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Cross faction trials: should it count for the leaderboards?
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Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be includedBluepitbull13 wrote: »Bluepitbull13 wrote: »
In WoW there is no leaderboards, people fight to be the first to kill the bosses in the world it takes to the most skilled players in EU/NA over 3 weeks to defeat hard af bosses that make look the bosses in ESO as dolls and then each guild in each realm does the same but at a realm level, being over 50 realms with thousands of players you see why leaderboards are not a thing they would cause more issues than rewards.
Boss fights in WoW unlike ESO have mechanichs tied to health % so you can't skip mechanincs with high DPS in fact you have to control how much DPS you do in some bosses because it could activate 2 stages at once making your group wipe and on top of that even if you are super skilled player you only do 30% more damage than someone who is not skilled because there is actual class balance unlike in this game where most of the class skills don't even make it to your bars because they are so useless they make you loose DPS.
so then in WoW can Horde and Alliance group towards a 1st world boss kill? since that's the thing to compete in that MMO, as far as skipping mechanics with high DPS yes that's sad, didn't use to be like this with Sanctum Ophidia when it 1st came out. Have you not seen ANYTHING in regards to the new trial?
Technically no, but in wow it takes 3 days to get to max level even i have 16 max level characters and that is nothing compared to other people. Nothing stops people on live servers of re-rolling to a different faction i just can't even understand why are so many of you afraid of betrayal, if someone betrays you they are not worth your sweat they are the most disgusting person they could achieve, and yes betrayal does happens in WoW its not a drama free game but i had never seen so much guild drama in a game until ESO guilds are not even required here and yet there is so much guild drama, in WoW you NEED to have everyone in the same guild to be taken into account on the world race.
Not sure about others but betrayal is not my concern lmaol, my concern is that the 3-5 top raiding guilds in NA are going to consolidate even further and end up having 1 maybe 2 mega guilds. I wouldn't be happy with 1 guild holding a monopoly of the leaderboards. Also to the claims of the casuals in this thread that this promotes competition, how so? when there's no diversity in guilds anymore. I'm in AD and I compete with other people in my guild then compete with other guilds in my faction that in turn compete with other factions, who then in turn compete with the EU server <---- (count the amount of compete's in that sentence alone)
I can already see leaderboards being removed or changed in the foreseeable future, just to add to this nothings stops people from doing this on live servers either, gear in this game can be put on your bank what stops elite players from banding together with 3 max level character in 3 faction and doing what you say. Either way after page 1 i'm against this for the simple reason that this stupid game doesn't need any more drama queens.
Your example uses 3 max lvl characters, next DLC it's going to be 8 characters with the CONVENIENCE of cross faction leaderboards, BUT what will happen is consolidation of guilds because as many examples that you give does not explain how atm there IS multiple guilds competing against each other on the NA/EU server. My characters that are locked behind AD will no longer have any limitations to join end game raiding guilds locked behind a faction, at that point why should I stay in the current 3 pve guilds that I'm a member of when I can join 1 mega guild? at this point why even have the ability to have 5 guilds? I can just join 1 super dooper OP leaderboard 360 no scope guild. BTW what is your experience with this MMO with the end game raiding? I ask because there seems to be a lot of knowledgeable people about other MMO's and seem to think that applies to Elder Scrolls Online
BTW Drama exist everywhere, pvp, pve, RP, ERP, market and you chose to stop drama here in what only affects the top players of this game?PC-NA0 -
Ra'Shtar✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes, they should countBluepitbull13 wrote: »Bluepitbull13 wrote: »Bluepitbull13 wrote: »
In WoW there is no leaderboards, people fight to be the first to kill the bosses in the world it takes to the most skilled players in EU/NA over 3 weeks to defeat hard af bosses that make look the bosses in ESO as dolls and then each guild in each realm does the same but at a realm level, being over 50 realms with thousands of players you see why leaderboards are not a thing they would cause more issues than rewards.
Boss fights in WoW unlike ESO have mechanichs tied to health % so you can't skip mechanincs with high DPS in fact you have to control how much DPS you do in some bosses because it could activate 2 stages at once making your group wipe and on top of that even if you are super skilled player you only do 30% more damage than someone who is not skilled because there is actual class balance unlike in this game where most of the class skills don't even make it to your bars because they are so useless they make you loose DPS.
so then in WoW can Horde and Alliance group towards a 1st world boss kill? since that's the thing to compete in that MMO, as far as skipping mechanics with high DPS yes that's sad, didn't use to be like this with Sanctum Ophidia when it 1st came out. Have you not seen ANYTHING in regards to the new trial?
Technically no, but in wow it takes 3 days to get to max level even i have 16 max level characters and that is nothing compared to other people. Nothing stops people on live servers of re-rolling to a different faction i just can't even understand why are so many of you afraid of betrayal, if someone betrays you they are not worth your sweat they are the most disgusting person they could achieve, and yes betrayal does happens in WoW its not a drama free game but i had never seen so much guild drama in a game until ESO guilds are not even required here and yet there is so much guild drama, in WoW you NEED to have everyone in the same guild to be taken into account on the world race.
Not sure about others but betrayal is not my concern lmaol, my concern is that the 3-5 top raiding guilds in NA are going to consolidate even further and end up having 1 maybe 2 mega guilds. I wouldn't be happy with 1 guild holding a monopoly of the leaderboards. Also to the claims of the casuals in this thread that this promotes competition, how so? when there's no diversity in guilds anymore. I'm in AD and I compete with other people in my guild then compete with other guilds in my faction that in turn compete with other factions, who then in turn compete with the EU server <---- (count the amount of compete's in that sentence alone)
I can already see leaderboards being removed or changed in the foreseeable future, just to add to this nothings stops people from doing this on live servers either, gear in this game can be put on your bank what stops elite players from banding together with 3 max level character in 3 faction and doing what you say. Either way after page 1 i'm against this for the simple reason that this stupid game doesn't need any more drama queens.
BUT what will happen is consolidation of guilds because as many examples that you give does not explain how atm there IS multiple guilds competing against each other on the NA/EU server
Exactly my point there is nothing stoping people from doing this if they wish so why the negativity about them doing it next patch? Like i said i don't care i'm against this just so the elite players can live happy.
Edit: My experience with endgame in this game is very negative so much i have not step inside a trial except to train a few guild mates in 6+ months.Edited by Ra'Shtar on March 1, 2016 11:02PMSome of my favorite screenshots
My opinions and posts are mostly on a PvE setting.0 -
Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be included
Exactly my point there is nothing stoping people from doing this if they wish so why the negativity about them doing it next patch? Like i said i don't care i'm against this just so the elite players can live happy.
So removing competition so that elite players can live happy? im sorry but all the ELITE players in this thread don't need your help to make us live happy, not sure if you can tell from all the comments coming from the majority of the ELITE players but are NOT happy with this change in Thieves Guild. You decided to state your opinion in a thread that wouldn't affect you, and I still struggle to see your point of view do you raid in this MMO at all? somebody a few comments ago linked an xbox trophy and that's cute and stuff but what's left of the raiders in THIS game are concern about the future of raiding in ESO.PC-NA0 -
SienneYviete✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes, they should countBluepitbull13 wrote: »Bluepitbull13 wrote: »
In WoW there is no leaderboards, people fight to be the first to kill the bosses in the world it takes to the most skilled players in EU/NA over 3 weeks to defeat hard af bosses that make look the bosses in ESO as dolls and then each guild in each realm does the same but at a realm level, being over 50 realms with thousands of players you see why leaderboards are not a thing they would cause more issues than rewards.
Boss fights in WoW unlike ESO have mechanichs tied to health % so you can't skip mechanincs with high DPS in fact you have to control how much DPS you do in some bosses because it could activate 2 stages at once making your group wipe and on top of that even if you are super skilled player you only do 30% more damage than someone who is not skilled because there is actual class balance unlike in this game where most of the class skills don't even make it to your bars because they are so useless they make you loose DPS.
so then in WoW can Horde and Alliance group towards a 1st world boss kill? since that's the thing to compete in that MMO, as far as skipping mechanics with high DPS yes that's sad, didn't use to be like this with Sanctum Ophidia when it 1st came out. Have you not seen ANYTHING in regards to the new trial?
Technically no, but in wow it takes 3 days to get to max level even i have 16 max level characters and that is nothing compared to other people. Nothing stops people on live servers of re-rolling to a different faction i just can't even understand why are so many of you afraid of betrayal, if someone betrays you they are not worth your sweat they are the most disgusting person they could achieve, and yes betrayal does happens in WoW its not a drama free game but i had never seen so much guild drama in a game until ESO guilds are not even required here and yet there is so much guild drama, in WoW you NEED to have everyone in the same guild to be taken into account on the world race.
Not sure about others but betrayal is not my concern lmaol, my concern is that the 3-5 top raiding guilds in NA are going to consolidate even further and end up having 1 maybe 2 mega guilds. I wouldn't be happy with 1 guild holding a monopoly of the leaderboards. Also to the claims of the casuals in this thread that this promotes competition, how so? when there's no diversity in guilds anymore. I'm in AD and I compete with other people in my guild then compete with other guilds in my faction that in turn compete with other factions, who then in turn compete with the EU server <---- (count the amount of compete's in that sentence alone)
The assumption that anyone that disagrees with your opinion is a "casual"Delta
Valheru's0 -
Ra'Shtar✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes, they should countBluepitbull13 wrote: »
Exactly my point there is nothing stoping people from doing this if they wish so why the negativity about them doing it next patch? Like i said i don't care i'm against this just so the elite players can live happy.
So removing competition so that elite players can live happy? im sorry but all the ELITE players in this thread don't need your help to make us live happy, not sure if you can tell from all the comments coming from the majority of the ELITE players but are NOT happy with this change in Thieves Guild. You decided to state your opinion in a thread that wouldn't affect you, and I still struggle to see your point of view do you raid in this MMO at all? somebody a few comments ago linked an xbox trophy and that's cute and stuff but what's left of the raiders in THIS game are concern about the future of raiding in ESO.
I'm against the my own vote L2Read.Some of my favorite screenshots
My opinions and posts are mostly on a PvE setting.0 -
Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be includedBluepitbull13 wrote: »
Exactly my point there is nothing stoping people from doing this if they wish so why the negativity about them doing it next patch? Like i said i don't care i'm against this just so the elite players can live happy.
So removing competition so that elite players can live happy? im sorry but all the ELITE players in this thread don't need your help to make us live happy, not sure if you can tell from all the comments coming from the majority of the ELITE players but are NOT happy with this change in Thieves Guild. You decided to state your opinion in a thread that wouldn't affect you, and I still struggle to see your point of view do you raid in this MMO at all? somebody a few comments ago linked an xbox trophy and that's cute and stuff but what's left of the raiders in THIS game are concern about the future of raiding in ESO.
I'm against the my own vote L2Read.
was replying to your previous responses which apply regardless of "Check yes or no" from the OP L2UnderstandPC-NA0 -
Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be includedSienneYviete wrote: »
The assumption that anyone that disagrees with your opinion is a "casual"
yeah I do facepalm, facepalm when majority of the people that are for this are the ones with not a single toon on the leaderboards. I do have a habit to refer a person casual when they are formulating opinions based on ignorance about end game raiding in ESO.
^^^ FYI, I state MAJORITYEdited by Bluepitbull13 on March 1, 2016 11:24PMPC-NA1 -
SienneYviete✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes, they should countBluepitbull13 wrote: »SienneYviete wrote: »
The assumption that anyone that disagrees with your opinion is a "casual"
yeah I do facepalm, facepalm when majority of the people that are for this are the ones with not a single toon on the leaderboards. I do have a habit to refer a person casual when they are formulating opinions based on ignorance about end game raiding in ESO.
^^^ FYI, I state MAJORITY
It's called a difference of opinion not ignorance, many good reasons have been stated both for and against within this thread. Just because someone does not agree with your opinion does not automatically mean they are wrong/ a casual/ignorantDelta
Valheru's0 -
Maddux✭✭✭✭Yes, they should countBluepitbull13 wrote: »SienneYviete wrote: »
The assumption that anyone that disagrees with your opinion is a "casual"
yeah I do facepalm, facepalm when majority of the people that are for this are the ones with not a single toon on the leaderboards. I do have a habit to refer a person casual when they are formulating opinions based on ignorance about end game raiding in ESO.
^^^ FYI, I state MAJORITY
Sorry that i have to tell you but my Score in HRC is better as yours
I dont understand what Problems all the better Guilds have with that Changes. You have a good Community, you have good Players that enjoys Playing, Improving and Creating Strategys together and want to get the best Score as possible in the Leaderboards with the Guild. What are you afraid of?
It is mandatory that you dont share sensitive Informations with Outsiders if you are in a competitive Raidguild. Also that the Guild should be your main Focus and you didnt run with other Groups on the same Level or all the other Things mentioned here. If it isnt a Problem for your Members now, why should it be a Problem on March 07?
Yeah, 1 Monsterguild in every Faction or just 1 gamewide Monsterguild with hundreths of Members. 10% of them in the Coreraid who gets the Fame and the Rest has to run in Group 2-X.
I dont think that this is going to happen. Sure, there are always People they are happy with standing on the Sideline if they can be a Part of the Franchise. But i think that the Majority of competitive Players are not happy with that. They wanna stand on the Pitch and dont sit on the Bench.
No Problem if your Best isnt enough for the Raid in a smaller Group. One Step back and try again with another Group. But do you really think that People are happy with being just a small Dot of Paint in a big Picture without being noticed? I dont think so and thats why such big Guilds wont exist in the long Term if you dont split the big Guild in small Groups. And then you have what you have now, just that it isnt Hodor vs BI vs OoM vs X vs X but Monsterguild Group 1 vs MGG2 vs MGG3 vs ...
A good competitive Group works best if you have a smaller Pool of Players where everyone knows what to do, when to do and what the other Groupmembers are doing.Edited by Maddux on March 2, 2016 12:10AM1 -
Maddux✭✭✭✭Yes, they should count
What about my Cooking Skills or the Length of my Hair? Your Argument about the Guys without Chars in the Leaderboard is invalid. Thats it.Bluepitbull13 wrote: »
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Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be included
What about my Cooking Skills or the Length of my Hair? Your Argument about the Guys without Chars in the Leaderboard is invalid. Thats it.Bluepitbull13 wrote: »
just as if I was to make comments about what emotes are lore breaking in a RP session? (FYI I don't RP) but you do have people that raid competitively and have already explained their points of views about why they are against it, some want to prevent drama, others are afraid about strategies leaking. We finally get a new trial (hopefully not 2017 before we get another one) and so far even if we each have different personal beliefs about a guilds integrity we all have the same 1 concern and that is that this change would be worse for the current raiding guilds.Edited by Bluepitbull13 on March 2, 2016 1:00AMPC-NA0 -
Decado✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be includedEvery person I know who is in a top raiding guild disagrees with this completely, I have absolutely no problems with cross faction raiding and I actually think it would be funny to get all the top raiders into one raid and see what scores they come out with, but I sure as hell don't think it should count to the leaderboard,
i have 8 V16s anyone wanna join me for a few VDSA runs, because who else needs the rewards? We can just horde all the gear to ourselves, I would imagine the top few guilds could fill those leader boards up themselves with everyone just switching around chars,0 -
Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be includedor as few have pointed out on this thread or maybe it was the other thread, to include a seperate leaderboards for multifaction runs
forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/250102/cross-faction-trials-zos-i-personally-thank-you-for-ruining-end-game-competition/p1PC-NA0 -
Maddux✭✭✭✭Yes, they should count@Bluepitbull13
I understand your Concerns about leaking Information and Stuff. There is nothing worst as working hard to find out Strategys and make them work, just to hear that someone you trusted shares that Information to anyone.
But this and other Points are still happening because sadly People are sometimes like that. This Discusion reminds me on the Discusion about GroupDamage and all the Sissies complaining about how the Community will change to its worst if the Addon didnt get shut down immediatly.
No Problem if People are against that because of Lore, they dont wanna Raid with Players they had bad Fights in PvP with or similar Stuff. But i really dont think that the Raidguilds are having more Problems with potential Leaks as before. It isnt so that you HAVE to invite Players from other Factions to your Guild. You CAN do that if you wanna and you can hire just from your own Faction or trusted Friends if you are more happy with that.0 -
Bluepitbull13✭✭✭✭No, they shouldn't be included@Bluepitbull13
I understand your Concerns about leaking Information and Stuff. There is nothing worst as working hard to find out Strategys and make them work, just to hear that someone you trusted shares that Information to anyone.
But this and other Points are still happening because sadly People are sometimes like that. This Discusion reminds me on the Discusion about GroupDamage and all the Sissies complaining about how the Community will change to its worst if the Addon didnt get shut down immediatly.
No Problem if People are against that because of Lore, they dont wanna Raid with Players they had bad Fights in PvP with or similar Stuff. But i really dont think that the Raidguilds are having more Problems with potential Leaks as before. It isnt so that you HAVE to invite Players from other Factions to your Guild. You CAN do that if you wanna and you can hire just from your own Faction or trusted Friends if you are more happy with that.
My concerns are more about the lack of guild diversity atm, getting even worse next update. When 1.6 released LOTS of players left and some top guilds folded, and just about every patch after that worse and worse, and now after each DLC more and more. I do believe it would be fun to do a multi-faction trial runs, but my concern is that a certain point is guilds would start consolidating further and with the convenience of not having your characters locked behind a faction would only make it a smaller place, but my perspective is from the NA server side. Perhaps none of this applies to EU.PC-NA1 -
Personofsecrets✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yes, they should countI don't see the leader board change as bad for competition. IMO this is coming down to people thinking that they are some of the best players, and they very well may be, but will be excluded from top runs.
Anyone can form their own multi-faction team to crush content. Such dynamics already happen to some extent in the present day.1 -
NoMoreChillies✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes, they should counthow about you get to nominate the character you want the leaderboard score to count? After each run you get a record score choice : Yes or No. New scores overwrite your old score.
this option prevents multiple rewards for 1 account and still creates more competition for all.Insulting people on the internet is cowardly.0 -
Maddux✭✭✭✭Yes, they should count@Bluepitbull13
The EU Server has the same Problem with People leaving the Game because of the Lack of Raidcontent. Its hard to motivate People to run AA, HRC or SO for the 3000. Time without being challenged from the Content itself or getting rewarded with Loot.
Some People had returned for the next Trial and maybe more will return. But i think that you also know that acquire new Costumers is easier as bring pissed Costumers to come back.
You are right with your Concerns that a decreasing Population could lead into less and less competitive Guilds. Every Guild needs a Pool of Players to fill there Raids with and if the Pool gets lower with a decreasing Population, you need to fill it again by recruiting from other competitive Guilds or not so competitive Players.
That sucks and it is in Zenimax Hands how long the Game will run on a competitive Level with many Guilds.0
