Gear after VR removal

Saumur11689

I'd like to know from the producers what is going to happen to the gear after the removal of VR levels.
Honestly I cba to farm V16 items if later those items are gonna be the same as VR1 gear.

I think they should answer this: will the same gear be craftable in different CP ranges or there will be only one version of any item?

Ruben

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2457704/#Comment_2457704

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

VR items should be converted to (VR*10) CP items.

It's still a work in progress, though. We should just wait until they give us more info.

Turelus

Rich Lambert announced in another thread the current idea (and still only an idea) is gear will now be CP level locked, so VR16 gear might require say 160 CP to equip, then the next expansion they make the new level of items require 170 CP.

Give me a sec and I will hunt down the link for you and edit this post.

Edit

Link to thread/post.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…

1. We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)
2. The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.
3. When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.
4. To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:

• We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)
• When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.
• We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

Saumur11689

Thanks for the answer guys.
From Rich words though you can't tell there will be different version of the same item, even though it's the most logical conclusion.

Turelus

I think most of the assumptions (and yes they're only assumptions) is that gear will simply be "CR10, CR20, CR20 etc." and as such nothing really changes from the current system other than we have one leveling system (again) rather than two.

Saumur11689

Turelus wrote: »

I think most of the assumptions (and yes they're only assumptions) is that gear will simply be "CR10, CR20, CR20 etc." and as such nothing really changes from the current system other than we have one leveling system (again) rather than two.

I guess that is the more logical conclusion even if in the end nothing will change.
Maybe dungeons will all be level 50 and you will get gear depending on yours CP I guess.

Sausage

I believe one version. In the year 2016 we grind Houses, not CPs and gears anymore, well, of course when CP-cap is raised we have to grind it, later if they wanna add gear-grind, they can do it with Gear Upgrades, why not to remove, green, blue, purple, legendary gears, they are basically joke and no new player even use them and introduce better system what takes months/weeks to get, not instant stuff what we currently have, everybody just upgrade new items to purple, then earn abit of money and upgrade to gold, you dont get a sense of progression if asked from me.

If they need gear-grind, why not to add Legendary+, Legendary++ upgrades to current upgrade system?

Saumur11689

Since they obviously know what they are going to do, they should share some informations with us imo.

infraction2008b16_ESO

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I think most of the assumptions (and yes they're only assumptions) is that gear will simply be "CR10, CR20, CR20 etc." and as such nothing really changes from the current system other than we have one leveling system (again) rather than two.

I guess that is the more logical conclusion even if in the end nothing will change.
Maybe dungeons will all be level 50 and you will get gear depending on yours CP I guess.

That would be a problem if there were 16 levels of gear, I mean what level of gear would they balance stuff like the level 50 vet dungeons towards? Would they balance them for the current VR16 gear and cut off everyone with lesser gear forcing them to go through the same (or even worse considering there would no longer be VR scaling) grind to get to the top level gear or would they do the opposite and balance everything down to be completed by people in current VR1 level gear and have the community outcry on how easy dungeons have got?

IMO the better option with the removal of VR would be for them to simplify the gear levels down to only a few tiers and have all VR1-16 gear converted to these tiers. Say for example all VR 1-14 gear gets converted to tier 1 gear equal to VR 14, VR 15 ends up as tier 2 and VR 16 ends up as tier 3.

This method would be a lot more work for them to do (especially with crafting skills/materials etc) but it would fix a lot of the issues people are having with veteran ranks currently as it's not so much the rank that matters but what gear you can equip and the difference between VR1 & 16 is huge.

Also I have a feeling CP gear progression might be more about what set pieces or even gear quality you can equip rather than what gear level it is.

Saumur11689

infraction2008b16_ESO wrote: »

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I think most of the assumptions (and yes they're only assumptions) is that gear will simply be "CR10, CR20, CR20 etc." and as such nothing really changes from the current system other than we have one leveling system (again) rather than two.

I guess that is the more logical conclusion even if in the end nothing will change.
Maybe dungeons will all be level 50 and you will get gear depending on yours CP I guess.

That would be a problem if there were 16 levels of gear, I mean what level of gear would they balance stuff like the level 50 vet dungeons towards? Would they balance them for the current VR16 gear and cut off everyone with lesser gear forcing them to go through the same (or even worse considering there would no longer be VR scaling) grind to get to the top level gear or would they do the opposite and balance everything down to be completed by people in current VR1 level gear and have the community outcry on how easy dungeons have got?

IMO the better option with the removal of VR would be for them to simplify the gear levels down to only a few tiers and have all VR1-16 gear converted to these tiers. Say for example all VR 1-14 gear gets converted to tier 1 gear equal to VR 14, VR 15 ends up as tier 2 and VR 16 ends up as tier 3.

This method would be a lot more work for them to do (especially with crafting skills/materials etc) but it would fix a lot of the issues people are having with veteran ranks currently as it's not so much the rank that matters but what gear you can equip and the difference between VR1 & 16 is huge.

Also I have a feeling CP gear progression might be more about what set pieces or even gear quality you can equip rather than what gear level it is.

Excellent post, I think they should do as you said or something along those lines.
The biggest work to do is how to balance dungeons after that.
Right now there is too much difference between V1 and V16 as you said, they should narrow the gap, probably having less tiers on gear.

Sausage

If I was them I'd revisit their Gear Upgrade system now at VR-removal, new players can upgrade levels, for example, if you're lvl 20, you have an item what you like lvl 5, you can upgrade it to lvl 20, then totally fresh start to all endgame players, so they wouldnt have to worry about gear-grind in next couple year or so.

MrDerrikk

Sausage wrote: »

If I was them I'd revisit their Gear Upgrade system now at VR-removal, new players can upgrade levels, for example, if you're lvl 20, you have an item what you like lvl 5, you can upgrade it to lvl 20, then fresh start to all endgame players. They wouldnt have to worry about gear-grind in next couple year or so.

I've said it a thousand times, but I just want this for my VR16 Silks of the Sun set...

Saumur11689

Ye, the gear is a worse problem than VR itself. Hopefully they will fix it while removing VR.
A new gear every level, which has a huge improvement, makes no sense and crates HUGE disparity between players.
Hopefully we will get some words from ZOS.

Emma_Overload

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I think most of the assumptions (and yes they're only assumptions) is that gear will simply be "CR10, CR20, CR20 etc." and as such nothing really changes from the current system other than we have one leveling system (again) rather than two.

I guess that is the more logical conclusion even if in the end nothing will change.
Maybe dungeons will all be level 50 and you will get gear depending on yours CP I guess.

No, that's actually a HUGE change, because CP is account-wide, while VR is not. It means that all you have to do is level alts to 50, which only takes a few days, and they're good to go with your best gear!

Tors

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Since they obviously know what they are going to do, they should share some informations with us imo.

Information on what?


Nothings changing apart from the name VR 1-16 or CP 10-160





apart from the name..........

Saumur11689

Tors wrote: »

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Since they obviously know what they are going to do, they should share some informations with us imo.

Information on what?


Nothings changing apart from the name VR 1-16 or CP 10-160

About what they are going to do with the dungeons then... if they are gonna just convert VR to CP gear as you said, it is just horrible.
Or maybe we will run CP 10 dunegons?? That would be a joke.

wafcatb14_ESO

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Since they obviously know what they are going to do, they should share some informations with us imo.

That would be nice but after being told for over 6 months about the game going Free 2 play, and the cash store was not true, and threads being closed by MODS , that even talked about the possibility of Free 2 play.
Then going free 2 play after all, after they milked the paying Subscribers for cash to finance it.

Personally I don`t trust anything they say anymore, and am only still here because the game I am waiting on has not finished Development , and Launched yet.

But I done buying anything else for this game,

infraction2008b16_ESO

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I think most of the assumptions (and yes they're only assumptions) is that gear will simply be "CR10, CR20, CR20 etc." and as such nothing really changes from the current system other than we have one leveling system (again) rather than two.

I guess that is the more logical conclusion even if in the end nothing will change.
Maybe dungeons will all be level 50 and you will get gear depending on yours CP I guess.

No, that's actually a HUGE change, because CP is account-wide, while VR is not. It means that all you have to do is level alts to 50, which only takes a few days, and they're good to go with your best gear!

Most people quit the game before even getting one character to the VR cap. Just changing the name/making the "levels" account wide would not change that. Unless the change is just the start of the conversion and simplifying gear comes later but eventually they will have to do it for the VR removal to matter.

The game needs less separation not the same/more.

Dubhliam

They are currently working on it, and TBH, they really don't know how to tackle this issue.

Take a look at my suggestion, and if you like it please comment. They just might take somethings we say into consideration.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/232989/gear-after-the-removal-of-veteran-ranks#latest

Tors

Saumur11689 wrote: »

About what they are going to do with the dungeons then... if they are gonna just convert VR to CP gear as you said, it is just horrible.
Or maybe we will run CP 10 dunegons?? That would be a joke.

Why would they change the dungeons?

They will stay as they are, the level of the party leader.

If he is CP 50 then the dungeon will be CP 50 which would have been called Vr 5 in the old days.


Its not difficult. Basically there is no change.


This is because.........


VR levels do not exist, they are just a label given to your level. From 1-66.

Why they called anything over 50 a VR level I don't know, it just confused people. If they had just called VR1 level 51 it would have made things much easier for ZOS

Saumur11689

That would be awful, the problem is not the VR itself but the gear and the dungeons level. Having the dungeon scale to the leader level creates so many problems and people of different levels wont play together for the huge diversity.

kupacmac

Tors wrote: »

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Since they obviously know what they are going to do, they should share some informations with us imo.

Information on what?


Nothings changing apart from the name VR 1-16 or CP 10-160





apart from the name..........

Stop spewing this misinformation. There are 2 major things that are changing:

1. CP is account wide, VR is not.
2. You can level your CP beyond the upcoming gear cap (160CP). You can't do that with VR levels.

Tors

kupacmac wrote: »

Stop spewing this misinformation. There are 2 major things that are changing:

1. CP is account wide, VR is not.
2. You can level your CP beyond the upcoming gear cap (160CP). You can't do that with VR levels.

Which means what?

1) CP Is account wide.

This does not affect anything, it just means that any character post 50 will be able to wear equipment of you highest character now.

This will mean nothing for a player hopeing that VR removal will allow him to bypass some VR ranks to get to top level. It means your alts get an easier time.

I have not heard of Cadwells Silver/Gold being removed, so maybe you get to do that quest line on your alts (again) so over powered that you fall alseep after 5 minutes.


2) You can level your CP beyond the upcoming gear cap

There is a cap on what level the gear goes to. Starting at CP160 on release.

Does this not sound just a bit like the cap of VR16 on current armour?

Yes you can level your CP above 160 (as you can do now) but there will not be any attibute gains post CP160, so in affect, its EXACTLY the same as it is now.




There are only 2 differences from the new system to that which we have now

1. Alts get to bypass all the leveling,
2. The name is CP not VR

TheShadowScout

Tors wrote: »

There are only 2 differences from the new system to that which we have now

1. Alts get to bypass all the leveling,
2. The name is CP not VR

Agreed, that's the ones we know of as of now. There might be a third, depending on how they deal with the region levels post-mainstory... but generally, that's about the main points I would think. it will make some people happy, others may not care too much for it... in the end, I expect all but the worst milk-drinking whiners will adjust and enjoy the game regardless of system adjustments...

Saumur11689

Hope they gonna change the dungeons level. Right now people of different VR are not playing together at all.
If you are higher level: why do a dungeon where you get items lower than your current level?
And if you get people to do dungeons of an higher levels than the one they are, most of the time it is a mess and you can't even complete it.

Tors

Saumur11689 wrote: »

Hope they gonna change the dungeons level. Right now people of different VR are not playing together at all.
If you are higher level: why do a dungeon where you get items lower than your current level?
And if you get people to do dungeons of an higher levels than the one they are, most of the time it is a mess and you can't even complete it.

This will not change, why would it?

They are ranking a character by his CP.

So there will be CP20 and CP 90 and CP160 people.

The dungeons will be as they are now. If the group leader is CP140 then the dungeon will be CP140.



Unless they introduce scaling like they did in Wrothgarm but they have not made any comments to this end (then again I only have visibility of the official forums and new from here, we know they would rather post on other sites)