Shortage of tanks in Tamriel

kojou

Is anyone else experiencing long wait times in group finder for DPS characters?

I play all roles Tank/Healer/DPS and enjoy each of them thoroughly, but am losing patience with waiting for a group on my DPS characters. My tank on the other hand gets a group instantly every time.

I vote that ZOS makes tanking more fun so that more players will like doing it. My Nord DK takes a beating and survives a lot of heavy hits. He can rez a dead player while holding taunt on a lot of bosses (some have stun and knock back mechanics that make it impossible), but he does little DPS and I am constantly in a battle to keep him with some stamina for the next block especially when the DPS is low and the fight goes a long time.

My make tanking more fun list:

1. Make better ways to retrieve stamina in PVE while blocking. If you want to be lazy then just make the no stamina regen while blocking feature a PVP battle spirit thing and let PVE tanks spend time and resources doing something other than getting stamina back.

2. Give an equal reward chance to tanks. I know that supposedly the loot table isn't based on DPS, but in my experience players that do large amounts of DPS get the best rewards and the tank that held aggro and made the boss stand where he was supposed to so the player could get a high DPS number gets left with green decon fodder and a soul gem. Maybe its just RNG, but it seems to happen a lot...

3. Increase the drop rate of Tempering Alloy already. My tank is running a mostly legendary set of armor master, but there is no way I am going to bother with any new armor experiments when it will cost most of my savings to buy the amount of tempering alloy needed for another armor set. The cost of Tempering Alloy also puts a huge "cost to entry" for a player that wants to play a serious tank and part of the fun with any role is experimenting with different armor builds.

4. Scale Footman to V16 and remove the exploration traits.

5. Add an AoE taunt.

6. Players (DPS's mostly) you too can help make tanking more fun by learning how to do reasonable amounts of DPS and avoid red circles before trying your first veteran dungeon. So many times I have tanked for "random group finder" groups and had fights go on for minutes or had to figure out how to save a wipe with 3 dead players.

I will continue to run my tank, but hopefully something will be done so that others can find some fun in tanking as well and not have to pay their entire in game savings to make a new armor set. If you have any ideas to make tanking more fun please post them as well.

UrQuan

I love tanking. IMO it's already the most fun role. I'm not a pro at it or anything, but it's my favorite role to do in group dungeons (and I think I'm pretty decent at it).

Having said that, i don't disagree that there's a shortage of tanks, and that there should be some things done to encourage more people to tank.

Katahdin

Tanks became extinct with the changes to stamina (I forget which update).

jkemmery

I moved my Nord DK back in to a DPS role because tanking now sucks so bad. When they took away stamina regen while blocking they made it so that you spend more time managing resources than doing what you need to do to help your group win.

RAGUNAnoOne

@Elloa

kojou

UrQuan wrote: »

I love tanking. IMO it's already the most fun role. I'm not a pro at it or anything, but it's my favorite role to do in group dungeons (and I think I'm pretty decent at it).

Having said that, i don't disagree that there's a shortage of tanks, and that there should be some things done to encourage more people to tank.

I find a lot of fun in it as well, but I am getting the feeling that players like us who enjoy it are getting more rare, and I would like to see some of the issues addressed.

UrQuan

Katahdin wrote: »

Tanks became extinct with the changes to stamina (I forget which update).

It didn't stop me from tanking - or even change my tanking style at all. Tanks who perma-blocked may have quit tanking. Tanks who only blocked when it was actually important to block barely noticed the change.

Moglijuana

Currently leveling my argonian sap tank! He is definitely already really good at trolling bad enemy dps characters in Cyrodiil lol.

UrQuan

ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

I love tanking. IMO it's already the most fun role. I'm not a pro at it or anything, but it's my favorite role to do in group dungeons (and I think I'm pretty decent at it).

Having said that, i don't disagree that there's a shortage of tanks, and that there should be some things done to encourage more people to tank.

I find a lot of fun in it as well, but I am getting the feeling that players like us who enjoy it are getting more rare, and I would like to see some of the issues addressed.

We're on the same page for sure. I'd like to see some changes to make tanking more attractive for other people. I don't need any changes for my own benefit - I enjoy it as is. But it would sure be nice to see more people tanking.

Xandyaffonso

I think that tanking is more fun than the rest. I never healed, yet people say that it is boring and when I have to DPS I get really bored. As to the rewards thing I never realized that, and if it is true it really sucks.

I think that they could make tanking more fun by making it easier to taunt a large group of mobs. Every time that I have to tank 10 or more I lose a lot of aggro. A AoE taunting skill would be perfect.

kojou

UrQuan wrote: »

Katahdin wrote: »

Tanks became extinct with the changes to stamina (I forget which update).

It didn't stop me from tanking - or even change my tanking style at all. Tanks who perma-blocked may have quit tanking. Tanks who only blocked when it was actually important to block barely noticed the change.

My biggest change is to use shields for tanking now a lot more and block less. A lot of players have found ways around the issue, but I would argue that the change was unnecessary in PVE.

kojou

Xandyaffonso wrote: »

I think that tanking is more fun than the rest. I never healed, yet people say that it is boring and when I have to DPS I get really bored. As to the rewards thing I never realized that, and if it is true it really sucks.

I think that they could make tanking more fun by making it easier to taunt a large group of mobs. Every time that I have to tank 10 or more I lose a lot of aggro. A AoE taunting skill would be perfect.

That's a great point... AoE taunt would be so nice.

Saint314Louis1985

i made a tank for the sole purpose of being able to run group finder dungeons. you are right when you say that the queue for tanks is almost nonexistent. On my dps sorc though, he has to wait 30mins+ to find a group most of the time.

I think tanking is pretty fun and is more of a challenge than strictly dpsing especially in group finder. It does seem that alot of groups lack the dps or heals required to do vet dungeons but its pretty awesome when you are the only person that survives and res all 3 group mates while self healing and maintaining all aggro lol. Been in groups where, i kid you not, the dps is using only fully charged heavy attacks. There was no saving them. Using group finder on a tank is definitely an eye opening experience.

But yeah overall i think its pretty fun how it is. It would be too easy if they let you regen stam while blocking.

As far as gear goes, v16 all gold with gold glyphs really isnt necessary. Make v15 stuff and see how it does for you.

DDemon

Most dungeons you can do without a tank, and when you really do need one, you can have one of your dpsers use a taunt and fit a sword and shield.

You are right about longer fights though, you need to have a proper tank setup when you have dpsers that don't really do any dps. And most people don't want to waste the resources on a complete new armor set to make a tank.

Most tanks currently in the game are players that have good resource management, they enjoy tanking, or they have an alt that is specifically leveled for tanking. The average player can't successfully tank or simply does not enjoy playing a tank as the resource management can be quite tedious, especially if you are low on CP.

Theodard

This is why my DK that just started doing pledges I'd moving along quickly. Magicka DK is just plain fun to play too.

LadyNalcarya

I really like tanking, but I have other characters as well since my tank is not really suited for questing/vMA/pvp.
Also, there's another issue. I taunt all the mobs, can buff the group and sustain my resources, I never have issues with inhibitor's portals and stuff like this, but... I cant do anything if the group is bad (well, except standing in a group of mobs watching them scratching my shield) So pugging on a tank is quite risky considering how many people join as "dds" just because thay cant tank or heal, even though they cant do damage as well.
Those 2 issues are the reason why there's not enough tanks imo.

Jennifur_Vultee

I still play my DK tank with my questing partner but I'm still a magic based tank in full heavy armor. I have seriously considered switching to stamina DPS but if I did we'd have no tank at all. On the plus side for solo play I can switch to 5 light/2 heavy to play as a DK fire mage and do decent DPS/heal. Tanking used to be fun, now...not so much. Thanks @Wrobel for making tanking suck and taking away one of the few defenses my mages/DK fire mage had against NB. I'm very unhappy with the changes to Radiant Magelight but I guess its too much to ask to have any defenses against Wrobel's pet class.

UrQuan

ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Katahdin wrote: »

Tanks became extinct with the changes to stamina (I forget which update).

It didn't stop me from tanking - or even change my tanking style at all. Tanks who perma-blocked may have quit tanking. Tanks who only blocked when it was actually important to block barely noticed the change.

My biggest change is to use shields for tanking now a lot more and block less. A lot of players have found ways around the issue, but I would argue that the change was unnecessary in PVE.

I agree that it wasn't a necessary change for PVE. I've always tanked using shields and only blocking for heavy attacks, special boss attacks, and other cases where there was a specific reason to block though. So all I'm saying is that my tanking playstyle was always that way and the change was barely noticeable for me personally.

Alorier

Dumped my tank and healer too much grief from the dps guys in dungeons

LadyNalcarya

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

Not true
My tank is still strong.
But ist much less versatile outside group dungeons and most of "dds" in this game are horrible.

Miszou

Katahdin wrote: »

Tanks became extinct with the changes to stamina (I forget which update).

^ Only for players that don't know how to manage their resources.

Stamina regen is fine. Use heavy attacks, potions, whatever. Be an Argonian, I don't know.... but there's more to it than just "I'm a magicka tank, therefore my stamina must suck and I should be able to regen stamina while performing activities that consume stamina, herp a derp".

I wouldn't mind an AoE taunt though... that would be super useful (and possibly OP) for burning down trash mobs.

Tera had a nice mechanic, where anyone standing in a cone behind a blocking tank would take less damage. Simple things like that can really make you feel like you're actually helping, rather than just chasing the boss around and hoping it doesn't break off and rage on the healer or something.

Artjuh90

No to AOE taunts! this isn't WoW.
i agree with the rest

UrQuan

Miszou wrote: »

Katahdin wrote: »

Tanks became extinct with the changes to stamina (I forget which update).

^ Only for players that don't know how to manage their resources.

Stamina regen is fine. Use heavy attacks, potions, whatever. Be an Argonian, I don't know.... but there's more to it than just "I'm a magicka tank, therefore my stamina must suck and I should be able to regen stamina while performing activities that consume stamina, herp a derp".

lol I've got 2 magicka tanks (a Templar and a Dragonknight - I've mostly neglected the tanking on my DK until recently because he's DC and I'm usually tanking with guildies on AD characters - the changes in being able to invite cross-faction mean that he's now coming out to play more). Both of them are far more likely to run into issues with magicka resource management than with stamina resource management... Of course, both of them are magicka builds on races that are generally seen more as stamina races (the magicka Templar is a Redguard, and the magicka Dragonknight is an Imperial), and I use all gold tri-stat enchants on all of their gear, and use purple tri-stat food while tanking, so they've got good pools of resources for all 3 stats.

Taryf

Official Tanking Feedback Thread Here.

nine9six

If I'm not Healing on my Templar, I'm Tanking on my DK. I have a VR16 Stam NB and a VR16 Magicka Sorc, but DPS is boring (IMO).

I wish more people would Tank (and Heal, for that matter). You learn a lot by filling other roles. I'd love to watch an "I only DPS" player take-up Vet Tanking / Healing for a month. That's enough time to get comfortable with the Role and realize how much they've been adding unnecessary difficulty for the other Party Members. Be it from standing in places they shouldn't, attacking when they shouldn't, *not* using Synergies (or using ones you *know* aren't for you...), pulling mobs when someone says "sec...", etc.

Not saying *every* DPS is oblivious to the effort other roles put into a run, but the vast majority of the ones I encounter when I need a PUG, are.

TLDR; maybe try taking up Tanking (or Healing). It's fun. You'll learn stuff. More Groups for everyone (and thus more Drops). Yay!

*EDIT*

Resources aren't an issue with Tanking. Bad players making excuses are. There are multiple ways to regen Stam. Stop hiding behind your shield, anyway. Contribute more!

efster

Just FYI there's an official thread for tanking feedback over in the Adventure Zones and Group Dungeons forum.

Teridaxus

Watch out or the devs will add negative stamina regen when you block if you dare to ask buffs to something not dps related.

UrQuan

nine9six wrote: »

That's enough time to get comfortable with the Role and realize how much they've been adding unnecessary difficulty for the other Party Members. Be it from standing in places they shouldn't, attacking when they shouldn't, *not* using Synergies (or using ones you *know* aren't for you...), pulling mobs when someone says "sec...", etc.

The healer (*cough* @MissBizz *cough*) pulling the next boss while the tank is still talking to the dungeon quest NPC, and then when you, as the tank, try to get into the sudden unexpected boss fight as quickly as possible your gap closer bugs out and prevents you from using any abilities or even light & heavy attacks for 10-20 seconds... Not that this just happened the other day or anything

nine9six

UrQuan wrote: »

nine9six wrote: »

That's enough time to get comfortable with the Role and realize how much they've been adding unnecessary difficulty for the other Party Members. Be it from standing in places they shouldn't, attacking when they shouldn't, *not* using Synergies (or using ones you *know* aren't for you...), pulling mobs when someone says "sec...", etc.

The healer (*cough* @MissBizz *cough*) pulling the next boss while the tank is still talking to the dungeon quest NPC, and then when you, as the tank, try to get into the sudden unexpected boss fight as quickly as possible your gap closer bugs out and prevents you from using any abilities or even light & heavy attacks for 10-20 seconds... Not that this just happened the other day or anything

lol I've NEVER been in a situation like that either.

MissBizz

UrQuan wrote: »

nine9six wrote: »

That's enough time to get comfortable with the Role and realize how much they've been adding unnecessary difficulty for the other Party Members. Be it from standing in places they shouldn't, attacking when they shouldn't, *not* using Synergies (or using ones you *know* aren't for you...), pulling mobs when someone says "sec...", etc.

The healer (*cough* @MissBizz *cough*) pulling the next boss while the tank is still talking to the dungeon quest NPC, and then when you, as the tank, try to get into the sudden unexpected boss fight as quickly as possible your gap closer bugs out and prevents you from using any abilities or even light & heavy attacks for 10-20 seconds... Not that this just happened the other day or anything

HEY! It was for science! Cuz... yeah! SCIENCE! And don't forget that one other time someone else pulled the boss!

I'm now kind of afraid to actually hop on my tank now (I do have one, but it's EP so haven't used it for a long time...) because of all the payback I'll receive...

DISCLAIMER: I don't pull that nonsense with people I don't know. I promise.

UrQuan

MissBizz wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

nine9six wrote: »

That's enough time to get comfortable with the Role and realize how much they've been adding unnecessary difficulty for the other Party Members. Be it from standing in places they shouldn't, attacking when they shouldn't, *not* using Synergies (or using ones you *know* aren't for you...), pulling mobs when someone says "sec...", etc.

The healer (*cough* @MissBizz *cough*) pulling the next boss while the tank is still talking to the dungeon quest NPC, and then when you, as the tank, try to get into the sudden unexpected boss fight as quickly as possible your gap closer bugs out and prevents you from using any abilities or even light & heavy attacks for 10-20 seconds... Not that this just happened the other day or anything

HEY! It was for science! Cuz... yeah! SCIENCE! And don't forget that one other time someone else pulled the boss!

Are you referring to the one time when you waited for the tank to pull the boss? lol

MissBizz wrote: »

I'm now kind of afraid to actually hop on my tank now (I do have one, but it's EP so haven't used it for a long time...) because of all the payback I'll receive...

Bwa ha ha! Mine is an evil laugh!

MissBizz wrote: »

DISCLAIMER: I don't pull that nonsense with people I don't know. I promise.

I have yet to see evidence of this claim...