Mag nb too much dmg

Xsorus

Zheg wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

MisterBastahrd wrote: »

The best part is when Sypher was whining about zergs. He ALWAYS whines about zergs. This was while he was doing an emp push with a magicka nightblade and running vicious death while siphoning and proxying everything. Sorry, but when you play a completely broken build on a server actually trying to run a campaign, and you RELY on those zergs to get you emp, you don't get sympathy.

I wouldn't give a rats ass about zergs if the game/servers could handle it. I was more pissed about the lag.

Ironically enough, almost all of the changes trumpeted by people complaining about zergs just added MORE incentives this patch to bring more numbers and drop the lag. Go figure, it's not like people predicted it or anything

Don't even try to put it like that Zheg.

What the people asked for (Removal of AOE caps / Dynamic Ultimate system) is NOT what Zenimax delivered.

I'm happy there is something to potentially bust up a group of stacked players, but Viscous Death was NOT the answer.

Well, I wasn't specifically talking about you, but the yahoos on the forums in general. So many were stoked when VD, prox det increase, siege changes were announced - and when I and others pointed out the flaws and how these are things that will end up promoting more numbers at fights, we were waved aside because we're just zerglings and don't know what we're talking about. Most of us want aoe caps gone, I just always add in the caveat that damage numbers need to drop across the board at the same time.

Even though almost everyone seems to agree that introductions like VD were a terrible idea and a poor replacement for proper fixes, the difference is that some (yourself included, as per your most recent post) followed up that up with a "well, at least we have something, and it's better than nothing". No. It's not better than nothing, because tacit approval indicates to ww2 that band-aid fixes are OK and will fly. I really do wonder sometimes what would have happened if the entire community flat out said no to band-aid fixes like VD from the get-go.

None of those things are actually causing more numbers at the fight though....You pretty much pull that directly from your ass.

What was added to the patch that is causing large numbers to end up around Objectives? Oh that's right...The same thing that was causing it before when it was in the game...Supply Camps.

If people had to release and run back instead of supply camps..you wouldn't have these huge long engagements....In fact you can see this perfectly by looking at the IC on Haderus in a certain section of the city that has usually a constant battle going on that's never ending because the spawn points are right next to one another....Camps basically make Keep Fights into that....If your zerg instant died from say Proxy/VD/Siege or whatever..and camps didn't exist...You'd have to run back...

If you're going to try and look tough, you should at least know that they're called forward camps. Forward camps are certainly a component to the increase in numbers, but hardly the only one. It's naive to think otherwise, but I've learned my lesson in trying to use logic and facts with you.

So you're saying that methods that instant kill large stacks of people are what's causing people to fight around keeps in extreme numbers even though these methods directly kill large groups doing exactly that... And that the portable Rez spot isn't the sole cause of this issue? Even though it was the bloody cause in not only this game but did the same thing in DAOC also when it had something similar....

In other words..... One method directly sends people away from the keeps to Rez... And the other allows them to Rez directly next to said keep.. And you think it's not the main issue?

Gonza

stahp

Zheg

Xsorus wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

MisterBastahrd wrote: »

The best part is when Sypher was whining about zergs. He ALWAYS whines about zergs. This was while he was doing an emp push with a magicka nightblade and running vicious death while siphoning and proxying everything. Sorry, but when you play a completely broken build on a server actually trying to run a campaign, and you RELY on those zergs to get you emp, you don't get sympathy.

I wouldn't give a rats ass about zergs if the game/servers could handle it. I was more pissed about the lag.

Ironically enough, almost all of the changes trumpeted by people complaining about zergs just added MORE incentives this patch to bring more numbers and drop the lag. Go figure, it's not like people predicted it or anything

Don't even try to put it like that Zheg.

What the people asked for (Removal of AOE caps / Dynamic Ultimate system) is NOT what Zenimax delivered.

I'm happy there is something to potentially bust up a group of stacked players, but Viscous Death was NOT the answer.

Well, I wasn't specifically talking about you, but the yahoos on the forums in general. So many were stoked when VD, prox det increase, siege changes were announced - and when I and others pointed out the flaws and how these are things that will end up promoting more numbers at fights, we were waved aside because we're just zerglings and don't know what we're talking about. Most of us want aoe caps gone, I just always add in the caveat that damage numbers need to drop across the board at the same time.

Even though almost everyone seems to agree that introductions like VD were a terrible idea and a poor replacement for proper fixes, the difference is that some (yourself included, as per your most recent post) followed up that up with a "well, at least we have something, and it's better than nothing". No. It's not better than nothing, because tacit approval indicates to ww2 that band-aid fixes are OK and will fly. I really do wonder sometimes what would have happened if the entire community flat out said no to band-aid fixes like VD from the get-go.

None of those things are actually causing more numbers at the fight though....You pretty much pull that directly from your ass.

What was added to the patch that is causing large numbers to end up around Objectives? Oh that's right...The same thing that was causing it before when it was in the game...Supply Camps.

If people had to release and run back instead of supply camps..you wouldn't have these huge long engagements....In fact you can see this perfectly by looking at the IC on Haderus in a certain section of the city that has usually a constant battle going on that's never ending because the spawn points are right next to one another....Camps basically make Keep Fights into that....If your zerg instant died from say Proxy/VD/Siege or whatever..and camps didn't exist...You'd have to run back...

If you're going to try and look tough, you should at least know that they're called forward camps. Forward camps are certainly a component to the increase in numbers, but hardly the only one. It's naive to think otherwise, but I've learned my lesson in trying to use logic and facts with you.

So you're saying that methods that instant kill large stacks of people are what's causing people to fight around keeps in extreme numbers even though these methods directly kill large groups doing exactly that... And that the portable Rez spot isn't the sole cause of this issue? Even though it was the bloody cause in not only this game but did the same thing in DAOC also when it had something similar....

In other words..... One method directly sends people away from the keeps to Rez... And the other allows them to Rez directly next to said keep.. And you think it's not the main issue?

A lot of people play casually. Whether you want to admit it or not, most of the time the pvp guilds are composed of good players and last patch were able to push a defended keep elsewhere on their own. Sure, sometimes groups stacked, but groups were capable of and did in fact push the frontline outside of the one main single fight on the map.

This patch though? When even a 20 man experienced group has an immensely hard time assaulting a defended keep? You think the casuals are going to try pushing that? No, they will stack up at one keep fight and it will turn into alliance v alliance, exactly what we have right now. Most of these changes that were done in an anti group effort still screw over solo and small groups (to varying extents), and most of these changes made defending far easier than assaulting. Forward camps are a component, but hardly the only component to the increased lag.

Furthermore, people tend to be more afraid when fighting. I can't even count the number of times that people sit back and drop a 10+ siege line because they don't actually want to come in and fight any more. I'm sure that does wonders for the lag, particularly when the other side does it as well and you have to siege lines just pelting each other back and forth and not really accomplishing anything.

OtarTheMad

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

leepalmer95

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

ThatNeonZebraAgain

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Tsar_Bogatyr

Please keep your VD and zerg whine out of this thread, this topic is to discuss how ridiculous the NB kit is when it comes to % scaling with dmg. Thx

leepalmer95

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

GRxKnight

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

Proxy soul tether combo only works because of proxy scale into a larger group...i think what's deadlier but harder to pull off is a inevitable det + meteor...throw two inevitable down and drop meteor and watch the explosion...if you're a sorc you can guarantee a full hit by streaking through the group...and you're not crippled by caltrops pulling you out of stealth...so there.

Back on topic nightblades, magicka or stamina, are perfectly fine where they are...it may seem they're leagues ahead of DK's and Templars when in fact those classes just have lack luster class abilities (except for RD). Both nb and sorc are fine...I'm sure 95%, if not more, of the pvpers would support a buff of templars (again after looking more into RD) and DK's before they nerf sorcs and nightblades...nerfing is never the solution you should first try

Lava_Croft

Tsar_Bogatyr wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

Tsar_Bogatyr wrote: »

So i've been playing mag nb for a while and the dmg i dish out is insanly high, 15k soulharvest and 12k concealed crits with people that are soulharvested, this on people with 5 impen, is there a possibility to gimp some of nb dmg scaling?

You don't hit anything close to that on actual players. If you do. I wanna see your video. I have over 4k spell dmg with 40k mag and concealed weapon hits like a wet noodle. I call lies

4250 fully buffed spell power and 36k magicka and an empowered concealed can do 10k...i average 5-6k dps with concealed w/o empower....so you must have low cp

No mate. I have 650. I also have one of every class in the game and I've played them all quite a fair bit. I don't believe for one minute you're hitting what you originally said you were. Get a screen shot to prove me wrong.

againts sorc with impen, a good note is that im not using spell dmg bonus for this nor do i have the resource buff so im missing 40% possible extra spell dmg

http://i.imgur.com/eIssF8M.png

It's a recap with some damage numbers. Your word that the target hit by these numbers was wearing so and so gear is not what constitutes proof.

Just sayin'

Tsar_Bogatyr

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Tsar_Bogatyr wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

lynog85 wrote: »

Tsar_Bogatyr wrote: »

So i've been playing mag nb for a while and the dmg i dish out is insanly high, 15k soulharvest and 12k concealed crits with people that are soulharvested, this on people with 5 impen, is there a possibility to gimp some of nb dmg scaling?

You don't hit anything close to that on actual players. If you do. I wanna see your video. I have over 4k spell dmg with 40k mag and concealed weapon hits like a wet noodle. I call lies

4250 fully buffed spell power and 36k magicka and an empowered concealed can do 10k...i average 5-6k dps with concealed w/o empower....so you must have low cp

No mate. I have 650. I also have one of every class in the game and I've played them all quite a fair bit. I don't believe for one minute you're hitting what you originally said you were. Get a screen shot to prove me wrong.

againts sorc with impen, a good note is that im not using spell dmg bonus for this nor do i have the resource buff so im missing 40% possible extra spell dmg

http://i.imgur.com/eIssF8M.png

It's a recap with some damage numbers. Your word that the target hit by these numbers was wearing so and so gear is not what constitutes proof.

Just sayin'

i was asked to post some screenies i did, how you take it from there is not really my concern since it doesn't change the fact how good the dmg can get from all the passives + skills and shadow stone

Prabooo

Tsar_Bogatyr wrote: »

(...) this topic is to discuss how ridiculous the NB kit is when it comes to % scaling with dmg. Thx

Have you seen how much spell damage a sorc can stack and deliver? QQ

hammayolettuce

Balance isn't something that will ever be completed for all 4 classes. Get over it.

Lava_Croft

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Balance isn't something that will ever be completed for all 4 classes. Get over it.

Sometimes it feels like some people want every class to be the same.

frozywozy

Zheg wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

MisterBastahrd wrote: »

The best part is when Sypher was whining about zergs. He ALWAYS whines about zergs. This was while he was doing an emp push with a magicka nightblade and running vicious death while siphoning and proxying everything. Sorry, but when you play a completely broken build on a server actually trying to run a campaign, and you RELY on those zergs to get you emp, you don't get sympathy.

I wouldn't give a rats ass about zergs if the game/servers could handle it. I was more pissed about the lag.

Ironically enough, almost all of the changes trumpeted by people complaining about zergs just added MORE incentives this patch to bring more numbers and drop the lag. Go figure, it's not like people predicted it or anything

Don't even try to put it like that Zheg.

What the people asked for (Removal of AOE caps / Dynamic Ultimate system) is NOT what Zenimax delivered.

I'm happy there is something to potentially bust up a group of stacked players, but Viscous Death was NOT the answer.

Well, I wasn't specifically talking about you, but the yahoos on the forums in general. So many were stoked when VD, prox det increase, siege changes were announced - and when I and others pointed out the flaws and how these are things that will end up promoting more numbers at fights, we were waved aside because we're just zerglings and don't know what we're talking about. Most of us want aoe caps gone, I just always add in the caveat that damage numbers need to drop across the board at the same time.

Even though almost everyone seems to agree that introductions like VD were a terrible idea and a poor replacement for proper fixes, the difference is that some (yourself included, as per your most recent post) followed up that up with a "well, at least we have something, and it's better than nothing". No. It's not better than nothing, because tacit approval indicates to ww2 that band-aid fixes are OK and will fly. I really do wonder sometimes what would have happened if the entire community flat out said no to band-aid fixes like VD from the get-go.

None of those things are actually causing more numbers at the fight though....You pretty much pull that directly from your ass.

What was added to the patch that is causing large numbers to end up around Objectives? Oh that's right...The same thing that was causing it before when it was in the game...Supply Camps.

If people had to release and run back instead of supply camps..you wouldn't have these huge long engagements....In fact you can see this perfectly by looking at the IC on Haderus in a certain section of the city that has usually a constant battle going on that's never ending because the spawn points are right next to one another....Camps basically make Keep Fights into that....If your zerg instant died from say Proxy/VD/Siege or whatever..and camps didn't exist...You'd have to run back...

If you're going to try and look tough, you should at least know that they're called forward camps. Forward camps are certainly a component to the increase in numbers, but hardly the only one. It's naive to think otherwise, but I've learned my lesson in trying to use logic and facts with you.

So you're saying that methods that instant kill large stacks of people are what's causing people to fight around keeps in extreme numbers even though these methods directly kill large groups doing exactly that... And that the portable Rez spot isn't the sole cause of this issue? Even though it was the bloody cause in not only this game but did the same thing in DAOC also when it had something similar....

In other words..... One method directly sends people away from the keeps to Rez... And the other allows them to Rez directly next to said keep.. And you think it's not the main issue?

A lot of people play casually. Whether you want to admit it or not, most of the time the pvp guilds are composed of good players and last patch were able to push a defended keep elsewhere on their own. Sure, sometimes groups stacked, but groups were capable of and did in fact push the frontline outside of the one main single fight on the map.

This patch though? When even a 20 man experienced group has an immensely hard time assaulting a defended keep? You think the casuals are going to try pushing that? No, they will stack up at one keep fight and it will turn into alliance v alliance, exactly what we have right now. Most of these changes that were done in an anti group effort still screw over solo and small groups (to varying extents), and most of these changes made defending far easier than assaulting. Forward camps are a component, but hardly the only component to the increased lag.

Furthermore, people tend to be more afraid when fighting. I can't even count the number of times that people sit back and drop a 10+ siege line because they don't actually want to come in and fight any more. I'm sure that does wonders for the lag, particularly when the other side does it as well and you have to siege lines just pelting each other back and forth and not really accomplishing anything.

*cough Radiant destruction cough*

hammayolettuce

Lava_Croft wrote: »

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Balance isn't something that will ever be completed for all 4 classes. Get over it.

Sometimes it feels like some people want every class to be the same.

Exactly. Each class cant have the same "skills" or same functions. They follow the basic 4 categories for the classes; Rouge, Tank, Healer, Mage ... granted under certain scenarios each class has at least 1 thing considered OP, but there isn't much ZOS can do about all of this. You cant balance for both Stam and Mag and then account for someone playing into one of those 4 categories with the classes.

Lord-Otto

GRxKnight wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

Proxy soul tether combo only works because of proxy scale into a larger group...i think what's deadlier but harder to pull off is a inevitable det + meteor...throw two inevitable down and drop meteor and watch the explosion...if you're a sorc you can guarantee a full hit by streaking through the group...and you're not crippled by caltrops pulling you out of stealth...so there.

Back on topic nightblades, magicka or stamina, are perfectly fine where they are...it may seem they're leagues ahead of DK's and Templars when in fact those classes just have lack luster class abilities (except for RD). Both nb and sorc are fine...I'm sure 95%, if not more, of the pvpers would support a buff of templars (again after looking more into RD) and DK's before they nerf sorcs and nightblades...nerfing is never the solution you should first try

Inevitable is potentially more powerful in open fights, but this is not what people are moaning about.
As soon as someone has the red circle around him/her, the group knows what's up and splits, negating the whole point of the bomb. Worse, Inevitable is easily interrupted afterwards.
A NB with Proxy hits guaranteed, without giving you time to react. And not only that, with the strongest magicka gapcloser in the game, which also deals AoE. Much better than Streak for bombing. And a class AoE (Sap) that allows for use with DW. Impulse is nowhere close. Tether is so much better than Bats, and you don't get the negatives of being a vampire. And lastly, NBs can get out quite often, or just continue close-range fighting, which is their strong suit. Sorcs get gapclosed to death, especially by NBs, and if they continue fighting, they are in close-range, which is something sorcs don't really excel at.
Overall, it's pretty obvious how this meta prefers magicka NBs, just how the former meta preferred stamina NBs and Steel Tornado. Sorcs are by no means a bad class, DKs and Temps might be struggling more, but when ZOS implement a zerg "fix" and make it so it works best with one particular class, this is just bad and leads to everyone switching to FotM... AGAIN!
I have seen a cometically rising amount of magblades after Sypher uploaded his zergbomb vid. And also, he is maining magblade now, not stamblade or sorc. Richard and Feng and Lucy on the other hand seem to be quite unhappy with the current state. So judge for yourself.

GRxKnight

Lord-Otto wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

Proxy soul tether combo only works because of proxy scale into a larger group...i think what's deadlier but harder to pull off is a inevitable det + meteor...throw two inevitable down and drop meteor and watch the explosion...if you're a sorc you can guarantee a full hit by streaking through the group...and you're not crippled by caltrops pulling you out of stealth...so there.

Back on topic nightblades, magicka or stamina, are perfectly fine where they are...it may seem they're leagues ahead of DK's and Templars when in fact those classes just have lack luster class abilities (except for RD). Both nb and sorc are fine...I'm sure 95%, if not more, of the pvpers would support a buff of templars (again after looking more into RD) and DK's before they nerf sorcs and nightblades...nerfing is never the solution you should first try

Inevitable is potentially more powerful in open fights, but this is not what people are moaning about.
As soon as someone has the red circle around him/her, the group knows what's up and splits, negating the whole point of the bomb. Worse, Inevitable is easily interrupted afterwards.
A NB with Proxy hits guaranteed, without giving you time to react. And not only that, with the strongest magicka gapcloser in the game, which also deals AoE. Much better than Streak for bombing. And a class AoE (Sap) that allows for use with DW. Impulse is nowhere close. Tether is so much better than Bats, and you don't get the negatives of being a vampire. And lastly, NBs can get out quite often, or just continue close-range fighting, which is their strong suit. Sorcs get gapclosed to death, especially by NBs, and if they continue fighting, they are in close-range, which is something sorcs don't really excel at.
Overall, it's pretty obvious how this meta prefers magicka NBs, just how the former meta preferred stamina NBs and Steel Tornado. Sorcs are by no means a bad class, DKs and Temps might be struggling more, but when ZOS implement a zerg "fix" and make it so it works best with one particular class, this is just bad and leads to everyone switching to FotM... AGAIN!
I have seen a cometically rising amount of magblades after Sypher uploaded his zergbomb vid. And also, he is maining magblade now, not stamblade or sorc. Richard and Feng and Lucy on the other hand seem to be quite unhappy with the current state. So judge for yourself.

You don't have to explain to me how the class works...I've been playing it since beta...and as for Sypher's video it's not like he was the first to use that setup...everyone had access to the pts and those that actually tested (myself being one) found the combo stupid and op in the first place...we figured it would have been nerfed or not implemented but it went live and we all shrugged, moaned, and all decided to just go around one shooting groups because that's what zenimax apparently wants...sypher may have been the first to post footage using the bomb, but in no way did he pioneer this

Lord-Otto

GRxKnight wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

Proxy soul tether combo only works because of proxy scale into a larger group...i think what's deadlier but harder to pull off is a inevitable det + meteor...throw two inevitable down and drop meteor and watch the explosion...if you're a sorc you can guarantee a full hit by streaking through the group...and you're not crippled by caltrops pulling you out of stealth...so there.

Back on topic nightblades, magicka or stamina, are perfectly fine where they are...it may seem they're leagues ahead of DK's and Templars when in fact those classes just have lack luster class abilities (except for RD). Both nb and sorc are fine...I'm sure 95%, if not more, of the pvpers would support a buff of templars (again after looking more into RD) and DK's before they nerf sorcs and nightblades...nerfing is never the solution you should first try

Inevitable is potentially more powerful in open fights, but this is not what people are moaning about.
As soon as someone has the red circle around him/her, the group knows what's up and splits, negating the whole point of the bomb. Worse, Inevitable is easily interrupted afterwards.
A NB with Proxy hits guaranteed, without giving you time to react. And not only that, with the strongest magicka gapcloser in the game, which also deals AoE. Much better than Streak for bombing. And a class AoE (Sap) that allows for use with DW. Impulse is nowhere close. Tether is so much better than Bats, and you don't get the negatives of being a vampire. And lastly, NBs can get out quite often, or just continue close-range fighting, which is their strong suit. Sorcs get gapclosed to death, especially by NBs, and if they continue fighting, they are in close-range, which is something sorcs don't really excel at.
Overall, it's pretty obvious how this meta prefers magicka NBs, just how the former meta preferred stamina NBs and Steel Tornado. Sorcs are by no means a bad class, DKs and Temps might be struggling more, but when ZOS implement a zerg "fix" and make it so it works best with one particular class, this is just bad and leads to everyone switching to FotM... AGAIN!
I have seen a cometically rising amount of magblades after Sypher uploaded his zergbomb vid. And also, he is maining magblade now, not stamblade or sorc. Richard and Feng and Lucy on the other hand seem to be quite unhappy with the current state. So judge for yourself.

You don't have to explain to me how the class works...I've been playing it since beta...and as for Sypher's video it's not like he was the first to use that setup...everyone had access to the pts and those that actually tested (myself being one) found the combo stupid and op in the first place...we figured it would have been nerfed or not implemented but it went live and we all shrugged, moaned, and all decided to just go around one shooting groups because that's what zenimax apparently wants...sypher may have been the first to post footage using the bomb, but in no way did he pioneer this

I am underlining how this Proxy Death meta leans much more towards magblades. I am aware that Sypher (and others) expected a nerf to VD after the PTS, but it never came. He did not engineer, I was using a Bat-Proxy-Talons combo before IC came. It's his popularity that catalyzed this evolvement, which was inevitable anyway.
What I'm heavily criticizing is how the #1 counter to the biggest thing in ESO's PvP works absolutely best with one single class. Sorcs are okay but could do better, but Templars and DKs also have to deal with zergs, and they just can't. A nerf to NB damage isn't the right solution, but by all means, something has to be done.

GRxKnight

Lord-Otto wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

Proxy soul tether combo only works because of proxy scale into a larger group...i think what's deadlier but harder to pull off is a inevitable det + meteor...throw two inevitable down and drop meteor and watch the explosion...if you're a sorc you can guarantee a full hit by streaking through the group...and you're not crippled by caltrops pulling you out of stealth...so there.

Back on topic nightblades, magicka or stamina, are perfectly fine where they are...it may seem they're leagues ahead of DK's and Templars when in fact those classes just have lack luster class abilities (except for RD). Both nb and sorc are fine...I'm sure 95%, if not more, of the pvpers would support a buff of templars (again after looking more into RD) and DK's before they nerf sorcs and nightblades...nerfing is never the solution you should first try

Inevitable is potentially more powerful in open fights, but this is not what people are moaning about.
As soon as someone has the red circle around him/her, the group knows what's up and splits, negating the whole point of the bomb. Worse, Inevitable is easily interrupted afterwards.
A NB with Proxy hits guaranteed, without giving you time to react. And not only that, with the strongest magicka gapcloser in the game, which also deals AoE. Much better than Streak for bombing. And a class AoE (Sap) that allows for use with DW. Impulse is nowhere close. Tether is so much better than Bats, and you don't get the negatives of being a vampire. And lastly, NBs can get out quite often, or just continue close-range fighting, which is their strong suit. Sorcs get gapclosed to death, especially by NBs, and if they continue fighting, they are in close-range, which is something sorcs don't really excel at.
Overall, it's pretty obvious how this meta prefers magicka NBs, just how the former meta preferred stamina NBs and Steel Tornado. Sorcs are by no means a bad class, DKs and Temps might be struggling more, but when ZOS implement a zerg "fix" and make it so it works best with one particular class, this is just bad and leads to everyone switching to FotM... AGAIN!
I have seen a cometically rising amount of magblades after Sypher uploaded his zergbomb vid. And also, he is maining magblade now, not stamblade or sorc. Richard and Feng and Lucy on the other hand seem to be quite unhappy with the current state. So judge for yourself.

You don't have to explain to me how the class works...I've been playing it since beta...and as for Sypher's video it's not like he was the first to use that setup...everyone had access to the pts and those that actually tested (myself being one) found the combo stupid and op in the first place...we figured it would have been nerfed or not implemented but it went live and we all shrugged, moaned, and all decided to just go around one shooting groups because that's what zenimax apparently wants...sypher may have been the first to post footage using the bomb, but in no way did he pioneer this

I am underlining how this Proxy Death meta leans much more towards magblades. I am aware that Sypher (and others) expected a nerf to VD after the PTS, but it never came. He did not engineer, I was using a Bat-Proxy-Talons combo before IC came. It's his popularity that catalyzed this evolvement, which was inevitable anyway.
What I'm heavily criticizing is how the #1 counter to the biggest thing in ESO's PvP works absolutely best with one single class. Sorcs are okay but could do better, but Templars and DKs also have to deal with zergs, and they just can't. A nerf to NB damage isn't the right solution, but by all means, something has to be done.

Remove the set, bring back dynamic ultimate, and get rid of the damage mitigation in the aoe caps...enable this in pvp only...all pvpers are happy...name me one person who likes aoe caps that's not a zenimax employee

Lord-Otto

GRxKnight wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I'll say it in this thread just like I did another thread... you can't pretend that just Nightblades can do this type of damage with some combo and VD. All classes can do this, it doesn't make it right but I think putting Nightblades into this conversation is just going to get them nerfed when it's not just them who can do this.

Fairly simple, take a hard hitting AoE ult (Meteor, Soul Tether, Leap), Proxy, an AoE (Sap, Draw Essence, Impulse) and in some cases a AoE stun/root (Streak, Spear Shards, Talons) and bam... you can blow up some zerg balls too. Add in all purple gear that's V16, Vicious Death set, and a Glass Cannon type build and look at that... you're diving into groups and destroying multiple targets.

But other classes can't cloak into a group like nb's can... xD

Invisibility+speed potion. Could even use Clever Alchemist to help with pre-buffing via potions.

Then you'd give up the 100% crit from cloak, the ability to escape after you kill people, the 20% dmg buff from the pot.

Tether+proxy on a nb is by far the best zerg killing combination it's like the skills/set where made for a nb.

Meteor is ok, but takes time to actually land and half decent group will notice it, leap doesn't as big of an aoe as tether, doesn't heal you either. Nova... xD , Standard?, There no other ult that has the same burst as proxy with a stun.

No other class can easily or as successfully 'blow up zerg's than a nb.

Proxy soul tether combo only works because of proxy scale into a larger group...i think what's deadlier but harder to pull off is a inevitable det + meteor...throw two inevitable down and drop meteor and watch the explosion...if you're a sorc you can guarantee a full hit by streaking through the group...and you're not crippled by caltrops pulling you out of stealth...so there.

Back on topic nightblades, magicka or stamina, are perfectly fine where they are...it may seem they're leagues ahead of DK's and Templars when in fact those classes just have lack luster class abilities (except for RD). Both nb and sorc are fine...I'm sure 95%, if not more, of the pvpers would support a buff of templars (again after looking more into RD) and DK's before they nerf sorcs and nightblades...nerfing is never the solution you should first try

Inevitable is potentially more powerful in open fights, but this is not what people are moaning about.
As soon as someone has the red circle around him/her, the group knows what's up and splits, negating the whole point of the bomb. Worse, Inevitable is easily interrupted afterwards.
A NB with Proxy hits guaranteed, without giving you time to react. And not only that, with the strongest magicka gapcloser in the game, which also deals AoE. Much better than Streak for bombing. And a class AoE (Sap) that allows for use with DW. Impulse is nowhere close. Tether is so much better than Bats, and you don't get the negatives of being a vampire. And lastly, NBs can get out quite often, or just continue close-range fighting, which is their strong suit. Sorcs get gapclosed to death, especially by NBs, and if they continue fighting, they are in close-range, which is something sorcs don't really excel at.
Overall, it's pretty obvious how this meta prefers magicka NBs, just how the former meta preferred stamina NBs and Steel Tornado. Sorcs are by no means a bad class, DKs and Temps might be struggling more, but when ZOS implement a zerg "fix" and make it so it works best with one particular class, this is just bad and leads to everyone switching to FotM... AGAIN!
I have seen a cometically rising amount of magblades after Sypher uploaded his zergbomb vid. And also, he is maining magblade now, not stamblade or sorc. Richard and Feng and Lucy on the other hand seem to be quite unhappy with the current state. So judge for yourself.

You don't have to explain to me how the class works...I've been playing it since beta...and as for Sypher's video it's not like he was the first to use that setup...everyone had access to the pts and those that actually tested (myself being one) found the combo stupid and op in the first place...we figured it would have been nerfed or not implemented but it went live and we all shrugged, moaned, and all decided to just go around one shooting groups because that's what zenimax apparently wants...sypher may have been the first to post footage using the bomb, but in no way did he pioneer this

I am underlining how this Proxy Death meta leans much more towards magblades. I am aware that Sypher (and others) expected a nerf to VD after the PTS, but it never came. He did not engineer, I was using a Bat-Proxy-Talons combo before IC came. It's his popularity that catalyzed this evolvement, which was inevitable anyway.
What I'm heavily criticizing is how the #1 counter to the biggest thing in ESO's PvP works absolutely best with one single class. Sorcs are okay but could do better, but Templars and DKs also have to deal with zergs, and they just can't. A nerf to NB damage isn't the right solution, but by all means, something has to be done.

Remove the set, bring back dynamic ultimate, and get rid of the damage mitigation in the aoe caps...enable this in pvp only...all pvpers are happy...name me one person who likes aoe caps that's not a zenimax employee

That is a good solution. You know, I have stumbled across an interview with one of the first emps a few days ago. He was talking about powerleveling and AoE caps. He came to the game because it was sold to him as having DAoC-like PvP, WITHOUT AoE caps. Surprised he was to see AoE caps in place, and claimed they needed to be removed or the PvP would turn into a zergfest, having seen similar before.
That was two years ago. AoE caps are still there, PvP is a zergfest. Everyone but ZOS acknowledges.
I don't know what to say...
=(

Satiar

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

GRxKnight

Satiar wrote: »

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

Roll because you want hard mode?

Zheg

GRxKnight wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

Roll because you want hard mode?

Roll because it's the easiest way to show bulb what a baddie he's been on his DK all this time.

GRxKnight

Zheg wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

Roll because you want hard mode?

Roll because it's the easiest way to show bulb what a baddie he's been on his DK all this time.

Lol...

On a random note i miss fighting you guys...that and wiping a group all by myself...those are the two things i miss right now about eso

Ghost-Shot

Zheg wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

Roll because you want hard mode?

Roll because it's the easiest way to show bulb what a baddie he's been on his DK all this time.

The OK DK

Satiar

GRxKnight wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

Roll because you want hard mode?

As the new best DK in VE will someone pls tell me how to set up my bars?

Is talons worth the skill point????

Ghost-Shot

Satiar wrote: »

GRxKnight wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

NB is so stupid right now, I say this as a longtime nightblade.

I can't help but laugh when I'm leading a 24-man prox train of death but I've already dropped 8 people ahead of the group simply because of Prox/Tether combo. It's so stupid.

I think I'm going to roll a DK.

Roll because you want hard mode?

As the new best DK in VE will someone pls tell me how to set up my bars?

Is talons worth the skill point????

Steve...I literally can't even

Make sure you get stone fist, its easily one of your best abilites. Also you want to morph obsidian shield to fragmented shield, that *** is OP.

Durham

Honestly the amount of damage a single player takes in AOE is crazy atm ... Scaling of damage is the issue here...

MichYodias

At one time frag shield was one of the most op skills in the game. Those were the days. I miss my DK.