Zenimax admits that new crafting material is bound because they want it in the crown store...

nordickittyhawk

So im just going through dev tracker wondering if zenimax is actually talking to us n i come across this

ZOS_KaiSchober wrote: »

Hallo,

Lorbeeren lassen sich sich nicht verkaufen, handeln oder verschicken, weil wir uns die Option offen halten wollen, diese später auch im Kronen-Shop zu verkaufen. Um den Tausch von echtem Geld in Gold zu vermeiden, ist jeder Gegenstand im Kronen-Shop an das Konto gebunden.

Bei den bisherigen Stilen wurde dies Problem so gelöst, dass man man im Spiel mehrere (handelbare) Splitter, Scherben oder Sonstiges sammeln musste, die sich dann zu einer (nicht-handelbarem) Handwerkszutat zusammen fügen ließen.
Bei den Lorbeeren für den Söldner-Stil haben wir uns entschieden, eben diese Materialjagd nicht einzubauen, sondern die Handwerkszutat direkt zu vergeben. Sobald ihr ein Kapitel des Söldnerstil kennt, habt ihr bereits eine gute Chance, Lorbeeren zu finden - sie steigt nicht linear auf die 14 Kapitel verteilt an.
Auch die Kapitel selbst sind einfach zu bekommen als z.B. diejenigen für Glasit.

Which translates too:



Hello there,

Laurels can not sell, trade, or send, because we want to keep open the option to sell them later on Crown Store. In order to avoid the exchange of real money into gold, every object in the Crown Store is linked to the account.

In previous styles, this problem has been solved so that you had to collect more (tradable) splinters, shards or anything else in the game, which then could be put together to a (non-tradable) Craft ingredient.
The credit for the mercenary-style we have chosen, these same material hunting not installed, but to forgive the craft ingredient directly. Once you learn one chapter of mercenary style, you already have a good chance of finding laurels - it does not increase linearly to 14 chapters distributed to.
The chapters themselves are easy to get as example those for Glasit.


I could be wrong but you guys tell me what you think...

Weberda

I'd say that was a pretty straight answer.

Ruben

I called it

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2359643/#Comment_2359643

nordickittyhawk

@ruben so you did! :P

Rosveen

I still think this solution is total BS, but I can appreciate honesty.

badmojo

It's the same with the current glass materials isn't it? Crown store items are bound, the shards you find in the world aren't.

I don't see the issue here. If they're going to sell the motif in the crown store, it would be silly not to sell teh racial stones also. It's all cosmetic in the end, it's not like they're selling wood/cloth/metal.

Weberda

ESO is a business for Zenimax. The idea is to make a profit. I have no problem with them using the crafting stuff as a revenue stream particularly since that's probably one of the more dependable revenue stream items they can come up with. What I DO have a problem with is their lack of candidness on the subject.

They could probably avoid taking a lot of grief if they just came out and said "this is what we're doing and how we're going to do it" (regarding a lot of things actually). After all players can farm the stuff in the game. They don't have to be purchased. And any player with an I.Q. above 5 will agree that it's important that the game is a financial success.

angelyn

I'll just quote myself here:

angelyn wrote: »

The more scarcity intentionally implemented in game, with the sole purpose of driving people to the cash shop, the more I want to unsubscribe and uninstall.

I became super wary when motifs and style materials got implemented with massive scarcity/misery that they didn't have before, and suddenly they now sell crafting mats (style materials ) in crown store . They have already started selling items that are not cosmetic only or are of lesser quality than in game. ( no in game chest will give you 10 malachite in one go). As I said before, now that crafting mats are in crown store what will be next? V16 stacks of mats? Nirncrux? Perfect Roe? Why bother with a stack of mats when you could just buy armour for crowns..all the things that are being made hard/unpleasant to get may now end up in crown store.

Also I could have sworn that ZOS said they wouldn't make things scarce/hard to obtain/nerf drop rates in game with the sole motivation of pushing people to cash shop? I remember seeing a quote from ZOS saying this shortly after B2P. If anyone can find that quote, please post here.

Well I'm not sure how long I'll stick around with ESO now tbh.. don't like the direction it's heading in. Priority should be providing good/enjoyable content and not altering content around cash shop, in order to maximise cash shop sales.

Edit: more rambling

redspecter23

I suppose it would have been too hard to make 2 versions. A bound one for the store and an unbound one in game? We have store soul gems and repair kits as well as in game versions.

Work your cash shop around the game. Don't warp the game for the cash shop.

Personofsecrets

So the cash shop has poisoned game direction? Who would have thought?

How do we know that crown store monetization isn't around the corner for and guiding the development of many more parts of this game that aren't just aesthetic in effect?

Edit: This all being said - I don't consider the Laurel that big of a cash grab opportunity. As Kai write, they won't be a pain to get and that means that we probably won't feel the need to buy them.

Jennifur_Vultee

badmojo wrote: »

It's the same with the current glass materials isn't it? Crown store items are bound, the shards you find in the world aren't.

I don't see the issue here. If they're going to sell the motif in the crown store, it would be silly not to sell teh racial stones also. It's all cosmetic in the end, it's not like they're selling wood/cloth/metal.

Sure the shards aren't bound but once refined they resulting style material is bound.

Morimizo

angelyn wrote: »

I'll just quote myself here:

angelyn wrote: »

The more scarcity intentionally implemented in game, with the sole purpose of driving people to the cash shop, the more I want to unsubscribe and uninstall.

Also I could have sworn that ZOS said they wouldn't make things scarce/hard to obtain/nerf drop rates in game with the sole motivation of pushing people to cash shop? I remember seeing a quote from ZOS saying this shortly after F2P. If anyone can find that quote, please post here.

Well I'm not sure how long I'll stick around with ESO now tbh.. don't like the direction it's heading in. Priority should be providing good/enjoyable content and not altering content around cash shop, in order to maximise cash shop sales.

We all knew this to be true, but to read it stated in so unapologetic a manner, it just reeks of avarice.

Not long before this game goes Free-to Wait, like FB games.

ZOS, you could still make a nice profit without having to fleece your customers. Just sayin'.

badmojo

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

It's the same with the current glass materials isn't it? Crown store items are bound, the shards you find in the world aren't.

I don't see the issue here. If they're going to sell the motif in the crown store, it would be silly not to sell teh racial stones also. It's all cosmetic in the end, it's not like they're selling wood/cloth/metal.

Sure the shards aren't bound but once refined they resulting style material is bound.

What does that matter? If you want to sell or give away a glass style stone, just sell or give away a stack of 10 shards.

The only problem I have with all this, is that I have to look at the shards in every refining screen I ever look at from now on. Which is still just a minor inconvenience, that I can easily live with.

lonewolf26

What makes me confused is went they wouldn't set a flag on the items that were purchased through the crown store so as to prevent their trading, while making those you acquire through drops in-game tradeable. It feels super clunky to be a master crafter when you can't effectively craft for others using their materials.

If the intention is to lock only items bought with crowns, then I would really like them to revisit this in a future iteration to make style items that drop or are created from drops tradable.

Elsonso

angelyn wrote: »

Also I could have sworn that ZOS said they wouldn't make things scarce/hard to obtain/nerf drop rates in game with the sole motivation of pushing people to cash shop? I remember seeing a quote from ZOS saying this shortly after B2P. If anyone can find that quote, please post here.

The statement that you are looking for is from The Road Ahead. I won't bother linking to it or quoting it because it does not matter. The main thrust of that statement was related to ESO as it already existed. Nothing was said to indicate that it was Holy and worthy of doing into the future. All they wanted to do was assure people that the game they were already playing would not suddenly become locked behind a paywall.

Crafting being one of the few areas of this game that really stood out as something worth doing, it is not hard to imagine that they would put a priority on putting it behind a paywall and punishing players who don't want to pay.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

badmojo wrote: »

It's the same with the current glass materials isn't it? Crown store items are bound, the shards you find in the world aren't.

I don't see the issue here. If they're going to sell the motif in the crown store, it would be silly not to sell teh racial stones also. It's all cosmetic in the end, it's not like they're selling wood/cloth/metal.

No. Anyone, whether they have learned the glass style or not, can get Malachite shards from any chest in the world. The gold style mat itself is bound once refined from 10 shards.

The issue here with Merc motif is that it isn't just that it will be sold in Crown Store, but that your crafter must be able to run undaunted dailies. Again, this issue isn't having to get it from dungeons, but that, because of skill point scarcity (which used to be more of a problem than it is today) and time investment over the last year to achieve 8+ researched traits on people's dedicated master crafters, many people do not have crafting characters that are also leveled "adventuring" characters. This means that, while you can get the motif from your adventuring char's dungeon runs, you will never get the style mat unless you waste learning the style on your adventuring character. As such, this is vastly different than any other crafting mechanic, and not in a good way. It's just a senseless mechanic that needlessly undermines the choices people have made about their characters and crafting progression.

stewart.leslie76b16_ESO

ZOS, you are going in the wrong direction. We want to spend out money on quality content that extended our game play. We want areas, quests, challengers. We want to learn new skills along the way. We don't want to pay to make something. As it has been said before, crafting was something worth doing. I loved getting to where I am now, but it's starting to burn me out. I'm getting to the stage I don't want to play anymore.

I've set my tipping point to where I will walk away, but I will give the benefit of doubt for the next DLC. Look after your players and your players will look after you.

newtinmpls

lonewolf26 wrote: »

It feels super clunky to be a master crafter when you can't effectively craft for others using their materials.

With the upcoming changes to how materials drop, I would expect that most of the non-crafters won't even have "the materials" on hand any more.

Xjcon

So. It's not hard to kill the last boss in any vet dungeon.

Ourorboros

Rosveen wrote: »

I still think this solution is total BS, but I can appreciate honesty.

It's interesting that all these honest answer seem to come from European CS. Any bets on whether Kai Schroder will be looking for a job soon? I'm willing to bet this is not what ZOS would like us to hear, or Rich and Gina, etc. could have confirmed what we have been saying since motifs and potions were first put in the crown store.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

Xjcon wrote: »

So. It's not hard to kill the last boss in any vet dungeon.

To quote myself:

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

Anyone, whether they have learned the glass style or not, can get Malachite shards from any chest in the world. The gold style mat itself is bound once refined from 10 shards.

The issue here with Merc motif is that it isn't just that it will be sold in Crown Store, but that your crafter must be able to run undaunted dailies. Again, this issue isn't having to get it from dungeons, but that, because of skill point scarcity (which used to be more of a problem than it is today) and time investment over the last year to achieve 8+ researched traits on people's dedicated master crafters, many people do not have crafting characters that are also leveled "adventuring" characters. This means that, while you can get the motif from your adventuring char's dungeon runs, you will never get the style mat unless you waste learning the style on your adventuring character. As such, this is vastly different than any other crafting mechanic, and not in a good way. It's just a senseless mechanic that needlessly undermines the choices people have made about their characters and crafting progression.

badmojo

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

badmojo wrote: »

It's the same with the current glass materials isn't it? Crown store items are bound, the shards you find in the world aren't.

I don't see the issue here. If they're going to sell the motif in the crown store, it would be silly not to sell teh racial stones also. It's all cosmetic in the end, it's not like they're selling wood/cloth/metal.

No. Anyone, whether they have learned the glass style or not, can get Malachite shards from any chest in the world. The gold style mat itself is bound once refined from 10 shards.

The issue here with Merc motif is that it isn't just that it will be sold in Crown Store, but that your crafter must be able to run undaunted dailies. Again, this issue isn't having to get it from dungeons, but that, because of skill point scarcity (which used to be more of a problem than it is today) and time investment over the last year to achieve 8+ researched traits on people's dedicated master crafters, many people do not have crafting characters that are also leveled "adventuring" characters. This means that, while you can get the motif from your adventuring char's dungeon runs, you will never get the style mat unless you waste learning the style on your adventuring character. As such, this is vastly different than any other crafting mechanic, and not in a good way. It's just a senseless mechanic that needlessly undermines the choices people have made about their characters and crafting progression.

The issue that was raised here is style mats being bound because they are also sold in the crown store. What you just said is interesting and all, but not at all what has been discussed in this thread so far.

nordickittyhawk

Zenimax just came out n said this but they dont get that the material SHOULD NOT BE BOUND... not everyone is a crafter and crafters would like to make money by selling the style or helping others get it.

MSchroeder wrote: »

There’s been a lot of discussion about the Mercenary motif since it appeared on the PTS yesterday, and we’d like to clear up some misconceptions and answer some questions.

First, we’ve seen your concerns about the time and effort it’s going to take to obtain all the chapters of the motif. We’re aware that some of you feel that the other recently-released motifs are too grueling to get, so we wanted Mercenary to be more easily obtained. Bronze chests will drop a chapter 40% of the time; Silver chests, 50% of the time; Gold chests, 60% of the time.

We’ve also seen some confusion when we say that the Laurels (the style item required to craft a piece of gear in the Mercenary style) are Bind on Pickup. To be clear, when we say ‘Bind on Pickup’, we mean it binds to your account, not your character. This means that any of your characters can earn a Laurel, bank it, and let any of your other characters use it.

Finally, we’ve seen lots of talk about how the Laurels will only drop for characters who know at least one chapter of the style. One thing we didn’t mention in the patch notes, however, is that this is not a simple 0%-100% scale – while knowing zero chapters of the style does mean you won’t ever see a Laurel, having just one chapter means that final bosses from Veteran Dungeon will have a 50% chance to drop a Laurel for you. From there, it scales up linearly to 100% (approx. +4% per chapter). Note that the drop rate of Laurels from final bosses in Normal Dungeons Laurel is always 1/4th of their Veteran counterparts.

If you’re concerned that you now have to get your crafting character suited up and ready for dungeons, consider this: With just one chapter under your belt – likely obtained after only a day’s worth of Pledges – your most Undaunted character will be getting a Laurel about every other run through a Veteran Dungeon.

what do you have to say to that @MSchroeder

nordickittyhawk

Just to add with what they said... IM 100% ok with drop rates but id really love them to stop this bound pick up BS..

Elsonso

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

The issue here with Merc motif is that it isn't just that it will be sold in Crown Store, but that your crafter must be able to run undaunted dailies. Again, this issue isn't having to get it from dungeons, but that, because of skill point scarcity (which used to be more of a problem than it is today) and time investment over the last year to achieve 8+ researched traits on people's dedicated master crafters, many people do not have crafting characters that are also leveled "adventuring" characters. This means that, while you can get the motif from your adventuring char's dungeon runs, you will never get the style mat unless you waste learning the style on your adventuring character. As such, this is vastly different than any other crafting mechanic, and not in a good way. It's just a senseless mechanic that needlessly undermines the choices people have made about their characters and crafting progression.

I think that the bold part is a good thing, to be honest. It is a good idea to link motifs to achievements in the game, like undaunted pledge runs. I know that certain players will do what it takes if they are completionists that must have the latest motifs. They will respec the character to achieve this.

Now, what they really need to do is to drop plans to sell Laurel in the Crown Store and remove the BoP restriction. I know that the ZeniMax overlords want their pound of flesh from ESO, but the players need to have commerce and players do commerce in style materials. While Laurel in the Crown Store will get sales from people buying Laurel, what commerce by players in the Laurel trade gets is active players that use Crowns to buy pets, mounts, costumes, DLC, and spend cash to buy ESO Plus.

@MSchroeder, tell the ZeniMax overlords that the players have to have something to sell each other in the game, more than just completed armor and motif chapters. Players need to be able to buy and sell, for gold, all the materials used to create these items in the game.

Pangnirtung

What all of this rarity of materials and motifs has done is made me NOT interested in changing the look of my toon.

For all the guars and frost horses and pets following toons around it changes nothing in the game. Purely cosmetic. It doesn't affect my enjoyment one way or the other.

Scyantific

Well at least they're being honest about money taking a priority over everything else.

Maotti

Well, Zenimax, i'm gonna make it perfectly clear to you guys that i will never spend real money to be able to craft for others who do not know the style.

SirDopey

Stop ya crying...we all know we're all going to be doing VR1(or even L10) scaled Dungeons on our VR16 alts to get all the laurels we'll ever need the first week the DLC is out....

abhimat1999rwb17_ESO

A friend of mine said a long time ago that they're trying to milk eso for every last dime as they chase off players. Can definitely confirm that happening lol.

SirDopey

Scyantific wrote: »

Well at least they're being honest about money taking a priority over everything else.

I love how so many people in this community seem to believe that the servers can maintain themselves for free, that the developers continue to work on improvements for free and that new content will just keep on coming without any of us having to spend a dime..... ZOS is entitled to make money of something that's so enjoyable...