Dear ZOS- Why can't we play "This game" it used to work

tinythinker

Takllin wrote: »

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

I suffer with both. When the game launched it auto-set me to high on the graphics end. After the lighting patch I kept it at medium with lots of things turned down or off (except for subsampling) and made lots of usersettings changes. And at this point, I have gone from 40-60 fps in PvE (expected from my specs) to 10-30fps, and that is in sparsely populated vet zones at odd hours. Cyro, of course, is just brutal.

Takllin

tinythinker wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

I suffer with both. When the game launched it auto-set me to high on the graphics end. After the lighting patch I kept it at medium with lots of things turned down or off (except for subsampling) and made lots of usersettings changes. And at this point, I have gone from 40-60 fps in PvE (expected from my specs) to 10-30fps, and that is in sparsely populated vet zones at odd hours. Cyro, of course, is just brutal.

What your describing is FPS issues though. I completely agree the lighting patch *** FPS performances across the board.

I don't agree with the notion that it's causing latency issues in Cyrodil, they are two very different things. What Brian is talking about makes sense, with the passives and everything else. Also look at how much more abilities we can all use now, as opposed to before. There is far better resource management these days without having to give up anything for this. I think @Ezareth has covered this issue a few different times.

Quite simply I think ESO might have become too complicated for their server/code to handle at the kind of performance we saw earlier.

Shunravi

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

tinythinker

Takllin wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

I suffer with both. When the game launched it auto-set me to high on the graphics end. After the lighting patch I kept it at medium with lots of things turned down or off (except for subsampling) and made lots of usersettings changes. And at this point, I have gone from 40-60 fps in PvE (expected from my specs) to 10-30fps, and that is in sparsely populated vet zones at odd hours. Cyro, of course, is just brutal.

What your describing is FPS issues though. I completely agree the lighting patch *** FPS performances across the board.

I don't agree with the notion that it's causing latency issues in Cyrodil, they are two very different things. What Brian is talking about makes sense, with the passives and everything else. Also look at how much more abilities we can all use now, as opposed to before. There is far better resource management these days without having to give up anything for this. I think @Ezareth has covered this issue a few different times.

Quite simply I think ESO might have become too complicated for their server/code to handle at the kind of performance we saw earlier.

I focused on FPS sure, and that is a problem all over. It wasn't great but it has been worse since the most recent maintenance. As for the ping, it sometimes goes up more than it ever did in PvE too, but other factors are at work in Cyrodiil to make the lag bad there. I don't claim that one thing causes either issue, let alone both, I only know that both have steadily gotten worse over time and it doesn't seem likely to be reversed anytime soon.

Ezareth

Shunravi wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

I'm my experience the performance in cyrodiil has been consistently worse with almost every patch, not just the lighting patch. 1.6 was worse than 1.5. IC patch was worse than 1.6 (despite initial exclamations that it was in fact better)

Wrothgar I think may be the first patch that I can say I've noticed it getting slightly better. I've had my hopes crushed too many times for too much hope at this point but I think ZoS may finally be heading down the right track(slowly) to getting these problems resolved.

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

Takllin

Ezareth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

I'm my experience the performance in cyrodiil has been consistently worse with almost every patch, not just the lighting patch. 1.6 was worse than 1.5. IC patch was worse than 1.6 (despite initial exclamations that it was in fact better)

Wrothgar I think may be the first patch that I can say I've noticed it getting slightly better. I've had my hopes crushed too many times for too much hope at this point but I think ZoS may finally be heading down the right track(slowly) to getting these problems resolved.

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

QFT.

Agreed though that Wrothgar was finally a patch where performance was actually better than the previous patch. I find it funny that people are complaining about how bad the lag is now, saying it was worse than 1.6/IC. I don't think they remember how bad 1.6/IC was...

Shunravi

Ezareth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

I'm my experience the performance in cyrodiil has been consistently worse with almost every patch, not just the lighting patch. 1.6 was worse than 1.5. IC patch was worse than 1.6 (despite initial exclamations that it was in fact better)

Wrothgar I think may be the first patch that I can say I've noticed it getting slightly better. I've had my hopes crushed too many times for too much hope at this point but I think ZoS may finally be heading down the right track(slowly) to getting these problems resolved.

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

I can certainly agree there. Its not like the patch did it all, but there was a noticeable difference. So much so that i clearly remember the location and conversation i was having on that first few minutes after loging in.

I certainly hope they are on the right track. It seems they might be, and of course i dont have any data from their side of things other than their statements.

Im still hanging in there... One of the last of 300 people I knew who I guilded with at the begining... What can i say, im still having fun. For now.

Minno

Ezareth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

I'm my experience the performance in cyrodiil has been consistently worse with almost every patch, not just the lighting patch. 1.6 was worse than 1.5. IC patch was worse than 1.6 (despite initial exclamations that it was in fact better)

Wrothgar I think may be the first patch that I can say I've noticed it getting slightly better. I've had my hopes crushed too many times for too much hope at this point but I think ZoS may finally be heading down the right track(slowly) to getting these problems resolved.

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

Now that i read more of the patch notes, it might have to do with how they are adjusting skills. It mentioned grand healing was causing fps issues and it was adjusted after the "lighting patch".

And if you read those patch notes, you can see certain skills receiving an increase in dmg, additional time for DOT, a snare componen, etc.

Example: "Impulse: When an enemy is damaged first by this ability, the target(s) will now display a hit reaction.". Is that effect clientside or server side?

Another:
"Ice Comet: This ability now snares all nearby enemies instead of only the initial enemy target.
Meteor: This ability will now always deal its area-of-effect damage, even if blocked."

Another status (server side? Players use?)
"The death recap potion hint now only displays if your potion is not on cooldown."

Separate note:

"Objects in the world will now load in more smoothly while riding on horseback."

Takllin

Minno wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

I'm my experience the performance in cyrodiil has been consistently worse with almost every patch, not just the lighting patch. 1.6 was worse than 1.5. IC patch was worse than 1.6 (despite initial exclamations that it was in fact better)

Wrothgar I think may be the first patch that I can say I've noticed it getting slightly better. I've had my hopes crushed too many times for too much hope at this point but I think ZoS may finally be heading down the right track(slowly) to getting these problems resolved.

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

Now that i read more of the patch notes, it might have to do with how they are adjusting skills. It mentioned grand healing was causing fps issues and it was adjusted after the "lighting patch".

And if you read those patch notes, you can see certain skills receiving an increase in dmg, additional time for DOT, a snare componen, etc.

Example: "Impulse: When an enemy is damaged first by this ability, the target(s) will now display a hit reaction.". Is that effect clientside or server side?

Another:
"Ice Comet: This ability now snares all nearby enemies instead of only the initial enemy target.
Meteor: This ability will now always deal its area-of-effect damage, even if blocked."

Another status (server side? Players use?)
"The death recap potion hint now only displays if your potion is not on cooldown."

Separate note:

"Objects in the world will now load in more smoothly while riding on horseback."

Which goes back to my fear that ESO has become far too complicated for their servers to handle, and Ezareths point that if they ever can fix this, it might not be an ESO any of us are interested in playing.

Soulac

tinythinker

What do you think Homer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoWtHqmITOM

And you, Spidey?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_jtm_muCB8

Zheg

Ezareth wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

Trust me, I hate the lag just as much as anyone. I want it fixed just as badly. But lets point in the right direction for the cause. Which isn't 1.6 directly.

I linked patch notes from the Devs stating this isn;t true. They admitted in their own patch notes the FPS bug with 1.2.3 was never fully fixed. They brushed it under the rug after giving us lip service. the cause of today's lag is listed in ZOS very own patch notes, that horrible FPS bug from back in the day was never fully fixed...performance was been down the drain since that patch, they need to roll the darn thing back, it worked before that update.

Correct. I was about to post those notes too!

Though Brian said via ESO live recently it wasnt the lighting patch. But somehow the patch notes paint a different picture.

Also, many of those visual patches were vague with 2 sentences only. I wonder how much of the light is being reflected around, how skill's lighting effects calculation if at all, if the slider bars introduced to reduce performance problems actually work?

Lots of craziness.

He's saying the lighting patch isn't what's causing our pings to skyrocket. I think some people get performance confused, as it's not always clear in what context people are talking about, latency or FPS.

Agreed on this point. The lighting patch definitely affected client FPS, but I think the anti-bot stuff affected the server latency, resulting in ping-fest server crapouts. The two don't need to be related.

However, breaking two things at once?

All i know is that the issues were immediately noticeable in all areas of the game immediately after the patch. It wasnt as if everybody suddenly leveled up and had all the passives. There werent more spells being spammed than before, and people who were animation canceling were still canceling, and those who werent, werent. The deer population was no stronger than before, same with bugs. There were actually more people on the servers. And skills were still dynamic, I immagine those would account for more variables than the current non stackable major and minor buffs.

Something happened that patch. It was even noticable in the nearly vacant gold zones.

I'm my experience the performance in cyrodiil has been consistently worse with almost every patch, not just the lighting patch. 1.6 was worse than 1.5. IC patch was worse than 1.6 (despite initial exclamations that it was in fact better)

Wrothgar I think may be the first patch that I can say I've noticed it getting slightly better. I've had my hopes crushed too many times for too much hope at this point but I think ZoS may finally be heading down the right track(slowly) to getting these problems resolved.

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

I've heard this from soooo many people that i really am confused. Do people forget 1.5/1.6 where 90 people would stack on flags, 40+ banners would be down and meteor sound effects were queued up for the next 5 minutes and light attack was the only 'skill' you could maybe get to go off? The performance is terribad right now, but it was even more craptacular in 1.6 imo.

To be honest, I recall our guild thinking the performance was finally, magically, been fixed at the start of the IC patch because we could fight 50+ reds in a keep with a full raid and not have any issues on trueflame. Our TS was giddy for a few nights. Performance got progressively worse as people got bored of IC and came above ground, and then quick forays in azura would be even worse (I'd just crash every 3 minutes).

Its hard to describe, but I feel like performance was improved from the meteor spam lag of 1.6, so long as population is kept below 100 or so on a campaign. Even right now, you could probably have two full raids collide on axe and not have issues, but try that on higher population campaigns and performance drops.

Xsorus

The damn fps bug is back, where frame rate drops and stays there till relog

FENGRUSH

Dear ZOS threads never get a ZOS response - you fool!

tinythinker

Xsorus wrote: »

The damn fps bug is back, where frame rate drops and stays there till relog

Not sure it ever left.

tinythinker

Takllin wrote: »

Which goes back to my fear that ESO has become far too complicated for their servers to handle, and Ezareths point that if they ever can fix this, it might not be an ESO any of us are interested in playing.

I'm picturing something like this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nz7hBtY4iY

Joy_Division

Ezareth wrote: »

What concerns me most is the game we find at the end may be one in which we have no desire to play.

We have a winner here. Many of the suggestions made on these forums fits under the "cure is worse than the disease" phrase. And that's not even considering these "cures" have zero guarantees of making the lag tolerable.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Stikato wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

People keep beating this dead horse called 1.6

It's already been said numerous times that the entire population started to max out about that time. Everyone had morphs of their abilities. Everyone had gotten new sparkly effects on their skills. Please go watch the last videocast with Brian Wheeler. It explains a LOT of what's been happening.

Should it have been foreseen or fixed by now? YES! ... Can we all wish for those days when 200 ppl could be on screen? Sure.
Can we all turn down or off certain effects? Yes we can.Can we all stop blaming the lighting patch now? Yeah, I think we can. Calculating LoS, crunching the numbers to enhance or limit the AE of many abilities really is way more intensive on server load than the light crap. So please, that horse is nothing but atoms now.

It wasn't 1.6. I think it was 1.3.

Those of us who were there know that that patch killed performance. Anything else, like people leveling up skills coincidentally at the same time is wishful and borderline ignorant thinking. Here's how it happened. These are only the basic facts.

1) Pre-patch, performance was good. As evidenced by the videos
2) Immediately after the patch, the "FPS Bug" started. Which was, after any sort of decent engagement, FPS would collapse into the 2-6 range. After the engagement, FPS would not improve. The only was to fix it was to exit the game. This was a sudden, drastic change, that was *immediately* felt after the patch.
3) This went on for weeks. 2-3, if I recall correctly.
4) ZOS pushed a fix, that improved the situation. In particular, the FPS would now return to a higher level after a fight. However, it did not improve to the level that it had been at before the patch. It was clear to every single pvp player that played this game at that time that this patch had broken something significant within the game that was manifesting in lower FPS across the board.

Now, specific reasons why this is the case are above my level of knowledge. Including the interaction, if any, between video and net lag.

This 1000x. Don't let that revisionist history about the "people starting to max out skills" BS take hold. There was impulse spam and talons spam since the beginning of the game. Sorcerers were streaking through tons of people and dropping negates all over the place. Tons of AOE and particle effects. It wasn't that. ZOS implemented some major behind the scenes changes that ruined performance. They consider it a sunk cost and don't want to revert it. They are perfectly willing to let us rot in lag and try to remove deer or lower pop caps instead of facing their failure and admitting they broke their game and their promise to us that we could have "hundreds" of players on screen at a time.

MisterBigglesworth

PEOPLE OF ZOS!
YOU DOOM YOURSELVES IN YOUR HUBRIS!
I am leaving soon, and you will forgive me if I speak bluntly.
The universe grows smaller every day, and the threat of aggression crippling latency by any
group, anywhere, can no longer be tolerated.



The result is, we live in peace experience epic gameplay, without arms exploits or armies zergs, secure in the knowledge that we are free from aggression 1-shot deaths and war broken CC immunity. Free to pursue more... profitable enterprises. Now, we do not pretend to have achieved perfection, but we do have a system, and it works. I came here to give you these facts. It is no concern of ours how you run your own planet game, but if you threaten to extend your violence terrible netcode, this Earth Cyrodiil of yours will be reduced to a burned-out cinder. Your choice is simple: join us and live in peace eSports potential, or pursue your present course and face obliteration.
We shall be waiting for your answer. The decision rests with you.

Jhunn

Alcast wrote: »

https://youtu.be/-DV9TwsosyI?t=3m16s

I just randomly clicked around 12:30 and got the best laugh in a while.

jcasini222ub17_ESO

Call me crazy but I believe it was lighting/audio.

The audio part always got me and stuck with me, this could just be me being crazy. In cyro crashes/ping mind boggling happens when there is a ton of sounds, lots of seige and lots of people casting. Then I believe sometime around 1.3-1.4 something odd happened in pve. It was in rivenspire at the dolmen near the group dungeon everything smooth and going fine to the final boss. Me and another high level (ungrouped) set up to ult drop/spam heavy hitters, the third person there lower level and a bit away from the circle. Boss pops, i drop standard the other higher level drops nova (I think but it was another loudish ult) we click a few skills or try to at least.

I crashed and the other high level crashed, we logged back into our corpses the dolmen was complete and the lower level finished (I assume) the dolmen and did not crash. Her or she was confused at to what happened to us.

I haven't had this happen since in pve but that incident really stuck in my mind.

Also there has always been spamming in pve or PvP, remember delve bosses circa release there was enough players (not just bots) and particle effects stacked on each other there were times I couldn't make out the boss and for that matter the exit to leave. No crashes no problem. Same for dolmens early on.

Something about those big booms.

Ezareth

Xsorus wrote: »

The damn fps bug is back, where frame rate drops and stays there till relog

And the missing animations bug is back as well. I overloaded and killed myself from a DK who flapped his wings (Which I didn't see) unsure if my overloads were firing (couldn't see them) until I just keeled over. The sad part is I thought the DK was a nightblade because he was just spamming bow attacks at me.

Old bugs never seem to die forever unfortunately. Broken animations is definitely something introduced with the latest patch.

Ghostbane

You fools.

The actual lighting change did not affect the fps, this is the actual culprit,

Have updrafts been an issue for you robe wearers? Rejoice, citizens of Tamriel, as you may now craft light jerkins for added comfort and style

To save a buck, the devs didn't actually create a new item, it is just a cloned dress with transparent clipping. Since nearly everyone rolled into Jerkins immediately on launch, the stress of the visual processing to generate the effect has taken a toll ever since.

Didgerion

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Dear ZOS threads never get a ZOS response - you fool!

At least now we know how to get @FENGRUSH response.

tinythinker

jcasini222ub17_ESO wrote: »

Call me crazy but I believe it was lighting/audio.

The audio part always got me and stuck with me, this could just be me being crazy.

...

Something about those big booms.

Earlier today I was at a keep that got crushed and rezzed somewhere else. Almost 10 minutes later, I heard the sound of abilities, siege, and shouting, all very loud like it was close by. I thought maybe my location had come under attack in the minute or two I had gone AFK. I went outside. Nothing. I went back in thinking maybe some allies were just messing around. Nothing. Then a minute later, those sounds just stopped. It was like my character had PTSD. And I've been having more performance issues lately. So, I dunno if it's coincidence, but it might be worth checking out.

Lucky28

don't know how much the lighting patch had to do with it. i think the majority of the lag problems came because they moved too many things from application to server in response to such things as speed hacks. which is putting too much strain on the server.

just my opinion.

Sanct16

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Video dated March 17th, 2014

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64bBvOKxnVE

Look at how many people there are in once place, look at all the siege sheilds, particle effects, bombs and siege going off...stable 60 FPS

Where is this game? Why can't we have this game? This game used to work, why can't you just roll it back to a version that did work? Im sure many would give up some fancy lights for a workable game....

Lightning patch.

Master_Kas

Ezareth wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

The damn fps bug is back, where frame rate drops and stays there till relog

And the missing animations bug is back as well. I overloaded and killed myself from a DK who flapped his wings (Which I didn't see) unsure if my overloads were firing (couldn't see them) until I just keeled over. The sad part is I thought the DK was a nightblade because he was just spamming bow attacks at me.

Old bugs never seem to die forever unfortunately. Broken animations is definitely something introduced with the latest patch.

Yeah I've noticed this the last few days. Most obvious one is My magicka nbs proxy det.

I use it but see no visual blue light on My body and no explosion after 8 sec. But the damage from it is there just the animation. Happens both when soloing on low pop camps and when in raid ..

americansteel

Alcast wrote: »

https://youtu.be/-DV9TwsosyI?t=3m16s

this is the way ESO was meant to be played, but look at all those low levels

bitaken

If the lag in Cyro was never really fixed - don't kid yourselves where it is coming from.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/116358/should-zenimax-roll-back-to-1-2-2/p1

Yes - July 1st - 2014 - and yes a LOT of us left - the game went F2P just like we predicted....sadly...it's still not fixed?

Almost done with my VR 16 - and ready to begin champ grinding....when I enter Cyro and the game is craptastically laggy and I bow out...it will be the final time.