Rapid Maneuver Change - Good or Bad?

anitajoneb17_ESO

Good Change

JDar wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Excellent change. Less zergs, less moving around for nothing, and most of all, not having to suffer all those unwanted speed buffs any more.

Why would you not want a speed buff.

Because I AM the one who controls my character, not someone else. If I want a speed buff I do it myself. And no, I don't want to be speedy all the time.

Do you like it when you're driving your car and your passenger would use the gas pedal instead of you, without warning ? That's how unwanted speed buffs feel like.
There have been quite a few threads about that on these forums, asking for rapid maneuver to be applied only to grouped players, but it always lead to some jerks saying how much they enjoyed disturbing other players with this ability, or forcing roleplayers to unsheathe their weapons.
Now that problem is solved and I'm very happy about it (even though that issue was probably not the main reason ZOS did it).

.

Draxys

Bad Change

This has become a ridiculous trend since 1.6 update. No one wanted these mechanics changed. No one asked for it, and they didn't even poll the community. They don't play their own game, that much is obvious. So who the hell is telling them to do this stuff? This kind of thing has happened every update it feels like.

Asmael

Draxys wrote: »

This has become a ridiculous trend since 1.6 update. No one wanted these mechanics changed. No one asked for it, and they didn't even poll the community. They don't play their own game, that much is obvious. So who the hell is telling them to do this stuff? This kind of thing has happened every update it feels like.

People complained about how unstoppable zergs are when rushing in a keep, just popping rapids, spamming purge, and getting to top floor.

So, some people asked for this to be changed and ZoS listened.

ToRelax

Good Change

Asmael wrote: »

Draxys wrote: »

This has become a ridiculous trend since 1.6 update. No one wanted these mechanics changed. No one asked for it, and they didn't even poll the community. They don't play their own game, that much is obvious. So who the hell is telling them to do this stuff? This kind of thing has happened every update it feels like.

People complained about how unstoppable zergs are when rushing in a keep, just popping rapids, spamming purge, and getting to top floor.

So, some people asked for this to be changed and ZoS listened.

Exactly. When we don't recognize it when ZOS is actually listening to the players, how can we blame them not to when they actually don't?

eliisra

Bad Change

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

ToRelax

Good Change

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

Well the one Templar I play with said it's a nice change. There are many things that need to be addressed to help Templars, but spamming heals while being immune to roots and snares and running around with a speed buff on top of that is not among them.

OPheliaMortal

Good Change

Good change. Yes, healers will have a difficult time if they can't adapt to the change but frankly a healer shouldn't be invulnerable while still spamming heals. So either keep your speed buff or die in the back because you can't/won't L2notspam. Healing a decent large group in this game is faceroll easy, perhaps this will enrich healers' experience as they'll have to incorporate this change into their playstyle.

themdogesbite

Can't tell yet

Can't quite tell yet, i know its hurting the kind of style my guild plays since we rely on manouvers alot. Will need some time to see how it is but i do think it will promote a more skillfull play in the long run.

Lava_Croft

Good Change

Protip: Blessed Thistle, Columbine and Namira's Rot.

AbraXuSeXile

Not sure yet.

I watched a 24 man train healing spring proxy group get absolutely demolished by randoms from the back.

It didnt effect my 10ish man group too much but the competition was garbage so need more time to tell.

Etaniel

Good Change

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

The magicka templar in the group is non existant, so he's not affected.
The magicka dk in the group doesn't feel a difference because he's always in the back, and has always been, and gets gapclosed all the time so it really doesn't make a difference, because mag dks could never kite anyways.

Cinbri

Good Change

Etaniel wrote: »

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

The magicka templar in the group is non existant, so he's not affected.
The magicka dk in the group doesn't feel a difference because he's always in the back, and has always been, and gets gapclosed all the time so it really doesn't make a difference, because mag dks could never kite anyways.

How dare you, Sir.

timidobserver

Can't tell yet

Zheg wrote: »

The rapids nerf needs to go. Wrobel implemented it because this is supposed to be the anti-group patch and he's trying to kill ball groups, but guess what, even with perma roots and no barriers we're still winning. I give him a one finger salute for his efforts, and request that he undo the damage this change has done for all styles of pvp.

You don't even have to pvp to realize what the meta has become. You can literally stand on top of a wall and watch people fighting and realize how slow everyone is moving.

I do not like the change, but ball groups do go down a lot easier now.

Zheg

Bad Change

Etaniel wrote: »

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

The magicka templar in the group is non existant, so he's not affected.
The magicka dk in the group doesn't feel a difference because he's always in the back, and has always been, and gets gapclosed all the time so it really doesn't make a difference, because mag dks could never kite anyways.

AAAAAAAND this is the crappy ZOS logic. Even in small groups you want someone with rapids on so you can kite and re-position yourselves. Do you know who is in the best shape for this nerf? Sorcs. Spam hardened ward nonstop and not a worry in the world. DKs and templars are royally effed over, and yes, there are indeed magicka templars, healers, and magicka dks that would like to not be the fat kid in the back when everyone else is able to keep moving.

I can't even put down my channeled focus ffs without losing my rapids on templar. Have a class purify so you don't need to use expensive purge? It's great isn't it? Except that it will be guaranteed to remove your rapids. Want to do literally any heal as a templar because you're maybe being gap closer spammed, or all of the ranged damage from bombard spam is starting to catch up to you? Well, you should have been smart and rolled sorc so you can just put on another hardened ward because #wrobelbalance.

Anti group mechanics I can handle, because we'll still win and I can tell ww2 to eff off with their poor balance decisions. Changes like this that penalize classes that will be further penalized by other poor ideas (cough cough fasalla's guile) and pick clear class winners are terrible, and the only ones I see defending this change are people that are so blindly anti-group they'll cut off their nose to spite their face, or sorcs, go figure.

ToRelax

Good Change

Zheg wrote: »

Etaniel wrote: »

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

The magicka templar in the group is non existant, so he's not affected.
The magicka dk in the group doesn't feel a difference because he's always in the back, and has always been, and gets gapclosed all the time so it really doesn't make a difference, because mag dks could never kite anyways.

AAAAAAAND this is the crappy ZOS logic. Even in small groups you want someone with rapids on so you can kite and re-position yourselves. Do you know who is in the best shape for this nerf? Sorcs. Spam hardened ward nonstop and not a worry in the world. DKs and templars are royally effed over, and yes, there are indeed magicka templars, healers, and magicka dks that would like to not be the fat kid in the back when everyone else is able to keep moving.

I can't even put down my channeled focus ffs without losing my rapids on templar. Have a class purify so you don't need to use expensive purge? It's great isn't it? Except that it will be guaranteed to remove your rapids. Want to do literally any heal as a templar because you're maybe being gap closer spammed, or all of the ranged damage from bombard spam is starting to catch up to you? Well, you should have been smart and rolled sorc so you can just put on another hardened ward because #wrobelbalance.

Anti group mechanics I can handle, because we'll still win and I can tell ww2 to eff off with their poor balance decisions. Changes like this that penalize classes that will be further penalized by other poor ideas (cough cough fasalla's guile) and pick clear class winners are terrible, and the only ones I see defending this change are people that are so blindly anti-group they'll cut off their nose to spite their face, or sorcs, go figure.

It certainly doesn't make a lot of sense which skills break maneuver and which do not, but that neither means the change is generally a bad one nor that anyone does not recognize it's not perfect yet.

ChrisXO

This magicka templar-healer uses immovable speed pots and also runs rapids. It's somewhat more challenging but really I'm not too bothered by the changes.

Joy_Division

Bad Change

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It´s awesome.

Ofc it´s affecting DK and Templar the most as they have no access to a magica based runspeed morph (that should be subject to change). Rapid with speed + soft cc immunity while healing was too powerful. This should under no circumstance be subject to change again.

If people in bigger grps don´t like it - it´s a good change. You´re not supposed to like it. It was meant to hurt.

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

Is that a joke? Try playing a small group trying to kite bombard and snare spammers while trying to heal/purge of the debuffs of the enemy zerg chasing you xD

Big groups still have the numbers on their side, small group doesnt.

Edit: wops didn't see who posted it. This affects smaller groups harder than big ones imo. In big groups I got the protection of aoe caps, more heals, more damage dealers. When I play small groups, you need to be able to kite and rebuff/heal up. With this change that's not possible unless you want to be permarooted and snared to death while all their friends come running after you.This change pushes ppl into bigger groups I think.

I'm guessing his small man group all have self-sufficient heals. Because this change otherwise equally effects small groups and zergs.

pmn100b16_ESO

Of the top of my head a alternative solution to the rapids purge might have been to remove the purging but adjust speed buff based on size of group. Big lumbering 24 mans getting a smaller % rapids speed buff than a 12 man, a 12 man smaller buff than a 6 man, and a soloer the fastest buff of all. Not sure if that would achieve what they were aiming for with this change though.

AbraXuSeXile

As usual theyve changed way too much at the same time, Instead of altering it over time.

Barrier
BoL
Purge
Rapid

All got naffed in one single patch, add onto this the siege change and many more.

The thing i dont understand is why add vicious death, bol and change proxy if theyve gone to such lenghts to stop people stacking.

Theyve essentially used a sledge hammer to kill a fly.

andy_s

Can't tell yet

Well, this change hurts everyone, not only big groups. But big groups spamming rapid, purge and heals were too annoying. Now they have to be smarter

PosternHouse

Bad Change

My primary form of mobility is now gap closer spam.

I think the nerfs for purge and barrier paired with the buffs for proxy and siege were enough. Regardless, we will find a way around this; we always do.

Etaniel

Good Change

Zheg wrote: »

Etaniel wrote: »

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

The magicka templar in the group is non existant, so he's not affected.
The magicka dk in the group doesn't feel a difference because he's always in the back, and has always been, and gets gapclosed all the time so it really doesn't make a difference, because mag dks could never kite anyways.

AAAAAAAND this is the crappy ZOS logic. Even in small groups you want someone with rapids on so you can kite and re-position yourselves. Do you know who is in the best shape for this nerf? Sorcs. Spam hardened ward nonstop and not a worry in the world. DKs and templars are royally effed over, and yes, there are indeed magicka templars, healers, and magicka dks that would like to not be the fat kid in the back when everyone else is able to keep moving.

I can't even put down my channeled focus ffs without losing my rapids on templar. Have a class purify so you don't need to use expensive purge? It's great isn't it? Except that it will be guaranteed to remove your rapids. Want to do literally any heal as a templar because you're maybe being gap closer spammed, or all of the ranged damage from bombard spam is starting to catch up to you? Well, you should have been smart and rolled sorc so you can just put on another hardened ward because #wrobelbalance.

Anti group mechanics I can handle, because we'll still win and I can tell ww2 to eff off with their poor balance decisions. Changes like this that penalize classes that will be further penalized by other poor ideas (cough cough fasalla's guile) and pick clear class winners are terrible, and the only ones I see defending this change are people that are so blindly anti-group they'll cut off their nose to spite their face, or sorcs, go figure.

I don't think you understand.. i enjoy being the fat kid, i just wish the fat kid had some way to stand his ground though. Mag dks were never meant to kite, not everyone should be able to kite. Overall this patch has done wonders for our small group, immo it mainly hurts ball groups.

@Master_Kas if you are spamming bombard you've already got your major expedition buff covered with the roll dodge, what exactly are you complaining about?

Master_Kas

Bad Change

Joy_Division wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It´s awesome.

Ofc it´s affecting DK and Templar the most as they have no access to a magica based runspeed morph (that should be subject to change). Rapid with speed + soft cc immunity while healing was too powerful. This should under no circumstance be subject to change again.

If people in bigger grps don´t like it - it´s a good change. You´re not supposed to like it. It was meant to hurt.

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

Is that a joke? Try playing a small group trying to kite bombard and snare spammers while trying to heal/purge of the debuffs of the enemy zerg chasing you xD

Big groups still have the numbers on their side, small group doesnt.

Edit: wops didn't see who posted it. This affects smaller groups harder than big ones imo. In big groups I got the protection of aoe caps, more heals, more damage dealers. When I play small groups, you need to be able to kite and rebuff/heal up. With this change that's not possible unless you want to be permarooted and snared to death while all their friends come running after you.This change pushes ppl into bigger groups I think.

I'm guessing his small man group all have self-sufficient heals. Because this change otherwise equally effects small groups and zergs.

Not really equally. Zergs can afford to lose more numbers than small/medium groups can.

I'm playing on my sorc mostly anyway so I can pop immovable pot + streak and hardened through breaches and chokepoints. And I run duo / smallgroups latley only so I'm not biased. Can't tell how many times we tried to recover while a angry zerg hunts us down and snares/roots us while we cant heal or purge to even have a chance to kite decently. But this is my opinion you don't have to agree.

Master_Kas

Bad Change

Etaniel wrote: »

Zheg wrote: »

Etaniel wrote: »

eliisra wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

So how does the magicka templar in your 3-6 man group keep up with the rest than? Does he or she enjoy it as much as you do? Spam rapid x1000O times for him or? Maybe leave the poor thing behind to die to zerg every time, while you sorcs kite away with blink and 30% movement?

Or you're not even grouping with templars like most smaller groups, so this doesn't even affect you?

I hate it, even tho I haven't logged in. I dont have to tests it to know that loosing speed buff/snare immunity if I try to heal myself will suck. It's not fun gameplay always being slow and wading through the quicksand of immobilizes and snares.

It's just to unfair, infuriating really lol. You dont loose rapid when keeping yourself alive popping Rally, for example. You dont loose Rapid when spamming Hardened Ward to infinity. But if your only defences are smart heals by Wrobel fail design, than you loose it. If they want consistency so badly, make all skills remove Rapid than or give all classes their own speed buff.

Why does it always have to be templars that gets crapped on because "nerf zerg" or lag. Why cant ZoS come up with other solutions?

The magicka templar in the group is non existant, so he's not affected.
The magicka dk in the group doesn't feel a difference because he's always in the back, and has always been, and gets gapclosed all the time so it really doesn't make a difference, because mag dks could never kite anyways.

AAAAAAAND this is the crappy ZOS logic. Even in small groups you want someone with rapids on so you can kite and re-position yourselves. Do you know who is in the best shape for this nerf? Sorcs. Spam hardened ward nonstop and not a worry in the world. DKs and templars are royally effed over, and yes, there are indeed magicka templars, healers, and magicka dks that would like to not be the fat kid in the back when everyone else is able to keep moving.

I can't even put down my channeled focus ffs without losing my rapids on templar. Have a class purify so you don't need to use expensive purge? It's great isn't it? Except that it will be guaranteed to remove your rapids. Want to do literally any heal as a templar because you're maybe being gap closer spammed, or all of the ranged damage from bombard spam is starting to catch up to you? Well, you should have been smart and rolled sorc so you can just put on another hardened ward because #wrobelbalance.

Anti group mechanics I can handle, because we'll still win and I can tell ww2 to eff off with their poor balance decisions. Changes like this that penalize classes that will be further penalized by other poor ideas (cough cough fasalla's guile) and pick clear class winners are terrible, and the only ones I see defending this change are people that are so blindly anti-group they'll cut off their nose to spite their face, or sorcs, go figure.

I don't think you understand.. i enjoy being the fat kid, i just wish the fat kid had some way to stand his ground though. Mag dks were never meant to kite, not everyone should be able to kite. Overall this patch has done wonders for our small group, immo it mainly hurts ball groups.

@Master_Kas if you are spamming bombard you've already got your major expedition buff covered with the roll dodge, what exactly are you complaining about?

Where did I mention that I spam bombard? I haven't used this skill a single time since this new patch came out xD Been either trying to proxy bomb on my magicka nb, or on my sorcerer which has less issues with this change or fooling around on my glass cannon templar.

I wrote when small groups try to recover from getting zerged , we're permanently snared and rooted since we cant buff up nor heal with movement bonus up.

chaserstorm16909

JDar wrote: »

The change to Rapids is also a crypto-nerf to magicka nightblades who used Major Expedition to stack with Concealed Weapon for extra speed. Not only has Cloak been nerfed but so has our movement. And we still can't stack as much damage as stamina players. Thanks Eric.

If you use cloak when rapids is active, does the effect of rapids break?

Dyride

Bad Change

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

JDar wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Excellent change. Less zergs, less moving around for nothing, and most of all, not having to suffer all those unwanted speed buffs any more.

Why would you not want a speed buff.

Because I AM the one who controls my character, not someone else. If I want a speed buff I do it myself. And no, I don't want to be speedy all the time.

Do you like it when you're driving your car and your passenger would use the gas pedal instead of you, without warning ? That's how unwanted speed buffs feel like.
There have been quite a few threads about that on these forums, asking for rapid maneuver to be applied only to grouped players, but it always lead to some jerks saying how much they enjoyed disturbing other players with this ability, or forcing roleplayers to unsheathe their weapons.
Now that problem is solved and I'm very happy about it (even though that issue was probably not the main reason ZOS did it).

.

With analogies like that, I don't think you should even be trusted behind the wheel. You must have lore appropriate names like "Rides-off-Cliffs".

anitajoneb17_ESO

Good Change

Dyride wrote: »

With analogies like that, I don't think you should even be trusted behind the wheel. You must have lore appropriate names like "Rides-off-Cliffs".

What a powerful convincing argument. Really.

Joy_Division

Bad Change

Master_Kas wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It´s awesome.

Ofc it´s affecting DK and Templar the most as they have no access to a magica based runspeed morph (that should be subject to change). Rapid with speed + soft cc immunity while healing was too powerful. This should under no circumstance be subject to change again.

If people in bigger grps don´t like it - it´s a good change. You´re not supposed to like it. It was meant to hurt.

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

Is that a joke? Try playing a small group trying to kite bombard and snare spammers while trying to heal/purge of the debuffs of the enemy zerg chasing you xD

Big groups still have the numbers on their side, small group doesnt.

Edit: wops didn't see who posted it. This affects smaller groups harder than big ones imo. In big groups I got the protection of aoe caps, more heals, more damage dealers. When I play small groups, you need to be able to kite and rebuff/heal up. With this change that's not possible unless you want to be permarooted and snared to death while all their friends come running after you.This change pushes ppl into bigger groups I think.

I'm guessing his small man group all have self-sufficient heals. Because this change otherwise equally effects small groups and zergs.

Not really equally. Zergs can afford to lose more numbers than small/medium groups can.

I'm playing on my sorc mostly anyway so I can pop immovable pot + streak and hardened through breaches and chokepoints. And I run duo / smallgroups latley only so I'm not biased. Can't tell how many times we tried to recover while a angry zerg hunts us down and snares/roots us while we cant heal or purge to even have a chance to kite decently. But this is my opinion you don't have to agree.

Oh, I agree from that respect. I meant there is nothing mechanically different about this spell or how it functions if you have a group of 24 or 4.

I also don't like how this change punishes certain classes more than others. As a sorcerer, I could care less about it. As a templar, it's a whole different story.

Derra

Good Change

Joy_Division wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It´s awesome.

Ofc it´s affecting DK and Templar the most as they have no access to a magica based runspeed morph (that should be subject to change). Rapid with speed + soft cc immunity while healing was too powerful. This should under no circumstance be subject to change again.

If people in bigger grps don´t like it - it´s a good change. You´re not supposed to like it. It was meant to hurt.

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

Is that a joke? Try playing a small group trying to kite bombard and snare spammers while trying to heal/purge of the debuffs of the enemy zerg chasing you xD

Big groups still have the numbers on their side, small group doesnt.

Edit: wops didn't see who posted it. This affects smaller groups harder than big ones imo. In big groups I got the protection of aoe caps, more heals, more damage dealers. When I play small groups, you need to be able to kite and rebuff/heal up. With this change that's not possible unless you want to be permarooted and snared to death while all their friends come running after you.This change pushes ppl into bigger groups I think.

I'm guessing his small man group all have self-sufficient heals. Because this change otherwise equally effects small groups and zergs.

Not really equally. Zergs can afford to lose more numbers than small/medium groups can.

I'm playing on my sorc mostly anyway so I can pop immovable pot + streak and hardened through breaches and chokepoints. And I run duo / smallgroups latley only so I'm not biased. Can't tell how many times we tried to recover while a angry zerg hunts us down and snares/roots us while we cant heal or purge to even have a chance to kite decently. But this is my opinion you don't have to agree.

Oh, I agree from that respect. I meant there is nothing mechanically different about this spell or how it functions if you have a group of 24 or 4.

I also don't like how this change punishes certain classes more than others. As a sorcerer, I could care less about it. As a templar, it's a whole different story.

That´s why mag DK and templar need a magica speed morph at their disposal. Snare + root immunity while spamming heals was just stupidly op imo.

Master_Kas

Bad Change

Joy_Division wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

It´s awesome.

Ofc it´s affecting DK and Templar the most as they have no access to a magica based runspeed morph (that should be subject to change). Rapid with speed + soft cc immunity while healing was too powerful. This should under no circumstance be subject to change again.

If people in bigger grps don´t like it - it´s a good change. You´re not supposed to like it. It was meant to hurt.

It has absolutely no effect on our 3 to 6 person grps (apart from enemies not being able to chase as good because their bol spamming healers can´t keep up with DDs - which is good).

Is that a joke? Try playing a small group trying to kite bombard and snare spammers while trying to heal/purge of the debuffs of the enemy zerg chasing you xD

Big groups still have the numbers on their side, small group doesnt.

Edit: wops didn't see who posted it. This affects smaller groups harder than big ones imo. In big groups I got the protection of aoe caps, more heals, more damage dealers. When I play small groups, you need to be able to kite and rebuff/heal up. With this change that's not possible unless you want to be permarooted and snared to death while all their friends come running after you.This change pushes ppl into bigger groups I think.

I'm guessing his small man group all have self-sufficient heals. Because this change otherwise equally effects small groups and zergs.

Not really equally. Zergs can afford to lose more numbers than small/medium groups can.

I'm playing on my sorc mostly anyway so I can pop immovable pot + streak and hardened through breaches and chokepoints. And I run duo / smallgroups latley only so I'm not biased. Can't tell how many times we tried to recover while a angry zerg hunts us down and snares/roots us while we cant heal or purge to even have a chance to kite decently. But this is my opinion you don't have to agree.

Oh, I agree from that respect. I meant there is nothing mechanically different about this spell or how it functions if you have a group of 24 or 4.

I also don't like how this change punishes certain classes more than others. As a sorcerer, I could care less about it. As a templar, it's a whole different story.

In that case I fully agree, and you are correct. It punishes the less mobile classes even more. Stam builds can use vigor, NB's can use cloak/shade to kite, sorcs can bolt escape (for a bit atleast).

And yes this affects both full raids and small groups just the same. Tough it might get better since ZOS mentioned they might have done a unintended change to normal movement speed making snares seem way more annoying than they should be. We'll see :P