are all scaled appropriately so if you're below VR16, you're still capable of doing the same damage as them if you're high enough with passives etc unlocked.

Except it's not scaled proportionally properly as I've given in the example above. We did the dungeon in LFG with everything scaled to VR16 and mobs hit harder, you do less damage, and healing is harder. We then did it with people in the zone and scaled to a normal level and we cake walked it.


I wish people would read before commenting...

you dont do less damage, i know that for a fact, since i did scaled dungeons several times.

You may get more damage, and you need to deal more damage, but your health is igher too, your regen and weapon damage too, so not really a problem

Bidaum92

laksikus wrote: »

you dont do less damage, i know that for a fact, since i did scaled dungeons several times

You may get more damage, and you need to deal more damage, but your health is igher too, your regen and weapon damage too, so not really a problem

Well blackheart cavern mobs and player attributes are definitely not scaling properly.. As it was next to impossible to do and we had to abandon it when scaled up to VR16 from level 38.and was very easy when not scaled and running with a group created outside of the looking for group.

Bidaum92

quick bump to ensure discussion continues.

j3crow

I agree completely. I simply don't understand those advocates who say scaling is working fine. It is not. I have seen run after run wipe with low level characters who were in theory, scaled to V16.

Conversely, I have seen players drop as soon as they see a non-vet in their party. I personally don't bother doing anything other than vet dungeons, becasue I know that I will be grouped with other veteran characters.

With my own characters that are sub-vet. I have opted to not even bother with the group finder until they are veteran ranked.

Its not too bad if a character is 40+ or so, when they are scaled. But anything less than that, is miserable

You can't just boost stats, and call it a day, when you scale characters. The smart approach, that plenty of other titles use, is to scale high level characters down to the appropriate level. Not try and scale low level characters up

vyndral13preub18_ESO

In not exactly sure what your problem was with scaled dungeons. With the cake buff not to long ago the gf and i both leveled 2 characters each from 10-50 almost exclusively in the random dungeon finder. We were both dps and had next to no issues doing enough damage or staying alive.

We tried to keep all our equipment blue level and within 5 levels of our characters. When we would get to 10 levels out on equip we could seriously tell a difference in damage.

I will say though that at lower levels you are much more dependant on your healer and tank. As you level and have more skills open it is easier for you to cover yourself and make up for bad play by others.

MasterSpatula

RE Questing Zones: Oh Lord, you're basically asking them to do exactly what ruined SWTOR for me. Please, for the love of God, I want my level to actually mean something somewhere. I want to be able to be underleveled or overleveled in some places. I don't mind some battle-scaling, but there needs to be some places without it.

RE Dungeons: Scaling players down to the original level of the dungeon wouldn't be the worst idea, but it would require some serious work to keep players from being OP due to CP and skill points, etc.

nimander99

Bidaum92 wrote: »

Whilst scaling is very good for allowing everyone to play together easier. I've noticed in a few areas there are major bugs in the way scaling works.

Story Quests - BUG Fix
My story quests levels are showing as my level (39) in my quest log - I go to do them and I'm actually fighting against level 43 mobs.

This is definitely a bug, as the quest level of the story quest should never be able to go below the level of the mobs you're fighting..


Dungeons - LFG Scaling Fixes
If a low level player uses LFG to join a dungeon that gets scaled to VR16 they are EXTREMELY underscaled for it.
A couple of days ago me and my fiance (level 39 again) did Blackheart Haven. First we tried LFG and joined a VR16 healer and VR1 tank.
The amount of damage we had to deal and received made it super difficult for a dungeon that really shouldn't be.
Once we left that group and looked for a normal group in the zone chat we cake walked it.

Instead I think non veteran dungeons should scale players down to the dungeon level instead of scaling up.
And to ensure players are actually going to join then be scaled as they currently are to the player's level.


Questing Zones - Quality of Life Change
One of my major annoyances with questing is how easily I actually out-level everything and therefor just want to skip that zone.
Also I'm unable to play questing content with my friends at times because I've out leveled them.

A really simple fix for that would be a toggle-able option to scale your stats and gear level down to the zone.

i.e You land in Sentinel in Alik'r Desert. The area level is 33.
Now if the player is level 35 or lower. No scaling happens.
The player is above level 35. Their attributes get scaled back down to what they would be if level 35.

You then go into the Sandblown Mine Delve. Which is level 37.
Now the numbers are changed to level 39 as the scaling max.

You also still gain experience at your true level. So if a quest is grey for you when not scaled you get grey experience.

All these issues will be solved when the entire game world is scaled... Patience my young Padawan.

notimetocare

Bidaum92 wrote: »

Whilst scaling is very good for allowing everyone to play together easier. I've noticed in a few areas there are major bugs in the way scaling works.

Story Quests - BUG Fix
My story quests levels are showing as my level (39) in my quest log - I go to do them and I'm actually fighting against level 43 mobs.

This is definitely a bug, as the quest level of the story quest should never be able to go below the level of the mobs you're fighting..


Dungeons - LFG Scaling Fixes
If a low level player uses LFG to join a dungeon that gets scaled to VR16 they are EXTREMELY underscaled for it.
A couple of days ago me and my fiance (level 39 again) did Blackheart Haven. First we tried LFG and joined a VR16 healer and VR1 tank.
The amount of damage we had to deal and received made it super difficult for a dungeon that really shouldn't be.
Once we left that group and looked for a normal group in the zone chat we cake walked it.

Instead I think non veteran dungeons should scale players down to the dungeon level instead of scaling up.
And to ensure players are actually going to join then be scaled as they currently are to the player's level.


Questing Zones - Quality of Life Change
One of my major annoyances with questing is how easily I actually out-level everything and therefor just want to skip that zone.
Also I'm unable to play questing content with my friends at times because I've out leveled them.

A really simple fix for that would be a toggle-able option to scale your stats and gear level down to the zone.

i.e You land in Sentinel in Alik'r Desert. The area level is 33.
Now if the player is level 35 or lower. No scaling happens.
The player is above level 35. Their attributes get scaled back down to what they would be if level 35.

You then go into the Sandblown Mine Delve. Which is level 37.
Now the numbers are changed to level 39 as the scaling max.

You also still gain experience at your true level. So if a quest is grey for you when not scaled you get grey experience.

Some story quests are lvl specific. It is fine that way, they are limited. Not to mention 39 v 43 is very easy.

Your stats are scaled to v15. The only reason your dps would not be enough for a normal dungeon is if you are playing poorly.
Taking too much dmg is almost always player error. Blackheart does have plenty of group dmg, that is a healer and player issue combined.
To repeat, you are scaled up to where you need to be. L2Play issue.

Questing in MMOs tends to favor solo playstyle. It is hard to adjust that, and is barely worth adjusting. It might SEEM simple, but scaling is not super simple, especially if it is something people wont use other than a small handful. Resources for content are limited.

kratier

yup, I agree, you outlevel things WAY too easily in this game

give the player the option to scale his own EXP gain, or a way to lock their own EXP via a button, or a slider that lets you determine what % of exp you want to gain. so I could set the slider to 30% and take my time with the game

Enodoc

MasterSpatula wrote: »

RE Questing Zones: Oh Lord, you're basically asking them to do exactly what ruined SWTOR for me. Please, for the love of God, I want my level to actually mean something somewhere. I want to be able to be underleveled or overleveled in some places. I don't mind some battle-scaling, but there needs to be some places without it.

Being underlevelled means you have the opportunity to level up and gain more power, and come back later to do something you couldn't do before. Indeed that is a good thing, and that's why I don't like the idea of scaling up. But bring overlevelled means things are too easy, completing them is trivial, and it's not enjoyable because it's a face roll and you don't get any meaningful reward from it. Scaling down would make this content interesting again.

MasterSpatula

Enodoc wrote: »

MasterSpatula wrote: »

RE Questing Zones: Oh Lord, you're basically asking them to do exactly what ruined SWTOR for me. Please, for the love of God, I want my level to actually mean something somewhere. I want to be able to be underleveled or overleveled in some places. I don't mind some battle-scaling, but there needs to be some places without it.

Being underlevelled means you have the opportunity to level up and gain more power, and come back later to do something you couldn't do before. Indeed that is a good thing, and that's why I don't like the idea of scaling up. But bring overlevelled means things are too easy, completing them is trivial, and it's not enjoyable because it's a face roll and you don't get any meaningful reward from it. Scaling down would make this content interesting again.

Obviously, you know your TES, so why do you want the thing that damn-near ruined Oblivion in ESO?

Overlevelling isn't really a problem, because if you're in content where you're so overleveled that you're not getting rewarded, you can burn through faster and reach the point where you're getting rewarded again. You can skip side quests. Or you can wait to do the DLC content until you've completed the leveling content, thus taking the content at the intended rate.

Oh, and by the way, @Enodoc, I'm a little disappointed. You seem like far too reasonable person to be resorting to the tiresome and snide term faceroll.

Down-scaling removes the fun of seeing for yourself the difference in power between VR1 and level 10. Downscaling removes the joy of utterly obliterating an enemy that way-back-when had you desperately hoping your potion would come off of cooldown before you run out of stamina from having to doge-roll and block the constant insane levels of damage he/she/it was doing. Downscaling removes the feeling, the meaningfulness, of level progression.

Unless, of course, they half-ass it like Bioware did in SWTOR. Then you're getting full XP and rewards of your own level for content that you can beat effortlessly. That's just as bad, even if it is in the opposite direction.

Can we please just let levels mean something somewhere?

Enodoc

MasterSpatula wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

MasterSpatula wrote: »

RE Questing Zones: Oh Lord, you're basically asking them to do exactly what ruined SWTOR for me. Please, for the love of God, I want my level to actually mean something somewhere. I want to be able to be underleveled or overleveled in some places. I don't mind some battle-scaling, but there needs to be some places without it.

Being underlevelled means you have the opportunity to level up and gain more power, and come back later to do something you couldn't do before. Indeed that is a good thing, and that's why I don't like the idea of scaling up. But bring overlevelled means things are too easy, completing them is trivial, and it's not enjoyable because it's a face roll and you don't get any meaningful reward from it. Scaling down would make this content interesting again.

Obviously, you know your TES, so why do you want the thing that damn-near ruined Oblivion in ESO?

Overlevelling isn't really a problem, because if you're in content where you're so overleveled that you're not getting rewarded, you can burn through faster and reach the point where you're getting rewarded again. You can skip side quests. Or you can wait to do the DLC content until you've completed the leveling content, thus taking the content at the intended rate.

If you're a completionist, which is the most likely cause of overlevelling, you don't want to skip anything permanently, and if you're doing everything in order, you'll reach a point where you're overlevelled for everything, and never get back to the point when you're appropriately rewarded again.

Oh, and by the way, @Enodoc, I'm a little disappointed. You seem like far too reasonable person to be resorting to the tiresome and snide term faceroll.

Yeah I actually really didn't like writing that, but I couldn't think of a better way to describe something that was so easy such that no effort was required. "No reward" resulting from that "no effort" is certainly appropriate, but when you want to enjoy the content you're doing, having it so easy that it requires no effort is not enjoyable.

Down-scaling removes the fun of seeing for yourself the difference in power between VR1 and level 10. Downscaling removes the joy of utterly obliterating an enemy that way-back-when had you desperately hoping your potion would come off of cooldown before you run out of stamina from having to doge-roll and block the constant insane levels of damage he/she/it was doing. Downscaling removes the feeling, the meaningfulness, of level progression.

That's true. But say you want to do a DLC at Level 30, because it's new, and DLCs are designed to be done at any level; by the time you come back to your Level 30 zone, you'll not be getting any rewards from it apart from the quest XP, because you overlevelled by completing the DLC content elsewhere. You want to do your Level 30 zone, but it's no longer enjoyable. If you had the option to scale down to the zone level, you'd be able to enjoy the content at the level that was intended, even though you're no longer at that level. That's the benefit of downscaling, and why, if implemented, it should be entirely optional.

Rune_Relic

A lot of the qeusts were scaled to vet level.
The problme being CS also increased your magicka/stamina/health and genral power level too.
So the scaling was a walk in the park for CP rich and difficult for CP poor.

Now "vet rank scaling" has been removed.
Now the difficulty "scales with CP" instead, so there is no more of the CP rich vs CP poor difficulty gap.

Bidaum92

MasterSpatula wrote: »

RE Questing Zones: Oh Lord, you're basically asking them to do exactly what ruined SWTOR for me. Please, for the love of God, I want my level to actually mean something somewhere. I want to be able to be underleveled or overleveled in some places. I don't mind some battle-scaling, but there needs to be some places without it.
.

I'm not saying you should be scaled up to the zone. That is a stupid idea indeed.

However a COMPLETELY OPTIONAL toggle to scale down to the zone level would be very nice for when you are already out-levelling the place but want to feel like it's worthwhile staying there. And if you don't want to scale down? You just disable it and return to your real level.

Obviously EXP would still be obtained based on your normal level not your scaled level to ensure the issue doesn't get exacerbated

notimetocare wrote: »

Your stats are scaled to v15. The only reason your dps would not be enough for a normal dungeon is if you are playing poorly.
Taking too much dmg is almost always player error. Blackheart does have plenty of group dmg, that is a healer and player issue combined.
To repeat, you are scaled up to where you need to be. L2Play issue.

Did you read what I wrote?

We were scaled up to VR16 in Blackheart. Bosses took 3x as long, damage recieved was much higher.. etc etc..

We then left that LFG group and went with a group we found in the zone of the appropriate level and cake walked it with me being able to pretty much tank the entire thing in medium armor with the cleave bubble as DPS.

It was IMPOSSIBLE to do even close to that when scaled up to VR16 so don't try and tell me it's a L2P issue.

Bidaum92

Also people are

MasterSpatula wrote: »

Overlevelling isn't really a problem, because if you're in content where you're so overleveled that you're not getting rewarded, you can burn through faster and reach the point where you're getting rewarded again. You can skip side quests. Or you can wait to do the DLC content until you've completed the leveling content, thus taking the content at the intended rate.

You say that, but my character is currently level 40 and hasn't even finished 30% of Alik'r desert.. By the time I have finished Alik'r I'll be overleveled for Bangkorai... and the issue will continue.

KaleidoscopeEyz

We did the dungeon in LFG with everything scaled to VR16 and mobs hit harder, you do less damage proportionally and healing is harder.

Of course they do. It's probably the champion points issue the poster mentioned since you can increase your resistances, healing & damage through them. A level 39 won't have them so they will be inferior.

susmitds

Bidaum92 wrote: »

Whilst scaling is very good for allowing everyone to play together easier. I've noticed in a few areas there are major bugs in the way scaling works.

Story Quests - BUG Fix
My story quests levels are showing as my level (39) in my quest log - I go to do them and I'm actually fighting against level 43 mobs.

This is definitely a bug, as the quest level of the story quest should never be able to go below the level of the mobs you're fighting..


Dungeons - LFG Scaling Fixes
If a low level player uses LFG to join a dungeon that gets scaled to VR16 they are EXTREMELY underscaled for it.
A couple of days ago me and my fiance (level 39 again) did Blackheart Haven. First we tried LFG and joined a VR16 healer and VR1 tank.
The amount of damage we had to deal and received made it super difficult for a dungeon that really shouldn't be.
Once we left that group and looked for a normal group in the zone chat we cake walked it.

Instead I think non veteran dungeons should scale players down to the dungeon level instead of scaling up.
And to ensure players are actually going to join then be scaled as they currently are to the player's level.


Questing Zones - Quality of Life Change
One of my major annoyances with questing is how easily I actually out-level everything and therefor just want to skip that zone.
Also I'm unable to play questing content with my friends at times because I've out leveled them.

A really simple fix for that would be a toggle-able option to scale your stats and gear level down to the zone.

i.e You land in Sentinel in Alik'r Desert. The area level is 33.
Now if the player is level 35 or lower. No scaling happens.
The player is above level 35. Their attributes get scaled back down to what they would be if level 35.

You then go into the Sandblown Mine Delve. Which is level 37.
Now the numbers are changed to level 39 as the scaling max.

You also still gain experience at your true level. So if a quest is grey for you when not scaled you get grey experience.

Blackheart Haven is actually the hardest normal dungeon, at least as hard as some of vet dungeons due to the sheer number of mobs everywhere. On under geared characters with low CP, it is quite damn hard to complete.

Note - I am not saying it is hard with end game characters and like all other dungeons becomes a cake walk eventually.

Bidaum92

KaleidoscopeEyz wrote: »

We did the dungeon in LFG with everything scaled to VR16 and mobs hit harder, you do less damage proportionally and healing is harder.

Of course they do. It's probably the champion points issue the poster mentioned since you can increase your resistances, healing & damage through them. A level 39 won't have them so they will be inferior.

So why is a level 39 able to join a instance scaled to VR16 then if they'll be inferior? Again the scaling is backwards.

susmitds

Bidaum92 wrote: »

KaleidoscopeEyz wrote: »

We did the dungeon in LFG with everything scaled to VR16 and mobs hit harder, you do less damage proportionally and healing is harder.

Of course they do. It's probably the champion points issue the poster mentioned since you can increase your resistances, healing & damage through them. A level 39 won't have them so they will be inferior.

So why is a level 39 able to join a instance scaled to VR16 then if they'll be inferior? Again the scaling is backwards.

Even if v16s are down scaled, they would be still way to strong due to better passives, skills and gear. And the dungeons would become even easier for them. IMO dungeons should still be upscaled, as at least that way high levels would still be able to enjoy some difficulty.

DurzoBlint13

a lot of people fail to realize that even though you are scaled to v16, that does not make you as powerful as a v16. Your resources and damage may be higher, but that does not account for Skill points or CP. In this game Passive abilities are a HUGE part of your build. Without the right passives, or the Skill points to acquire those passives, you will not deal as much damage or mitigate as much damage and a lot of passives will grant buffs/debuffs that play a large part in how your characters plays. CP obviously plays a big part in how your characters plays also.
And all of this is not even considering gear. With the right gear you can almost double your damage output and sustainability if you were previously running around in non-set gear
And the scaling is fine. If anyone could jump on a lowbie to be scaled to v16 to the point they do just as much damage and have as much sustain as a v16 that put time and effort into their build, this game would have died long ago. There has to be a reason to level up and progress. The scaling is there so people can play together and compete, not so you can avoid progressing your character. The content can be completed by lowbies being scaled up, but you still have to learn the mechanics and play smart. Yes there are players that can burn bosses down before some mechanics even come into play but those players are true v16 with 200+ skill points and a healthy amount of CP. THAT is the difference between being scaled and actually being v16

SolarCat02

Bidaum92 wrote: »

Story Quests - BUG Fix
My story quests levels are showing as my level (39) in my quest log - I go to do them and I'm actually fighting against level 43 mobs.

This is definitely a bug, as the quest level of the story quest should never be able to go below the level of the mobs you're fighting..

The level shown is actually the level of the item you receive as reward (gold rewards are also scaled to level).
Each quest has a recommended range (shown by the color coding).
If you are within the range, the quest is yellow and the item will be your level.
If you are above the range, the quest will be green (or white if you are way above) and the maximum level of the quest, which will be below your character level, is the level of your reward.
If you are below the range, the quest will be red, and any item reward will be the minimum level of the recommended range, which will be above your character level. I believe any gold reward will still be scaled to your current level, though.

Lenikus

Scaling is fine. period.

The problem happens when you're using gear that is not your level and tries to use the scaling mechanics.
If your items are 2, maybe 3 levels under you, you might not feel it that much when you're lv 40;
But at Vr16, heck, from purple to gold there is a 200 weapon damage difference on weapons of same level.

KaleidoscopeEyz

So why is a level 39 able to join a instance scaled to VR16 then if they'll be inferior? Again the scaling is backwards.

Nah, the scaling is fine. It's your expectations that are backwards.

idk

First, your early example explaining a difference between quest level and npc level is very vague. So vague one cannot understand what is being discussed.

Second, scaling is never perfect and we shouldn't expect it to be. A player scaled up will always be weaker than someone who is actually that level and it should be this way. Same as a player scaled down should be stronger. Otherwise a lvl 39 will out dps a v16 which would be just wrong.

Additionally, scaling further punishes the player in lower level gear than their actual level. A lvl 39 player in lvl 34 gear will have lower stats than a player of the same level in lvl 39 gear. Again, it should be this way for obvious reasons.

Finally, if one does every single thing, especially random daily GF they will outlet do the zone. It's life in most any MMO. Skip some quests or deal with it. No biggie either way.

ADarklore

I honestly don't mind being overleveled, I enjoy it actually. With every alt I create, I now grind mobs through quest zones to reach level 50, then go back and do the quests. I love feeling like I'm a super hero, destroying enemies- instead of worrying about whether I'm going to survive a fight or not. I could care less about whether I'm getting XP or not during fights because, hey, guess what, I've already received the XP (while grinding) that I would have received had I done the quests in order. Yet, I still receive XP for completing quests... so the ONLY thing you miss out on for being over-leveled is the XP gain from killing enemies. I'm one who doesn't enjoy challenges, I don't like struggling, I like one-shotting enemies. That is one thing I've hated about other MMOs, when they abruptly decide that they're going to scale content based on gear... so you never actually ever feel like you're powerful, you're always struggling... it sucks IMO. I don't spend all this time in a game just to feel like I never actually get stronger... this is why the ONLY way I'd ever agree to any type of scaling of older content is if it was optional.